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Old 03-23-2015, 12:59 PM   #1
ivansc
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Default Editing out little bips and farts

Anyone have a better audio editing method than churning through the track (a vocal) and removing all the little bits of extraneous noise by splitting either side of it and silencing the offending bit, then glueing stuff back together?

Never had to do this before but it looks like a scratch vocal is going to have to be "the one" and it has mess.
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Old 03-23-2015, 01:12 PM   #2
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sounds like you might need a pair of latex gloves for that job
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Old 03-23-2015, 01:15 PM   #3
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i wouldn't trust an automated method for something like this.

i've used click remover and noise reducer plugins in the past that i've liked but nothing really beats the fine toothed comb...and i deal with a lot of stuff from vinyl and old vhs...
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Old 03-23-2015, 01:44 PM   #4
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I use a custom action to split and mute the selected area of an item. super quick to clean up tracks.
I have another one that will actually paste in roomtone so it's not complete silence.
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Old 03-23-2015, 03:29 PM   #5
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I use time selection + cut selected area of items. Don't like to glue (ever watched LEGO the movie..?), but if you absolutely have to, do it once when finished editing that track.
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Old 03-23-2015, 04:08 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EpicSounds View Post
I use a custom action to split and mute the selected area of an item. super quick to clean up tracks.
I have another one that will actually paste in roomtone so it's not complete silence.
Brilliant idea @epicsounds. I hope you don't mind if I steal that idea.
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Old 03-23-2015, 05:03 PM   #7
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I explain it in my podcast editing tutorial plus a few more.

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Old 03-23-2015, 05:40 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ivansc View Post
Anyone have a better audio editing method than churning through the track (a vocal) and removing all the little bits of extraneous noise by splitting either side of it and silencing the offending bit, then glueing stuff back together?

Never had to do this before but it looks like a scratch vocal is going to have to be "the one" and it has mess.
It's a dirty job but sometimes nothing else will do. Set up a custom action as suggested for whatever you need and that's the way to go. I use Yamaha's Vocaloid software to 'scratch track' vocals semi-often and I gotta do that a lot when I do. Mostly it's not pop/click stuff, but 'editing' the word sustain etc. (cool software BTW. Can't wait to see where it will be in a few years. Gets better all the time.)
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Old 03-23-2015, 05:49 PM   #9
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Ah well - not sure it would be worth sorting out a custard action for the relatively small amount of this sort of stuff I do.
MY vocals I tend to leave pretty much "as is", warts and all.

(but I expect you already noticed that!)

Assuming that I DO decide to make a custom action, er um (blush) I have never bothered to do one before. What pages in the manual dos one consult for best advice?
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Old 03-23-2015, 07:18 PM   #10
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Actions> Show action list> Custom actions> New> Scroll through the actions and find "Item:Split items at time selection". Drag it over into the panel on the right. Find "Item: Remove items". Drag it over. Give custom action a name (I use 'split-remove'). Tick 'consolidate undo points' and 'show in actions menu'. Click OK. Now your new custom action appears at the top of the action list. Highlight it> Shortcuts for selected action> Add shortcut (I use the Q key).
When editing, make sure just the item you want to edit is selected. After doing this action you can still drag the item edges and get back bits of the 'removed' item if you want. Sometimes complete cuts like this don't sound good and I get better results just splitting at time selection then reducing the new item's volume, or even changing the EQ with an item FX, or mucking about with the fades.
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Old 03-23-2015, 07:23 PM   #11
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Had a feeling it was that easy.... thank you for making an old man very happy...



P'S' Yep - I already do all the fiddling about as you outlined - just hoped I could reduce the strain on my arthritic wrists, which you have kindly provided the means to do!
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Old 03-24-2015, 04:45 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goldreap View Post
Actions> Show action list> Custom actions> New> Scroll through the actions and find "Item:Split items at time selection". Drag it over into the panel on the right. Find "Item: Remove items". Drag it over. Give custom action a name (I use 'split-remove'). Tick 'consolidate undo points' and 'show in actions menu'. Click OK. Now your new custom action appears at the top of the action list. Highlight it> Shortcuts for selected action> Add shortcut (I use the Q key).
When editing, make sure just the item you want to edit is selected. After doing this action you can still drag the item edges and get back bits of the 'removed' item if you want. Sometimes complete cuts like this don't sound good and I get better results just splitting at time selection then reducing the new item's volume, or even changing the EQ with an item FX, or mucking about with the fades.
That seems to be what the "remove selected area of items" action already does?
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Old 03-24-2015, 06:49 AM   #13
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Yes, "remove selected area of items" seems to do the same thing, but there is a difference.
Say you have 2 adjacent items on a track (item 1 being the earliest). Now use "remove selected area of items" somewhere in item 1.
Now drag the left edge of the created gap either to the left or right...see what happens to the original right edge of item 1 (where it meets item 2).
I'm not sure where I'd use this action (and visually it also looks the same as "cut selected area of items"..hence paste), but it's not what I'd want for OP's purpose, because after making these cuts I often have to adjust the edges of the gap and don't want any little surprises further down the track.
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Old 03-24-2015, 06:57 AM   #14
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With you Goldreap.

I have yet to find time to try it out but looks like I have a solution.
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Old 03-24-2015, 09:02 AM   #15
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Cool, I see what you mean Goldreap. In your custom action the items ends up unselected - easier if you want to make a little fade etc.
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Old 03-24-2015, 09:14 AM   #16
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Hi Ivan, I don't know if anyone mentioned this already but I simply use a Take Volume envelope for this.

With the Take Volume envelope you can fix things to perfection, eliminating unwanted pops and clicks, adjusting breath noise so that it is at a proper level (usually you don't want to totally eliminate breath noise).

Sure it takes some hands on and a little time, but I personally wouldn't leave something like this to plugins, that's too easy for a couple of old farts like us.
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Old 03-24-2015, 09:16 AM   #17
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I've cleaned up a lot of dialogue tracks, there's no replacement for going over it manually with a toothcomb and edit out all the bips coughs and smacks. Reaper is actually very efficient at this and much user friendly than Pro Tools imo.

One thing that can be tricky (but maybe it's a non issue if this is a vocal in a song) is that when you cut out a bit of a line you also cut room tone (if any) which, if there is nothing else going on, can make it sound weird; which is why you normally record room tone on the set. But that may be irrelevant in your situation.
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Old 03-24-2015, 09:30 AM   #18
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most of that can done in reaper directly, but I much prefer using Adobe Audtion as my Ext. wav editor to do it.... much more delicate control for me, but I am used to using it.
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Old 03-24-2015, 10:31 AM   #19
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Cool, I see what you mean Goldreap. In your custom action the items ends up unselected - easier if you want to make a little fade etc.
Ah right, I didn't actually notice the selection status, but yeah, looks like that is what makes it different..both sides of the gap are still selected, whereas with mine, the first action (split items at time selection) of the custom action de-selects the old and selects the new..then the second action removes that new selected item. I knew mine was better but didn't know why!
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Old 03-24-2015, 10:43 AM   #20
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most of that can done in reaper directly, but I much prefer using Adobe Audtion as my Ext. wav editor to do it.... much more delicate control for me, but I am used to using it.
but in reaper you can do this stuff with grouped items and listen in context with the mix.
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Old 03-24-2015, 11:33 AM   #21
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Default Can't Find it now, BUT!

Since I saw a few of the longtime users and "Script Kitties" post in this thread I thought I'd mention a little (Lua/.EEL/.JS ???) script I saw someone demo in a gif recently. Basically Looked like he selected an area of time where a pop or click was and scrubbed out the inconsistency with a wave of the mouse. Don't know where it is now after searching around for a a few hours to find it for you. It was in a longer post with a few other scripts and a lot of other solutions to whatever the problem was.It was the last post in the thread a few days ago. The interface was black, had two sliders or value input areas and maybe a dial or two. Maybe someone knows the thread I'm referring to. Damned if I can find it again.
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Old 03-24-2015, 01:10 PM   #22
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this is exactly why I've been asking for a pencil tool to redraw the waveform since V 1.x


Every DAW has a pencil tool for waveform redrawing, well Cubase/Nuendo/pro tools in my studio do.


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Old 03-24-2015, 01:28 PM   #23
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Gate that shit.

insert gate after first compressor.
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Old 03-24-2015, 01:32 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by norbury brook View Post
this is exactly why I've been asking for a pencil tool to redraw the waveform since V 1.x


Every DAW has a pencil tool for waveform redrawing, well Cubase/Nuendo/pro tools in my studio do.


MC
over the years I've heard people swear by that but I've never had it work well personally and never saw a demo of it. Can you do a 30 second demo of it?
Just want to understand better.
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Old 03-24-2015, 01:41 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by norbury brook View Post
this is exactly why I've been asking for a pencil tool to redraw the waveform since V 1.x


Every DAW has a pencil tool for waveform redrawing, well Cubase/Nuendo/pro tools in my studio do.


MC
Oh, that is some weapons grade balonium right there and you know it.

By definition, any non-destructive DAW will not natively let you change the waveform. You have to chop out the bit and edit it externally or, apply a transient manipulation plug and add the new "replacement" waveform to another track.

So... so there.
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Old 03-24-2015, 02:21 PM   #26
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farts add so much flavor to music

i vote you leave them in

perhaps hit them with a little tape sat
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Old 03-24-2015, 05:02 PM   #27
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@F..F..
It's really the "Essence" that moves me. Some farts give way more than others, but none the less, I like the other elements to add the flavor.
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Old 03-25-2015, 02:43 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dtrud0h View Post
Since I saw a few of the longtime users and "Script Kitties" post in this thread I thought I'd mention a little (Lua/.EEL/.JS ???) script I saw someone demo in a gif recently. Basically Looked like he selected an area of time where a pop or click was and scrubbed out the inconsistency with a wave of the mouse. Don't know where it is now after searching around for a a few hours to find it for you. It was in a longer post with a few other scripts and a lot of other solutions to whatever the problem was.It was the last post in the thread a few days ago. The interface was black, had two sliders or value input areas and maybe a dial or two. Maybe someone knows the thread I'm referring to. Damned if I can find it again.
Hope someone finds that!
My problem is that I have used the ProTools audio editor, which for MY way of thinking and doing things is absolutely perfect.

It's just the other 90% of the workflow and business model I have issues with!
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Old 03-25-2015, 04:43 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tod View Post
Hi Ivan, I don't know if anyone mentioned this already but I simply use a Take Volume envelope for this.

With the Take Volume envelope you can fix things to perfection, eliminating unwanted pops and clicks, adjusting breath noise so that it is at a proper level (usually you don't want to totally eliminate breath noise).

Sure it takes some hands on and a little time, but I personally wouldn't leave something like this to plugins, that's too easy for a couple of old farts like us.
Yeah that is pretty much like riding the volume fader for vocals all the way through a track. A bit detailed, but worth it.
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Old 03-25-2015, 07:43 AM   #30
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Just one problem with all the "ride the fader" type suggestions.
This is drums I am trying to get rid of, so a lot of the extraneous noise is within a section where I need to keep as much of the original vocal as possible.

Hence the need to very selectively and surgically reduce tiny snippets of sound.

Hand work IS working but damn it is tedious. Unfortunately in this case a re-take is not an option.
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Old 03-25-2015, 08:23 AM   #31
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assign a split item under mouse
assign delete to top part of Item

I can erase the offending part in 3 clicks
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Old 03-25-2015, 01:48 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ivansc View Post
Just one problem with all the "ride the fader" type suggestions.
This is drums I am trying to get rid of, so a lot of the extraneous noise is within a section where I need to keep as much of the original vocal as possible.

Hence the need to very selectively and surgically reduce tiny snippets of sound.

Hand work IS working but damn it is tedious. Unfortunately in this case a re-take is not an option.
Aah, well that do make a difference.
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Old 03-25-2015, 02:03 PM   #33
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I got iZotope RX-4 about 6 weeks ago and I recommend it very highly for this sort of thing. It works like magic.

PM me if you need some help with the vocal.
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Old 03-25-2015, 02:46 PM   #34
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I am very impressed by what a wealth of information my idle question has generated!

This has now gone from me being bit lazy to me wondering if I could speed this sort of operation up on the few occasion I have to do it, based on all your suggestions.
Thanks as always guys.

Already own a freebie from Izotope that performs very well, so may also go look at Rx as well.

EDIT: Ouch! A little expensive for the few occasions I would actually need it.
Ah, well.....
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Old 03-25-2015, 02:55 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skamm Goodiez View Post
assign a split item under mouse
assign delete to top part of Item

I can erase the offending part in 3 clicks

But as I explained, my issue is with removing SOME of the item, but leaving s much of the BG room sound and the vocal part intact as possible.

What I have been doing is scrolling down to very low level and then reducing the level of the worst areas of drum track interference, which is the least intrusive way of removing (at least partially) the drum spill.

A simple erase would lose too much of the vocal.

From watching the videos on iZotopes site, I suspect Rx4 would indeed do a wonderful job of automating this process, but even the educational pricing (IF I even qualified at age 70 ) would break the bank for me.
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Old 03-25-2015, 03:23 PM   #36
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Default Little Edits

Check out Spectro - Spectral editor - Stillwell Audio
http://www.stillwellaudio.com/plugins/spectro/
There's a demo too
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Old 03-25-2015, 06:29 PM   #37
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But as I explained, my issue is with removing SOME of the item, but leaving s much of the BG room sound and the vocal part intact as possible.

What I have been doing is scrolling down to very low level and then reducing the level of the worst areas of drum track interference, which is the least intrusive way of removing (at least partially) the drum spill.

A simple erase would lose too much of the vocal.

From watching the videos on iZotopes site, I suspect Rx4 would indeed do a wonderful job of automating this process, but even the educational pricing (IF I even qualified at age 70 ) would break the bank for me.
RX4 (or 2 or 3) is comparable to the sort of value you get from buying REAPER.

I use that **** on everything.
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Old 03-26-2015, 02:35 PM   #38
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I know surgery to remove such -- farts, warts and whatall -- can be painful and should be done by an actual human, but this is precisely where a great editor such as Melodyne really shines. Can be done under Melodyne and proper sedation, leaving no scars or cut-and-paste artifacts ('cause no Cut and Paste will be needed!).
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Old 03-26-2015, 02:50 PM   #39
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never had Melodyne integrate well with REAPER. As a rewire client I save some load time but it doesn't detect the project tempo correctly.
As a plugin there are no keyboard shortcuts and transport controls aren't linked to reaper.
Seems like just bringing the audio into Melodyne changes the sound too.
Must be just me.
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Old 03-26-2015, 04:44 PM   #40
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over the years I've heard people swear by that but I've never had it work well personally and never saw a demo of it. Can you do a 30 second demo of it?
Just want to understand better.
I can't show you a demo but I have fixed delicate audio wave files in Pro Tools using the pencil tool. It's a very delicate operation and it doesn't always work, but it can save the day especially with audio artifacts.
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