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10-28-2014, 11:27 AM
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#1
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 348
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Red Nose - orchestral (using SSO)
The piano part was written by Gustavo Lopez. This is our second collaboration. I used the Sonatina Symphonic Orchestra (except for the timpani sound) and for the first time the MT Power Drumkit which I recently discovered thanks to a post by another Reaper user. I thought I had a good drum sound with SuperDrumFx which I had used for years, but MT Power Drumkit sounds even better to me (No drum grooves from MT Power Drumkit were used. The drum track is what I'd play if I were playing live).
Red Nose
Let me know what you think.
Edit: Replaced MT power Drumkit with DrumCore 3 Free.
Last edited by pbattersby; 02-08-2015 at 07:05 AM.
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10-28-2014, 12:06 PM
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#2
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Asheville NC
Posts: 1,335
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Wow, that's all Sonatina? Very nice and understated. Sounds great.
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10-29-2014, 07:01 AM
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#3
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Posts: 5,465
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You did well, very understated, yes. But the piano piece was more about playing triads in a certain groove/fashion, the line of chords forming a kind of "theme" or melody... that's not much to build on, imho.
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10-29-2014, 11:45 AM
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#4
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 348
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swamp Ape
Wow, that's all Sonatina?
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Yes. All the orchestra stuff except for the timpani, is Sonatina Symphonic Orchestra.
Mattias Westlund did an amazing job when he put this orchestra sound font together.
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10-29-2014, 11:58 AM
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#5
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 348
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jorgen
But the piano piece was more about playing triads in a certain groove/fashion, the line of chords forming a kind of "theme" or melody... that's not much to build on, imho.
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Jorgen, thanks for commenting but I'm not sure I understand. When you say "that's not much to build on" do you mean:
- the piano part was too simple or too repetitive
- or the piano part doesn't lend itself to easily write accompaniment
- or I missed the essence of the piano part with my orchestration
- or my orchestration is naturally understated because of the piano part
- or do you mean something else entirely?
I appreciate the comment, I just want to make sure I fully understand the point you were making.
Thanks,
Paul
Last edited by pbattersby; 11-08-2014 at 05:34 AM.
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11-06-2014, 05:49 AM
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#6
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Posts: 5,465
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Hello Paul, I didn't hear much of a theme or a melody, mostly fluent piano-playing, very driven, but it's not a song... more a display of rhythms and cadences. The focus is on the playing/piano performance, it's technically powerful, but musically weak, imo. You composed this together? Or did your partner deliver a finished track? To me, it sounds like you put your contribution on top of his "riffing" composition, which doesn't leave much room for an orchestra to begin with... again, in my opinion.
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11-08-2014, 05:40 AM
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#7
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 348
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jorgen
I didn't hear much of a theme or a melody
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I'm surprised. I can hear a very clear melody.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jorgen
but it's not a song...
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I was curious what you meant by "it's not a song", then I looked up the dictionary definition of "song" and you're right. Unless there is singing or the suggestion of singing it's not a song as far as the dictionary is concerned. Interesting.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jorgen
You composed this together? Or did your partner deliver a finished track?
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He composed and performed the piano part then I came along later to add my stuff. I realize that's not ideal because that does not give the piano player an opportunity to respond to what the orchestra is doing and in some cases that can be limiting.
Last edited by pbattersby; 02-08-2015 at 07:05 AM.
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11-13-2014, 03:05 AM
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#8
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Glasgow
Posts: 521
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I enjoyed listening to that piece, thank you.
I understand where Jorgen is coming from up to a point, but believe that there is strong melodic material in the piece. There is just too much of it in a short period of time, and while you are taking in one hook, another has come along to displace it. Every call has a response, and it becomes a bit overwhelming. It sounds slighty "studied" rather than emotive. Maybe this is the intention - but if not, I have some suggestions;
1) There are too many instruments playing too many counter parts too quickly. Lighten up on the initial orchestration, bring it in more gradually. Maybe save more of it for when the drums come in, and it will pack a bigger punch at that point.
2) Pace the material better. Instead of having a response to every piano call, have some accompaniment or "space", or move it into little sections of its own to allow the music to breathe.
3) The orchestra sound behind the beat, which bounces me out of the piece. Especially the strings, which have a big "swell" attack on them. This makes them seem out of place with the piano, which has a more direct sound, and is especially noticeable when playing counter melodies or patterns along with the piano.
Hope this helps - Jennifer
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11-14-2014, 03:08 PM
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#9
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 348
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Quote:
Originally Posted by endorka
I enjoyed listening to that piece, thank you.
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Thank you for listening and commenting.
Quote:
Originally Posted by endorka
I [...] believe that there is strong melodic material in the piece. There is just too much of it in a short period of time, and while you are taking in one hook, another has come along to displace it. Every call has a response, and it becomes a bit overwhelming. It sounds slighty "studied" rather than emotive.
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If you're referring to the piano part, good to know but I can't comment. The piano part, it's composition and performance came first and has nothing to do with me. I added my stuff much later.
Quote:
Originally Posted by endorka
1) There are too many instruments playing too many counter parts too quickly.
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I've recently come to realize the orchestration is a little dense and I should use more orchestra sections in isolation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by endorka
2) Pace the material better. Instead of having a response to every piano call, have some accompaniment or "space", or move it into little sections of its own to allow the music to breathe.
3) The orchestra sound behind the beat, which bounces me out of the piece. Especially the strings, which have a big "swell" attack on them. This makes them seem out of place with the piano, which has a more direct sound, and is especially noticeable when playing counter melodies or patterns along with the piano.
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All I do is record what I hear in my head and hope it works for most listeners but there will always be room for improvement.
Quote:
Originally Posted by endorka
Hope this helps - Jennifer
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You've given me some stuff to think about whether it ultimately gets applied to this piece or another in the future so yes, it helps. Thanks.
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11-14-2014, 06:48 PM
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#10
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,259
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hi Paul.
very nice composition/playing. beautiful dynamics. you did a superb job of weaving instruments around the piano.
enjoyed this!
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11-15-2014, 09:12 AM
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#11
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Posts: 5,465
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pbattersby
The piano part, it's composition and performance came first and has nothing to do with me. I added my stuff much later.
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Yes, it seemed reasonable. You did good, sounds great in the cans, sounds, production, arranging too... I stand by it's not a song, though, too much riffing, as the "theme", repeated in the outro... it's just "there", not going anywhere...
The piece could work well in a proper context, like film/drama/documentary/soundtrack... not dissing it.
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11-16-2014, 09:11 AM
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#12
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 348
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mschuster
very nice composition/playing. beautiful dynamics. you did a superb job of weaving instruments around the piano.
enjoyed this!
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Thanks!
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11-16-2014, 09:17 AM
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#13
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 348
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jorgen
Yes, it seemed reasonable. You did good, sounds great in the cans, sounds, production, arranging too...
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Thanks. I appreciate that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jorgen
I stand by it's not a song, though
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That's fine. The dictionary definition I looked up agrees with you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jorgen
The piece could work well in a proper context, like film/drama/documentary/soundtrack... not dissing it.
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I'd be happy to have this piece used in that context. Thanks.
I should also clarify this statement: "The piano part, it's composition and performance came first and has nothing to do with me. I added my stuff much later."
I just meant that in response to endorka wondering if this was intended to be "studied" vs "emotional", I have no idea since I didn't compose the original piano part, but I very much like the original piano part.
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