Old 04-03-2011, 06:52 AM   #1
breakeven
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Default Pre-Open causing delay?

This is odd.

Two mics on a kick, one inside, one out. I'm gating the outside mic by sending the inside mic to channels 3/4. (So ReaGate set to auxiliary input detection.)

Now, if I use the pre-open slider on the outside mic (on the gate whose detection is set to 3/4) I get significant delays.

They were there on rendering as well.

Any ideas?

Should I be putting up screen shots/clips to make this a bit clearer?

Thanks guys, I'm looking forward to understanding what's going on here.
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Old 04-03-2011, 06:57 AM   #2
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No, clue why your getting delays, always works like a charm for me:



~Rob.
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Old 04-03-2011, 10:01 AM   #3
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ok, I'll put up clips and screen shots tomorrow if no-one else has come across it.
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Old 04-03-2011, 10:41 AM   #4
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I believe preopen is a look ahead which by nature will add latency.
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Old 04-03-2011, 10:47 AM   #5
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We have latency compensation Never once had a problem. But what kind of "delay" are we talking about here?
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Old 04-03-2011, 10:55 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by junioreq View Post
We have latency compensation
He's probably doing it live?
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Old 04-03-2011, 11:00 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by breakeven View Post
I'm gating the outside mic by sending the inside mic to channels 3/4. (So ReaGate set to auxiliary input detection.)

Now, if I use the pre-open slider on the outside mic (on the gate whose detection is set to 3/4) I get significant delays.
If you tell ReasGate to look-ahead (which is what pre-open is) it must delay its output at least as much as the pre-open. That's why you get the latency problem when using it when recording live input.

Just record what you have and gate it after recording...
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Old 04-03-2011, 11:32 AM   #8
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LOL Live lookahead loool

"They were there on rendering as well."..
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Old 04-03-2011, 11:46 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by junioreq View Post
LOL Live lookahead loool

"They were there on rendering as well."..
Well, if he rendered what he recorded then the delay will be there as well
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Old 04-03-2011, 11:57 AM   #10
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Oh no! He must be trying it live haha..
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Old 04-03-2011, 12:05 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by junioreq View Post
Oh no! He must be trying it live haha..
And maybe has forgotten to enable the clairvoyant mode...


Sorry couldn't resist...

Michael
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Old 04-03-2011, 12:09 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by MichaJo View Post
And maybe has forgotten to enable the clairvoyant mode...
*lol*
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Old 04-04-2011, 01:15 AM   #13
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Default You guys always so smug?

Of course it's not live.

So is this the amazing reaper community I've heard so much about?

Jesus christ.

I'll put up clips right now, but hey, let me save you some time:

"hurh hurh hurh maybe he is using a slap delay instead of a gate hurh hurh hurh"

Last edited by breakeven; 04-04-2011 at 01:27 AM.
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Old 04-04-2011, 01:26 AM   #14
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Default Clips.

http://soundcloud.com/user5751141/se...e-reaper-forum

First clip with no pre-open, second clip with pre-open at 40ms.

I get the same problem if I uncheck all other plugins.

Thanks for the help.
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Old 04-04-2011, 03:41 AM   #15
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Holy crap, 40ms!!You really shouldn't need too much lookahead, if any. By using the kick in as a key, you already get lik 1-2 ms of natural lookahead (because the kick out mic is like 1-2 feet away).

~Rob.
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Old 04-04-2011, 04:04 AM   #16
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Yes. I know.

I put it at that so that there wouldn't be anymore confusion, and we could get on with toubleshooting.

At 4ms the kick is almost completely removed by phasing.
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Old 04-04-2011, 04:11 AM   #17
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Machine specs?
REAPER version?
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Old 04-04-2011, 04:14 AM   #18
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Got a screenshot of your reagate? Something is def weird...
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Old 04-04-2011, 04:22 AM   #19
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2.53 Ghz Intel Core 2 Duo, 4 GB ram running Mac OS X 10.6.6
Reaper 3.73/64bit

What's strange is that the problem still occurs even if I remove every other track and plugin.

Screen shot to check that I haven't messed up the routing and am somehow sending it back to itself.

(for the love of god, please don't point out that soloing those tracks is unnecessary.)
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File Type: jpg Screen shot 2011-04-04 at 9.20.52 PM.jpg (65.8 KB, 238 views)
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Old 04-04-2011, 04:27 AM   #20
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Can someone else check to see if pre-open/look ahead works for them when it's detection source is a different track from the one it's on?

i.e. Gate is on track two, with detector input being the received aux input of track One.

Maybe that's the problem, that the pre-open is only able to look ahead on items on the track that it's assigned to?
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Old 04-04-2011, 04:56 AM   #21
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This works like a charm, I always do it. Nothing wrong with reaper...
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Old 04-04-2011, 04:56 AM   #22
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Ouch, as I suspected in the back of my head. Uncheck "preview filter"

"(for the love of god, please don't point out that soloing those tracks is unnecessary.)" lol don't take any offense to that stuff, we've just been hanging around here for years....and get bored lol..... Take it as a good sign

Look at my screenshot above, its setup the exact way for the same purpose.. in a mix...

Kinda hard otherwize to diagnose anything because the settings are probably in some test mode, they are way outta whack..

~Rob.

Last edited by junioreq; 04-04-2011 at 05:15 AM.
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Old 04-04-2011, 07:19 AM   #23
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Very glad to have my error spotted! And even happy to take a joke at my expense as payment.

So the deal is that preview filter is before latency comp? That seems strange?

Also, I found some of these comments fairly disheartening/uncool.

Last edited by breakeven; 04-04-2011 at 07:27 AM.
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Old 04-04-2011, 07:29 AM   #24
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Hey man, e-mail me the session and clicks.

I'm on windows on v 3.75 I'll see if its a mac thing... or maybe something else weird.
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Old 04-04-2011, 07:50 AM   #25
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"Also, I found some of these comments fairly disheartening/uncool."

Think you might need to relax a bit there dood.... Seriously. Life is too short..

Anyhow, happy gating!

~Rob.
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Old 04-04-2011, 09:34 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyGinese View Post
Hey man, e-mail me the session and clicks.

I'm on windows on v 3.75 I'll see if its a mac thing... or maybe something else weird.
Thanks Jonny, the solution was found! I'd stuffed up by having the "preview filter" selected. I'm still surprised that the preview bypasses latency compensation.
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Old 04-04-2011, 09:35 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by junioreq View Post
"Also, I found some of these comments fairly disheartening/uncool."

Think you might need to relax a bit there dood.... Seriously. Life is too short..

Anyhow, happy gating!

~Rob.
Even now you're focusing on me rather then the issue of preview filter bypassing delay compensation, and if that's an issue or not.

EDIT: just realised the answer to my own question; if it was delay compensated then the entire track would be playing with a noticeable lag, making fine riding faders difficult.

Last edited by breakeven; 04-04-2011 at 09:52 AM.
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Old 04-04-2011, 09:45 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by breakeven View Post
Even now you're focusing on me rather then the issue of preview filter bypassing delay compensation, and if that's an issue or not.
It's not bypassing it. The "preview filter" option is like the sidechain 'listen' option found in some compressors. You're hearing the filter, 'pre-opened'.
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Old 04-04-2011, 10:27 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by breakeven View Post
So is this the amazing reaper community I've heard so much about?
Nah, it's only one guy foolin' around with prejudice.

Welcome to forums, glad the solution was found, it's always
good to describe your problem thoroughly (to remove suspicion
of basic mistakes) and accompany it with a screen shot

e
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