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Old 07-10-2012, 01:56 PM   #81
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"without limits" would also seem to apply to the degree to which REAPER is open. Extensible, scriptable, themeable. That's what really does it for me.
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Old 07-10-2012, 03:26 PM   #82
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Originally Posted by koolkeys View Post
You mean a company who would take shots at other DAW companies to promote their own product? Why, that sounds familiar to me.....oh wait, everyone does it, including Reaper's devs and users.

Nothing new, and if you decide not to purchase a product because of it, you wouldn't have Reaper either. Heck, even today as a mature host, the Reaper product pages take many jabs at other companies, just not by name.
***THEY DO?*** I have obviously missed his. Care to point me at this, as I have genuinely overlooked any reference to other DAWs that are specific enough to make identification easy.***

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Of course, you could judge based on this ad, or you could go hang around some S1 users, and see that the devs are just as active there as they are here, and the updates are based around user requests, as they are here. Both great hosts, both great devs and great companies. Hardly seems like something worth getting so upset over to me.

Welcome to marketing.

Brent
I have yet to see ANY ads from Reapers devs, let alone targeted ones aimed at the users of other DAWs telling them their chosen application is a bloated piece of junk.


Actually, I had already bought S1 Artist and dismissed it as a not very exciting DAW. Its logic and workflow didn't suit me personally, but there ya go.
And it really is irrelevant that the S1 devs are all round jolly good chaps etc if I find their business methods objectionable. I get the impression that this unwholesome little bout of weasel advertising is indeed the product of some slimeball in their marketing department, but it still has to get that stamp of approval from someone with actual decision making power.
To be blunt, I could'nt care less what you personally think of this and you re welcome to take it as lightly as you choose. I am merely expressing MY opinion, which is one of disappointment in what I had looked upon as a company with a similar ethic to Cockos.
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Old 07-10-2012, 03:40 PM   #83
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Is this thing still going on? Ivan, my friend (I hope we're friends) relax a little man... Brent was actually right there, but it's not important at al... none of it.

Case in point. There is a direct jab at PT on the Reaper home page... and one that isn't even accurate...

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So we'll just say that unlike some other DAWs, REAPER will support almost any existing audio interface, even interfaces manufactured by companies whose software does not allow you to use any other hardware interface.
What other DAW's don't support almost any audio interace? Even PT does now.

What "other DAWs" couldn't ever always use PT's consumer hardware with Avid's ASIO drivers? None that I know of. I own an MBox, Cubase always could use it. Again... it's a direct jab at PT and some mysterious "other daws" who supposedly still can't do what they always could do afaik... use any existing audio interface with an ASIO or WDM driver... which is pretty much all of them.

Notice that DAWs is a reference to the plural, more than one. Which DAW's can't do that?

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not multiple software units under the central command of product marketing
Who is that talking about? Nobody else? Some fictitious company? What DAW has multiple software units under the command of product marketing (facts please, show me the company / corporate structure where it's under the command of product marketing)?

So what? It's just marketing. Who cares? Nobody. It's nothing to get riled up about. It's just marketing. Everybody does it.

Read between the lines. Get the humor and the intent. It's not anything serious at all. It's just marketing. We're bombarded by marketing daily from everywhere. So what?

Not to mention that JBM asked the logically relevant question about the FB ad on page one...

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Originally Posted by Jason Brian Merrill View Post
Well, if anything it would appear to be a troll by presonus advocates or employees... But no way to really verify that right?
Do we actually know where that FaceBook ad that unfairly slighted Reaper came from, who posted it, what company, or what individual with a FB ad account?

Maybe it was a Sweetwater sales guy or something, since they don't sell Reaper? Who knows? Maybe it was someone with a FB ad account who doesn't even sell S1 who just wanted to piss of some Reaper users for some stupid and juvenile reason... who knows?

Who cares? Or rather... is it REALLY worth getting angry about?

Last edited by Lawrence; 07-10-2012 at 04:12 PM.
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Old 07-10-2012, 05:20 PM   #84
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Maybe it was a Sweetwater sales guy or something, since they don't sell Reaper? Who knows? Maybe it was someone with a FB ad account who doesn't even sell S1 who just wanted to piss of some Reaper users for some stupid and juvenile reason... who knows?

Who cares? Or rather... is it REALLY worth getting angry about?
Now you're getting as silly as everyone else.


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Old 07-10-2012, 05:47 PM   #85
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Now you're getting as silly as everyone else.
Not really, at least imo.. I think JBM maybe called it right on page one, that someone was probably trolling for a reaction and got it. The motivation? Who knows? It's the net and people do all kinds of odd things.

At any rate, it will probably remain a mystery.

If it's really that important, who posted it, (?) email Facebook and ask them? If it was PreSonus then at least we'll know that the anger is being directed to the right place.

Or maybe just remember the old "stick and stones" playgound chant.

Last edited by Lawrence; 07-10-2012 at 05:58 PM.
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Old 07-11-2012, 01:47 AM   #86
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Who were you quoting, Lawrence? Not me.

And I go back to what I said, this is my own personal opinion - I am not stating facts, just expressing my er not as extreme as disgust, but let's leave it at disappointment in that sort of direct "dissing" of competitors products.
I know it is prevalent and presumably accepted in the advertising world nowadays, that doesnt mean I have to like it, nor will it stop me boycotting companies that do it so blatantly.
For me, the part I found the most distasteful was that they chose to cherry pick through facebook and direct their ad at people selected on the absis of using one of the products they were dissing.

And once again I notice you are busy supporting all things Studio One without say whether or not you have any connection to the company.

How about in the interests of openness you make a definite declaration as to whether or not you are affiliated in any way to Presonus/Studio One/Krystal?
I truly dont have a problem with it if you are, but lets at least get all our cards on the table, eh?

Just went and had a proper look at the reaper home page.



EDIT:

I just cant see "Case in point. There is a direct jab at PT on the Reaper home page... and one that isn't even accurate..." on the home page - what am I missing here?
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Old 07-11-2012, 02:31 AM   #87
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Hey you guys!

Just throwing in my two cents as a long time Reaper advocate.

I bought S1 V2. Its great. Theres a lot of features.

Ill NEVER stop using Reaper. I just had someone over tonight doing vocals and...I used Reaper for tracking.

That same audio might see Studio One come time for mixing - as well as mastering. The project window makes assembling a CD quite a fresh, fun, and highly tangible experience.

If you do Mastering for people...Im sorry to say, but the Project Mode/Window in Studio One makes the job easier. There also multiple batch rendering options for a quick Master to be put together and published straight to MusicSinkHoleCloud. Not that I deal with that place, but many do. Point is, the options and layout for Mastering in Studio One is a rather huge leap forward.

Continuing on, that same audio MAY end up in my Adobe Audition CS5 so I can batch process all the songs to a target RMS range. Thats a new feature in CS5 - batch volume matching. And honestly, it works for about 5 out of 6 songs. Of every 6, theres one song that needs a lil volume tweak, usually down, to match the rest. For an auto-feature, that aint such bad results.

**Lol, Im testing that feature out on clients projects to see if it does in fact work. Trust me, anything I send to print will be adjusted manually from song to song while adhering to the overall target. Sure if fun to guniea pig clients tho. Shh!**

Point is guys = Studio One V2 at the end of anything we all can say, is a positive step for audio and home/project studio production.

And so is Reaper. Im HIGHLY confident I could track down the things in Reaper that Ill need it for that the other DAW I have simply cant do. This is how the cookie crumbles. This is why you prepare yourself with multiple tools for audio. This is why you never be a fan-bitch toward any one DAW = cuz they all have their strengths.

Ever notice the types of guys who DONT use multiple DAW's and stick inside one lone platform = Yup...so do I. *shudders

Expand yourself. Get into other DAWs. That is, if you have music to create and projects to help people with. If not, a lower level of production is all you really need to worry about. Meaning, any one single DAW availble these days should suit your means. Some people have bigger fish to fry.

So for the halibut, I do recommend expanding your aresenal with Studio One V2 if in fact you do meet the two simple requirements I listed above. There are only positive things to be gained by doing so. And yes, this includes having Reaper along side it.

Besides all that, Reaper still kicks Studio One's butt simply on price alone. That really cant be argued. $60 compared to $400 is what we're talking about here. For my little business, good ol' Small Axe Studios, it was worth it for me to purchase Studio One for its Mastering environment advantages.
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Old 07-11-2012, 03:09 AM   #88
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[snip]
This is why you prepare yourself with multiple tools for audio. This is why you never be a fan-bitch toward any one DAW = cuz they all have their strengths.

Ever notice the types of guys who DONT use multiple DAW's and stick inside one lone platform = Yup...so do I. *shudders
[snip]
What is wrong with using just a single DAW? I do just that and yet you won't ever find me bitching about others. I don't subscribe to there being a correlation between how many DAWs one uses and how one behaves towards other people's choice of tools.
You can stop shuddering now .
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Old 07-11-2012, 03:44 AM   #89
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Yeah..I don't use half the shit I could be using in the one DAW I have.

I make fake rock n roll in my fake DAW.

SWEET!
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Old 07-11-2012, 04:31 AM   #90
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I say we invade their forum and make them look like morons....

Let the war begin lol





You made us all look bad by starting that thread...


Guess you didn't realize that the presonus forum members have nothing to do with presonus' advertising did ya?
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Old 07-11-2012, 04:36 AM   #91
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How about in the interests of openness you make a definite declaration as to whether or not you are affiliated in any way to Presonus/Studio One/Krystal? I truly dont have a problem with it if you are, but lets at least get all our cards on the table, eh?
Affiliation? No. I'm a user and it's what I use most.

Did that company kidnap one of your kids or something? You seemed really angry about the ad and it's not the first time you've been really angry about something related to that company. They must have done something really bad to you.

Maybe I'm nuts (possible) but this thread isn't even about Studio One the daw so I'm not sure why it took that turn. It's about a severe overreaction to advertising. It's much the same as people getting their panties twisted because Avid calls PT the "Industry Standard"... and gosh... that just makes some people really, really angry because (God forbid) we just can't have people using hype in advertising, that's just, abnormal and wrong...

... think of the poor children.
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Old 07-11-2012, 04:52 AM   #92
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In that case, Lawrence, I am somewhat mystified as to why you have taken it upon yourself to post all over the user forum of another DAW about how great YOUR preferred weapon is.

FWIW I never get angry about anything on the internet, unless it affects my pocket.

Studio One/Presonus did.
Which is why I find it more offensive than most to have received a facebook ad from them specifically aimed at me and implying pretty directly that any DAW other than theirs is a bloated piece of shite, including naming two of the ones I both own and use.

Oh and I currently own Sonar, Studio One Artist, Cubase LE and Ableton Live, plus other daws on other computer platforms and in fact don't use Reaper much at all for MIDI editing.
So please don't confuse me with a fanboi.
I leave that up to chaps like you.
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Old 07-11-2012, 05:24 AM   #93
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In that case, Lawrence, I am somewhat mystified as to why you have taken it upon yourself to post all over the user forum of another DAW about how great YOUR preferred weapon is.
I'll refrain from replying to that in any specific detail. I'll just say that I guess we're both really "mystified" about some things related to the other.

Anyway... it's apparently a very touchy subject for you for some reason. I mean, Airon (for example) has started about 35 threads about things that PT does very well that Reaper should look at but he doesn't get that reaction,... and he shouldn't get that reaction imo... because seeing those things (maybe) helps the devs to know what else is out there... because they otherwise wouldn't know, because they don't use those software packages. Like Bars and Pipes Pro.

Having said that.. I will refrain from doing that outside of a specific FR. Better? When people discuss features or talk about things I just won't mention anything related to Studio One, or Cubase, or FlStudio, or PT, on the Reaper general forums. If I feel the need to illustrate something that I think might be useful to look at, I'll do it in the FR forum or maybe just not do it at all.

Will that do it for you? I aim to please.

My thinking - which is maybe off base and annoying for you - is that having a various collection of users who are intimately familar with various different products brings a lot of varying useful info into the discussions. I can't speak intelligently about various things in Samp... because I don't own it. I can't speak intelligently about and forward things from Sonar to maybe look at, because I don't own it or use it.

That was my general thinking. I'll rethink that. It's maybe the wrong path. ED and Airon seemed to imply a few times that not looking hard enough elsewhere is the root cause of some things. But it's actually not my place to make that suggestion so... fair enough... I'll stop bringing the other side of any other fence over here.

I hope that settles it.

Last edited by Lawrence; 07-11-2012 at 05:50 AM.
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Old 07-11-2012, 05:33 AM   #94
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What is wrong with using just a single DAW? I do just that and yet you won't ever find me bitching about others. I don't subscribe to there being a correlation between how many DAWs one uses and how one behaves towards other people's choice of tools.
You can stop shuddering now .
Honestly, my response is it depends how far you want to go down the rabbit hole. I was too harsh there. I really try and encourage people, home producers like all of us, to get out and check out whats out there. I kinda went overboard.

Oh, I was mostly referring to Reason when I said "only one DAW". Reason is awesome. However, almost invariably, a production will come out better when dumping all the stems from Reason into a mighty fine DAW like Reaper.

See what I mean? I really was thinking Reason because I use it a lot and many of the users often times, strictly stay in that one program. And, its not always for the best.

Each DAW does indeed have different tools and uses. So, I was a bit, well quite, extreme in my assessment there and apologize.

For the record, I firmly believe Reaper is all one really needs. I dont doubt its prowess for a second.

On Topic: Fake Ad.
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Old 07-11-2012, 09:48 AM   #95
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I'll refrain from replying to that in any specific detail. I'll just say that I guess we're both really "mystified" about some things related to the other.

Anyway... it's apparently a very touchy subject for you for some reason. I mean, Airon (for example) has started about 35 threads about things that PT does very well that Reaper should look at but he doesn't get that reaction,... and he shouldn't get that reaction imo... because seeing those things (maybe) helps the devs to know what else is out there... because they otherwise wouldn't know, because they don't use those software packages. Like Bars and Pipes Pro.

Having said that.. I will refrain from doing that outside of a specific FR. Better? When people discuss features or talk about things I just won't mention anything related to Studio One, or Cubase, or FlStudio, or PT, on the Reaper general forums. If I feel the need to illustrate something that I think might be useful to look at, I'll do it in the FR forum or maybe just not do it at all.

Will that do it for you? I aim to please.

My thinking - which is maybe off base and annoying for you - is that having a various collection of users who are intimately familar with various different products brings a lot of varying useful info into the discussions. I can't speak intelligently about various things in Samp... because I don't own it. I can't speak intelligently about and forward things from Sonar to maybe look at, because I don't own it or use it.

That was my general thinking. I'll rethink that. It's maybe the wrong path. ED and Airon seemed to imply a few times that not looking hard enough elsewhere is the root cause of some things. But it's actually not my place to make that suggestion so... fair enough... I'll stop bringing the other side of any other fence over here.

I hope that settles it.

Don't let this stop you from telling your experiences. I'm a proponent for learning the strengths of the software DAWS available to us. I know there are people that started with Reaper, but I would imagine most users tried Reaper out, liked it and made the switch. Several made sure they told everyone on several forums about their switch. No problem, fun stuff really.

My go-to DAW is X1 expanded, love the prochannel and know my way around pretty well since leaving Logic, or was that the other way around. I've used Reaper for big and small projects. It performs very well.I would like to get PT at some point as well. I've experimented with S1 and like it, not enough to pull out the wallet just yet. But I'm keeping an eye on it.

As a songwriter/musician/loves to play studio engineer guy, I have to say wow, we have some amazing tools at crazy prices compared to about 20 years ago. We should all be smiling!
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Old 07-11-2012, 07:27 PM   #96
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You made us all look bad by starting that thread...


Guess you didn't realize that the presonus forum members have nothing to do with presonus' advertising did ya?
lol
Now that its outta your system u feelin better now?
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Old 07-12-2012, 10:47 AM   #97
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lol
Now that its outta your system u feelin better now?
Are you?
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Old 07-12-2012, 12:53 PM   #98
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Are you?
Life is beautiful!!!!
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Old 07-13-2012, 06:17 PM   #99
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As JBM says, that line is a reference to the fact that many DAWs do place arbitrary limits on track counts, FX per track, sends, render sample rate, and so on. There are fewer such limits now than there were a few years ago, which is of course a good thing. But it's still the case that many DAWs arbitrarily limit features to create pricing tiers -- the more you spend, the more features you unlock.

Anyway, none of it really matters. Ideally people choose their tools based on their personal needs and preferences, and a diverse market ensures that nobody's getting ripped off just because they don't have any alternatives.
besides the fact that S1 is a very basic DAW that lacks a huge amount of features (Although has some cool ones other devs need to look at)
Maybe that should read "without limits*"
*if you buy the pro licence otherwise limited to how much money you can make

Nobody is clean in the advertising crap speak game including Cockos
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Old 07-13-2012, 07:00 PM   #100
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Hey cool, another stuido one thread!



To each their own, like reaper or like S1 or like both. But let's face it, that clip in first OP's post is lame at best.
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Old 07-13-2012, 11:24 PM   #101
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Hey cool, another stuido one thread!



To each their own, like reaper or like S1 or like both. But let's face it, that clip in first OP's post is lame at best.
you should just go with whatever Andrew W.K. uses ...
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Old 07-14-2012, 12:03 AM   #102
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to be fair that was a size twelve glove slap to the face of reaper users. Attempting false equivalency is just plain lame. The guy had every right to go over and stir the shit....its tilting at windmills, but to suggest defense is "equally wrong" kind of tells us why the world is in the state its in
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Old 07-14-2012, 06:13 AM   #103
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to be fair that was a size twelve glove slap to the face of reaper users. Attempting false equivalency is just plain lame. The guy had every right to go over and stir the shit....its tilting at windmills, but to suggest defense is "equally wrong" kind of tells us why the world is in the state its in
Thank you.
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Old 07-14-2012, 11:36 AM   #104
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Andrew W.K.
You need to go stand in the corner for 10 minutes and think really hard about every using that language again mister!
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Old 07-19-2012, 11:24 PM   #105
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There's "REAPER considering OFFER from STEINBERG" mentions out there?

yeah, real simple. for me, the whoa's! that REAPER gives ya can't be found anywhere else ... and a 'play' with Studio One, for me mind you, is just that. Studio One's gonna be perfect for lotsa folks and that's great!


So with REAPER, and awesomeness ... gotta go deep? ... Sure, though that's how many many many of us are, and have been built here.

I get intuitively irked now and then reading some of the moaning around these parts...
(partly from having been mangled for a few years by emagic selling to apple when logic ruled)
that REAPER would be sold to say, Steinberg, as the perfect storm occurred, and the Dev's went, "ya know" and sold the whole deal.

it COULD happen.
I'd like to see where REAPER's going via CockOS.

i'm with the team who works for it and is thankful for REAPER and it's truly joyous gems, for those of us that need and find them.

Man, for the stuff I'm able to do with REAPER, BECAUSE I NEED TO ...

endless gratitude.
best wishes to all.
no-one need be like me.

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Old 07-19-2012, 11:45 PM   #106
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lolz, I forgot yet another s1 thread in GD.

unsubscribe.....
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Old 07-20-2012, 09:39 AM   #107
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I say we invade their forum and make them look like morons.... Not like they need the help but it could be a bit of fun lol

EDIT: http://forums.presonus.com/posts/lis...80.page#176307

Let the war begin lol
you do this - wouldn't be the first time that an over-zealous Reaper fanboi trolls other companies' forums instead of consulting his analyst regarding all his varied issues...
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Old 07-20-2012, 10:23 AM   #108
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The official advertisement from Presonus implies that Reaper is one of the bloated DAWs.




jnif
Has anybody seen the FAIL in their Ad?
They wrote Performer, MOTU and Digital Acid. ) ) )
LOL.

It's MOTU Digital Performer and Acid.

They put Reaper towards the bottom of the list. Little do they know what lies within Reaper (the possibility of becoming the perfect DAW!)

PS: Please make a Boxed version that we can sell in the store I work in! (Romania).
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Old 07-20-2012, 12:21 PM   #109
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you do this - wouldn't be the first time that an over-zealous Reaper fanboi trolls other companies' forums instead of consulting his analyst regarding all his varied issues...
Shhh... mir sind do für d'Reaper fanbois!!!

Gruess vom Schwarzbuebeland.
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Old 07-20-2012, 02:21 PM   #110
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I'm thinking about adding Studio One to my collection. The ad may be a little messed up, but I'm not overly sensitive.
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Old 07-20-2012, 03:06 PM   #111
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Saying Reaper is not a real DAW is just so lame by Presonus it makes you wonder if they are just kids. Certainly doesn't sound like something a developer of a real DAW would say..
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Old 07-20-2012, 07:40 PM   #112
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Maybe it was Sound On Sound that really started this feud.
https://twitter.com/doctormcfarland/...68709009231872
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Old 07-20-2012, 07:50 PM   #113
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Presonus has something REAPER does not have.

marketing.

which would you rather pay for, marketing? or development
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Old 07-20-2012, 08:22 PM   #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EpicSounds View Post
this feud.
There is no feud (did I miss something?). People get carried away a bit all the time, on all sides. Whether or not that makes you look good is in the eye of the beholder, but it helps a lot when everyone keeps their pants on.
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Old 07-20-2012, 08:38 PM   #115
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Quote:
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Maybe it was Sound On Sound that really started this feud.
https://twitter.com/doctormcfarland/...68709009231872
by citing there is a competitor? That's more of a compliment to reaper if anything.
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Old 07-20-2012, 08:41 PM   #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ollie View Post
Whether or not that makes you look good is in the eye of the beholder, but it helps a lot when everyone keeps their pants on.
...or has a pants off dance off.
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Old 07-20-2012, 08:44 PM   #117
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That's more of a compliment to reaper if anything.
It is. If Reaper wasn't listed along with the rest in marketing or reviews, some would take it as disrespect.

It's like the "Honey, is my ass fat?" question. Doomed at "hello" to piss somebody off.
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Old 07-21-2012, 11:31 AM   #118
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I like Reaper, but I don't understand the almost religious type of dedication it or any software would have. My favorite is Sonar, but Reaper is very cool. I've played around with the Studio One demo and it is a fine piece of software. Like I mentioned above, I'm planning to pick that one up in the future. That would allow me to have 3 fine daws to pull upon their strengths for certain projects. Let's make some music!
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Old 07-21-2012, 12:20 PM   #119
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Presonus has something REAPER does not have.
Elastic audio? Melodyne ARA? Significant updates every month?
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Old 07-21-2012, 03:45 PM   #120
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Quote:
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Significant updates every month?
It will be a long time before they ever catch up to Reaper on updates... significant or otherwise!

If you doubt me, check out the old change logs.


http://www.cockos.com/reaper/download-old.php.

Links at top of page for pre-ver 4 changelogs at the top of the page.

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