Old 10-25-2014, 10:59 AM   #1
LBP
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Hertfordshire, UK
Posts: 48
Default MIDI loop points incorrect

Being new to Reaper and music creation in general apart from using OctaMED a lot in the 90s, I'm finding some oddities with recording MIDI.

I have created three 32 position sequences with Megababy in a default 120BPM 4/4 timeline.

I got the patterns pretty much as I want them and decided to record as MIDI so I selected the 8 sections in the grid and recorded using the "time Selection Autopunch" record option.

But what I've found is that is I stretch the recorded MIDI the loop points are not correct and appear to be randomly placed.

If I glue them (although I don't quite understand what glueing does)then when dragged they loop as expected and loop perfectly.

Is this normal?
LBP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2014, 11:53 AM   #2
Fex
Human being with feelings
 
Fex's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Portsmouth, UK
Posts: 4,376
Default

Yes. Items will loop from the end when stretched, regardless of whether the end is in the right place (which would normally fall on a measure, or a beat, at least). The solution is to create an empty item which does end at the desired loop point, and then glue the target material to the empty item.
Fex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2014, 12:22 PM   #3
LBP
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Hertfordshire, UK
Posts: 48
Default

Thanks Fex.

The problem I'm seeing is that even though I set the record length, when the clip is dragged the loops points are not where I think they should be (see attached screenshot)

In the screenshot you will see the top track that I've glued and acts as expected but the other two tracks that haven't been glued have seemingly random loop points.

I just glued the first track, what does glueing to an empty item do differently than just glueing an item on its own?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Reaper Loops.jpg (38.4 KB, 244 views)
LBP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2014, 12:38 PM   #4
Fex
Human being with feelings
 
Fex's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Portsmouth, UK
Posts: 4,376
Default

I'm not sure what you mean by 'glueing an item on its own'; surely if an item is glued, it must be glued to something?

[Edit: Gluing a looped item in isolation will remove the loop points.]

The rogue parts in your screenshot clearly don't end at 3.1.00. What happens if you split them at 3.1.00, delete the part after 3.1.00, and then loop?

Another thing to look at is 'Copy loop of selected area of items' - Ctrl + Alt + L (also in the menu if you right click on the item).

Select the bit you want (1.1.00 to 3.1.00), copy it as a loop, paste it, delete the original, and work with the new loop.

Glueing to an empty item works if the target item ends before the desired point, which I'd assumed to be the case from your first post. My bad.
Since your targets end after the desired point, it's not relevant here.

Last edited by Fex; 10-25-2014 at 12:49 PM.
Fex is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2014, 01:10 PM   #5
LBP
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Hertfordshire, UK
Posts: 48
Default

Hi Fex,

I've just highlighted the second MIDI clip and selected Glue and it "glues" and makes the clip behave as I'd expect (loops at the end) but what I can't understand is why when I set the length to record, the clip seems to set the loop point where it feels like it and I have to fiddle with it to get it to loop correctly, although it isn't much hassle to Glue, because I don't quite grasp what I'm glueing, I hope I'm not going to hit problems later in the Project.

Thanks for the other tips
LBP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2014, 03:09 PM   #6
Banned
Human being with feelings
 
Banned's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Unwired (probably in the proximity of Amsterdam)
Posts: 4,868
Default

[OT] Reading "OctaMED" made me smile.
__________________
˙lɐd 'ʎɐʍ ƃuoɹʍ ǝɥʇ ǝɔıʌǝp ʇɐɥʇ ƃuıploɥ ǝɹ,noʎ
Banned is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2014, 01:12 AM   #7
ivansc
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Near Cambridge UK and Near Questembert, France
Posts: 22,754
Default

Bars n Pipes Pro.

(another smile, hopefully)
Actually, having made the break I have realised that most of the MIDI heavy lifting I was still using BPP for was connected with manipulating stuff in my old MIDI backing tracks, which I no longer use.

Mind you I still go to do MIDI stuff now and again that is not just point and click in Reaper.....
ivansc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2014, 04:57 AM   #8
LBP
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Hertfordshire, UK
Posts: 48
Default OctaMED

Quote:
Originally Posted by Banned View Post
[OT] Reading "OctaMED" made me smile.
I have fond memories of MED & OctaMED... I remember I wrote to Teijo and offered to pay some cash for MED and he replied that he really wanted a new assembler, so I think I went 50/50 with Ray Burt-Frost and sent him the assembler which no doubt OctaMED was written with.

I only started looking into composing (term used very loosely) as I found some VQF files of my Amiga MED/OctaMED stuff and have settled on Reaper as it really does seem to be excellent value for money... although I still have about 48 days left before I finish my trial!
LBP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2014, 01:51 PM   #9
LBP
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Hertfordshire, UK
Posts: 48
Default

OK back on topic...

I've done some testing and it looks to me that when MIDI is recorded using the "time selection auto punch" that even though the range is restricted the MIDI end is actually set where I stop recording and the only way I can find to correct this to is to glue the item.

Does anybody know if this is intentional or a bug?
LBP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2014, 02:14 PM   #10
Wolffman
Human being with feelings
 
Wolffman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Down Under
Posts: 2,148
Default

Not sure if i should answer this Question or not as i'm still using V3 of the software as well as being unsure if midi and audio work the same in "time selection auto punch" mode. And V4 might have some changes that i don't know about So this post might be a load of hosre $#!!

When in "time selection auto punch" mode The recorded ( Audio, wave file ) actually records from the time you hit record until you hit stop although it only shows on screen in the time selection you've selected.
So if you then try to drag the end to loop, it will actually uncover the unseen audio recorded until it reaches the point you stoped recording and the loop will start from there.
Hope this makes sense ?

So by setting the time selection where you want and "gluing", you are actually cutting the audio recorded before and after the time selection leaving only the audio you want, which will now loop as expected.

As i said, i've never used "time selection auto punch" for midi but it might work the same as audio and if so would be where your problem lies.


HTH's

Cheers
__________________
" Serve the song "

https://soundcloud.com/wolffman7
Wolffman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2014, 02:18 PM   #11
ELP
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 943
Default

Preferences/Project/Media Item Default

Maybe "loop source for recorded items" = generally on? (for me it´s a wrong Default behavior )

Better turn this to off and if you need you can turn loop source later on per item properties.

Last edited by ELP; 10-27-2014 at 02:25 PM.
ELP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2014, 03:00 PM   #12
LBP
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Hertfordshire, UK
Posts: 48
Default

Wolffman that is exactly the behaviour that I'm seeing, so it is to be expected and when a single item is "glued" it is really like a crop, I think maybe I'm just looking at Reaper from an unusual angle with my inexperience.

ELP for me that setting seemed to make no difference to the behaviour I was seeing.

Thanks for your help.
LBP is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 03:41 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.