Go Back   Cockos Incorporated Forums > REAPER Forums > REAPER General Discussion Forum

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-15-2011, 02:07 AM   #1
xsidcorex
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 5
Default Problem with midi programming in a live band set

I have a reaper (3.74) project that has around 16 songs, all at different bpms, with midi programming for each song. The project is used for a live band set. For different set lists it's necessary to delete time from the project (removing songs that won't be played that night). This is easy by making a selection over the song(s) to be removed, right clicking, and selecting "remove contents of selection (moving late items)".
The issue i'm having is that when I do this (delete time) all of the midi for the songs that remain gets thrown off from where it's supposed to be - it doesn't move where the audio moves. I tried changing the timebase between beats and seconds but that doesn't make a difference for me. Just cutting the audio/midi out without deleting time is not an option because I can't have long gaps between songs on the setlist (the entire file runs through the whole set start to finish, we don't stop and start between songs).
Any help? This is a major pain!

Thanks
xsidcorex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-15-2011, 02:40 AM   #2
Cosmic
Human being with feelings
 
Cosmic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Online
Posts: 4,896
Default

Have you tried ripple editing?
__________________
it aint worth a bop,if it dont got that pop
Cosmic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-15-2011, 06:40 AM   #3
Blechi
Human being with feelings
 
Blechi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Saarlänner
Posts: 1,141
Default

Hi and welcome to REAPERland,

you may want to try if the project-in-project feature (PiP) works for you.
Although it's still in beta stage, it may be of use for your purpose.

First you have to enable the PiP feature. Read here how this is done.

Once PiP is enabled, create (and save) a separate project for each of your songs.

Now create a performance project and drop the project files (.rpp) of the desired songs from the media explorer into a track.
Choose 'Insert project as media item' when REAPER shows you the 'Open RPP choice' window.

hth
Blechi
Blechi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-15-2011, 10:45 AM   #4
xsidcorex
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 5
Default

Thanks everyone! Haven't tried ripple editing and that PIP looks really sweet!

Can you enlighten me on how ripple editing may help out? The PIP thing scares me a little because the set is meant to have no breaks (the 45seconds - 1 minute between each song has audio running through so there is never a break in the music for the entire set). Running PIP would maybe require pauses between projects right? Seems like it may be a bit processor heavy as well to be running whole projects instead of files within a single project. Also in order to run each song as a separate project (in PIP) wouldn't I still have to do the same thing and get rid of the other 15 songs (and their time) in the project that aren't used for each song?
With this project being a tempo/sample/midi track for a live set it's CRUCIAL that it runs glitch free. What would be a small problem in the studio could be a major problem live.

I feel like with previous versions of reaper I could just remove a selection of time and it didn't have this effect - hoping there's a simple solution, I feel like this should be considered a major problem if reaper can't handle removing time and keeping midi in it's appropriate place (in respect to the audio that occupies the same time) after doing so! I am wondering why it's proving difficult to cut time and that time be equally subtracted from all tracks, and not just the audio tracks.
xsidcorex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-15-2011, 11:48 AM   #5
Paradiddle
Human being with feelings
 
Paradiddle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: I am the elephant
Posts: 88
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by xsidcorex View Post
I have a reaper (3.74) project that has around 16 songs, all at different bpms, with midi programming for each song. The project is used for a live band set. For different set lists it's necessary to delete time from the project (removing songs that won't be played that night). This is easy by making a selection over the song(s) to be removed, right clicking, and selecting "remove contents of selection (moving late items)".
The issue i'm having is that when I do this (delete time) all of the midi for the songs that remain gets thrown off from where it's supposed to be - it doesn't move where the audio moves. I tried changing the timebase between beats and seconds but that doesn't make a difference for me. Just cutting the audio/midi out without deleting time is not an option because I can't have long gaps between songs on the setlist (the entire file runs through the whole set start to finish, we don't stop and start between songs).
Any help? This is a major pain!

Thanks
It appears to work for me. With a project containing MIDI and audio, I did this.
On the timeline at the top, click at the beginning of the time to be deleted. Shift-click at the end of the time to be deleted.

Remove contents of selection (moving later items)
Lather, rinse and REAPEat.
Paradiddle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-15-2011, 12:07 PM   #6
Paradiddle
Human being with feelings
 
Paradiddle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: I am the elephant
Posts: 88
Default

Check Locked Settings.
Paradiddle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2011, 01:48 AM   #7
xsidcorex
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 5
Default

Enabled ripple editing and no change. Tried toggling between seconds and beats for timebase for the project and no change. Also tried paradiddle's highlight section/remove contents method and still no dice. The midi track isn't locked but it's still not moving in sync with the audio when I remove a time selection. I'm not talking it's off by a couple seconds. It's like a song and a half off.

More suggestions? Show is tomorrow!
xsidcorex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2011, 04:26 AM   #8
Cableaddict
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,910
Default

xsidcorex,

This is off-topic, but I'm curious:

Why do you even want this as midi? Wouldn't it be easier, and safer, to turn them all into audio files? You could then run them from something like Traktor, and be able to re-arrange them a will. (that's what I do)

You could even pre-program loop-points, if so needed, in case you decide to extend a solo. You can change tempos, etc. The only thing you can't do is change the mix on-the-fly.

As a computer-based live performer, I'm curious to hear your thoughts & reasoning.
Cableaddict is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2011, 12:41 AM   #9
xsidcorex
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 5
Default

If it were an instrument/sound midi track I would totally just import a bounce of the midi and make it an audio track. This midi track, however, controls our 122 channels of dmx lighting in real time on stage, and is programmed to do EXACTLY what I need it to do WHEN I need it to do it. Thus you can see why spending countless hours on this intensely complicated programming makes me so bummed that something as simple as cutting time in reaper is the only issue that stands in my way.
xsidcorex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2011, 01:08 AM   #10
gwok
Human being with feelings
 
gwok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: canada
Posts: 3,396
Default

you can try using marker actions or caveman's arranger plugin to jump to different places in your project. IMO it would be the ideal way except for the fact that it it might not perform very well and hence would be totally useless. It's worth a try though, marker actions are real cool

http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=67175

http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.p...marker+actions

if it runs stable, then one of these way would be optimal (imo )

Last edited by gwok; 01-17-2011 at 01:14 AM.
gwok is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2011, 01:45 AM   #11
Cableaddict
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,910
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by xsidcorex View Post
If it were an instrument/sound midi track I would totally just import a bounce of the midi and make it an audio track. This midi track, however, controls our 122 channels of dmx lighting in real time on stage, and is programmed to do EXACTLY what I need it to do WHEN I need it to do it. Thus you can see why spending countless hours on this intensely complicated programming makes me so bummed that something as simple as cutting time in reaper is the only issue that stands in my way.
Ah.

FWIW, there is at least one DJ software that lets you also run lighting cues(and videos decks) from it. (though I forget which one.) There's even one with full built-in DMX. You might want to research this & consider it as an option.
Cableaddict is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2011, 10:19 PM   #12
xsidcorex
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 5
Default

gwok you just made MY LIFE!

Works like a charm and I can do any playlist I want now without having to mess with cutting time at all!

Phew
xsidcorex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-18-2011, 01:57 AM   #13
gwok
Human being with feelings
 
gwok's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: canada
Posts: 3,396
Default

Nice!
Btw, if your using marker actions, you can save marker sets if you want to keep different arrangements. If your using midi to trigger markers you can save your tracks as track templates.

This will allow you to keep a catalogue of any past arrangements available for easy access.

Ps. Please test the shit out of jumping around in a project like this,, cause it'd suck for it to take crapper in a live situation

Oh ya, another thing that might help stability. Is turn on smooth seek, and set it to 2 or 4 beats or so, and set your trigger ahead of the actual change. I found the gives reaps sone time to "get ready" for the change instead of just slamming it with the trigger right at the change.
The audible result should be no different, but in my experience it makes reaps a little happier to have sone advance notice of the upcoming change.


Glad it worked out for ya

Last edited by gwok; 01-18-2011 at 02:06 AM.
gwok is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 02:47 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.