Old 08-06-2015, 08:11 AM   #1
famous beagle
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Default Auto punching without time selection

So I know how to use the "Record mode: time selection auto punch" feature. But is there a way to set an auto punch-in point without having to set an end? In other words, can you just set an auto punch-in point without a punch out point?

I'd like to be able to just punch in and be able to keep going without having to worry about the recording stopping. Didn't see anything like that in the manual, but surely there's a way to do it?

Thanks
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Old 08-06-2015, 09:00 AM   #2
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After three years from the switch to Reaper from Cubendo, I can say that the only thing I miss is the Punching I/O method: two locators for In and Out, free positioning and activation.
Did you try to post a FR?
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Old 08-06-2015, 09:07 AM   #3
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Why not just set your punch out point somewhere beyond the end of the song?
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Old 08-06-2015, 09:23 AM   #4
Tim Ragnur
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What edkilp said.

Another tip is to use "Time selection: Set start point" and "Time selection: Set end point" as punch in & out while rolling.
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Old 08-06-2015, 09:25 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by famous beagle View Post
So I know how to use the "Record mode: time selection auto punch" feature. But is there a way to set an auto punch-in point without having to set an end? In other words, can you just set an auto punch-in point without a punch out point?

I'd like to be able to just punch in and be able to keep going without having to worry about the recording stopping. Didn't see anything like that in the manual, but surely there's a way to do it?

Thanks
the recording doesn't actually stop, if you drag the item back out you'll see that. The time selection just sort of automatically trims the item.

It would be nice to have an option where there is simply a punch in point.

Closest thing to that behavior would be to split the items at the punch in point - making sure the item(s) after the punch in point is selected and use the "auto-punch selected items" record-mode.
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Old 08-06-2015, 09:34 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by famous beagle View Post
So I know how to use the "Record mode: time selection auto punch" feature. But is there a way to set an auto punch-in point without having to set an end? In other words, can you just set an auto punch-in point without a punch out point?

I'd like to be able to just punch in and be able to keep going without having to worry about the recording stopping. Didn't see anything like that in the manual, but surely there's a way to do it?

Thanks
There's always the option to record "DAW style" and not simulate the analog tape deck punch limitations.

Make tracks to record in and simply record at will.
Make 'arrangement' tracks for the parts you want to keep.
Record/edit/comp at will.

Just throwing that out there.
If the 'analog' workflow is your thing - that's cool. Not going to argue.
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Old 08-06-2015, 10:07 AM   #7
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Thanks for the replies y'all.

It doesn't have anything to do with preferring an analog workflow. Here's why it came up:

I'm recording harmonica examples for a book, and I'm working by myself. Each example is a different length, so it's not really a "song" I'm working on. I played for a bit and made a mistake, so I wanted to punch in there. I hate using the mouse (not only because I always hate it, even with MS Word, for example, but because I'm standing when I'm recording, and I don't want to have to bend over and click the mouse; it's much easier to push buttons), so I have command keys and/or controls mapped to my Nanokontrol that I use for setting the beginning and ending of the time selection, navigating, etc.

So I moved to the point just before the mistake (again, not using the mouse) and set the time in location. Then I used CTRL+arrow to quickly move ahead by what I thought was plenty of space to finish the exercise. I punched in and played until the end, but then I realized that I actually hadn't extended the time selection far enough.

(Quick regression)
James HE: I didn't realize that the recording continues past the end of the time selection. If I had known that, I probably wouldn't have posted this question.
(Back to our normally scheduled programming)

So I thought, "surely their must be a way to set the in point without having to set an out point."

Tim Ragnur: I'm not entirely sure what you mean, but if you're saying to set the beginning point after I've started recording, I can't do that because I'm at the mic. If you're saying to set the beginning point, start recording, and then set the end point, that doesn't seem to work for me. If I don't have both begin and end points set for the time selection, then it starts recording right away and doesn't wait to punch in.

Anyway, obviously, I could have just held down CTRL+arrow for several seconds and made EXTRA sure that I would have plenty of time for the exercise (and that's probably what I will do from now on I guess), but I just thought if there was a quick way to set a punch-in spot, that would delete an extra step (having to set the out point) and would allow you to play as long as you like just in case the inspiration of a lifetime struck.

(Again, I didn't realize the recording kept going after the end of the time selection.)

Still seems odd to me that there's just not a way to set an auto punch in on its own, but oh well. At least now I know that it continues to record after the time selection.
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Old 08-06-2015, 10:47 AM   #8
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(Again, I didn't realize the recording kept going after the end of the time selection.)

Still seems odd to me that there's just not a way to set an auto punch in on its own, but oh well. At least now I know that it continues to record after the time selection.
It also starts recording where ever your edit cursor is. Even if you set a punch in/out, it also records starting at the edit cursor.
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Old 08-06-2015, 10:48 AM   #9
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It also starts recording where ever your edit cursor is. Even if you set a punch in/out, it also records starting at the edit cursor.
Yes I realize that now too! Thanks
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Old 08-06-2015, 10:50 AM   #10
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But seriously ... I thought Reaper was supposed to be all about convenience and customization/speed of workflow. It's less work to set only an in point if you don't need to set the out point. To me it seems like a no-brainer.
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Old 08-06-2015, 11:52 AM   #11
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I'm not entirely sure what you mean, but if you're saying to set the beginning point after I've started recording, I can't do that because I'm at the mic.
Yeah that was what I meant. I see that wouldn't fit in this case.
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Old 08-06-2015, 12:08 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by famous beagle View Post
But seriously ... I thought Reaper was supposed to be all about convenience and customization/speed of workflow. It's less work to set only an in point if you don't need to set the out point. To me it seems like a no-brainer.
I'm not totally sure how you operate, but what if you put a marker (01) how ever long into the project necessary. And used something like this custom action as a record button:

Xenakios/SWS: Store edit cursor position
Markers: Go to marker 01
Time selection: Set end point
Xenakios/SWS: Recall edit cursor position
Transport: Record
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Old 08-06-2015, 12:42 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Tim Ragnur View Post
I'm not totally sure how you operate, but what if you put a marker (01) how ever long into the project necessary. And used something like this custom action as a record button:

Xenakios/SWS: Store edit cursor position
Markers: Go to marker 01
Time selection: Set end point
Xenakios/SWS: Recall edit cursor position
Transport: Record
Thanks for the tip. That sounds as though it would work, but I think it would unnecessary, now that I think about it. If I just go way out at the very beginning (way past what I would think necessary) and set the end point there, then I would only need to adjust the beginning point - which is only one button anyway - as I progressed through the track with subsequent punches if necessary.

Right? That may be the closest thing to faking a "punch-in-only" method.
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Old 08-06-2015, 02:27 PM   #14
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I like the usb pedal method. Set to toggle record. Punch in and out at will.
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Old 08-06-2015, 03:10 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by famous beagle View Post
Thanks for the tip. That sounds as though it would work, but I think it would unnecessary, now that I think about it. If I just go way out at the very beginning (way past what I would think necessary) and set the end point there, then I would only need to adjust the beginning point - which is only one button anyway - as I progressed through the track with subsequent punches if necessary.

Right? That may be the closest thing to faking a "punch-in-only" method.
Yeah that's much more elegant
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Old 08-06-2015, 03:32 PM   #16
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I like the usb pedal method. Set to toggle record. Punch in and out at will.
Didn't even realize those existed. Something like this?

http://www.gearbest.com/usb-gadgets/...l9QRoCH2Dw_wcB
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Old 08-06-2015, 04:13 PM   #17
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btw there is a (little known i think) action 'transport: start/stop recording at next project marker'

this should work well for your needs: drop a marker, execute the action via key/midi/etc. it begins playback (if stopped) then recording starts at the marker.
( and that means at the marker, nothing is recorded prior )

if there are markers after the 'next marker' they are ignored so it doesnt get messy.

-- tip: can use action sws/br 'create project marker at mouse cursor' - bind to a key, then is v easy to place a marker where your punch in is, then execute the 'start recoding at next marker' action.

likewise it can act as a 'record until the next marker' feature if you execute the action whilst recording, or if it is part of a macro starting with record, followed by that action.

seems pretty handy
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Old 08-06-2015, 07:16 PM   #18
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Usb.brando.com
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Old 08-06-2015, 10:30 PM   #19
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Tie record to an action marker.
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Old 08-07-2015, 12:34 AM   #20
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btw there is a (little known i think) action 'transport: start/stop recording at next project marker'
Nice find!!
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Old 08-07-2015, 12:42 AM   #21
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Really liking the idea of that MIDI footswitch. At least I could kid myself it is working like my old Fostex Hard Disk recorders.

But $19 seems a little steep for a cheap piece-of-crap footswitch and the software to set it.

Off to see if anyone else does an alternative... I will report back if I find one tat looks good.
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Old 08-07-2015, 07:19 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BenK-msx View Post
btw there is a (little known i think) action 'transport: start/stop recording at next project marker'

this should work well for your needs: drop a marker, execute the action via key/midi/etc. it begins playback (if stopped) then recording starts at the marker.
( and that means at the marker, nothing is recorded prior )

if there are markers after the 'next marker' they are ignored so it doesnt get messy.

-- tip: can use action sws/br 'create project marker at mouse cursor' - bind to a key, then is v easy to place a marker where your punch in is, then execute the 'start recoding at next marker' action.

likewise it can act as a 'record until the next marker' feature if you execute the action whilst recording, or if it is part of a macro starting with record, followed by that action.

seems pretty handy
Thanks for the tip. I'll check that out.
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Old 08-07-2015, 07:20 AM   #23
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Tie record to an action marker.
I'm sorry, but I don't fully understand. Can you be more specific please? Thanks
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Old 08-07-2015, 07:36 AM   #24
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I'm sorry, but I don't fully understand. Can you be more specific please? Thanks
There is a marker type called "Action Marker", create one (or rather enable them) then the name of the marker becomes !actionID or similar - search around for action markers.

If that action is record, or record toggle (whatever you like), it will perform that action when the play curser hits the marker. Thusly, just move the marker to your punch in point. Then place the play cursor somewhere before that point and hit play. It will punch and start recording at the marker.

You could make two of these with the proper actions and have true In/Out points. Then just move them around at will. If I'm reading your OP correctly, you just wanted to punch in and no punch out. In that case you only need the one. Lots of possibilities really when you think of all the things that can be accomplished.
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Old 08-07-2015, 07:42 AM   #25
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There is a marker type called "Action Marker", create one (or rather enable them) then the name of the marker becomes !actionID or similar - search around for action markers.
More specifically: right click in the action list menu bar:



Haha - now that's a funny bug in the Snipping Tool
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Old 08-07-2015, 09:03 AM   #26
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Thanks for the explanation. That does sound as though it would do what I'm wanting to do. The only problem is that it seems it would require a lot of mouse usage, which I don't want to do --- unless there's a way to move markers without using the mouse?
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Old 08-07-2015, 09:24 AM   #27
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Thanks for the replies y'all.

It doesn't have anything to do with preferring an analog workflow.
You might want to consider not using the punch features then as they are all about simulating analog tape deck workflow. Where you needed to punch the new part into an existing track (because there weren't more tracks available) and perform the punch in and punch out edits along with performing the part and all in real time while the tape was rolling.

In a DAW:

Make a track (or a number of tracks for multitrack input) to record in. Don't monitor playback from your recording track.
Make tracks under it to build your arrangement.
Drop parts you like into the 'arrangement' tracks as you get good parts.

Your recorded tracks stack up in lanes in your recording track as you lay them down.
When you grab a bit and drop it into your arrangement, you can edit as you comp things together. You can change your mind and preview other takes and edit between them as you please just as fast as you can think about it.

There's no need to treat tracks as a limited resource and go through the exercise of setting punch in and out points and trying to make those edit decisions ahead of time before the part is even recorded.

These punch features are truly only there for old-school tape deck guys that want to continue with their old workflow for personal or artistic reasons.

FYI:
The numeric pad keys are set by default to move items. '2' is move item down one track and '8' is move item up one track.

Make sure to set Options > New recording that overlaps existing media items > Creates new media items in separate lanes.
This is the 'classic' overdub mode.
The default mode of 'splits existing items' is intended to build new takes into the single original item as additional audio streams. The original item will edit as a single item and not allow you to move or edit overdubs like you would expect.


That's a lot of talking... but this is quick, works on any DAW, and doesn't require learning any complex archaic punch features.

Learn a few commands for placing markers and you'll be overdubbing as quickly as you can think of the parts and not touch the mouse at all.
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Old 08-07-2015, 10:16 AM   #28
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You might want to consider not using the punch features then as they are all about simulating analog tape deck workflow. Where you needed to punch the new part into an existing track (because there weren't more tracks available) and perform the punch in and punch out edits along with performing the part and all in real time while the tape was rolling.

In a DAW:

Make a track (or a number of tracks for multitrack input) to record in. Don't monitor playback from your recording track.
Make tracks under it to build your arrangement.
Drop parts you like into the 'arrangement' tracks as you get good parts.

Your recorded tracks stack up in lanes in your recording track as you lay them down.
When you grab a bit and drop it into your arrangement, you can edit as you comp things together. You can change your mind and preview other takes and edit between them as you please just as fast as you can think about it.

There's no need to treat tracks as a limited resource and go through the exercise of setting punch in and out points and trying to make those edit decisions ahead of time before the part is even recorded.

These punch features are truly only there for old-school tape deck guys that want to continue with their old workflow for personal or artistic reasons.

FYI:
The numeric pad keys are set by default to move items. '2' is move item down one track and '8' is move item up one track.

Make sure to set Options > New recording that overlaps existing media items > Creates new media items in separate lanes.
This is the 'classic' overdub mode.
The default mode of 'splits existing items' is intended to build new takes into the single original item as additional audio streams. The original item will edit as a single item and not allow you to move or edit overdubs like you would expect.


That's a lot of talking... but this is quick, works on any DAW, and doesn't require learning any complex archaic punch features.

Learn a few commands for placing markers and you'll be overdubbing as quickly as you can think of the parts and not touch the mouse at all.
Thanks for the idea. I must say, though, I really hate the "lanes" idea. That drove me crazy when I first started working with a DAW. It just looked so scrambled and crowded to me. As soon as I figured out how to, I always set my projects up with the "trim existing recording behind new take" (or whatever it is). The thing is, I am more of an analog guy and use the DAW out of necessity for my job, but I just meant that my wanting to punch in without using a time selection had nothing to do with wanting a more anaglog workflow. However, after hearing you talk about it, maybe it does, and I just didn't know it.

Because, yeah .. I hate the idea of just filling up dozens of tracks and then comping them together. It's now how I prefer to work. Different strokes I guess. I am one of those old-school tape guys I guess.
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