New to Reaper

[Toolless]

Hi there

It has not beeen long since I downloaded Reaper but never got it to work anyway I have had another go at it

So I am now at the stage where I can drag my mp3. karaoke track onto the main page and record over it
I can record over it with me singing into the microphone but when I record over it I literally do record over it and the backing track can no longer be heared at all

Anyone know why please???

[Reason]

Sounds like you're recording on the same track your karaoke mp3 is on. Track | Insert new Track, record on that one instead.

[trevlyns]

Hi and welcome to the forums!

Great idea also is to take some time out and have a look at Kenny's videos - as an example video # 5 deals with recording audio

[kero]

Originally Posted by Toolless

Hi there

It has not beeen long since I downloaded Reaper but never got it to work anyway I have had another go at it

So I am now at the stage where I can drag my mp3. karaoke track onto the main page and record over it
I can record over it with me singing into the microphone but when I record over it I literally do record over it and the backing track can no longer be heared at all

Anyone know why please???

You will need to insert a new track and record your new singing on that new one, BUT, you have to make sure the other track with your Karaoke music on is NOT armed to record, the little red light on the Karaoke track should be off, not lit.
The red recording light should only be ON on your new microphone/singing track.

Keep us posted!

[Mike Raine]

The principles of multi-track recording seem to have momentarily deserted you.

As others have noted: once you've dragged the karaoke MP3 onto the main page, create a new track (CTRL T) on which to record. Arm this, hit record, and start singing.

[fixerdave]

Hi, if you have mp3&g files you can convert the graphic .cdg file to an avi and put it on another new track and your project will display the lyrics in time as well. dave

[Toolless]

Originally Posted by Mike Raine

The principles of multi-track recording seem to have momentarily deserted you.

As others have noted: once you've dragged the karaoke MP3 onto the main page, create a new track (CTRL T) on which to record. Arm this, hit record, and start singing.

OK so I have done all that
I can then play my recording back using the Reaper program and both my voice and the karaoke track are playing together.

But when I have finished recording I hit the stop button and then I am given "select file to save or delete" dialog box
I press save and 2 saved files appear in "my documents" folder
One an .mp3 file and the other a .wav file which can not be opened!
When I play the .mp3 file it only plays my recorded voice and not the karaoke track for some reason?
Am I right in thinking that I have only saved one of the two and not both
And if this is the case how do I save both please?

[Reason]

Originally Posted by Toolless

But when I have finished recording I hit the stop button and then I am given "select file to save or delete" dialog box

This is Reaper asking you if the take was worth saving. This is separate from what you ultimately want.

I press save and 2 saved files appear in "my documents" folder
One an .mp3 file and the other a .wav file which can not be opened!

This sounds like the files that reaper is using while you're recording, which will be different from the file that you'll end up with.

Make sure the red "record" button is NOT lit up on the .mp track when you're recording your voice. It should only be lit up on your "voice" track.

When I play the .mp3 file it only plays my recorded voice and not the karaoke track for some reason?

If the record button was lit up on the mp3 track while you were recording your voice, you may have recorded over it. If not, I'm not sure what would cause that.

Am I right in thinking that I have only saved one of the two and not both
And if this is the case how do I save both please?

I'm assuming you want to 1. save your original karaoke track, without vocals, and 2. your version, with vocals.

For 1, just make sure you have a backup of your MP3. In Windows, just select the file and hit Ctrl C, Ctrl V, and you'll end up with "Copy - karaoke.mp3" or something similar.

For 2, you need to render the project. I'm not going to go into detail here as it's covered in the manual in section 3.2.

To be blunt, it sounds like you're very new to both multitrack recording and Reaper, is that correct? If so, there is a newbie forum here, and there's no shame in asking questions there. Es ist noch kein Meister vom Himmel gefallen.

[Mike Raine]

Originally Posted by Toolless

OK so I have done all that
I can then play my recording back using the Reaper program and both my voice and the karaoke track are playing together.

So far so good.

Originally Posted by Toolless

But when I have finished recording I hit the stop button and then I am given "select file to save or delete" dialog box
I press save and 2 saved files appear in "my documents" folder

As some has already observed, this is just Reaper asking whether you want to keep the stuff you've just recorded or not.

Originally Posted by Toolless

One an .mp3 file and the other a .wav file which can not be opened!

When I play the .mp3 file it only plays my recorded voice and not the karaoke track for some reason?

Which is what you'd expect. One is your backing track, the other is the one you just recorded.

Originally Posted by Toolless

Am I right in thinking that I have only saved one of the two and not both
And if this is the case how do I save both please?

Here are the basic steps you need to follow:

1 Load up your backing track into Reaper
2 Go 'File'/'Save project as' and save the project somewhere on your computer.
3 Create a new track. Arm it for recording, hit record and sing.
4 Hit Ctrl S to save the project again. Do this lots of times whenever you do stuff, like further recordings.
5 When you've done with recording, go 'File'/'Render . . .' Doing this is where Reaper will combine the backing track with the vocal tracks to create a single stereo file.

[jerome_oneil]

Originally Posted by Toolless

OK so I have done all that
I can then play my recording back using the Reaper program and both my voice and the karaoke track are playing together.

But when I have finished recording I hit the stop button and then I am given "select file to save or delete" dialog box
I press save and 2 saved files appear in "my documents" folder
One an .mp3 file and the other a .wav file which can not be opened!
When I play the .mp3 file it only plays my recorded voice and not the karaoke track for some reason?
Am I right in thinking that I have only saved one of the two and not both
And if this is the case how do I save both please?

It's your lucky day! http://www.reaper.fm/userguide.php

[peter5992]

Originally Posted by Mike Raine

Here are the basic steps you need to follow:

1 Load up your backing track into Reaper
2 Go 'File'/'Save project as' and save the project somewhere on your computer.
3 Create a new track. Arm it for recording, hit record and sing.
4 Hit Ctrl S to save the project again. Do this lots of times whenever you do stuff, like further recordings.
5 When you've done with recording, go 'File'/'Render . . .' Doing this is where Reaper will combine the backing track with the vocal tracks to create a single stereo file.

This is it Toolless - just follow these steps and you're good to go.

[Toolless]

Originally Posted by Mike Raine

Here are the basic steps you need to follow:

1 Load up your backing track into Reaper
2 Go 'File'/'Save project as' and save the project somewhere on your computer.
3 Create a new track. Arm it for recording, hit record and sing.
4 Hit Ctrl S to save the project again. Do this lots of times whenever you do stuff, like further recordings.
5 When you've done with recording, go 'File'/'Render . . .' Doing this is where Reaper will combine the backing track with the vocal tracks to create a single stereo file.

That seams to have done the job and I can now sing over the track and save it as .mp3

Some time over the weekend I will record a song and let you know how I got on with it

Yes I am new to everything hear and I mean everything

But I did not know there was a manual for it until now!

Anyway I find this forum to be very helpfull and usefull
So thanks to everyones help

Now I know this is going to sound a bit off topic; but is there a way I can upload my .mp3 files to the net?
Thanks

[Reason]

Soundcloud account is a pretty popular method to do that.

[Toolless]

Originally Posted by Reason

Soundcloud account is a pretty popular method to do that.

As I recall saids web site removed about 3 of all of my uploads
Simpaly because they must of had data tags to the karaoke tracks and used copy right as an excuse to do such a callus fascist act.
So soundclowd no good!

[slipstick]

Well there's your answer...you could upload YOUR files. What you can't do is upload someone else's work and claim it as your own.

Seems reasonable enough to me.

Steve

[Toolless]

Originally Posted by slipstick

Well there's your answer...you could upload YOUR files. What you can't do is upload someone else's work and claim it as your own.

Seems reasonable enough to me.

Steve

Nope that dont work
Uploading a file and nameing it of the original artist still gets automaticaly removed

[Bazzbass]

dude, you can't take someone's song, add a vocal and put it on the net. It's called COPYRIGHT INFRINGEMENT

somehow this doesn't apply to hip hop artists and rappers,they can do it without fear apparently, maybe coz they are gangstas?

google it.

plus who wants to hear someone singing over someone else's song apart from karaoke fans?

[Toolless]

This is not for hire and reward and I have no plans what so ever on making money from it
Will I be sued in court if I get up and sing on the karioke machine?

[The Byre]

Originally Posted by Bazzbass

somehow this doesn't apply to hip hop artists and rappers,they can do it without fear apparently, maybe coz they are gangstas?

No, it's because they have either paid for the samples/music, or because the samples/music comes from the same label or parent company, so the music publisher owns it already.

[slipstick]

Originally Posted by Toolless

This is not for hire and reward and I have no plans what so ever on making money from it
Will I be sued in court if I get up and sing on the karioke machine?

No because that's a one-off and if you're doing it in public someone has paid for the rights to use the original song.

OTOH if you record someone's song with your voice over it and post it out there for every lawyer to see, maybe you will be sued. It's the publishing that causes the problem.

Steve

[The Byre]

Originally Posted by Toolless

This is not for hire and reward and I have no plans what so ever on making money from it.

Abusing somebody's copyright is regarded in most jurisdictions as theft and is an infringement of their property rights in all jurisdictions.

The fact that you don't intend to profit from your theft or infringement in no way alters anything. If it is theft, they can prosecute and if it is merely a matter of the law of tort, they can sue and also recover any costs.

Originally Posted by Toolless

Will I be sued in court if I get up and sing on the karioke machine?

No, because the music on a karaoke machine is licenced for exactly that purpose. If you record that music and put it out as your own, then, yes, you could be sued!

[Toolless]

Well I have paid money for these Karioke tracks so there for I have paid for the licnece of them and I am free to use them to my own accord

[The Byre]

You paid a few dollars for the tracks - you did not pay a few thousand for the publishing rights!

That means you can use them privately and for your own amusement, but you are not allowed to publish them, for example, by putting them on SoundCloud.

[Bazzbass]

oh my lord, just go ahead and do it, who cares?

no one will likely listen to it,and if they do,that's their loss.

we tried to educate you in the international laws of copyright but you don't listen so go ahead.

You won't go to jail because no one will even know it's there, no one apart from you and or your friends and family will likely hear it.

Still, at least your username is accurate lol

[Mike Raine]

Originally Posted by Bazzbass

oh my lord, just go ahead and do it, who cares?

no one will likely listen to it,and if they do,that's their loss.

we tried to educate you in the international laws of copyright but you don't listen so go ahead.

You won't go to jail because no one will even know it's there, no one apart from you and or your friends and family will likely hear it.

Still, at least your username is accurate lol

As it happens, he can't "just go ahead and do it" because Soundcloud is correctly removing it.

[ivansc]

...and here you have at least part of the reason it is getting harder and harder to make money from creative output.
People just don`t get it at all.
I`m going to order a steak dinner tonight and walk out without paying.

[Toolless]

I am just trying to put my point accross and finding a way round this hell hole that is all.
I dont think I am doiing anything wrong

[grayter1]

Originally Posted by Toolless

I am just trying to put my point accross and finding a way round this hell hole that is all.
I dont think I am doiing anything wrong

Well, copyrights are what they are, and are enforceable by law.

Sometimes it helps to flip the situation around for a different perspective:

If I spent hours writing, composing, engineering, recording, mixing, practicing, performing, promoting and selling MY music to earn a living - the LAST thing I'd want is for some dude on the internet to download an instrumental version, track their own vocals, then post it - even if you're not charging.

I would have no way to make money from the PUBLISHING of the song. In short, you'd be taking money off my table. That's why SoundCloud won't allow it to happen. They're protecting me as a songwriter.

Rules are rules, like it or not.

Hope this helps...

tg

[Reason]

Originally Posted by Toolless

I am just trying to put my point accross and finding a way round this hell hole that is all.
I dont think I am doiing anything wrong

In the scheme of things, you putting up a song with your vocals recorded over the top for free is not going to constitute a genuine threat to the rightsholders. In that respect, you're not doing anything ethically wrong. Who among us has never covered a song? How did we decide to get into music in the first place? A comparison would be video game modders, who use the assets owned by the game makers to change (and sometimes improve) the game.

The problem is that by you uploading that song, Soundcloud opens themselves up for lawsuits if they don't take it down. If someone else uploads, for example, an Adele album and lets people download it for free, then Soundcloud not only has to take that one down, but they have to show that they take the rightsholders' concerns seriously by taking down anything that might show they allow infringing material.

If they don't, there's a good chance they'll get sued, and even if they win, they will still have spent a LOT of resources defending themselves. That's not a good situation for anyone, and Soundcloud in particular is not a cash-rich company. They really don't have any choice but to prevent lawsuits.

[Mike Raine]

Originally Posted by Toolless

I dont think I am doiing anything wrong

Originally Posted by Reason

In the scheme of things, you putting up a song with your vocals recorded over the top for free is not going to constitute a genuine threat to the rightsholders. In that respect, you're not doing anything ethically wrong.

That Toolless 'thinks' he is not doing anything wrong doesn't make what he is doing right. I agree that what he wants to do is "not going to constitute a genuine threat to the rightsholders".

However, the fact that it doesn't have an impact on rights holders does not shift it out of the realm of being ethically wrong. It's like someone taking home pens or paper from their work. It may be unnoticed, of little value, and inconsequential to the business, but it is still wrong. Neither pen, paper, nor karaoke should be taken until the rights to their being taken are transacted, i.e. permission is given.

[Reason]

Fair enough.

I'm making some assumptions, and based on those assumptions, I think the circumstances in this situation are significant enough to make it OK, though.

What it comes down to, for me, is this: where is the harm? where could the harm come from?

Toolless can't sell his or her recordings. As stated, no profits are being pursued or expected. From a technical standpoint, Soundcloud doesn't directly allow this. And to be blunt, from a taste standpoint, who would pay for a karaoke recording?

So I think it's fair to assume that there is no threat of financial harm from this.

Money isn't everything, so what other harm could possibly occur?

First thing that comes to my mind is credit or attribution. Say that Toolless' version somehow gets more famous than the original (cf "Blinded by the Light," "The Man Who Sold the World" etc). Now let's assume the worst case scenario and say that Toolless has no morals and does not mention that the song is a cover.

That wouldn't stand. The internet is amazing; people would find out and sound the alarm pretty quick.

And that's worst case. When I think of someone singing karaoke, it's because they love that song. I think this is done out of love for the music.

So yes, I'm making some assumptions, but the things that I see, don't present a problem. If anyone thinks I've missed anything I'd like to hear it. I'm open minded, or at least I like to think so.

Edit: none of this will change Soundcloud's policies or the realities behind them. I'd try google drive or something similar for sharing.

Off Topic re: Blinded by the Light:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U9_3nQFNy-w

"Held up like a loofah, by the foreman of the night"

[ivansc]

Suppose it al depends on whether or not he is financially "worth" suing too.
Toolless: In case you were still in any doubt, what you want to do is NOT A GOOD THING.

[Toolless]

some people have rerecorded someone ells song and relised it making money from it
But I think the money in covering someones ells song is in a live gig

Rules are rules
Har har, how many times have I heard that one before.
We in the UK are having our independence day

[ivansc]

Sorry mate but you just dont get it.
YES people do cover versions of other peoples songs and release them and make money from it.
BUT Whoever wrote the song gets ALL the publishing royalty payments from that version too.
YES people use all or part of other peoples recordings and re-release them with their own added extras (voice track in your case) BUT they have to get permission to sample the original artists work and this almost always involves either a large lump sum payment or (again) a percentage of the sales.
Very seriously, you DO risk (however small the risk is) getting sued for what you are trying to do.
Far easier just to re-do your own backing track and release your version.
Anything you sell WILL mean whoever wrote the song will get paid. By you. Via someone like BMI ASCAP or PRS, whose job it is to watch out for who is selling what and collect on behalf of the owner of the copyright.

P.S. So you are at least in part to blame for us leaving the EU. Gee, thanks! I just hope the French are still going to let me live there after we are out.

[The Byre]

I love people like 'Toolless'! I think they were put on this Earth for the general amusement of the rest of us!

[ivansc]

And of course he skipped over "clue" in the dictionary....

[Toolless]

Originally Posted by ivansc

Very seriously, you DO risk (however small the risk is) getting sued for what you are trying to do.

P.S. So you are at least in part to blame for us leaving the EU. Gee, thanks! I just hope the French are still going to let me live there after we are out.

Take me to court!

Viva la Marine Le Pen

[bazsound]

Originally Posted by Toolless

As I recall saids web site removed about 3 of all of my uploads
Simpaly because they must of had data tags to the karaoke tracks and used copy right as an excuse to do such a callus fascist act.
So soundclowd no good!

sound cloud has removed several of my mies because the backing track has been flagged up as cpyrighted material, even though its not the same as the original.

i guess your not allowed to use karaoke tracks for this purpose even though you h ave paid for them.

i understand that they dont want people downloading there karaoke tracks, but its not really a karaoke track anymore, since it now has vocals.

[The Byre]

Originally Posted by bazsound

i guess your not allowed to use karaoke tracks for this purpose even though you h ave paid for them.

i understand that they dont want people downloading there karaoke tracks, but its not really a karaoke track anymore, since it now has vocals.

It is not a question of 'allowed', but a question of mechanical copyright. If SoundCloud (or any other website, come to that) leaves copyrighted material on its website, it opens itself up to litigation by the copyright owner.

There are two copyrights on a recorded song, the mechanical and the intellectual. The intellectual copyright is the tune and the words. The mechanical is the recorded sounds. You are free to use other people's tunes in most jurisdictions, as long as you pay for them in accordance with the various rights agencies.

The recordings are NEVER free to use, unless it specifically states this on the copy of the recording. In that case, the terms and conditions will be placed on the recording.

If you think of a song as being like a car, all this makes sense. If the song is like a VW, then you are free to drive it, enjoy it and sell it on to somebody else to drive. You are not free to rebadge the car and call it your own design. You are not free to copy key parts of the car that are subject to patents and design protection. All that is the intellectual property of the Volkswagen Aktien Gesellschaft, who have spent hundreds of millions of dollars and Euros creating that IP.

OK, a karaoke CD is hardly a billion dollar car design, but it still represents an investment of between $10,000 and $20,000 by someone and even a few seconds of that CD will be spotted by the recognition software used by SoundCloud and YouTube and automatically removed.

[slipstick]

Originally Posted by bazsound

i guess your not allowed to use karaoke tracks for this purpose even though you h ave paid for them.

If you look a bit more closely at what you have actually paid for it almost certainly tells you that it's for your personal use but does not allow you to republish the material.

It really is that simple.

Steve