Old 03-25-2017, 05:23 AM   #1
pbattersby
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Default Automation lane - mod wheel conflict

I prefer to add my automation as a track automation lane rather than in the MIDI editor because I find it easier to draw and adjust the curves that I want.

I have the mod wheel set up to control volume. I set the mod wheel to some middle value, record my notes, then go back and draw the volume curve that I want.

The problem is, that when I want to practice the next part, Reaper is caught between 2 sources of volume settings. After I've stopped playback / record, if want to practice my next part, and I move the mod wheel, Reaper tries to set the volume to the value of the mod wheel and the volume level from the curve at the location of the play cursor. As Reaper struggles to set both levels, as I move the mod wheel, it sounds like a Geiger counter and ultimately the value of the automation curve wins.

The only way I've seen to correct this is to bypass the automation lane as I'm practicing and moving the mod wheel.

Is there some mode where, once the play back is halted, a movement of the mod wheel can take over as the sole source of volume level?

I've looked through the preferences, I've tried all the settings for track automation mode, "Trim/Read", "Latch", "Touch" etc but nothing helped except bypassing the automation lane.

I should also add that my automation lane is configured to control CC1 from the Sforzando sample player, and CC1 is set to control the gain of my samples in my .sfz file in case that's a factor.

Any ideas?
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Old 03-27-2017, 06:20 AM   #2
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Anyone have any ideas?
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Old 03-27-2017, 07:47 AM   #3
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I think Latch Preview mode should work for this, have you also tried it ? (maybe I'm misunderstanding the problem).
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Old 03-27-2017, 08:10 AM   #4
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I think Latch Preview mode should work for this, have you also tried it ?
Yea, I've tried all those modes. It seems like, even with playback stopped, Reaper is constantly reading and applying the volume from the automation lane creating a conflict between the automated volume and any volume adjustments I make with the mod wheel.
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Old 03-27-2017, 10:27 AM   #5
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I don't know any way but bypassing the lane.
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Old 03-27-2017, 11:05 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by teniente powell View Post
I don't know any way but bypassing the lane.
So it isn't just me then. I wonder if this is a bug. It doesn't seem like a desirable feature.
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Old 03-27-2017, 12:20 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by pbattersby View Post
So it isn't just me then. I wonder if this is a bug. It doesn't seem like a desirable feature.
It doesn't seem to matter if playback is stopped or not-unless the envelope is bypassed or muted some way the value at cursor is kept and read.
There is a bug in write mode though tbh. v.5.40 - if playhead is stopped,and write is enabled,2 points are being placed at exact same positions,same or different values if a write value from a controller is made before cursor's position.

Just hotkey disable for now,or even better-know where you want changes to occur,forget your controller (unless live) and draw//save your envelopes for laterzzz.This may help you focus on playing,not twiddling.
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Old 03-28-2017, 11:32 AM   #8
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It doesn't seem to matter if playback is stopped or not-unless the envelope is bypassed or muted some way the value at cursor is kept and read.
Yes. I would expect that during playback, but I wouldn't have thought it would work that way when playback is stopped.

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or even better-know where you want changes to occur,forget your controller (unless live) and draw//save your envelopes for laterzzz.
That's how I typically handle Trim Volume which curiously doesn't have this problem.
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Old 03-28-2017, 11:53 AM   #9
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Yes. I would expect that during playback, but I wouldn't have thought it would work that way when playback is stopped.
It's just the same as an eq or w/e-it reads `info` at given time position.

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That's how I typically handle Trim Volume which curiously doesn't have this problem.
Aye,because trim volume is a different beast.You cannot `arm` it for eg.

I don't mean to throw you from using your controllers and twiddling- I've made many tracks of just pure *that.
It's just if your trying to get ideas down-do that 1st-commit to recordings-then twiddle later.=)
^Unless your track is pure twiddles,fiddles and auto's.

Did you happen to stumble upon the mentioned 'bug'?
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Old 03-28-2017, 01:25 PM   #10
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I don't mean to throw you from using your controllers [...] It's just if your trying to get ideas down-do that 1st-commit to recordings-then twiddle later.=)
Actually you reminded me that I could treat the use of the mod wheel (that I have controlling expression + cross fade) in exactly the same way as I use Trim Volume. I don't tend to dynamically adjust trim. I draw my curves, ensuring the curve always ends up in the middle at the end of the phrase so it's in a good place for recording the next phrase. I should just do the same with the mod wheel.

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Did you happen to stumble upon the mentioned 'bug'?
No, because until I started fiddling with the mod wheel, I've always left the controllers alone and drawn all my automation after recording.
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Old 03-28-2017, 02:06 PM   #11
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Actually you reminded me that I could treat the use of the mod wheel (that I have controlling expression + cross fade) in exactly the same way as I use Trim Volume........... I should just do the same with the mod wheel
This is the beauty of automation-it does it all for you-- years ago people had to actually ride faders and controllers realtime on the consoles-- itb and motorized faders own now-a-days.
TBH- I am an extremely lazy composer- I learn how stuff works automatically,and set'n'forget.
I learnt basic notation when I was younger,but now rely heavily on computed commands.
Still,great compositions can,and do come from organised,or randomly generated arrangements.
I also believe we have no boundries other than set by us-trying to be creative and adventurous with music and modern processings!!

**Off topic** Just about to play with the Virtual Playing Orchestra that was created. (by yourself?)
Many thanks.
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Old 03-29-2017, 05:17 AM   #12
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Just about to play with the Virtual Playing Orchestra that was created. (by yourself?)
Many thanks.
Yea, that's mine. Hope you like it.
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Old 03-29-2017, 06:09 AM   #13
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Yea, that's mine. Hope you like it.
^Yes ty- Had some of the fonts from previous--your additions are quite nice
Thinking of converting and making nnxt patches for reason finally.. might be worth doing now.

Hopefully any controller issues have been dissolved,and your moving along in reaper?
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Old 03-29-2017, 07:50 AM   #14
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Hopefully any controller issues have been dissolved,and your moving along in reaper?
Dissolved, no, but managed, yes. This all came about due to the next addition to Virtual Playing Orchestra. I have dynamic cross fading for the brass patches that I'm currently testing. This is essential for realistic crescendos / decrescendos. This won't affect the main library. It will be an additional (and still free) download for those that want it.
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