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Old 07-29-2008, 03:45 PM   #1
martygras
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Default Can't stop listening. AAAARRRGHH

I've been recording for many years and am starting to have a problem shutting off the "engineering" portion of my brain. Everyday noises that used to be ignored are now bombarding me and I can't seem to filter this out. It even makes it hard to get to sleep. It's as if I am in mixdown mode all the time.

Unfortunately I rarely drink alcohol and that's probably one of the first things someone will recommend.

Any ideas? Sometimes it drive me nuts.
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Old 07-29-2008, 03:52 PM   #2
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White noise generator (or the cheap option: box fan).

Helps me sleep.
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Old 07-29-2008, 03:54 PM   #3
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+1 for fan, can't sleep without the sound.
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Old 07-29-2008, 04:03 PM   #4
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hmm you sound like all the people who use DAW's or play any type of musical instrument.

They forget that virtually no one cares about any of that stuff, unless it impairs enjoying the moment they want to access.

Other than that, all the discussion about anything mix this / sound that / bla bla bla is totally pointless.

Again, unless what you're creating / enjoying sounds like it A) Can't be heard B) disturbs the moment of the music C) No one really cares. Just pay for my gas.
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Old 07-29-2008, 04:46 PM   #5
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sometimes almost every noise i hear is considered from a musical viewpoint. it drives me nuts too.

on a more serious note you may be suffering from some kind of anxiety. i get anxiety if i have lots of unfinished projects on the go especially if they are not going too well. if i get myself all tied up over these things i go out on a long cycle ride(i'm a keen cyclist) which is usually a great release and a good head clearing exercise. any kind of sport is great for switching your mind into a different gear.

as for sleeping i find that hearing people talking helps. i usually put a familiar dvd on my pc and turn the screen off if i cant get to sleep.
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Old 07-29-2008, 04:58 PM   #6
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Exercise! I play tennis.
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Old 07-29-2008, 05:04 PM   #7
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Meditation - now often called relaxation therapy - doesn't have to have any spiritual or religious connotations and is an excellent method reducing the clutter of conscious thoughts. Incredibly easy to do, all it takes is practice, most of which is just practicing chilling out.

If you drink coffee try reducing your intake.

I also like going to sleep listening to relaxing and familiar music - Eno's Music for airports in particular
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Old 07-29-2008, 05:18 PM   #8
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Another vote for exercise. I find myself jittery, edgy and sometimes on the verge of paranoia after a full day of DAW work or intense listening. A walk, run or some other physically involving activity sets me to right. I think the unfiltered sunlight helps too as most places I work at have little to no natural light.
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Old 07-29-2008, 06:54 PM   #9
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It's a curse I tell ya. I have it too. Not to the point where I can't sleep. I only have that when I'm writing music. It's just that I can't really enjoy music purely for pleasure anymore. It's been like that for years now. When I hear a truly great sounding recording [or any music for that matter], I go into analyze mode and work through why it sounds so good, instead of just enjoying it. Listening to music has become a study for me, not an enjoyable listen in a pure sense. It's like making movies- once you study and know the formula of how a film is put together, it's hard to watch a movie for enjoyments sake anymore.

As for sleep problems, try playing classical music at a very low, almost inaudible, level. It's been said this will aid you off to sleep. I've tried it and it does work. Having music cable channels helps make it convienient. Good luck.

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Old 07-29-2008, 06:58 PM   #10
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Sorry, but I opt for the booze Just kidding. Exercise, as mentioned, does wonders.
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Old 07-30-2008, 03:09 AM   #11
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Footie, man! Trust me, you will have A LOT more people to have arguments with than daw people (to use up your energy), unless you live in the US...
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Old 07-30-2008, 08:00 AM   #12
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Radio 4 (BBC) - talking - talking about something interesting specifically - although you do sometimes wonder what mics they're using and the like...

I think generally "do something else" seems to be the main point of most people's thoughts.
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Old 07-30-2008, 08:33 AM   #13
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Thanks gang.
Tried the fan for white noise and it helped a lot.
As for the coffee, yeah I'm a caffeine-aholic but I should probably taper off a bit.

As for exercise, tennis sounds like fun and I haven't played for 15 years so I'll be starting over.

You guys rock.
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Old 07-30-2008, 08:50 AM   #14
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I vote for goatse.cx
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Old 07-30-2008, 09:36 AM   #15
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http://www.amazon.com/Marpac-SleepMa.../dp/B000KUHFGM

I too suffer from being annoyed by small noises. This thing is the best $50 you can spend. Because its mechanical there are no looping points to drive you crazy and the ability to adjust the volume and tone is great. The problem with using fans is that they are no good in cold weather.

Here's a good write up:
The Marpac Sleep Mate 980 with its soothing fan-like sound is the most popular of all white noise machines. The Sleep Mate is the "Original" sound conditioner, developed and patented over 45 years ago. It combines compact size and economical price with dependable service. Marpac white noise machines have proven to be well received by consumers with the highest quality sounds and the lowest rate of returns. More information about white noise machines can be found at this website.

The Marpac Sleep Mate models produce a smooth fan like sound that most people find pleasing. In our years of selling white noise machines, the SleepMate has proven to be the most popular choice. The Sleep Mate does not loop (loop means - to play a short segment of sound over and over) like most other models. Getting a machine that doesn't loop is really important. If you can detect a repetitive quality in the sound (such as a chirp that repeats over and over every 5 seconds), then that can be as annoying as the sound you are trying to mask. Again, the Sleepmate is one of the few machines on the market that doesn't loop.

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Old 07-30-2008, 11:54 AM   #16
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Sometimes, I absolutely hate listening to old mixes that I've done. I'm constantly critiquing myself and second guessing myself, saying stuff like...."oh, that guitar was a tad too soft right there....Damn!!! That has a tad too much reverb on that vocal." So, I try my best not to listen to old mixes that I did, because I'll drive myself insane. This is one of the reasons, when me and my partner owned a studio together, I let him have all the mixing duties while I stuck to the final mastering duties and tracking duties. For some reason, my mastering doesn't bother me afterwards as much as my mixing.

When you mix something, you become too familiar with it and you have too many options of what you can do to the mix. I find I usually enjoy my mixes more the less time I spend on mixing them. Keeping it simple and not agonizing over every little detail can be really good for your sanity is what I found. Then go back to it in a week or so and listen to it again, and then make minor tweaks when you're not so familiar with what you originally did.

When I would listen to some of my partner's mixes, I would say...damn, that mix sounds good....what did you do? He would usually reply and say, I just threw up the faders added some EQ and compression on a couple of the tracks, and used a single plate reverb on the drums and vocals. So keeping things simple can be a very good thing.

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Old 07-30-2008, 12:01 PM   #17
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Smoke a bit of something green before going to bed

aladeaire

PS: kidding!
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Old 07-30-2008, 12:25 PM   #18
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Um... uh... well...
OK!
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Old 07-30-2008, 01:06 PM   #19
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More seriously, I will share this experience with you guys and see what you think about it...

I have allergies, not seasonal, but chronic. This means than more than being triggered by specific allergens, I am sensitive to things like temperature changes and stuff like that.

This allergies of course have an effect on my nose and throat generally (running or stuffed nose, sneezing, sore throat and the like)

But then it comes the ears... sometimes I feel pressure changes on them, but more disturbingly, noise and clicks. My left ear has a high pitched tone that gets better and then worse along the day.

What I wanted to tell you is that from a couple of years to the date, that is, from when I started to produce my music, listening critically, using headphones and earphones, etc. to the date... I am more aware of this changes in my ears than before...

And is very irritating. I thought it was getting worse, but now that I've read that tinnitus and other ear artifacts are affected by the psychology of the subject I know where the problem lies. I haven't noticed any hear losing nor anything. It is just that I am more aware of the problem

What do you think?

aladeaire

PS: BTW... if any other comrade out there can share his experience on doing music on allergies, I would like to know, lol
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Old 07-30-2008, 02:26 PM   #20
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Yes, I too have allergies (animal hair and pollens) and have to pop my ears occasionally during recording/mixdown. I live in farm country here in Oregon USA. Achooo.

One other note.
Some medications make my ears ring a little. Usually stuff for headaches. When this happens I can't hear 16KHz and up so I try not to do any critical mixing at these times.

I've been running live sound for bands for 10 years so maybe some of the ringing isn't the meds.
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Old 07-30-2008, 02:29 PM   #21
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i have chronic allergies too. asthma, hayfever, animal fur/hair, cosmetic smells like perfume and deoderant. all those kind of things lead to sneezing, runny nose, very itchy eyes/skin and ear problems(left side also aladeaire!). i hear crunching noises, clicks and pops and occasionaly high pitch tones. now and again i also get what i can only describe as a dullness sensation in the left ear as well. its something i have learnt to cope with without too much difficulty and to be honest it's not something i would want to do any research into regarding causes etc. i have also come to the conclusion that being more aware of the problem could result in perceiving the problem as getting worse. i'm always having to do that thing where you hold your nose and blow to pop your ears. probably not very good for you but it works!!

i don't do any kind of headphone mixing at home because of the ear problem - it causes a lot of discomfort after only short periods of time(i have to use the darn things for college though )

sorry if this steering your original post off topic marty gras!
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Old 07-30-2008, 02:39 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Amberience View Post
I vote for goatse.cx

Cruel, cruel man!

I vote for the bme (body modification e-zine) videos. You will not be able to sleep either but I assure you that you won't be bothered by any noise. ...maybe your own screams.

On the serious side. Try drinking less coffee. I gave up caffeine a while ago and it did wonders to my anxiety problems.
Now, if I could do the same with booze and nicotine...
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Old 07-30-2008, 02:49 PM   #23
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Any ideas? Sometimes it drive me nuts.
I haven't found anything helpful. But for the love of pete, stay away from venues with bad sound!
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Old 07-30-2008, 03:06 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aladeaire View Post
My left ear has a high pitched tone that gets better and then worse along the day.
I don't have allergies, but I do have a constant ringing in my right ear, which I suppose is mild tinnitus. I've learned to shut it out, but now I'm thinking about it I really notice it at the moment. I'm convinced it's because of years of gigging with loud drummers and they've usually been on my right. Most of the younger musicians I work with wear ear plugs, which is very sensible.

Back to the original post: When I'm thinking/focusing on something, I completely shut out what's going on around me (which often annoys my wife). However, I have a slightly different but related problem when it comes to music.

I think I’ve gradually started to listen to sounds much more acutely. When I first got Reaper I knocked out 3 or 4 pieces really quickly. Now I spend ages trying to get good sounds. In frustration that I can’t get a good sound, I go and listen to some CDs for reference, only to discover that I don’t like the sound of them either.

Oh, and my monitors once sounded great, but now I can hear a crunchy harshness. Although the sound does vary as I move my head around the room. Then I purchased some headphones that got good reviews (including on this forum) but, when I got them home, I hated them and ended up returning them and getting my money back.

AAAARRRGHH, as it says in the title of this thread.

Pete
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Old 07-30-2008, 06:16 PM   #25
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Quote:
i'm always having to do that thing where you hold your nose and blow to pop your ears. probably not very good for you but it works!!
I read from some ENT recently that it's not a bad thing to do. It opens the tube that's stuffed and promotes drainage of the fluid. It can be a bit traumatic when you first start doing it, but you soon learn just the right amount of 'push' for the pop. I do it frequently when my ears are bad and it's truly amazing how much I'm NOT hearing a lot of the time. My whole sense of frequency responce and loudness is changed [corrected] when my ears open up. It can be quite a handycap in this business.

Dan
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Old 07-30-2008, 07:29 PM   #26
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10 mins of ACDC usually does it for me(The band,not the other<grin>
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Old 07-30-2008, 09:13 PM   #27
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Sing:

FLIPPER
FLIPPER
Faster than lighting !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Later
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Old 07-31-2008, 09:16 AM   #28
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I have mild tinnitus, when the ringing is loud it is generally very short duration. Allergies too, which require the ear popping exercise. But the worst one for me is the constant creaking and grinding in my neck, it sounds exactly like static, and minor, DAW related, popping and clicking that we are all familiar with. I have to remember to keep my neck perfectly still when listening for those kinds of sounds, particularly with headphones.
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Old 07-31-2008, 11:37 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by martygras View Post
Yes, I too have allergies (animal hair and pollens) and have to pop my ears occasionally during recording/mixdown.
I've heard about this but... wow, is this really safe? I wouldn't even know how to do it...

This reminds me of a trip anecdote. I was in Toulouse, France, in a cold winter. I was staying with three girl students after passing the new years eve in a cabin in the mountains. I had a terrible amigdalitis by being lost in the snow for a couple of hours, and of course my ears were stuffed as hell. One morning I woke up, went to the bathroom and... plop!!! My left ear exploded or something! I was brought down to the ground and started vomiting. The labyrinth was hit badly I guess. Took me a couple of days to get rid of the sickness... like being on a boat or something... Forget about doing anything interesting with the girls, other than watching TV

aladeaire
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Old 07-31-2008, 12:19 PM   #30
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Quote:
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But the worst one for me is the constant creaking and grinding in my neck, it sounds exactly like static, and minor, DAW related, popping and clicking that we are all familiar with. I have to remember to keep my neck perfectly still when listening for those kinds of sounds, particularly with headphones.
That happens to me too and it freaked me out the first time I was monitoring in phones. Funny how the pops always occur at different times.
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Old 07-31-2008, 12:24 PM   #31
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Meditation, as Greg says, it's powerful stuff. I have found it useful in all manner of situations from anxiety to solving relationship problems.

Try this (below) if you like read more about it here: http://arobuddhism.org/meditation/

Sit comfortably, as before – but this week, open your eyes slightly. This allows a little light to enter – but does not allow you to see clearly. The light will help you remain awake and alert. Try remaining still, without fidgeting. Complete motionlessness is impossible. You can move if discomfort prompts – but try not to move unnecessarily.

Turn your attention to your breath. Silently count each exhalation. Count each out-breath from 1 until you reach 21. Then count your breaths backwards until you reach 1. Repeat this process for the duration of your meditation session.

Breathe normally and naturally. Do not attempt to control your breath in any way. Do not breathe any faster, slower, or deeper than usual. Simply allow breathing to happen.

You may sometimes become lost in thoughts – and suddenly notice that you have stopped counting your out-breaths. Alternatively you may forget the number you have just counted. You may forget whether you are counting forwards or backwards. You may find yourself at 27, having passed 21 without noticing. Whenever you notice that you have lost track of the technique – begin again. Return to 1 and count upward again.

Try this for ten minutes – or fifteen, if you are feeling ambitious.

When you have finished, record your impressions.
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Old 07-31-2008, 01:02 PM   #32
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Tedwood, it almost sounds as if you are channeling Maharishi Mahesh Yogi.

I do a little meditation occasionally using a cd with alpha state inducing tones (frequency beats).
So far not much relaxation that a martini wouldn't fix.

I use a program called brainwave generator to create the tones.
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Old 09-22-2009, 12:34 PM   #33
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Very timely that I came across this thread today.

Yesterday, I was sitting in my living room and my daughter was on the floor playing. I found myself focusing on the loudness of the toys she was playing with and the contrast with frequencies and volume levels being produced by the show on the television.

She had perfect placement in the mix and neither she nor the television overlapped frequencies.

Blew my mind when a bird started chirping outside and to the left of me. I thought to myself, 'I would have placed him a little more to the center and bumped him by about a dB at 2.5k'.
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Old 09-22-2009, 01:00 PM   #34
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there's a place I go out for dinner on Saturday nights with my wife sometimes. They've got live music going on there. My wife is enjoying it less and less though. She tells me I grimace every time I hear a note that is off or a poorly played solo.....

what to do? such is the life of a musician guy who records. You notice all the little things.
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Old 09-22-2009, 01:10 PM   #35
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there's a place I go out for dinner on Saturday nights with my wife sometimes. They've got live music going on there. My wife is enjoying it less and less though. She tells me I grimace every time I hear a note that is off or a poorly played solo.....

what to do? such is the life of a musician guy who records. You notice all the little things.
Heh... I have actually CEASED going to my wife's favorite restaurant because of this very thing. There is always this guy with his one man band setup playing. It is admirable I will admit, the problem is, the dude is AWFUL! I can't enjoy my dinner because;

A. He's too loud
B. He knows tons of songs in many genres
C. He does ALL of them a horrible injustice

Wife goes there with her friends on "girls night out"... I can't stand it.

D
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Old 09-22-2009, 01:16 PM   #36
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That's one of the reasons why I don't operate a studio anymore. My face didn't leave any doubt (in both flavors ) about the artist's performance and I couldn't be bothered to get a overdose of botox in my face.
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Old 09-22-2009, 02:11 PM   #37
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Heh... I have actually CEASED going to my wife's favorite restaurant because of this very thing. There is always this guy with his one man band setup playing. It is admirable I will admit, the problem is, the dude is AWFUL! I can't enjoy my dinner because;

A. He's too loud
B. He knows tons of songs in many genres
C. He does ALL of them a horrible injustice

Wife goes there with her friends on "girls night out"... I can't stand it.

D
What you have to do D, is get up on stage one night and show him how to do it properly, then he will see the error of his ways and get a sensible job selling tires, or something
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Old 09-22-2009, 02:25 PM   #38
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Windchimes. Use them.
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Old 09-22-2009, 03:05 PM   #39
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What you have to do D, is get up on stage one night and show him how to do it properly, then he will see the error of his ways and get a sensible job selling tires, or something
How'd you know I was a tire salesman?

D

PS No... I'm honest enough with myself to know I couldn't pull it off.
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Old 09-22-2009, 03:41 PM   #40
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Very interesting thread.

I have tinnitus plus sleep apnea, have to use a C-PAP machine to keep me breathing regularly. Also have had a battle with prostate cancer, undergone radiation treatments and am presently on a series of chemo treatments. On top of that, I have always had trouble sleeping dating back to my high school band days playing in the Spyders, not very good but VERY loud, (which probably explains the tinnitus).

The fan does help, as well as the spoken word. I play the King James Bible from an mp3 player hooked up to some computer speakers. I have had some interesting dreams where the characters were quoting Bible verses at odd times. I even had one in which I WAS Jesus, that took a while to get over.
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