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02-18-2011, 07:57 PM
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#1
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 673
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New Reascale File
For anyone who might be interested, I've just made and uploaded a reascale file with several additional scales and chord key maps for loading into the MIDI editor in Reaper 4 (alpha 42 onwards):
https://stash.reaper.fm/v/7982/xasman.reascale
Enjoy!
Last edited by Xasman; 02-19-2011 at 09:04 AM.
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02-18-2011, 08:42 PM
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#2
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 673
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(For those 8 people who just downloaded this ;-) Just to let you know I've just uploaded an update with a few additions...
EDIT...and a few more again!
Last edited by Xasman; 02-18-2011 at 09:53 PM.
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02-18-2011, 08:57 PM
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#3
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 3,793
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Thanks for this.
Aeolian also created a nice one for those interested.
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Last edited by PitchSlap; 05-18-2016 at 05:56 PM.
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02-18-2011, 09:49 PM
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#4
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Administrator
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: NY
Posts: 15,750
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Woo you even got a "B" (11th) in there!
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02-18-2011, 10:00 PM
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#5
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 673
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schwa
Woo you even got a "B" (11th) in there!
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Yep - had to try! Actually, I was wondering whether it would be possible to cover more than a 1 octave range. For example, a 2-octave range would be useful when stacking notes in thirds to create chords (so that we could have, e.g. 1,3,5,7,#9, b13). and some more exotic scales which run over more than a single octave.
Probably a bit mad, I know, but what do you think?
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02-18-2011, 10:35 PM
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#6
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Dubai, UAE
Posts: 299
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Quick question: How do i use the scales and arps? I have no idea where to find this option... Just a quick pointer would suffice.
Thanks in advance
EDIT:Found it. Was right under my nose
Last edited by pitpat; 02-19-2011 at 12:08 AM.
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02-19-2011, 04:26 AM
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#7
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 673
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schwa
Woo you even got a "B" (11th) in there!
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Schwa, just to clarify a bit; common chord extensions tend to be 9ths, 11ths and 13ths (rather than 10ths and 12ths, though the latter may indeed be useful in some exotic scales) hence my suggestion for extending the available range (in other words it would be good if we had something like, A=9, B=10, C=11,D=12, E=13, F=14, G=15 and if these ACTUALLY DEFINED those notes in the second octave). No problem if it's not possible or practical though (it's just an idea), and many thanks for the work you've done on this already.
Last edited by Xasman; 02-19-2011 at 04:34 AM.
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02-19-2011, 04:37 AM
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#8
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Terra incognita
Posts: 7,670
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To make it look visually easier, I added "blank" dividers into my reascale list.
edit:removed bad image link
Example as above:
...
# 0 "Major" 102034050607
# 1 "Major triad" 100030050000
# 0 "Blues" 100304450070
# 1 "Dim 7th chord" 100300500700
0 " " 102034050607
0 "Dorian" 102304050670
0 "Phrygian" 120304056070
0 "Lydian" 102030450607
0 "Mixolydian" 102034050670
0 "Aeolian" 102304056070
0 "Locrian" 120304506070
0 " " 102034050607
0 "Maj Pentatonic" 102030050600
0 "Min Pentatonic" 100304050070
0 "Mel Min Pentatonic"102300050600
0 "Maj Pentatonic b6" 102030056000
...
Unfortunately the dividers themselves can be chosen as a scale too, which might be a tad confusing. The way I have it now, each divider is the same as a major scale.
A way to make real blank dividers?
Love the attention MIDI sees right now, thanks for all these features!
Last edited by xpander; 09-02-2015 at 10:34 PM.
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02-19-2011, 05:18 AM
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#9
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 673
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Good idea, but it would be nice to have not just dividers, but more headings (like folders) which open sub-groups (in the way the "chords" heading works now). Then we could group scales into groups and sub-groups, say Major scale modes, Mel Minor scale modes, Pentatonic, Hexatonic, Symmetrical, etc.
It would be great if these could be searchable too, like the VST plug-in list...
Last edited by Xasman; 02-19-2011 at 05:24 AM.
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02-19-2011, 05:20 AM
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#10
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 3,210
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xasman
but more headings (like folders) which open sub-groups (in the way the "chords" heading works now). Then we could group scales into groups and sub-groups,
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+1
Subz
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02-19-2011, 05:37 AM
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#11
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 673
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By the way, I must say that I love the way this has been implemented so that any given scale or mode can be selected from its own root (rather than have to back-track to the parent major or minor scale root, as in some other hosts... )
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02-19-2011, 05:42 AM
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#12
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Terra incognita
Posts: 7,670
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xasman
Good idea, but it would be nice to have not just dividers, but more headings (like folders) which open sub-groups (in the way the "chords" heading works now). Then we could group scales into groups and sub-groups, say Major scale modes, Mel Minor scale modes, Pentatonic, Hexatonic, Symmetrical, etc.
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I agree. What I got going there was just a quick fix as of now.
At any rate, thanks for your reascale Xasman...as well as others already involved.
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02-19-2011, 05:44 AM
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#13
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Croatia
Posts: 24,790
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Definitely, this thing needs subfolders. Please, devs.
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02-19-2011, 06:08 AM
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#14
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Scottish refugee in Germany
Posts: 4,368
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where do I put the
Reascale file?
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02-19-2011, 06:17 AM
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#15
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Croatia
Posts: 24,790
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Yeah, we need the ability to declare a subfolder inside a .reascale file, much like in .reamenu files. This way you could have lots of entries and not overflow the screen.
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02-19-2011, 06:40 AM
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#16
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,257
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We definitely need folders to take stupidly large scale files like this:-
https://stash.reaper.fm/7975/ZDScaleWorld.reascale
Something like this would do
F "Hexatonic"
0 "Sixtone Mode 1" 100230056007
0 "Sixtone Mode 2" 120034005600
0 "Prometheus" 102030406070
0 "Prometheus Neop" 120030406070
0 "Whole-tone" 102030405070
0 "Blues" 100304450070
0 "Sus 4" 102004050670
Also could we have the option to overwrite the existing scales and chords when the file is loaded. I want the list to show just what I have in the file, then its customized to what you want to see. At the moment I see the default as well.
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02-19-2011, 07:00 AM
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#17
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Terra incognita
Posts: 7,670
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bob
Reascale file?
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In the \Reaper\Data folder.
There's a default one already there, named sample.reascale. Choosing Load at the bottom of the list should automatically open that folder, but other locations should be possible as well.
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02-19-2011, 07:39 AM
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#18
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Scottish refugee in Germany
Posts: 4,368
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xpander
In the \Reaper\Data folder.
There's a default one already there, named sample.reascale. Choosing Load at the bottom of the list should automatically open that folder, but other locations should be possible as well.
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thanks
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02-19-2011, 10:18 AM
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#19
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 477
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilDragon
Yeah, we need the ability to declare a subfolder inside a .reascale file, much like in .reamenu files. This way you could have lots of entries and not overflow the screen.
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+1. Love all the chord / arp stuff, and hope this remains a quick and simple input (which is the point of having this) instead of wading through menus and such where it'd be easier just to play them.
Would be really cool if the notes played upon painting them to verify what we want.
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02-19-2011, 12:42 PM
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#20
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 673
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bitrate
Would be really cool if the notes played upon painting them to verify what we want.
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Strange, they already do here...
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02-19-2011, 01:25 PM
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#21
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-blänk-
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 11,359
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I just requested to get rid of the Chords submenu in the alpha42 thread... in favor of mousewheeling to change chords/scales on the fly. I don't fancy to have to navigate to the chord submenu each freaking time i need another chord type (iow after almost each insert).
Diving submenus is sloooow, and if you choose to use the chords feature, you'll be changing them constantly. There needs to be a fast and convenient way to do it.
My idea was to change the label which sais "Scale:" and does nothing into a mode switch. It would switch between scales and chords "mode". The dropdown would include only the scales in "scales" mode and only the chords in "chord" mode. The important thing is that it needs to be wheel-able, submenus or not..
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02-19-2011, 01:28 PM
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#22
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Somewhere PRO
Posts: 1,049
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xasman
Schwa, just to clarify a bit; common chord extensions tend to be 9ths, 11ths and 13ths (rather than 10ths and 12ths, though the latter may indeed be useful in some exotic scales) hence my suggestion for extending the available range (in other words it would be good if we had something like, A=9, B=10, C=11,D=12, E=13, F=14, G=15 and if these ACTUALLY DEFINED those notes in the second octave). No problem if it's not possible or practical though (it's just an idea), and many thanks for the work you've done on this already.
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I created a bunch of 9ths, 11ths and 13ths, but REAPERs MIDI editor does its scale snap wizardry via hiding/showing the keys over a single octave range, that is duplicated for each octave up and down, so a 9th is no different from a 2nd, because it doesnt have a second octave to extend out to.
Even if we could define A=9, B=10, C=11,D=12, E=13, F=14, G=15, they will show in both/all octaves and have no functional difference.
a CMaj13th chord will look the same as a full C Major scale, on the midi PR keyboard, with maybe the 5th omitted, with extremely close voicing.
using the ABCD etc etc is really only for scales with more than 7 notes.
those bebop scales (that have b3,3 ... b5,5 ... b7,7) will probably need those letters.
I dont know if it can help with extensions though.
Hope im wrong
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02-19-2011, 01:31 PM
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#23
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Somewhere PRO
Posts: 1,049
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gofer
I just requested to get rid of the Chords submenu in the alpha42 thread... in favor of mousewheeling to change chords/scales on the fly. I don't fancy to have to navigate to the chord submenu each freaking time i need another chord type (iow after almost each insert).
Diving submenus is sloooow, and if you choose to use the chords feature, you'll be changing them constantly. There needs to be a fast and convenient way to do it.
My idea was to change the label which sais "Scale:" and does nothing into a mode switch. It would switch between scales and chords "mode". The dropdown would include only the scales in "scales" mode and only the chords in "chord" mode. The important thing is that it needs to be wheel-able, submenus or not..
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If they add it as an action, we can add it to a right click menu, and add seperators as well!
2 birds with one stone !
although ..... selecting the root will be pretty hard this way
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02-19-2011, 01:38 PM
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#24
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-blänk-
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 11,359
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I don't care as much for separators or submenus as I do for quick change of chords. It was wheelable in it's first incarnation (before the chord submenu was added). Much better. At the moment I declared all my chords to be scales, just to have them first level. Still slow.
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02-19-2011, 01:45 PM
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#25
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 632
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Not all of us have mousewheels. There is a wheel on my wacom pad but its much more of a pain to use than submenus.
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02-19-2011, 01:51 PM
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#26
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-blänk-
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 11,359
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I was talking mousewheel, because that's what Reaper does elsewhere. I also would prefer click drag up/down to change dropdown menu entries . If it's done across the entire application where now wheel is used for menus (like the MIDI editor's grid and length menus and the bpm box in the transport).
As Krahosk sais, any way that's fast is welcome.
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02-19-2011, 01:56 PM
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#27
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 632
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For sure.
I am really excited about this feature and I just wanted to make sure I wouldn't be implemented in a way that excluded users.
I'm sure it will all get sorted.
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02-19-2011, 02:20 PM
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#28
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 673
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aeolian
...REAPERs MIDI editor does its scale snap wizardry via hiding/showing the keys over a single octave range, that is duplicated for each octave up and down, so a 9th is no different from a 2nd, because it doesnt have a second octave to extend out to.
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Exactly right, hence my question to Schwa earlier about whether it would be possible/practicable to extend the range over 2 octaves where required. I have no idea how feasible this might be though (as obviously it implies that 2 octave range would need to be transposable etc.).
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02-19-2011, 02:26 PM
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#29
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 673
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gofer
...There needs to be a fast and convenient way to do it.
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Agreed, which is why I suggested having a searchable menu (like in the plug-ins dialog) earlier in this thread, which would be an even better solution for me personally (though, as always, no reason why mousewheel selection shouldn't be available too).
I'd still prefer to be able to organise both scales and chords into user-definable categories for manageability though; the prospect of having to scroll through a long shopping list (mousewheel or not) every time is not terribly appealing.
Last edited by Xasman; 02-19-2011 at 02:33 PM.
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02-19-2011, 02:37 PM
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#30
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Administrator
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: NY
Posts: 15,750
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Submenus and mousewheel scrollability .. you can't have both unfortunately.
We could add actions to switch to next/previous scale though.
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02-19-2011, 02:49 PM
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#31
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Afford Slaughterhouse, FL
Posts: 624
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schwa
mousewheel scrollability .. you can't have both unfortunately.
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Why not?
BTW, some SWS extensions menus suffer from the same problem. Using the mousewheel in long pop-up menus would be great (clicking the up/down arrows is slow... and lame for 201x ).
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It takes an ordered complex system to recognize another ordered complex system.
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02-19-2011, 02:58 PM
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#32
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 673
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Quote:
Originally Posted by schwa
Submenus and mousewheel scrollability .. you can't have both unfortunately.
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In which case I'd have to come down in favour of submenus. Personally, I find navigating with keyboard arrows is much quicker and less RSI inducing than navigating with the mousewheel anyway.
Quote:
Originally Posted by schwa
We could add actions to switch to next/previous scale though.
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Good idea!
So should I assume that my idea of making scales searchable like in the plug-in list is pie in the sky? (...thought so.. )
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02-19-2011, 03:09 PM
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#33
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Croatia
Posts: 24,790
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[EDIT: quoted schwa's obviously not existing anymore post, about existence of an application that supports mousewheeling through pop-up menus with submenus]
Not that I know of, actually. Not sure if it's even feasible. I favor submenus, myself. BUT - you could allow mousewheeling in the currently selected submenu? That would be a NICE compromise
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02-19-2011, 03:14 PM
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#34
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Administrator
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: NY
Posts: 15,750
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilDragon
[EDIT: quoted schwa's obviously not existing anymore post, about existence of an application that supports mousewheeling through pop-up menus with submenus]
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Yeah sorry about the delete, I didn't want to veer too far off topic.
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02-19-2011, 03:28 PM
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#35
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Terra incognita
Posts: 7,670
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Ach so..well, if it's between mouse scrolling and submenus, I would personally choose mouse scrolling for the speed.
I'm also entertaining the thought of having separate scale and chord modes, as suggested by Gofer.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gofer
My idea was to change the label which sais "Scale:" and does nothing into a mode switch. It would switch between scales and chords "mode". The dropdown would include only the scales in "scales" mode and only the chords in "chord" mode. The important thing is that it needs to be wheel-able, submenus or not..
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02-19-2011, 03:29 PM
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#36
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,257
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Scales should be on the drop down menu. I can't see the scale being changed repeatedly to need scrolling. I'd prefer this to be in nested folders.
Chords should be on a right click menu/scrollable, whatever, for ease of access as Gofer says.
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Music is the best
เพลง ที่ดีที่สุดคือ
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02-19-2011, 03:35 PM
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#37
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 3,793
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xasman
In which case I'd have to come down in favour of submenus.
So should I assume that my idea of making scales searchable like in the plug-in list is pie in the sky? (...thought so.. )
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+1 for submenus.
A filter could be useful. Click on the scale button and a menu pops up while the button becomes a text filter so you can quickly narrow down the menu.
__________________
FRs: v5 Media Explorer Requests, Global Quantization, Session View
Win10 Pro 64-bit, Reaper 6(x64), AMD 3950x, Aorus X570 Master, 64GB DDR4 3600, PowerColor Red Devil 5700XT, EVO 970 2TB, 10TB HD, Define R6
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02-19-2011, 03:41 PM
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#38
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Toronto, Canada
Posts: 4,630
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02-19-2011, 03:41 PM
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#39
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Terra incognita
Posts: 7,670
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zappadave
Scales should be on the drop down menu. I can't see the scale being changed repeatedly to need scrolling. I'd prefer this to be in nested folders.
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I do change scales all the time, but that might be just me. Going without any in "chromatic mode" ain't problem for me either. The need to change chord types is more usual though, unless in the pitch axis mood and working on both at the same time.
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02-19-2011, 08:44 PM
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#40
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Somewhere PRO
Posts: 1,049
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zappadave
Scales should be on the drop down menu. I can't see the scale being changed repeatedly to need scrolling. I'd prefer this to be in nested folders.
Chords should be on a right click menu/scrollable, whatever, for ease of access as Gofer says.
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This is wisdom
@Xasman ..... yep i follow what your saying now
expanding on your example before, what about this:
1 "Maj13" 100030000007_0020040000600
The "_" tells the midi editor to spread the snap over two octaves instead of one (or 3 or 4 octaves, whatever) ..... and the second octave is as easy to define as the 1st.
Those extensions will become all too easy
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