I use outdoor IR samples, why does stuff still sound weird?

[Megagoth1702]

Hello guys,

I design and create weapon sounds for games as a hobby and I wonder how I can make the "tail" of a shot more realistic and diverse.

I got myself the BoomLibrary Outdoor impulse responses and tried applying them to gun sounds with ReaVerb-Add File.

The sound is kind of weird though, to me it does not sound like something is really being outside, it sounds more like a huge hall. Maybe it is supposed to sound like that without any "other" natural ambient noise that is found in game? I don't know.

At the moment I am stuck with creating the beginnings of gun sounds and then mixing in pre-recorded tails and it sounds nice but I wonder if I can use a more dynamic approach.

Look at this file I prepared (click on the DOWN arrow at the top of the window to download). The "source" are my FINAL sounds BEFORE any IR reverb, I used pre-recorded weapon tails. The "outdoorSounds" are tails taken from the game Battlefield 3 and are what I am going for. The IR response file in there is for you to muck around with.

I am sure my process is faulty so I ask you guys for tips on this. Do I need EQ? Compression? Delay? What should I send through the reverb? Only the impulse at the beginning or maybe the short part after it too? How would YOU create a tail for a gun shot?

Thanks in advance guys!

[karbomusic]

it sounds more like a huge hall

That sounds about right because...

- Truly outside with no reflections would sound 100% dead.

- Otherwise, there are reflections so it will sound like short or long reflections, aka delay or reverb or both.

I did some outdoor IRs a couple years ago while in the mountains, however I did it due to the extreme natural reverb sound of the mountain valley I was in.

[hopi]

just a thought... after listening to the boom lib sound cloud examples on their site:

'outdoors' is a big place... and with lotta variety, eh?

I am thinking about a particular sound in a place in the mountains that I have visited often.... and there the echo is the thing... it's way diff than just a normal reverb space... so if that is the sort of sound you want [though I doubt that] one would have to create that which would involve some long delays between the echos...

I think Karbo was saying the same thing

[Tod]

Originally Posted by Megagoth1702

Look at this file I prepared (click on the DOWN arrow at the top of the window to download). The "source" is what I sent to the IR reverb that ended up sounding weird. The "outdoorSounds" are tails taken from the game Battlefield 3 and are what I am going for. The IR response file in there is for you to muck around with.

When you're talking about outside sounds, that's a big world out there.

It's going to sound very different on flat ground with no trees around you then if your on flat ground in a forest. Then if you've got hills around you, you're going to hear echoes. Then in the middle of a city it's also going to sound different.

I live in very forested mountains and the one ogg file you sent "_full3" sounds pretty good and really quite realistic.

I didn't try anything else that you sent, it might have helped if you'd have sent a project file with the settings you were using.

At any rate, I think it really depends on the environment your recreating the gun sounds for.

[Megagoth1702]

Originally Posted by karbomusic

That sounds about right because...

- Truly outside with no reflections would sound 100% dead.

- Otherwise, there are reflections so it will sound like short or long reflections, aka delay or reverb or both.

I did some outdoor IRs a couple years ago while in the mountains, however I did it due to the extreme natural reverb sound of the mountain valley I was in.

Any chance I could get my hands on your IR recordings? Or are they private $$ ?

Originally Posted by Tod

When you're talking about outside sounds, that's a big world out there.

It's going to sound very different on flat ground with no trees around you then if your on flat ground in a forest. Then if you've got hills around you, you're going to hear echoes. Then in the middle of a city it's also going to sound different.

I live in very forested mountains and the one ogg file you sent "_full3" sounds pretty good and really quite realistic.

I didn't try anything else that you sent, it might have helped if you'd have sent a project file with the settings you were using.

At any rate, I think it really depends on the environment your recreating the gun sounds for.

There is a misunderstanding. _full3 was not created using IR reverb at all. It was mixed with a pre-recorded tail.

I will fix up a project right now.

[Megagoth1702]

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7r...ew?usp=sharing

See how this sounds really weird?

[karbomusic]

Originally Posted by Megagoth1702

Any chance I could get my hands on your IR recordings? Or are they private $$ ?

There is only one I kept but it isn't ideal because there was a light wind noise (damn nature!) and I had to cut the decay short. I'll see if I can dig it up but I didn't think it was useable once I got back home and processed it. Here is the only test clip I made with it just testing it out...

http://wallsonic.com/public/music/BrysonValley.mp3

Notice I don't pause very long when playing, that's due to the fact I had to cut the decay short.

[Tod]

Originally Posted by Megagoth1702

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B7r...ew?usp=sharing

See how this sounds really weird?

Yes, that's not a good IR for this at all as far as I can tell. It's way to smooth. Probably a little long too.

[Megagoth1702]

But the IR recordings are legit. I don't know any better ones.

I am sure my fault lies in my processing.

The ideal case would have me sending a short impulse, like in the project, through the ReaVerb plugin with an IR file that would generate a nice Tail for me. :-/
I just have no idea how to do it. I also am afraid the REAPER forums are not the right place to talk about weapon sounds, haha.

[Tod]

Originally Posted by Megagoth1702

But the IR recordings are legit. I don't know any better ones.

I am sure my fault lies in my processing.

The ideal case would have me sending a short impulse, like in the project, through the ReaVerb plugin with an IR file that would generate a nice Tail for me. :-/

You might try shortening it and then add some delayed sound to it. Also a slight doppler affect.

I think if you notice on the "_full3" file, it has an slight crackling sound with a slight doppler affect, much like what's created by a lightning streak going through the air.

I just have no idea how to do it. I also am afraid the REAPER forums are not the right place to talk about weapon sounds, haha.

No problem here, it's all sound engineering to me.

[Tod]

Incidentally, I think that crackling sound I was talking about might be little sonic booms bouncing off trees, hills, or rocks.

[Megagoth1702]

Thanks for your tips.

Could you please fix up an example project with the changes you mention? I am not really sure where to shorten, apply the doppler and delay.

@Crackling - yes, most probably the reflections from the sonic crack from the bullet.

[Tod]

Originally Posted by Megagoth1702

Thanks for your tips.

Could you please fix up an example project with the changes you mention? I am not really sure where to shorten, apply the doppler and delay.

@Crackling - yes, most probably the reflections from the sonic crack from the bullet.

Okay I don't really have the time to refine this, but I did put something together you might be able to work off from. It should give you some ideas about what you can do.

First of all you'll notice I shortened the IR file, put a fade on it and also automated some EQ, it's on track 3. It's the IR audio file that you want to mostly work on and this should give you some ideas about what you can do. You should be able to right click on this link and do a "Save link as..".

https://stash.reaper.fm/22559/01%20Re...0to%20send.zip

If I find some time to work on it some more I will but it will be a while.

[Fergler]

Reverb should really be done by the game engine and not put on the sounds themselves.
No idea what game engine you are working with, UE3+4 most definitely have this capability and even open source game engines have things like FMOD to work with.

It's also strange for me for the gun shot to be in stereo, that should be handled by localization ingame.

Reverb on the sound itself will sound silly indoors, in tree areas, etc.

But if you want to add just a touch to the sound, I think those IRs are just fine. But you put WAY too much on.

I put this:

http://puu.sh/duMpH/c9a25301bd.png

The first file is the same as was there to begin with, and I added the second one to emphasize the shorter tail.

http://picosong.com/4pft/

edit: I like tod's a lot too!

[hopi]

https://stash.reaper.fm/v/22560/Gunsh...rsion%2001.wav

hard for me to know what kind of outdoors is to you...
there is so much out there...

but here is a version to try... it's your file with my fx on it...

not a good idea for me to send as a project as you may not have the same fx, etc., ...so here is the wav that you can drop into your project and solo the track.

[Megagoth1702]

I found something out!

There are "IR reverb TRIGGER files" that are there to create a nice tail.

Check this project out I built:

http://www.mediafire.com/download/dm...1t/reverb2.zip

The problem is - these IR trigger files are from a sound library. They also seem to be different for each gun. I wonder - how to create these sounds myself? All I would need then would be a final sample and from there I can process it into the IR trigger "blip".

(I got the IR trigger file tip from this YouTube video)
Help me out here guys.