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Old 02-04-2016, 03:17 PM   #1
X-Tech
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Default Conclusion after months of use of REAPER for tryouts in creating electronic music

Reaper is wonderfull with all customization and options and a lot custom thing which can be attached here. Addictive i spend so much time for customizing, amazing software at each category in making music but still few things feels uncomplete so i cant use this DAW so freely as other DAWS for making electronic music. In 99% Reaper is Uber Cool but this 1% is pain and cant allow me to exceed limits which is needed for free operations on items. Really only three things are here key to coomplete this in matter of completely free items operation for creating electronic music - whole rest things CONNECTED to electronic music creation is easy to work-around with this what Reaper offers.

1(COPYING ALL ENVELOPE CHANGES under SELECTED POOLED MIDI ITEM into POOLED COPIES)
No way to put all envelope changes under single item into all other items of this category (pooled) by one operation. So basically when i make some item as my melodical (midi) and (envelopes) element for music and i want to change this in all their copies - this is impossible. I cant change one item envelopes and attach this change to the same items on whole PROJECT...this is painfull ! In electronic music i think by MUSIC elements as - midi item structure joined to envelopes struture under this element - as one part in whole arrange in copies. Reaper should allow to glue envelopes structure under pooled item as one piece. 2 ways to get that - byt allow to edit vst parameters in midi editor event area or by some type of special glue between items and envelopes. Special type of glueing for item as option - which selected always make this type of item as mirror in midi and envelope structure under it in copies of this item. Just it. (maybe some script for copy all envlopes changes under selected pooled to all other pooled as little workaround)


2 (SMART ITEMS IN PARENT TRACKS)
Reaper should be able to pool items in parent track as form of a grab of elements under their area on children tracks. This should be special otpions for mark special type of item placed on parent track. So when i basically create this item in parent track and copy this item reaper should now copy elements in children track too (on area of this item in parent) in same rule as pooled are midi notes in items - this rule would be about - position of all items in children tracks under item on parent with "cut" edges of these children items on area of item on parent track edges. In this way you basically can use children tracks in way as used can be midi item tracks with midi content for pooling - but this will be way to pooling items on parent track by position of items on children tracks under item on parent track.

Imagine making drum bar or other structure - on children tracks PUT kick, snare, hihat and make one item on parent track above these children track which contain pattern of kick,snare,hihat. Now copy this parent track item and childrens under this will be copied too. Edit somehow items on children track under this item on parent and what ? If this item is pooled position of items on children track under this parent item copies will be changed like in mirror. This is all about !

Easier way to explain: This items could work as container of content of children tracks under them - This is basically change items in parent tracks into pooled REGION-items of their content which is children tracks content - so basically it allow create infinite POOLED region-items based on items in parent folders (!)
With ability to add option which i mentioned in point 1 this could be bomb for item operations. I know there is a script which allow to make multiple regions but this script does not work in that way as i mentioned. My way is about simple and clear view of things and once change multiple items on children tracks by operation under one item in parent track - copy and edit content under items on parent tracks in matter of one click (pooling could be done by some kind of prefix in name with number in matter of workaround by script)) UNPOOL would be done if any item under parent track item would be repositioned or removed in way as midi pooling works. This whole script machine would allow copy many items and their envelopes under items on parent track by one click. I'm almost sure this is possible to do with some script.


3 (MIXER I/O DOTS or POINTS for FAST send VIEW - or QUICK I/O view when TRACK SELECTED )
Mixer should have some kind of view of track sends in the SIMPLE graphical way like - dots or points which appear only when specific track is selected - as option for track. Simply - when you select one track in mixer now you should be able to see dots on tracks into which you actuall track sending from this track. Basically in this view you can use ultra small mixer track presets and see into which track sending audio signal without big tracks with I/O view - so more mixer tracks could be viewed easly i think even 4-8 x more at screen. One dot mono - 2 dots stereo.
Color = 1-12 for each pair of channel 1-24. I think super handy.
(I think workaround and even better - by script should be small little window above mixer track which show i/o when track is clicked. Other way to workaround - by change mixer selected track into narrow style to see all things in track as vst and i/o and back to previous style of track when unselect)




Thats it. Rest many things is easy to work around. I found a lot of work arounds for other things but these still waiting for solutions.
I think 1 and 3 are simplest to workaround by some simple scripts - second need more attention on data which is content of items on children tracks under item on parent track.

I guess everything is possible in Reaper. Reaper is WOW. Thats all.


and EXTRA info:
I read once some peoples complaining about midi editor - with actions i can make my midi editor ultra powerfull with my actions - simply what i want - other midi editors in daws not so good. Reaper nr 1

Last edited by X-Tech; 02-04-2016 at 04:59 PM.
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Old 02-04-2016, 03:29 PM   #2
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Thanks for the detail! I'm sure there will be some along soon to discuss this further.
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Old 02-05-2016, 12:09 PM   #3
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I really like the colored dots for seeing routing. I quess the routing matrix is only one click away though.
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Old 02-05-2016, 12:33 PM   #4
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THX for reply.

I'm not sure dots is perfect idea in most cases especially when there is lot of tracks and they go out of screen - it's only a concept BUT if add to this little half-invicible lines from points to selected track (as option) it could work perfect - visually.









Something which show fast i/o of track when track selected is important. Narrow style of mixer track when track is selected and back to previous style when is unselected is seriously far than enough "possible action" in my opinion cause show i/o and vst list but not perfect with other - themes - or if not style change - just something which always show i/o when track selected and back to previous original track view when unselected as action - or show its I/O in small simple window - thats it - but still not perfect. It's all about quick view of i/o as track extra option just it.


Another my idea is something like clone/mirror/ghost track i guess perfect for all this. This track could be like monster in "Body Snatchers" movie XD When user select any track this track would work as mirror of selected track and show this selected track inside - especially super usable cause no dots needed, no i/o windows - just track which act like mirror of selected track in user selected mixer style - for me this style of this track could ne "narrow" with show i/o and vst list or different. This could be yeah Mirror track as option - this track would behave like "Thing" movie monster which assmilate the selected target in this case - track to show inside of selected track and control this track insides - no matter of other selected track - mixer style if they small/showing i/o, vst - no matter. Clone/mirror track could show inside of any selected in user prefered style as always Reaper does - total customization. Mhmm yeap. Imagine you can use multiple micro style of tracks - get lots of them and show their selected insides in one mirror track in different track mixer style which allow to see inside of this track. Mhmm perfect i think but yeah - changing track size at selection - as some action or auto resize track to show vst/i/o when selected is simply far enough too but probably will not work with all track styles.

Last edited by X-Tech; 02-05-2016 at 01:36 PM.
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Old 02-05-2016, 06:23 PM   #5
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That's a good point about the envelopes and pooled items. Right now I think that while Reaper's automation system is perfectly good for general mixing tasks, it really is quite barebones when it comes to electronic/synthesised music, or any music in general which tends to use lots of small automation tweaks.

(Ghosted) Automation items would be one answer to this problem. I'm not sure how eager the devs are to tackle this, though. It might not even be possible without some serious tweaks to the way items are handled in general, as the Reaper philosophy is to not differentiate between MIDI and audio items.

Maybe in Reaper 6? One can hope.
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Old 02-06-2016, 09:12 AM   #6
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Yes. It's basically for each genre - give more needed control during arrange.

Anyway i'm sure 1,2,3 is (mostly 1,3 - 3 in version - mirror track or resize selected in mixer or change mixer STYLE of selected to selected id of style) is rather almost possible to make by actions only (some workaround) - but requiring some operations on variables and conditions according my algorithm idea - so need to be done in lua or eel for extra math operations. I got algorithm in my head for 1 and 3 and almost for 2 based only on actions and simple math operation. I downloaded some LUA end EEL tutorials maybe i get it in free momment and do something - or someone will be faster. I get simple algorithms just in head just need to translate it into some properly working code- if i learn eel or lua properly for this needs.

FOR1 i founded algorithm in Reaper users data base on the net - but this code is working only on items of same name and require to change each prototyPe item name + work only on single selected envelope. Incomplite. It should be done fast at whole envelopes under selected item and his pooled copies - when action run after select one item. This is what is about. I know this could be work perfect when implemented into Reaper (as some selected item option which give it new glueing character) but workarounds could be good alternative for a while and yeah this dots system with half invicible lines (both as options) could be fast workflow accelerator in many cases but mirror/ghost track is another interersting alternative too - more clearly visually - same as changing selected track mixer style to selected as (id) and back to origin when unselected.

Last edited by X-Tech; 02-06-2016 at 09:30 AM.
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Old 02-06-2016, 04:06 PM   #7
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absolutely agree on the automation editing

this is THE killer
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Old 02-06-2016, 05:51 PM   #8
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dotted concepts.
pooled children.
luv it?
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Old 02-07-2016, 03:36 AM   #9
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What about "real" Non-destructive glue?
Let's vote: http://forum.cockos.com/project.php?issueid=5665
http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=172507

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Old 02-07-2016, 05:28 AM   #10
X-Tech
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@UP:

Hey in this topic i informed about 2 necessary things - maybe threee (+3 point - but not so important in priority) in matter of overall music creation and arrange in Reaper. I mean glue between SELECTED pooled midi item envelopes as option to send this envelopes under this item to this pooled item copies - this kind of "glue" which gives new type of item or operation type when toggled for selected pooled item which is so important in overall creating electronic music. 2nd thing (2nd point in this topic) is something like "Folder Items" at parent tracks which pooled and changed will send changes into all pooled copies - changes into children tracks under this "Folder Items"

I'm not sure what you introduced at screens but i think it's one of many detail things - rather not big keys in arrange of music and creation at this momment i guess. 1,2 point of my topic i think would change a lot (by add big/gigantic new things) in arrangeing and creating music in REAPER

Last edited by X-Tech; 02-07-2016 at 05:52 AM.
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Old 02-07-2016, 04:39 PM   #11
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how come automation and envelopes aren't treated as media items?
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Old 02-07-2016, 06:21 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reapercurious View Post
how come automation and envelopes aren't treated as media items?
+1. Is there a feature request for this?
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