Can't get playback on Saffire 56 at 88.2khz

GordonBennett · 08-31-2015, 08:57 AM

Picked up the Saffire 56 at the weekend and have managed to get my head around everything other than one thing - I can't seem to get anything to playback at 88.2Khz...

I have changed the settings in the Saffire Mix Control to 88.2khz / 24-bit and loaded a Reaper 5 project at the same settings but can't hear anything on playback. The meters within Mix Control don't register anything, suggesting it's something going amiss between the master track and Mix Control. Sync Source set to internal, Sync Status shows locked, Firewire Driver shows In Use when I play back and Connected when stopped.

Tested and I am able to record at 88.2khz (confirmed via the item properties), it's just the playback that's bust.

Change down to 44.1khz in Reaper and playback is not a problem, even for an item recorded at 88.2khz.

Connected at the computer end with a 4-pin Firewire 400 cable, not that I can see that matters.

So really scratching my head and would appreciate any help.

Thanks

GordonBennett · 09-03-2015, 04:46 AM

Anyone able to share any thoughts on this please?

Simonblarkin · 09-04-2015, 08:38 PM

Are the audio settings within reaper set to 88.2 or are they still set to 44.1. There's a box in the audio settings to request sample rate.....

Sounds obvious i know but just trying ideas.....

GordonBennett · 09-05-2015, 12:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Simonblarkin

Are the audio settings within reaper set to 88.2 or are they still set to 44.1. There's a box in the audio settings to request sample rate.....

Sounds obvious i know but just trying ideas.....

Thanks for the response.

The Project sample rate option in Project Settings is ticked and set to 88200.

Within the Device settings in the Reaper Preferences, Request sample rate is ticked and set to 88200; Request block size is ticked and set to 256.

The above tie in to the settings in Mix Control.

Some additional information, to clarify one point:
- When I press play, Reaper usually appears to be trying to play the audio. The cursor moves along the TCP and the Master meter registers the sound. However, from time-to-time, Reaper won't even play and appears to hang - the cursor moves forward a tiny fraction and stops, with the Transport bar showing "[Buffering]".

serr · 09-05-2015, 07:52 AM

It really sounds like you have identified a hardware failure on the Saffire. It sounds like it's sample rate clock is not running at the 88.2k setting.

Do you have another audio interface that you could try to clock from? Word clock out would be best but even over a digital audio connection to deliver sync.

If the Saffire runs at 88.2k when clocked externally but not with its internal clock - that would verify hardware failure on the Saffire. This of course might simply not function at all depending on where in the circuits the failure is (assuming the failure theory is correct) but it's something further to try. (Not for a permanent workaround, but to help identify what's going on.)

Ollie · 09-05-2015, 09:09 AM

Does it work at 96kHz?

serr · 09-05-2015, 10:10 AM

PS. My above comment assumes 96k is working as expected. (As well as 44.1k & 48k of course.)

Also, that you can record at 88.2k clearly means the unit's clock operates at 88.2k. Any hardware failure (if that theory is correct) would be in the selection/switching logic.

GordonBennett · 09-05-2015, 10:23 AM

I got playback to work at 48Khz although it seemed to have sped up, with a slight increase in pitch. Odd.

88.2Khz and 96Khz the cursor moved but no playback.

176.4Khz and 192Khz froze the cursor. I then couldn't reset back to 44.1Khz.

I also had a moment earlier where I changed t0 176.4Khz and got some error message in Mix Control about bus overload (not the exact phrase that was used but something along those lines). Reaper and Mix Control ceased to recognise the device being there and I had to reboot.

I think perhaps this is one to take back and get a replacement. I assume shops swap faulty products rather than needing to send to Focusrite.

Only other device I have is a Pod X3 Pro so not sure that's going to help much. I'm a little bit lost when it comes to digital connections and clocking etc, so perhaps there is something I can do?

karbomusic · 09-05-2015, 10:25 AM

Quote:

I have changed the settings in the Saffire Mix Control to 88.2khz / 24-bit and loaded a Reaper 5 project at the same settings but can't hear anything on playback.

Load the Reaper project *first, then click the sound card info text at the top-right of the TCP/Arrange window to get to the Audio Device preferences, click the "ASIO Configuration" button to take you to the sound card properties and change the sample rate that way. If you can't change it or it flips back as soon as you change it, something else already has the card's settings locked. Usually, if reaper won't playback like you described, it is because something else already has control using settings that don't align with the settings Reaper needs to use and Reaper can't playback because of it.

*Changing sound card settings outside of reaper, then launching reaper is not the same thing as accessing that same control panel 'through' Reaper. When going through Reaper, Reaper owns the rights to the sound card (if it can get them) for lack of a better term. Also check the default project settings and consider setting that to your desired rate and saving.

serr · 09-05-2015, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GordonBennett

I got playback to work at 48Khz although it seemed to have sped up, with a slight increase in pitch. Odd.

88.2Khz and 96Khz the cursor moved but no playback.

176.4Khz and 192Khz froze the cursor. I then couldn't reset back to 44.1Khz.

I also had a moment earlier where I changed t0 176.4Khz and got some error message in Mix Control about bus overload (not the exact phrase that was used but something along those lines). Reaper and Mix Control ceased to recognise the device being there and I had to reboot.

I think perhaps this is one to take back and get a replacement. I assume shops swap faulty products rather than needing to send to Focusrite.

Only other device I have is a Pod X3 Pro so not sure that's going to help much. I'm a little bit lost when it comes to digital connections and clocking etc, so perhaps there is something I can do?

OK, that's a different scenario then.
That ALL HD audio is having trouble suggests system overload.

I know that a 256 sample block size should be big enough and all...
But, just for an experiment, increase the block size to an obvious large value like 1024 samples and try it again.

If that works, then it's a resource thing.
There MAY be a way to get your block size lower again for any live work. But you may in fact find that you need to use lower sample rates (like 48k) for live sound or live performance work and can only work with HD audio in a studio tracking setting with a larger block size (when live monitoring through the system is not needed).

GordonBennett · 09-05-2015, 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by serr

OK, that's a different scenario then.
That ALL HD audio is having trouble suggests system overload.

I know that a 256 sample block size should be big enough and all...
But, just for an experiment, increase the block size to an obvious large value like 1024 samples and try it again.

If that works, then it's a resource thing.
There MAY be a way to get your block size lower again for any live work. But you may in fact find that you need to use lower sample rates (like 48k) for live sound or live performance work and can only work with HD audio in a studio tracking setting with a larger block size (when live monitoring through the system is not needed).

I've been playing around with block sizes all along and not had success.

If by system overload, you mean not enough oomph in my PC, I'd be surprised - I'm running at i7 3770k @ 3.9Ghz and 16GB RAM (I built the computer myself, so it's all decent stuff).

Could the fact I'm running through Firewire 400 rather than 800 be an issue?

serr · 09-05-2015, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GordonBennett

I've been playing around with block sizes all along and not had success.

If by system overload, you mean not enough oomph in my PC, I'd be surprised - I'm running at i7 3770k @ 3.9Ghz and 16GB RAM (I built the computer myself, so it's all decent stuff).

Could the fact I'm running through Firewire 400 rather than 800 be an issue?

FW400 is not a problem. 2 channels of 24/96 is about 4.5mb/sec (m-bits that is. FW400 is 400 m-bits/sec)

So... no change at 1024 samples?

Investigating the driver install again is all I can think of.
I don't see an obvious mistake. I don't own any Focusrite gear, so no inside tricks to share.

Just maybe...
Try unchecking the sample rate box in Preferences/Audio/Device. This tells Reaper to give control to other apps. Then make sure it is set with the Saffire control panel. If the Saffire control panel has a setting for block size (system I/O), you can try the same for that.

After that, maybe verify the driver install one more time with their tech support and then call it broken.