Tempo Mapping 101

[nofish]

I just tried these new actions - wow this is huge. Seems like we can do tempo mapping now graphically almost like eg Cubase style.
Big thanks.

[Guido]

Hi,

If this works like i think it does..i may soil myself^^

Testing.. and many thanks Breeder!!!!

guido

[G-Sun]

Originally Posted by Breeder

Just a quick heads up, latest SWS pre which can be found here has a new feature:

SWS/BR: Convert project markers to tempo markers

You can covert any number of markers per measure in any time signature:

Looks just fantastic!
Any chance it can output linear shape?

Who are we to credit? BR = Breeder? Thank you!!

[G-Sun]

+SWS/BR: Move selected tempo points forward
+SWS/BR: Move selected tempo points back
+SWS/BR: Move selected tempo points forward X ms
+SWS/BR: Move selected tempo points back X ms
+SWS/BR: Select and adjust tempo markers...
+SWS/BR: Move edit cursor to next/previous envelope point and select it

This just looks awesome
Do we need some sort of manual/instructions?
(In that case, may I suggest the wiki)

[Breeder]

Originally Posted by G-Sun

Any chance it can output linear shape?

I think it could be done, I will give it a try when I find the time.

Originally Posted by G-Sun

This just looks awesome
Do we need some sort of manual/instructions?
(In that case, may I suggest the wiki)

Yep, I'll create a wiki (on SWS page) input as soon as I can - it's all straight forward except for certain cases involving linear points behind currently selected point

[IXix]

Nice one Breeder, I wondered what you were up to. Looks like you've taken a ton of tedium out of tempo mapping. Good work!

[Breeder]

Originally Posted by IXix

Nice one Breeder, I wondered what you were up to. Looks like you've taken a ton of tedium out of tempo mapping. Good work!

I'm standing on the shoulder of giants there. I've learned A LOT by reading posts of you more experienced guys and examining a great SWS source code. So thanks for that!

Reaper is such a strange thing...it can turn you into a coder if you're not careful

[Bobby3503]

This is exactly what I was looking/hoping for!! Very much appreciated - thanks!

[TimTyler]

I have a feeling I'm about to get into trouble... Reason? Answer is probably here, but I missed it. Saying "sorry" now.

Project set to: BEATS(Position only)
Project timebase: Beats
Track and media set to: Project Default/Timebase

All audio should not move. One track is fine, three other tracks get WAY out of sync if I change the tempo of the song.

I'm trying to add a midi introduction to an existing audio recording of piano and three guitar tracks. The whole song is rubato, but I want to record the intro (via midi)so it flows nicely into the rubato piano/guitar tracks. When I change tempo, all the track start times change. That doesn't bother me at all if the four existing tracks would stay in sync. They don't.

Help me, please, keep all my recorded audio tracks in sync while I mess with the tempo to get my string intro to flow into the song start.

Thanks!

Tim

[heda]

Originally Posted by TimTyler

Help me, please, keep all my recorded audio tracks in sync while I mess with the tempo to get my string intro to flow into the song start.

Thanks!

Tim

you must set those tracks timebase to Time.
That way they won't be affected by tempo changes and will be in sync.

[Seven5555]

I tried Riffstation and you drop a file in it and it tells you the BPM and aligns a click to it in a couple of seconds. But you cannot record or save that track with the click.

I have a bunch of tunes that i have lost the individual tracks for. I want to quickly align drums so i can rerecord everything else. Also i would like to record my own versions of cover tunes in this manner. Not to sell.

If Anyone knows of a affordable place that can do data recovery on a hard drive that needs the heads replaced, that would be helpful too.

[G-Sun]

New thread:
Tempo mapping and manipulation with SWS

Actions and documentation

[doxent]

Just finished my first tutorial for reaper. It took me quite long when I figured it out and used Studio One 2 for that before.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3oIngWLpU1Y

Still miss the detect transient feature present in S1 so it could help me adjust tempo even more accurately.

[Youn]

Originally Posted by doxent

Just finished my first tutorial for reaper. It took me quite long when I figured it out and used Studio One 2 for that before.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3oIngWLpU1Y

Still miss the detect transient feature present in S1 so it could help me adjust tempo even more accurately.

The video shows probably the most labour intensive method to create a tempo map. Just look one post above yours to see some other tools to make things more efficient and accurate.

IMO this thread should probably be revised to show the latest/greatest way to go about this, just to clarify things for newcomers.

[doxent]

Originally Posted by Youn

The video shows probably the most labour intensive method to create a tempo map. Just look one post above yours to see some other tools to make things more efficient and accurate.

IMO this thread should probably be revised to show the latest/greatest way to go about this, just to clarify things for newcomers.

I didn't read about SWS before and tapping never worked for me as I always lose rhythm easily. The method I made is close to the one I've been using in Studio One for quite long time. The marker method always makes me big headache.

[Youn]

Originally Posted by doxent

I didn't read about SWS before and tapping never worked for me as I always lose rhythm easily. The method I made is close to the one I've been using in Studio One for quite long time. The marker method always makes me big headache.

Oh that's fine, whatever you are comfortable with. A tip, in case you haven't learned: you can fine-tune the envelope points up and down by using the keypad up/down arrows (AKA 8 and 2). This should give you a bit more accuracy then click/dragging the envelope.

[Manolito Mystiq]

Hey there,

Thanks for the tips. I got it to work, but I still have some issues.

A. I can’t hold down the shortcut key to finish it in a breeze, because it pops up a window asking me in every instant what time signature I want it to be. In some ways it was needed for my song because it kept changing time signatures, but I’d like to be able to do it without.

B. I have an orchestral piece I want to make a tempo track on. It’s very dynamic, though, and sometimes the file is so soft that it’s hard to find a clear peak. Slowing it down with the playback and redoing it manually can take care of it, but I’d like to hear the point I've set, so I can listen if I put the line at the right spot. It seems after the shortcut macro, I can’t fine tune the made beats.

C. For this one piece, having only the first beat of each bar as a reference is not precise enough, because the beats keep changing even midway a bar—with all the fermatas and such. By inserting a marker on every beat ('1/4's), I seem to solve the problem, but then point A is my problem.

I did get to insert a midi track along with it, so that’s done, too.

Thanks, anyway. I think I can work with what I have. It only is a lot harder to do.

P.S.

The song is “Why God, Why?”. I want to practice my MIDI techniques and VSTi's, Hollywood Strings/Brass/Woodwinds. This piece is rather simple; perfect to start with experimenting and learning.

[Breeder]

Originally Posted by Manolito Mystiq

Hey there,
A. I can’t hold down the shortcut key to finish it in a breeze, because it pops up a window asking me in every instant what time signature I want it to be. In some ways it was needed for my song because it kept changing time signatures, but I’d like to be able to do it without.

You've probably used Create measure from time selection (new time signature) in your macro instead of Create measure from time selection (detect tempo)

For the rest of your questions, I suggest you check SWS topic: http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=118061

Originally Posted by Manolito Mystiq

having only the first beat of each bar as a reference is not precise enough,

With SWS method you can pick number of beats per measure:
http://wiki.cockos.com/wiki/index.ph...pping_with_SWS

Originally Posted by Manolito Mystiq

...it’s hard to find a clear peak...It seems after the shortcut macro, I can’t fine tune the made beats.

To hear your tempo mapping immediately I suggest using MIDI, instead of project markers
http://wiki.cockos.com/wiki/index.ph...SWS#Using_MIDI

For fine tuning the markers after the fact, you can use these:
http://wiki.cockos.com/wiki/index.ph...e_tempo_marker

[Manolito Mystiq]

Hey, Thanks for your fast response! I’ll look into it.

[bardo]

Okay, I officially need help!
Here is what I have,
I have set markers to the beat of the song( on the one)
Time selection:set start point
Create measure from time selectio( detect tempo)
Time selection: set end point
Create measure from time selection( new time signature)
Set the short cut to the number 0
In project settings I changed "time base for items/envelopes/ markers": to Time
Also the "timebase for tempo/time signature envelope" to Time

When I hit my shortcut key(0)
Nothing happens!
If I play the song and hit (0) the
"edit time signatur"e box appears
As I continue to hold (0) time sig box goes to
000000000000/4
Time

What am I doing wrong???

[dug dog]

Bardo:

I feel your frustration. I've been there.

Why not try the new and improved method? It's MUCH simpler and just as effective. You will need all the markers that you've placed already, so you've not wasted your time doing that.

http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=118061

[bardo]

Thanks dug dog!
Ended up doing it by hand, a long and tedious task.
Defiantly need to pick up this trick and appreciate the link

Bardo

[Damage Inc.]

This is really weird. It used to be that I could just click the tap-tempo button to the rhythm of the song and the tempo-grid (or whatever) and the metronome would change into that speed. But what happens now is, whatever track is playing in the project speeds up as well. So say, I have a song that goes at about 100BPM, and the metronome is clicking away at 120BPM, so I tap-tempo the metronome to the song and it lowers to about the same speed of course, but then the song's playback goes down just as much. This is just wrong.
There's no way I can put the metronome at the same speed, cause whatever speed I enter for the metronome, the track's playback changes as well.
What the heck is going on? Is there some kind of "grouping" activated accidentally or anything like that? I didn't have this problem a couple of days ago, when I last used Reaper.

[Garrick]

hi damage

in project settings you might want timebase set to time when tapping tempo. i normally have it beats(position length rate) once i have set the tempo

[Damage Inc.]

Originally Posted by Garrick

hi damage

in project settings you might want timebase set to time when tapping tempo. i normally have it beats(position length rate) once i have set the tempo

Do you mean for 'Timebase for items/envelopes/markers' or 'Timebase for tempo/time signature envelope' or both?
Well, the former seemed to do the trick, I guess the default changed when I'd recently updated Reaper since a long time ago, but I didn't notice the change earlier.
I don't understand what those settings mean/do exactly, but I guess they just determine what the tempo is attached to or what is attached to the tempo rather.
For now I've put both settings to 'Time'... Thanks!

[musicman1007]

Awesome! I've been looking for a way to do this for a while

[LugNut]

Originally Posted by Breeder

You've probably used Create measure from time selection (new time signature) in your macro instead of Create measure from time selection (detect tempo)

For the rest of your questions, I suggest you check SWS topic: http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=118061

With SWS method you can pick number of beats per measure:
http://wiki.cockos.com/wiki/index.ph...pping_with_SWS


To hear your tempo mapping immediately I suggest using MIDI, instead of project markers
http://wiki.cockos.com/wiki/index.ph...SWS#Using_MIDI

For fine tuning the markers after the fact, you can use these:
http://wiki.cockos.com/wiki/index.ph...e_tempo_marker

Hi,

Breeder thank u thank u thank u ...for these invaluable extensions AND for the excellent documentation! Grazie!

Lug

[krahosk]

How is it that when I create tempo markers, I can't move the cursor to the place I want? It always jams to the marker and I have to use Ctrl+mouse move to unstick it.

[G-Sun]

Originally Posted by krahosk

How is it that when I create tempo markers, I can't move the cursor to the place I want? It always jams to the marker and I have to use Ctrl+mouse move to unstick it.

alt + s (snap off)

[krahosk]

Thanks!

[G-Sun]

Could someone please unsticky this thread,
and stick the updated one:
http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=118061

[Fergler]

Holy, this works great. Much faster than it looks, too, once you've set up the commands.

If you are using tab to transient, just make sure you are aware of what transients are actually down beats. It's easy to get lost.

I used this method to rectify that:

1. Use a midi track to tap the 1st beat of every bar. I just did downbeats but you could also use octaves to denote the other beats to make it clear where those are too. This doesn't need to be accurate.

2. Using tab to transient, add your markers. Have the midi track in view so you can see where the beats are roughly, this will prevent you from adding a marker on the wrong beat.

3. Convert to time, as per tutorial.

[jopatius]

I have an audio track (recorded to metronome) that I am trying to play in synch with a tempo-mapped Reaper project.

I have sliced the bars of the audio track into separate items, and it seems the only thing I can do now is to alt-drag the ends of each item -
unless someone has an macro like mentioned below now?
Anyone?

Originally Posted by Bevosss

I think the fastest way at present is to paste an item at each measure and alt-drag the end of the item to the next measure start (with snap enabled). Possibly there could be a fast macro for it (given some thought).

[Garrick]

Originally Posted by jopatius

I have an audio track (recorded to metronome) that I am trying to play in synch with a tempo-mapped Reaper project.

I have sliced the bars of the audio track into separate items, and it seems the only thing I can do now is to alt-drag the ends of each item -
unless someone has an macro like mentioned below now?
Anyone?

There is

sws: Quanize items edges to grid(change length)

I think that's what you're after

[MRatton]

To adjust the timeline ruler I use a reference track where I register one note for each beat. The procedure uses a simple ReaScript.

Look at: http://www.music-center.com.br/index...sical&Itemid=5

The tutorial is in Portuguese, but I hope the images help to understand.

[may4th]

I'm new to Reaper and home recording in general, so this is a steep learning curve for me. I'm very interested in beat mapping because I am taking found vocals and adding my own instrumentation. This would be perfect for this application and I set out to give it a go. I haven't done macros yet either, so I'm learning that too. I am trying to do a keyboard shortcut for the macros outlined in the beginning of this tutorial. I have the first three found, but for the life of me I can't locate either Markers:Time signature from time selection OR the new designation - Markers: create measure from time selection. Has it been renamed yet again? Pulling my freaking hair out. Help......

[G-Sun]

Originally Posted by may4th

I'm new to Reaper and home recording in general, so this is a steep learning curve for me. I'm very interested in beat mapping because I am taking found vocals and adding my own instrumentation. This would be perfect for this application and I set out to give it a go. I haven't done macros yet either, so I'm learning that too. I am trying to do a keyboard shortcut for the macros outlined in the beginning of this tutorial. I have the first three found, but for the life of me I can't locate either Markers:Time signature from time selection OR the new designation - Markers: create measure from time selection. Has it been renamed yet again? Pulling my freaking hair out. Help......

http://wiki.cockos.com/wiki/index.ph...pping_with_SWS

[may4th]

Thank you, G-Sun. I will give this a go when I have the time.

[Breeder]

Bevosss, could you please update the first post so it also includes information on SWS tempo mapping stuff:
http://wiki.cockos.com/wiki/index.ph...pping_with_SWS
http://wiki.cockos.com/wiki/index.ph..._grid_with_SWS

It would help a whole lot of people finding it and making tempo mapping a bit easier for them

Thanks!

[grinder]

Guy's I am a bit late on this post
I am putting in tempo changes in this case
One bar 7/4 then one bar of 6/4
I wish to have an easy way of copying this and pasting how ever many times I wish this to occur instead of having to place each tempo change in via the box.
Is there anyway of doing this with ease?
(I have looked at the manual)

Grinder