How to make knob stacks and color for project play rate control when not 1.0 work?

[Breeder]

See how White Tie's Imperial's play rate knob changes color when modified:


Well, Janne83's Universe2014 doesn't do that (yes, I've checked colors in theme tweak/configuration window, color is red and if this thing worked, it would be clearly visible):


I've tried playing both with WALTER and pink/yellow lines in knob stack but I just can't make it work :/

Could somebody more knowable explain if this is even possible?
The theme is using this knob_stack.png (this is from the original Janne83's theme, you can also get it if you download his theme) and this is the WALTER for transport layout (also from original theme):

clear trans.*

front set trans.rate set trans.rate.fader trans.bpm.tap trans.bpm.edit

set trans.size [1041 44]
set trans.size.minmax [336 44 1280 300]
set trans.size.dockedheight [44]

set trans.status w<1120 [376 6 220 16 0 0 0 0] [376 6 220 32 0 0 0 0]
set trans.status.margin [6 0 6 0 0.5]
set trans.status.color [203 203 203]

set trans.rate.fader ?trans_flags&2 [854 6 32 32 0 0 0 0]
set trans.rate.fader.fadermode [1]
set trans.rate.fader.color [203 203 203]
set trans.rate ?trans_flags&2 [740 6 110 32 0 0 0 0]
set trans.rate.margin [6 0 6 0 0.5]
set trans.rate.color [203 203 203]

set trans.sel w<1120 [376 22 220 16 0 0 0 0] [810 6 220 32 1 0 1 0]
set trans.sel.margin [6 0 6 0 0.5]
set trans.sel.color [203 203 203]

set trans.curtimesig ?trans_flags&4 [680 6 50 32 0 0 0 0]
set trans.curtimesig.margin [0 0 0 0 0.5]
set trans.curtimesig.color [203 203 203]

set trans.bpm.tap [606 6 64 32 0 0 0 0]
set trans.bpm.tap.margin [0 0 28 0 0.5]
set trans.bpm.tap.color [203 203 203]

set trans.bpm.edit [634 6 36 32 0 0 0 0]
set trans.bpm.edit.margin [3 0 0 0 0.5]
set trans.bpm.edit.color [203 203 203]

set trans.rew [10 6 36 36 0 0 0 0]
set trans.stop [50 6 36 36 0 0 0 0]
set trans.pause [90 6 36 36 0 0 0 0]
set trans.play [130 6 36 36 0 0 0 0]
set trans.fwd [170 6 36 36 0 0 0 0]
set trans.rec [210 6 36 36 0 0 0 0]
set trans.repeat [250 6 36 36 0 0 0 0]

set trans.automode [306 6 50 36 0 0 0 0]

[Janne83]

Knobstacks dont work with these color tinting options in Reaper (the one you mention and also the automation colors when in read or write).

One option to overcome this is to combine the knob stack (use only the moving part- for instance only the stripe part of the knob without the bg) and the *knob_large small.png (the old style knob bg) for back ground- but theres a catch- not all knobs in reaper have an independent component- for instance the playrate one uses the knob_stack.png which is connected with the gen_knob_lrge/small that is used within several components in Reaper interface- The large knob bg is used in REaSmpl5k and if you change it all knobs in the sample get distorted.

So its a compromise- things get silly pretty fast. I decided to use a full knob stack, because the color tinting bothered me more than helped.


PS If Im honest I more or less gave up on theming in Reaper because of this kind of quirks- there are just too many half-baked compromises in its current iteration- as much as I wanted to achieve the wanted result there is always a silly little detail that stops me.
Regards J

[+NRG]

Originally Posted by Janne83

PS If Im honest I more or less gave up on theming in Reaper because of this kind of quirks- there are just too many half-baked compromises in its current iteration- as much as I wanted to achieve the wanted result there is always a silly little detail that stops me.
Regards J

That's too bad because you have made some of the very best / most usable Reaper Themes! I was looking forward to V5 updates of some of your previous themes or your new creations...

[Sju]

Haven't checked out how WT achieves the tint, but it seems to me that he's using the native knob line function instead of a knob stack, and it might include a way to tint the non-zero state? I could be wrong though. The way I achieved the "alert color" function in the rate knob stack in Symbiosis is I had to make a stupid amount of individual knob states, so even the slightest (non-middle) position would show the colored state on the knob. And even that doesn't always work.

Originally Posted by Janne83

So its a compromise- things get silly pretty fast.

PS If Im honest I more or less gave up on theming in Reaper because of this kind of quirks- there are just too many half-baked compromises in its current iteration- as much as I wanted to achieve the wanted result there is always a silly little detail that stops me.
Regards J

Very much agreed. A lot of flexibility for sure, but still very much remains out of control of the themer. Small things mostly, but quite many small things, and some of them critical for achieving a certain feel etc... Well, I'll release the next version soon, and them I'm done for, at least for the moment.

[hopi]

Hey Breeder... here's a thought:

[and maybe I can help do the graphics if you have a problem with my idea]

Lets think about it this way first and then you can see how my scheme would apply to your needs...

Ok ... say the png stack is 101 frames... which means at frame 51 the indicator is straight up and down at the top of the knob... showing no playrate change.

Then frames less than 51 are playrates less and frames more than 51 are playrates more... right?

OK so let's say we color all the png stack frames less than 51 to have a green overlay color and all frames more than 51 to have a red overlay color.

You see???

Now IF I had the knob file used in knobman to make a given stack, it would be easy to do this...

Even with only the actual png stack it would still be possible but more work.

IF you would like help with it let me know.

PS: here is a screen shot to illustrate the concept.

[IMG]http://imagizer.**************/v2/xq90/540/rSJLpG.png[/IMG]

[EvilDragon]

Right, the only way would be embedding the tint in the knobstack itself.

Actually that's quite a simple solution, hah. But it does require to have a separate image just for the playrate control.

[hopi]

ED... hahaha you posted right after I added my PS: and image of the idea...

It really could be fairly easy to do this

[Breeder]

Originally Posted by Janne83

Knobstacks dont work with these color tinting options in Reaper (the one you mention and also the automation colors when in read or write).

PS If Im honest I more or less gave up on theming in Reaper because of this kind of quirks- there are just too many half-baked compromises in its current iteration- as much as I wanted to achieve the wanted result there is always a silly little detail that stops me.
Regards J

Hey Janne! Thanks for the answer. I completely get you about quirks when it comes to customizing - a lot of stuff are still no there yet. Not to mention that WALTER, while powerful, seem a bit tedious to use if you're not into coding. I think that's one of the main reasons we don't see that many themes around as we used to. Coding good TCP layouts is not really easy (when I was still newbie at coding in general, it took me quite a while to create my perfect layout )

Really, sorry to hear you won't be doing more themes or updating your old ones. I didn't properly tried your themes up till now, but when I did, I must confess you did hell of a job on them. Not to mention they are all pretty much finished besides MIDI track list icons (rare thing these days). I'm modding some colors and a few images, but nothing major - might share it when I finish it. So thanks for the Universe2014

Originally Posted by Sju

Haven't checked out how WT achieves the tint, but it seems to me that he's using the native knob line function instead of a knob stack, and it might include a way to tint the non-zero state? I could be wrong though. The way I achieved the "alert color" function in the rate knob stack in Symbiosis is I had to make a stupid amount of individual knob states, so even the slightest (non-middle) position would show the colored state on the knob. And even that doesn't always work.

Yup, White Ties doesn't use knob stacks...it seems easy to do it without them.

Originally Posted by Sju

I had to make a stupid amount of individual knob states, so even the slightest (non-middle) position would show the colored state on the knob. And even that doesn't always work.

Originally Posted by hopi

Hey Breeder... here's a thought:
OK so let's say we color all the png stack frames less than 51 to have a green overlay color and all frames more than 51 to have a red overlay color.

Yup, awesome idea guys! One thing I'm not really sure about is if knob_stack.png is used for some other stuff besides transport knob? When Stu says it doesn't always work properly, maybe he means that?

Hopi, thanks for the offer to help, while I suck at GUI most of the time, I think this should be fairly easy so no need to waste your time - some linked layers over original png should suffice I guess

I'll give it a try when I find the time and let you know (I'll probably just share the whole mod of Universe2014 if Janne allows it. It's really nothing special, but some color changes, mostly to MIDI editor. I'll probably do some layout changes too)

[hopi]

Breeder.... I have enuff time to waste for this week so np, if you want my help...
Again, what would make it the most easy and likely produce the best ressults would be if the knobman file for the png stack could be given to me. Along with that, you could then tell me the colors you like to see...

IF I had all that, I could set up a knobman file that you and or others could use to produce this kind of png stack in many variations.... and\or I could give you the knobman file combined with a PSD file.

This stuff is easy pi for me and you and others have been so much help over the years I'd be more than happy to do it.

PS... so hey, I went and dl'd the Jane83 2014 dark theme and for playrate control I get a slider... how do you get a knob?

[Janne83]

Originally Posted by +NRG

That's too bad because you have made some of the very best / most usable Reaper Themes! I was looking forward to V5 updates of some of your previous themes or your new creations...

Well I actually have 2 themes for v5 all packed and ready.



and



but theyve been waiting for v5 release for almost 5 months now.I was waiting and hoping that some more functionality would be addded during the beta period but nothing was done in this regard.

I can post them if you like but im afraid they will bring confusion to folk who use v4 (the colors and transpareny wont function properly in v4). Im somehow hoping v5 will be officialy released soon, since it in RC.(thats why i posted this topic- i will make a separate one wehn v5 is released)

EDIT: Heres a zip with both themes if anyone would like them. THey are completed and have a ton of different layouts.
https://stash.reaper.fm/theme/1580/JanneVPack.zip

Enjoy J

[Breeder]

Originally Posted by Janne83

EDIT: Heres a zip with both themes if anyone would like them. THey are completed and have a ton of different layouts.
https://stash.reaper.fm/theme/1580/JanneVPack.zip

Enjoy J

Awesome!

[+NRG]

Originally Posted by Janne83

EDIT: Heres a zip with both themes if anyone would like them. THey are completed and have a ton of different layouts.
https://stash.reaper.fm/theme/1580/JanneVPack.zip

Enjoy J

Thank you! They look awesome!!!

[amagalma]

This was something that I wanted to change in my own mod of Janne's theme.

I did it. If you want you can use this red knob stack. Or change it to the color you like with this Gimp xcf file.

Cheers!