Old 03-11-2009, 09:38 PM   #1
pipelineaudio
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Default NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



no matter how I edit this dribble foot, something is going to be suck

I can move the snares in time, but the kicks will still be a mess in the overheads.

Even if I pull mad tricks of stretch n shrink some of these will be icky

I know what I'm GOING to do, but short of rerecording, what would *you* do?

REAPER's param mod and sidechain features will come in real handy for this
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Old 03-11-2009, 09:42 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pipelineaudio View Post


no matter how I edit this dribble foot, something is going to be suck

I can move the snares in time, but the kicks will still be a mess in the overheads.

Even if I pull mad tricks of stretch n shrink some of these will be icky

I know what I'm GOING to do, but short of rerecording, what would *you* do?

REAPER's param mod and sidechain features will come in real handy for this
hmmm... let me think...

cry.
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Old 03-11-2009, 09:54 PM   #3
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find the best four bars in the song, clean them up as well as you can, and replace everything else in the drum track with them. keep it as low in the mix as you can.

then cry a bit.
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Old 03-11-2009, 10:00 PM   #4
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here's one solution

https://stash.reaper.fm/oldsb/128902/Bow-Out.mp3
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Old 03-11-2009, 10:15 PM   #5
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Is the problem that you've got really messy recordings, bleed, etc? Didn't some dude named Pipeline Audio do a video tutorial on how to fix that using ReaFir?
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Old 03-11-2009, 10:15 PM   #6
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I know you'll solve that HUGE problem pipe... even though it makes me think about only ONE person in the whole world who could deal with it real fast and get nice results: beat-by-bits... maybe he will appear here soon with a good advice
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Old 03-11-2009, 10:34 PM   #7
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Something that would help a lot in this case would be having the ability to warp hit points in Reaper like in Live, Nuendo, etc,etc.
So you wouldn't have to deal with the glitching problem of the cuts and the weirdness that happens with the overheads.
( Maybe until we have audio warping in Repear you could export the files to...)

;-)
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Old 03-11-2009, 10:34 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lokasenna View Post
Is the problem that you've got really messy recordings, bleed, etc? Didn't some dude named Pipeline Audio do a video tutorial on how to fix that using ReaFir?
The problem in this case is the timing of the bleed

Without slowing some parts to under 50% and speeding some past 200% the kick bleed into the overhead is going to make it a mess regardless, IF I want the kick and snare on time

But as shown above there are ways to deal with it

Having the real, out of time kick drum control a ducker on the overheads set to like 400hz and bleow really cleaned it up
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Old 03-11-2009, 10:40 PM   #9
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it's a case for ableton Live, if you can live with some stretching artifacts.
othrwise, rerecord.
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Old 03-11-2009, 11:12 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pipelineaudio View Post
Having the real, out of time kick drum control a ducker on the overheads set to like 400hz and bleow really cleaned it up
i've done this to mix a decent (but not 100% locked in) live drum take with electronic drums. means you don't have to grid the hell out of it to keep it clean sounding.
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Old 03-12-2009, 07:46 AM   #11
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I would fix the problems then create a faux overhead track with the corrected stuff
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Old 03-12-2009, 08:10 AM   #12
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keep the overheads low in the mix, hi-pass at around 400Hz, or if you need them higher you could try phase cancellation of the original kick track against the overheads (nudged so the kick aligns with the overheads, use a variable phase adjustment if mics are not parallel), and maybe do this against the snare too if there's a lot of bleed there, then of course time correct the kick independent from the snare & overheads.

do this but use triggered kick and/or snare samples instead of raw tracks

that ducker solution would also be one of the first I'd try.

If it's still really annoying though, try adding delay or short reverb to something to cover it up, you might find it fits the music
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Old 03-12-2009, 08:11 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dub3000 View Post
find the best four bars in the song, clean them up as well as you can, and replace everything else in the drum track with them. keep it as low in the mix as you can.

then cry a bit.
Yeah, I'd cut and paste over the worst bits. But at some point you've got to cut your losses and re-track it.

And no crying. Man up!
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Old 03-12-2009, 09:07 AM   #14
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I've spent many an awful day doing that stuff!

I would either loop another part like some have suggested, or go for the average,- make it so that all the hits are "closer", sometimes that can be good enough if it's a busy mix.

Kind regards

Dave Rich
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Old 03-12-2009, 09:27 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Malevo View Post
Something that would help a lot in this case would be having the ability to warp hit points in Reaper like in Live, Nuendo, etc,etc
Yeah, that's really needed. Doing this all manually in Reaper is not an option in large projects.
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Old 03-12-2009, 09:33 AM   #16
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Grow some balls and try to remember that it's rock and roll, not data-entry.

Sheesh...

...and people wonder why music is so f*cking boring these days.
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Old 03-12-2009, 11:07 AM   #17
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End of story. Zargon, that rocked. Props.
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Old 03-12-2009, 11:40 PM   #18
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https://stash.reaper.fm/oldsb/129355/Bow-Outs.mp3

woo hoo!
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Old 03-13-2009, 08:14 AM   #19
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.. Looks like a cheap double bass pedal instead of two kicks...

Make a loop of the kick since they don't look to be too present in the OH and the snare looks "reasonable" on the OH track?

Which makes me ask the question Pipeline, "what is your "window" of acceptable timing on drums?"

Meaning, for some music I've done I want the snare locked to a ms of 2 and 4.. but others, maybe not. The kick - depends.

Do you stick steadfastly to the ruler regardless? Do you make concessions if the band is locked in with a loose drummer?

(this seems like a good question to put on gearslutz...)
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Old 03-13-2009, 02:36 PM   #20
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Come to the dark side Pipeline.....MIDI is the solution.

Next time, instead of using MICS on those sloppy drummers, just place drum triggers on the drum heads, and record MIDI data and then record their drum hits as individual samples. That way you can edit the "performance" all you want when it's in the MIDI domain.
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Old 03-13-2009, 02:45 PM   #21
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Or just go and get Drumtracker from Toontrack, and create your midi from that - mixing the acoustic recordings with triggered samples (A plug for BFD2!) is a little more realistic sounding than using just triggers on their own.
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Old 03-13-2009, 03:21 PM   #22
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looking at that beast of editing, i would agree that part triggering could ease the workload/pain! -
i recently just triggered the kick only but using a 13" mesh head that didn't make hardly any noise or crucially take up too much room in my limited space.

the drummer had the sampled kick sound in headphones live (give or take a few ms) so didn't bother his playing.

It made it a doddle to move stray hits around (plus velocity tweaks) without affecting the OH's. it also made it easier to mix OHs and room mic as no big thuds in the way.
of course I then had my choice of lovingly prepared (by someone else!) kick sounds to anchor things down with.

kick those kick woes into touch.
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