Old 11-19-2014, 09:23 AM   #1
jpchartrand
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Default Why I'm dropping Reaper

After countless hours spent trying to customize Reaper to imitate really basic functions easily accomplished in other DAWs, I have decided to stop. It's really just wasting my time. I've lost so much time trying to customize it to my liking. In other DAW's (Live, Logic, Bitwig) it normally takes me 2-3 hours to get everything customized to my liking. In Reaper, I seriously spent at least 80+ hours and it's still not even close...

Sure there are a lot of benefits in Reaper and man have I tried to love it and use it. However some crucial basic features are missing.

Here's some of my feedback and suggestions for the Reaper guys if they want to make this grow into a usable DAW.

- MARQUEE tool -> The one in Reaper is terrible. You can't select an area of a track without affecting the whole time selection. Just because of this, I would say Reaper is unusable (in my case anyways)

-Routing -> not user friendly. Needs to be more like Logic's which is extremely easy to use.

-The Edit cursor -> What a pain in the butt. Why in the world can't we take it out? I have no use for it and it messes up my mouse mods/key commands. If it needs to stay, it needs to be better integrated.

All in all, I learned a lot by using Reaper but never made a single song with it due to its limitations. I will of course look into Reaper 5 when it comes out and if these basic features have been implemented, I will happily upgrade and use it again.
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Old 11-19-2014, 09:30 AM   #2
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Thats too bad.

I've made over 200 tunes with it
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Old 11-19-2014, 09:31 AM   #3
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Well, you gave it a good try I suppose. I think it is very interesting that once in a while a post like this surfaces, and then a totally opposite post (about how after struggling with every DAW known to humankind Reaper saves the day....) also comes to light. There is no one tool that will be "the" tool for everyone (you can't please everyone all of the time, but you can please some of the people some of the time). There is something for everyone, good luck finding your super-DAW.
I have successfully made over 300 songs all in Reaper. I have created (tracked, arranged, mixed, mastered) multiple albums all in Reaper. I have even rescued other mixes that originated in other DAW's. I find Reaper to be extremely usable, quickly customizable, and ultra-intuitive and user-friendly.
There is something for everyone.
I hope that you post back here when you find whatever it is you are looking for, I am curious what works for you after Reaper didn't.
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Old 11-19-2014, 09:46 AM   #4
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I think you should take some time to learn the reaper basics.
Switching from a daw to another is not fast for everybody, especially if you want all daw's working in the same way.
Check the tutorials, learn how to do custom actions and you'll be more comfortable with reaper.
Also if you already like logic or bitwig, you have not reason to switch to reaper.
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Old 11-19-2014, 09:58 AM   #5
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Quote:
I've lost so much time trying to customize it to my liking. In other DAW's (Live, Logic, Bitwig)
It's the reason multiple products exists. I have always said, find the DAW that has the features you want and use that one instead of trying to make one into something it isn't; it truly is the best way. The only reason I use Reaper is for that reason, if it didn't do what I wanted, I wouldn't be typing this, I'd be using something else.
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Old 11-19-2014, 10:24 AM   #6
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Thinking about doing the same thing for similar reason's and the fact that some long standing bugs are impeding my work process...
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Old 11-19-2014, 10:56 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jpchartrand View Post
After countless hours...
Here's some of my feedback and suggestions for the Reaper guys if they want to make this grow into a usable DAW.

- MARQUEE tool -> The one in Reaper is terrible. You can't select an area of a track without affecting the whole time selection. Just because of this, I would say Reaper is unusable (in my case anyways)
Control-click (right-click) is marquee selection without time selection (or alteration thereof) by default. You can change the assignment (to left-click or something else for example) in Preferences/Mouse modifiers if you like.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jpchartrand View Post
-Routing -> not user friendly. Needs to be more like Logic's which is extremely easy to use.
You can click and drag up/down/across in the routing matrix view and re-route an entire board of complex subgroup bussing, etc, etc in seconds. Or you can drag and drop in the mixer to create sends. I've honestly never seen routing handled so easily and quickly in any other DAW. Certainly not Logic Audio Hell!

Quote:
Originally Posted by jpchartrand View Post
-The Edit cursor -> What a pain in the butt. Why in the world can't we take it out? I have no use for it and it messes up my mouse mods/key commands. If it needs to stay, it needs to be better integrated.
Don't know how to remove the edit cursor off the top of my head. I use this feature all the time so...
Look in the preference settings and you will find all the options for linking it or not to the play cursor and other operations. Might be an off switch for it there too. (How would you edit without an edit cursor?! Maybe you don't edit? Anyway...)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jpchartrand View Post
All in all, I learned a lot by using Reaper but never made a single song with it due to its limitations. I will of course look into Reaper 5 when it comes out and if these basic features have been implemented, I will happily upgrade and use it again.
You didn't find those basics after 80 hours? Crack open that pdf file for the manual or start lighting up the forum before you get this frustrated then!
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Old 11-19-2014, 11:31 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by jpchartrand View Post
In other DAW's (Live, Logic, Bitwig) it normally takes me 2-3 hours to get everything customized to my liking.
That must be because they may not very customizable then.
Reaper is not for everybody. you have the right to choose whatever suits you. Reaper default interface is basic because it forces you to read the manual and discover how to customize it. Then you love it.
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Old 11-19-2014, 11:35 AM   #9
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As others have said above, if you don't like the workflow in the first place then just use whatever DAW suits your style.
But as far as customization goes, you won't find anything deeper than Reaper, take my word for it. It just seems you want it to behave 100% like something else not just "customize" it.
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Old 11-19-2014, 11:49 AM   #10
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As long as Reaper is customizable, CPU-friendly and stable and as long as ReaComp, ReaVerb, ReaVerbate and ReaEq are included I will probably update !
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Old 11-19-2014, 12:38 PM   #11
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So is it really hard to be ignorant? I thought from lifestyle point of view it was the easyest
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Old 11-19-2014, 12:38 PM   #12
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I couldn't write a story in QuarkXpress because it didn't work like MS Word.
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Old 11-19-2014, 12:58 PM   #13
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Wow....after 80+ hours? I have to ask if you read the manual and/or watched the Groove3 videos? But yes, Reaper can be overwhelming with so many options to customize.

I've never used just one daw. But I've decided to go all in with Reaper as far as learning it top to bottom. I also use Reason and Studio One but keep coming back to Reaper.

Good luck with whatever you use.
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Old 11-19-2014, 01:42 PM   #14
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I'm like rvman. I bounce around between a number of DAWs, but eventually always return to Reaper because it's a fantastic tool for learning that, once learned properly, is more flexible than any other DAW. You really can make it your own if you stick with it and make a coordinated effort to learn.

Reaper definitely can seem overwhelming. Those Groove3.com video courses (I've watched "Explained", "Tips & Tricks", and the mixing with Reaper one) are really fantastic value. It's a bit like Linux, I guess. Steeper learning curve that is eventually rewarded with more control. It's not for everyone, though -- no question.
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Old 11-19-2014, 03:22 PM   #15
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I've never understood why someone gives up Reaper because it doesn't do what this DAW or that DAW does. Why come to Reaper in the first place if you already like what this DAW or that DAW does? Just keep using this DAW or that DAW.
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Old 11-19-2014, 03:24 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karbomusic View Post
find the DAW that has the features you want and use that one instead of trying to make one into something it isn't; it truly is the best way.
THIS^^

Best post ever.

See ya
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Old 11-19-2014, 04:06 PM   #17
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hey ...it's OK to drop reaper... it won't break
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Old 11-19-2014, 04:18 PM   #18
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Btw just interesting, seeing your first post

"I'm a new Reaper user. I'm coming from Logic. I've only used reaper for a few days and already I'm loving it. "

I really wonder why you left Logic in first place and why you decided to switch to Reaper? I'm serious, could you please answer? Im asking because i came from Logic 9 as well few years ago. Well i'm also using Ableton Live from time to time (because of the clients) but thats a different story.
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Old 11-19-2014, 04:51 PM   #19
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I do not know much about any of this.
I just want to say that one thing that I have always loved about this forum is how helpful and friendly most people here are.
Justin and his team also are so cool.

I think it is worth noting that the words that they have put under every user name in every post, is very worth noting:

Human being with feelings



the nature of the web and forums is such that, this fact can easily be ignored.
I would call Justin, or whoever put those words there, very wise.
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Old 11-19-2014, 05:11 PM   #20
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Reaper is heavy duty, built like a bull. Reaper is the most customizable DAW ever. What will late you change your theme as your change you pant without problem? As android is for phone, the same as Reaper is for DAWs. Other DAWs are just like iphone, can't make any change, and use them as they are.
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Old 11-19-2014, 05:33 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chas51 View Post
I do not know much about any of this.
I just want to say that one thing that I have always loved about this forum is how helpful and friendly most people here are.
I have been a lurker here and a user of Reaper beside my main DAW, for years. Would have to disagree with you, especially when it comes to threads like these. REAPER users can be quite harsh and insulting to those who dare leave the fold.


Perhaps the OP missed a few items in the manual. No one can say that REAPER is intuitive to use compared to say a Studio One (which I just sold). Recalling my early experiences with the software, I can definitely say it was harder to get going with it, than with any other DAW I have used thus far. I can see how s person relatively new to the program could be easily deterred, or frustrated.
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Old 11-19-2014, 05:46 PM   #22
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I'm actually considering giving up on Reaper as well. For me, Reaper has not been this rock solid, bug free program that it has the reputation for being. I too have spent way too much time trying to customize things to do some pretty basic stuff. Still fairly stable, but i've definitely experienced some weird bugs from time to time, sluggish performance, gui issues, audio dropouts during recording and sample rate sync issues. These don't happen all the time, but it seems like i'm always battling one issue or another at some point.

I think this is partly because I use macs, and the developers (and user base) seem to have a bias towards windows (there's some threads out there showing that Reaper performs much better on windows than mac). Probably going to switch to Logic X once I finish up my current projects (there's no way i'm going back to Pro Tools). I love Cocko's and their ethos, but I need to get back to focusing on making music and spending less time customizing and figuring out weird issues. Hopefully version 5 will fix a lot of things I don't like and I'll be able to come back.
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Old 11-19-2014, 05:46 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrides View Post
I have been a lurker here and a user of Reaper beside my main DAW, for years. Would have to disagree with you, especially when it comes to threads like these. REAPER users can be quite harsh and insulting to those who dare leave the fold.


Perhaps the OP missed a few items in the manual. No one can say that REAPER is intuitive to use compared to say a Studio One (which I just sold). Recalling my early experiences with the software, I can definitely say it was harder to get going with it, than with any other DAW I have used thus far. I can see how s person relatively new to the program could be easily deterred, or frustrated.
I agree. The forum can be really harsh. People use the software in different ways, for different things and have different expectations.
I tried the software many times over years (versions 2 and 3) and was underwhelmed with how it looked and confused by how it worked. It was hard to take seriously. It took one user (Adam Wathan) sharing their config and actions and making some videos to get me to convert officially from Pro Tools in 2010. It was SO FRUSTRATING up until that point. After my life got much better without Pro Tools.
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Old 11-19-2014, 05:54 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by esosotericmetal View Post
I'm actually considering giving up on Reaper as well. For me, Reaper has not been this rock solid, bug free program that it has the reputation for being. I too have spent way too much time trying to customize things to do some pretty basic stuff. Still fairly stable, but i've definitely experienced some weird bugs from time to time, sluggish performance, gui issues, audio dropouts during recording and sample rate sync issues. These don't happen all the time, but it seems like i'm always battling one issue or another at some point.

I think this is partly because I use macs, and the developers (and user base) seem to have a bias towards windows (there's some threads out there showing that Reaper performs much better on windows than mac). Probably going to switch to Logic X once I finish up my current projects (there's no way i'm going back to Pro Tools). I love Cocko's and their ethos, but I need to get back to focusing on making music and spending less time customizing and figuring out weird issues. Hopefully version 5 will fix a lot of things I don't like and I'll be able to come back.
You haven't posted bug reports and only 11 threads total. How are things going to get fixed if they aren't reported?

Performance between Windows and OSX are similar, but CPU use is a little better on Windows. At least last time I tested. Different systems, different strengths. For me REAPER is way more stable on my iMac than it was on my custom built PC.

I use OSX exclusively, I think Justin does also. I'm willing to take a look at each of your issues, and try to help you out.
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Old 11-19-2014, 06:03 PM   #25
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Its so weird when I see all these complaints!
I use Mac OSX with Reaper since 2011 with practically no issues.
Just some GUI plugin weirdness once in a while. But its pretty rare. Or maybe I'm just lucky.
Oh well, guess its how people use it that differs.

cheers
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Old 11-19-2014, 06:11 PM   #26
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Hey man, sorry you had such a bad time with the program. Many of us use other programs as well. I have Live and occasionally, by necessity even use Protools. They all have their pros and cons.

Remember it's always ok to ask questions here, and you're certainly in good company when you get frustrated with Reaper. We do somehow manage to solve most problems in the forum though, at least I hope so in your case.

And we all agree that it's ok to go for the best solution for your workflow, and that may not be Reaper.
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Old 11-19-2014, 06:18 PM   #27
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When I was using Pro Tools and a Digi Rack 002 with protools 7 to 8.
I can say honestly that 99.9 percent of trouble was at the Avid end with the 002 rack being the culprit.
Looking back I did like version 8 it had a nice sound and I could have lived with that but the 002 had broken for 6 months and I needed another interface so got an orpheus and tried Reaper.
Reaper..... well any problem in the 3. version days was with the computer I was using it could not carry the load I expected of it.
Later I got my first faster Windows computer, same again when stupid amounts of plugins were used of course things were a little sluggish but no breakdowns with Reaper.
My latest machine having a SSD plus two 7500 drives and having 32 GB Ram.... beautiful and of course I realize today that what you put into your mix matters most so I need less plugins. If you need heaps of eq's compressors multi reverbs etc you will suffer with a small machine with any DAW software.
Reaper to work with has been as stable as anything and I came through emagic through protools ...
Most problems if we like to look at the problems with clarity is that we get computers not able to deal with what we expect of them...
Like buying a rear wheel hatchback to drive across the Sahara not using a
pre built road then blaming the make when we don't quite get there.

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Old 11-19-2014, 06:57 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jpchartrand View Post
Here's some of my feedback and suggestions for the Reaper guys if they want to make this grow into a usable DAW.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jpchartrand View Post
- MARQUEE tool -> The one in Reaper is terrible. You can't select an area of a track without affecting the whole time selection. Just because of this, I would say Reaper is unusable (in my case anyways)


Quote:
Originally Posted by jpchartrand View Post
-Routing -> not user friendly. Needs to be more like Logic's which is extremely easy to use.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jpchartrand View Post
-The Edit cursor -> What a pain in the butt. Why in the world can't we take it out? I have no use for it and it messes up my mouse mods/key commands. If it needs to stay, it needs to be



(Sorry, I just couldn´t resist it...)

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Old 11-19-2014, 07:09 PM   #29
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I'd have to agree with all of that....
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Old 11-19-2014, 07:17 PM   #30
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I'd have to agree with all of that....


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Old 11-19-2014, 07:21 PM   #31
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feeling bloody minded
Do we ask ourselves "how did we used to record and make records with so little!"

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Old 11-19-2014, 07:43 PM   #32
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I agree. The forum can be really harsh. People use the software in different ways, for different things and have different expectations.
I tried the software many times over years (versions 2 and 3) and was underwhelmed with how it looked and confused by how it worked. It was hard to take seriously. It took one user (Adam Wathan) sharing their config and actions and making some videos to get me to convert officially from Pro Tools in 2010. It was SO FRUSTRATING up until that point. After my life got much better without Pro Tools.

Really harsh? Have you ever perused by gear slutz? Harsh is one of the last words I would use to describe this community. Yeah there is a few here and there but by in large this forum is extremely friendly and helpful.
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Old 11-19-2014, 07:51 PM   #33
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Compared to the Sonar, Cubase, and Reason forums, this place is all hugs and kisses. You can't totally escape the jerks.
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Old 11-19-2014, 08:20 PM   #34
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I know everything in life that we think we invent needs improvement however it is better when we can be measured and send problems to the Dev's when they so kindly ask for the problem material.
Were else do you get such a one on one service except Reaper..?

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Old 11-19-2014, 08:52 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grinder View Post
Were else do you get such a one on one service except Reaper..?

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Old 11-19-2014, 09:19 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jpchartrand View Post
- MARQUEE tool -> The one in Reaper is terrible. You can't select an area of a track without affecting the whole time selection. Just because of this, I would say Reaper is unusable (in my case anyways)
I'd be curious to know what you mean by that. Perhaps I'm misunderstanding but here it is in action (splitting at time selection):
https://i.imgur.com/VDTAIgX.gif

Either way, I hope you find what you're looking for... I own several DAWs but each time I come back to Reaper I wonder why I left.
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Old 11-19-2014, 10:25 PM   #37
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You haven't posted bug reports and only 11 threads total. How are things going to get fixed if they aren't reported?
Because I make music full time and don't really have all that much time to document bugs. Most of the ones i've encountered are one off ones, or things that I figure out how to work around. For example, the last one I encountered was where a project kept crashing. Narrowed it down to media item that was being time and pitch stretched. I rendered the item and the project stopped crashing. Never encountered that specific bug again. This is pretty typical of all the issues i've had.

This isn't THAT big of a deal though. Most other DAW's i've used have bugs as well. The bugs aren't the specific reason why i'm thinking about switching.
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Old 11-19-2014, 10:30 PM   #38
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"How people treat you is their karma... how you react is yours. -Wayne Dyer
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"TV has become nothing more than a Petri dish where this country grows its idiots." -Dr. John Becker
My First CD On Spotify - Side O' The Highway
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Old 11-19-2014, 11:10 PM   #39
poplomop
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omg I hate Wayne Dyer. I guess he's good for obvious platitudes, but obvious platitudes are obvious!
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Old 11-19-2014, 11:27 PM   #40
grinder
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RVMAN
Do you rate Saw Studio?
I know this is a side track I was looking into this years ago I see they have revamped their web site.
Yes it is good to hear that the Saw Forum is quality although in saying that it possibly would have less of a client base and most would be into positive forward facing energy or is that a bit too much!
I note the sound may be more like Radar.

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