Old 03-18-2017, 07:00 PM   #81
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Regarding hyper-threading.. had to test.
In the case of the i7-7700K, this screen speaks for itself and here HT is turned Off, what a humongous difference in REAPER w the Divas. (look at my other screen cap, HT ON with that one)
I even had to double check..
So.. HT ON seems to be better no?

Ps: thanks for the Process Lasso Pro tip Dave, that one was new to me, and, Speedstep is now Off *check*



Bonus: Don't go all to nutts on the memory speed train, put the money on spoiling your cat instead.
Ps, Intel users, not sure it's the same for AMD.
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Old 03-22-2017, 09:13 PM   #82
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So I was thinking, if you are going for it, I am hoping that you chose the exact same mobo as me so you can explain to me how the integrated soundcard can be so instant fast with asio4all, but not with wasapi or it's own asio..
So fast it feels like the pads are biting back at my fingers, see it as a bonus if you like the rest of the specs and did not intend to use the integrated anyway.
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Old 03-23-2017, 05:36 AM   #83
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I did read about disabling HT, but in my tests I also had better performance with HT on. Maybe it is about latency, I don't know. But I leave HT on for now because it is better for me.

By the way, SmajjL, did you try contacting me from my contact form in my web? I replied but I have received email back unable to send to a wrong address. I can't contact you by private message here in the forum either.
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Old 03-23-2017, 07:55 AM   #84
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Here's an idea. Let's create a reaper template track that people can easily download and run (maybe something with a freeware synth that's easy to install, since reaper doesn't have one built in).

Everyone use default settings, and upload a screenshot / CPU data to see how our CPUs compare (especially for people who have 7700K and Ryzen, since those are the 2 top options for getting a new CPU).

I'm also torn between getting a 7700k or a Ryzen (if Ryzen can make something with the STX form factor. I need portability).
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Old 03-23-2017, 09:35 AM   #85
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Maybe this is useful:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iq7u-agaxlM&t=0s

Although the dude is working in FL Studio, i can imagine his performance findings
also apply to Reaper.
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Old 03-23-2017, 10:08 AM   #86
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Yeah if I was to just go by with what internet have said in the past, I would put HT OFF, but 5 more Divas with HT ON is quite a difference! and it is gen 7 now, no clue what or if anything has improved since this is my first CPU with HT.

Nope, I have not contacted you heda and I have no PM's from you here either afaict, yet..

Cool to see some Ryzen users trying DAW stuff, finally, thanks vanhaze.
Ps: AMD, release Vega noooow!!

Mr.PC, I did upload a .rpp for this purpose so we can use the same.
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Old 03-23-2017, 12:37 PM   #87
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Ah yeah btw, I will get the latest FL Studio and do what he did and report back for you people stuck in deciding-land.

Wish he used Divas or something so there is less tracks to duplicate.. oh well..
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Old 03-23-2017, 02:25 PM   #88
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So... if I add one Harmor and set precition to prefect and add one note..
.. how to I fast duplicate to many instances with everything on it?
Just duplicate a track in REAPER is in FL Studio what?
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Old 03-23-2017, 02:47 PM   #89
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Harmor is a relative pussycat. Try AAS Chromaphone 2 demo (standalone):

https://www.applied-acoustics.com/chromaphone-2/

Purple Nights patch. play multiple notes, apply pitch bend and look at CPU usage. I would like to see how these current Ryzen stack up against i7 with that test.
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Old 03-23-2017, 03:13 PM   #90
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Yes Softie, but Vanhaze found a Youtuber using Ryzen and chose Harmor I am sorry to say .. so if I test Chromaphone I have no Ryzen reference
And REAPER would not fire up Harmor either, nice try SmajjL
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Old 03-23-2017, 04:53 PM   #91
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FL Studio not even playing can be 1-2% and trying 20 Harmors with perfect precision the FL Studio process avg 5% give or take, you do the math.
Can it run Crysis it is called and in DAW land, can it run Diva, or Softies suggestion maby.

Ps, yes sir, downloading.
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Old 03-23-2017, 05:15 PM   #92
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Yes Softie, but Vanhaze found a Youtuber using Ryzen and chose Harmor I am sorry to say .. so if I test Chromaphone I have no Ryzen reference
And REAPER would not fire up Harmor either, nice try SmajjL

I have Harmor. It is still working fine in Reaper. Harmor currently has an issue with pitch bend though - unless you get an old buggy version of Harmor pitch doesn't work.
That have been promising a vector version for ages too.
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Old 03-23-2017, 05:35 PM   #93
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I am only temporarily demoing FL Studio & Co so I am a little newbie with their stuff, the GUI looks good though.

So Your Chromaphone 2 on a i7-7700K, Purple Nights patch.
A basic 3 fingered chord total CPU 3%, when I mess with ReaControlMIDI Pitch Wheel, Baum!! 10 %

I think i'll use ReaPitch instead, no performance hit.
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Old 03-23-2017, 05:45 PM   #94
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I am only temporarily demoing FL Studio & Co so I am a little newbie with their stuff, the GUI looks good though.

So Your Chromaphone 2 on a i7-7700K, Purple Nights patch.
A basic 3 fingered chord total CPU 3%, when I mess with ReaControlMIDI Pitch Wheel, Baum!! 10 %

I think i'll use ReaPitch instead, no performance hit.
To see real cpu use the standalone (not in Reaper) and real pitch wheel.

i5 2400 quad core at 3.57ghz:
3 fingered chord 100% CPU with severe corruption. about 40% without pitch.

Chromaphone 1/2 is a single threaded test.
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Old 03-23-2017, 06:02 PM   #95
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Ouch!! so maby you are also considering an upgrade too huh?
So using the Chromaphone2 GUI pitch, then 13% my gawd..
Is this thing optimized? judgeing by the sound I hear, it is not worth the CPU %
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Old 03-23-2017, 06:58 PM   #96
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Ouch!! so maby you are also considering an upgrade too huh?
So using the Chromaphone2 GUI pitch, then 13% my gawd..
Is this thing optimized? judgeing by the sound I hear, it is not worth the CPU %
More going on than just raw power on CPU?

I would not upgrade just for that VSTi. Toying with the idea of an upgrade though, eventually. Try different patches, it is pretty realistic. CPU is off the chart.

This test is proving the figures to be something of a nonsense. an i7 7700k isn't x times more powerful (per core) than an i5 2400. Sure it is in a different price bracket and a lot newer but those figures would suggest the difference between a clapped out moped and a Veyron!
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Old 03-23-2017, 07:21 PM   #97
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Sleepless Nights gave me a good vibe to make something.
What figures is nonsense? what do you mean? is this a UK slang thing again?
Prior to my upgrade, I would have loved to see how many VSTs per track or something here.
I am waiting for the Vega release now and the first review for example, the FPS per game will help me chose red or green team.
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Old 03-24-2017, 03:45 AM   #98
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Sleepless Nights gave me a good vibe to make something.
What figures is nonsense? what do you mean? is this a UK slang thing again?
Prior to my upgrade, I would have loved to see how many VSTs per track or something here.
I am waiting for the Vega release now and the first review for example, the FPS per game will help me chose red or green team.
It was a single threaded test. The figures you gave me here are a Tiny fraction of the CPU figures I presented to you.
One i7 core is not many times more powerful, but the difference would suggest that. Therefore as I see it those figures can only let you know if a particular CPU can cope or not, nothing more.
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Old 03-24-2017, 05:44 AM   #99
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I am only temporarily demoing FL Studio & Co so I am a little newbie with their stuff, the GUI looks good though.

So Your Chromaphone 2 on a i7-7700K, Purple Nights patch.
A basic 3 fingered chord total CPU 3%, when I mess with ReaControlMIDI Pitch Wheel, Baum!! 10 %

I think i'll use ReaPitch instead, no performance hit.
Chromaphone has all sorts of settings for changing/controlling the pitch of the instrument. As a percussion VSTi for say pre programmed patterns and arpeggiators it is great.

That's not the point, given that it is also a playable instrument the string patches are a CPU killer.
If I take voices down to just 4 it works fine on strings with pitch control, even with 4x unison voices (their guide suggests double cpu requirements for 2x and quadruple for 4x).
However if I have no unison voices and use just 8 voices it breaks up with pitch control. This suggests real time pitch wheel control is therefore using WAY more than quadruple demand on CPU.

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Old 03-24-2017, 10:12 AM   #100
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Softie I am personally fine with facts and I have of course my old CPU as a reference also and including ancient leftovers so I finally.. could have/build Two computers witch was also one of my wishes and, I am not expert-grade, juuust a happy civilian.

I guess it simply depends what you are comparing to, I have not said i7-7700K is 10 times faster than all CPUs on the planet, you can do that yourselves if it turns out like that I am just helping with info and do as you say.

Speaking for myself, the Diva test in my world i7-7700K vs i5-3570K is "only" about twice the Divas, but that is
Pllllenty for me and if it was not for 4K and gameing and wanting two computers, I could actually be fine with the i5-3570K for a while longer.

I only have the iGPU atm as I am waiting for the you-know-what and a fun fact: It is possible to play Half-life 2 on the i7-7700K w iGPU in 4K, pushing it but, possible.

I have not gone through all the Diva patches either yet, but I am guessing you already know that there is no patch in Diva that beats the Chromaphone as a good stress test for a CPU?
I still think it is so cool what we can have and do today with software during my time on earth.

If you have anything else you would like me to do just give me instructions.
And if we fffffinally get a Ryzen user here that can just do these simple Diva tests and even beat my pppprecious, I would be fine and very happy, so curious to know and I would not mind if AMD kicked some ass, about time.
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Old 03-24-2017, 01:35 PM   #101
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Hi,

here´s my 1700X Ryzen test at 192 Samples - 8,4 ms
Attached Images
File Type: gif CPU.gif (6.2 KB, 45 views)
File Type: png Diva 19 Tracks.PNG (39.5 KB, 46 views)
File Type: png Diva 20 Tracks.PNG (39.9 KB, 51 views)
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Old 03-24-2017, 02:08 PM   #102
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Thank you!! Isi !! so cool of you!
The price situation today is: 1700X 3995:- and i7-7700K 3590:- Swedish dollars btw.
Not sure, but does Ryzen have a BIOS thingie that is like Intels HT, maby you could squeeze even more out of it for free by turning it on.

Edit: Intel Hyperthreading is called SMT on Ryzen? try that if it's true.
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Old 03-24-2017, 02:19 PM   #103
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Softie I am personally fine with facts and I have of course my old CPU as a reference also and including ancient leftovers so I finally.. could have/build Two computers witch was also one of my wishes and, I am not expert-grade, juuust a happy civilian.

I guess it simply depends what you are comparing to, I have not said i7-7700K is 10 times faster than all CPUs on the planet, you can do that yourselves if it turns out like that I am just helping with info and do as you say.

Speaking for myself, the Diva test in my world i7-7700K vs i5-3570K is "only" about twice the Divas, but that is
Pllllenty for me and if it was not for 4K and gameing and wanting two computers, I could actually be fine with the i5-3570K for a while longer.

I only have the iGPU atm as I am waiting for the you-know-what and a fun fact: It is possible to play Half-life 2 on the i7-7700K w iGPU in 4K, pushing it but, possible.

I have not gone through all the Diva patches either yet, but I am guessing you already know that there is no patch in Diva that beats the Chromaphone as a good stress test for a CPU?
I still think it is so cool what we can have and do today with software during my time on earth.

If you have anything else you would like me to do just give me instructions.
And if we fffffinally get a Ryzen user here that can just do these simple Diva tests and even beat my pppprecious, I would be fine and very happy, so curious to know and I would not mind if AMD kicked some ass, about time.
I thought I was helping you.

Doubling the Diva performance for 7700 from 3570, not bad.

I will get a i7 3770 to replace i5 2400. An affordable baby step. Every motherboard I get is usually good for two or more CPU upgrades.

I have made Diva patches that are more CPU hungry than any of the factory patches. It's not rocket science, just max it out.

It will be interesting to see if the slightly newer i7 will be man enough for Chromaphone pitch bend.

I haven't played a game for long while now.
I know onboard GPUs are weedy but Half life 2 is now so old I am not surprised the CPUs onboard GPU copes with that in 4k. Gordon Freeman is surely a Free man now?, shuffled off to another dimension, only this time with angels instead of head crabs.
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Old 03-24-2017, 02:56 PM   #104
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Yeah but Softie, sometimes I am a little schooby doo and slow in the head, we are cool and I love you, don't worry.
I am not complaining I am stuck in excitement enthusiasm land atm and hoping it never goes away.

You should be able to use a couple of instances I think and use that damn pitch bend from hell, finally.

Neither have I and that sucks, so ready to kick ass and... could people stop getting old around here? is that to much to ask?

I am pretty sure if Ryzen get an iGPU that it will kick Intel's ass as usual though, for normal usage to watch movies and stuff, no problem, and that Windows 10 Movies & TV app, is not so bad for 4K.

And my 3570 did not have HT, surely you will be fine for a while after that upgrade.
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Old 03-28-2017, 11:43 AM   #105
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Something I said? ..
I am guessing eeeeveryone is out upgrading their stuff atm even if you are with-in the (did not have the need) group? AMD or Intel, neither is poop today so, con'grats to human kind although i've seen a animals play instruments. (credits)
And btw, that integrated soundcard I mentioned is only about the response time, not 'quality that beats a real soundcard when you push the volume up and fatness energy etc etc, ok?
Ps: Not round trip either! just pad > sound > speaker > SmajjL
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Old 03-29-2017, 12:03 PM   #106
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Hi Smajll,
Upgraded to i7 3770 from i5 2400. It benchmarks well. As an upgrade it is barely perceptible.
Maybe in really large projects it will manage processing resources better because of hyper threading?, however struggling VSTis work no better.

Most DAW users would probably be better off with a higher clocked i5 than a similar price lower clock i7, unless say also 3d rendering or working with lots of 4k video.

FWIW your games won't benefit much from i7 either. Limited budget: get i5 and another SSD or more ram, better graphics, PSU, case, heatsink etc.

Not writing off i7 just putting it into context. Very large orchestral projects might benefit considerably from HT for all I know.
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Old 03-29-2017, 12:31 PM   #107
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Not writing off i7 just putting it into context. Very large orchestral projects might benefit considerably from HT for all I know.
Large orchestral projects benefit more from hosting instruments on slave machines via Vienna Ensemble Pro. So 2 cheaper machines would be better than one high performance one.
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Old 03-29-2017, 12:41 PM   #108
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Hey Softie!
You actually went for it? congrats! at least on having two computers (or almost, not sure, yet)

If the resolution in gameing is High and having a real GPU, then the difference is zzzz CPU-wise yes (according to reviews, have no GPU yet) but I am at 4K now and the HT can be turned off if something don't like it, I will have to learn what those things is/are, not bothered so much atm except while playing with benchmarks.

I don't work for either Intel or AMD you can write what ever you want and have any thought you want, at least in my house.
Did you not do a Diva test first or something so you have something to compare, like, how did your upgrade translate into the Chromaphone world in numbers or instances?
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Old 03-29-2017, 01:16 PM   #109
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Large orchestral projects benefit more from hosting instruments on slave machines via Vienna Ensemble Pro. So 2 cheaper machines would be better than one high performance one.
Good solution but Joe public doesn't like clutter, even pro's don't these days it seems. Big boxes or more boxes, whether PCs or loudspeakers are unpopular. People want simple streamlined, room friendly solutions for better or for worse. Higher cost, less performance as a compromise for space and convenience.
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Old 03-29-2017, 01:23 PM   #110
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Hey Softie!
You actually went for it? congrats! at least on having two computers (or almost, not sure, yet)

If the resolution in gameing is low and having a real GPU, then the difference is zzzz CPU-wise yes (according to reviews, have no GPU yet) but I am at 4K now and the HT can be turned off if something don't like it, I will have to learn what those things is/are, not bothered so much atm except while playing with benchmarks.

I don't work for either Intel or AMD you can write what ever you want and have any thought you want, at least in my house.
Did you not do a Diva test first or something so you have something to compare, like, how did your upgrade translate into the Chromaphone world in numbers or instances?
Maybe it will help on larger projects, that will be harder to gauge as with software synthesis it varies from project to project.

Chromaphone 2 performance is exactly the same regarding the pitch bend CPU overload. That's not to say the i7 might not cope with more instances of the patches used without pitch bend.

I will test Diva though I expect a higher clocked newer i5 would be better than i7 (a comment for people buying new, I'm happy enough with this system anyway).
I do not think hyper threading will benefit any single instances of VSTis. Only the potential for better use of resources of larger projects, maybe.

Despite this happy enough with the performance of the PC, at least for a couple more years and maybe beyond.
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Old 03-29-2017, 01:53 PM   #111
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Good solution but Joe public doesn't like clutter, even pro's don't these days it seems. Big boxes or more boxes, whether PCs or loudspeakers are unpopular. People want simple streamlined, room friendly solutions for better or for worse. Higher cost, less performance as a compromise for space and convenience.
I don't know any professional film composers, or of any, that do not use slaved hosts in their setup. It just seems to be the done thing. It means you can keep every instrument loaded in your template and never have to wait for loading times (unless there's a power cut).

I'm sure there are some smaller-time (is up and coming better?) composers who are using a single machine, but I don't know of anyone making a decent living who does.
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Old 03-29-2017, 01:54 PM   #112
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I will say ditto on happy "enough" for my real life actual usage on the CPU part, not sure I can say or suggest the same in the world of GPUs and gameing, I will get one as soon as AMD cares to reveal their stuff so I can chose either, hopefully in May.. zzz c'mon AMD!
And a few months later I expect something New and Improved to be released as usual.

Also any CPU you get can be overclocked, Intel goes pretty high and my ASUS mobo have something pre made to just click on if I feel like 5Ghz with the push of a button, but, I don't have the need to mess with that or my nerves or, intend to use 20+ Divas.
The turbo is almost on anyway by choice and that is only 4.5Ghz..
And I think Noctua NH-U12S can handle a little OC, but I am not doing it, this year, absolutely not!.

And then we have m.2 SSD support and flashing LEDs, happy times.. jees.

Ps: I am hoping/expecting it beats i5-3570 in default state vs the Divas even if not times x50, it should.. and I am curious.
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Old 03-29-2017, 03:10 PM   #113
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Originally Posted by Judders View Post
I don't know any professional film composers, or of any, that do not use slaved hosts in their setup. It just seems to be the done thing. It means you can keep every instrument loaded in your template and never have to wait for loading times (unless there's a power cut).

I'm sure there are some smaller-time (is up and coming better?) composers who are using a single machine, but I don't know of anyone making a decent living who does.
I like that vision of the market. Successful big name Pros have these lovely big setups, I doubt many forum users do.
Those making a decent living I suggest are in a tiny minority. The vast majority are hobbyists without any serious pretensions.
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Old 03-29-2017, 03:59 PM   #114
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I like that vision of the market. Successful big name Pros have these lovely big setups, I doubt many forum users do.
Those making a decent living I suggest are in a tiny minority. The vast majority are hobbyists without any serious pretensions.
It's pretty cheap to do though. Old Mac mini's are quite popular because of their diminutive size, as well as old PC's because as long as they can connect to LAN and can take a fair amount of RAM they will do the job perfectly well. It's actually a good way to keep old rust buckets going - think of it as conservation!
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Old 03-29-2017, 05:25 PM   #115
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Originally Posted by Judders View Post
It's pretty cheap to do though. Old Mac mini's are quite popular because of their diminutive size, as well as old PC's because as long as they can connect to LAN and can take a fair amount of RAM they will do the job perfectly well. It's actually a good way to keep old rust buckets going - think of it as conservation!
Hmm, build 'em up again,....that's 12 physical cores, 3ghz and above. 32GB ram between them(that could become 72GB at a push with some different ram, and they could all have SSD upgrades, and quiet fans and damping and..) and plenty of noise.....nooooooooo, stop the thoughts!
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Old 04-01-2017, 06:29 AM   #116
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Originally Posted by Judders View Post
I don't know any professional film composers, or of any, that do not use slaved hosts in their setup. It just seems to be the done thing. It means you can keep every instrument loaded in your template and never have to wait for loading times (unless there's a power cut).

I'm sure there are some smaller-time (is up and coming better?) composers who are using a single machine, but I don't know of anyone making a decent living who does.
I don't have a slave, but I'm not a pro, and spend tons of time waiting for things to load... and am constantly dealing with audio drops etc. and cranking buffers etc.
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Old 04-02-2017, 06:04 PM   #117
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Some AMD good stuff, and this guy can speak English!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HX_WEvEzR64
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Old 04-02-2017, 06:11 PM   #118
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I don't have a slave, but I'm not a pro, and spend tons of time waiting for things to load... and am constantly dealing with audio drops etc. and cranking buffers etc.
You can build a PC out of any old junk that meets the minimum specs of your software instruments and alleviate a load of that pain! The most expensive part will probably be Vienna Ensemble Pro (and possibly an iso-booth if the piece of junk you buy/find at the dump is particularly noisy)
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Old 04-05-2017, 05:26 AM   #119
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Originally Posted by Judders View Post
You can build a PC out of any old junk that meets the minimum specs of your software instruments and alleviate a load of that pain! The most expensive part will probably be Vienna Ensemble Pro (and possibly an iso-booth if the piece of junk you buy/find at the dump is particularly noisy)
My issue is more about portability. But will an old junk slave really help much?

What about tuning my phone into a slave? Raspberry Pii slave?
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Old 04-05-2017, 06:22 AM   #120
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My issue is more about portability. But will an old junk slave really help much?

What about tuning my phone into a slave? Raspberry Pii slave?
It's about RAM. As long as you've got the minimum OS and CPU requirements for a software instrument, it will be a great boon to speed. The reason is that you keep that slave's RAM full of samples at all times, so you have zero waiting time for samples to load when you switch projects, and you free up resources for the master machine to run the OS and DAW.
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