EZdrummer still running after drum part is over, hmm!

[psingman]

Hi, really need your help, forumites. I recorded my newest Christmas song and found that when the drum part was over (using loops from Ezdrummer which is activated in FX)there are numerous meter readings moving from either noises or whatever after the drum part for the verse or chorus ends.

I noticed this last year also but didn't hear it much on the final song wav file. However, as we all know, keeping the noises down or to a minimum makes for good songing, for want of a better verb.

So, will await your expertise as to what is causing this phenomenon, and what I can do to either prevent it or stop it from happening on the drum tracks, appreciate it, psingman

[Fex]

Strange that this should occur with Ezdrummer, of all things....
You're absolutely sure there's no other audio routed to the tracks concerned?

[hopi]

perhaps you could upload your project to the stash so we can test it and thereby both see and hear what you are talking about?

[psingman]

Yeah, I would love to upload it, but the studio computer is in my cellar, not sure how to do it. I know it is the EZdrummer track causing it as I had a few people look at the noise and we narrowed it down.

It sounds like a grumbling etc. and the meters move. If I click on the end of the drum part and play it, it doesn't do it. I am kindof getting at my wit's end trying to clean it up. I might render it and make a wav from it, to see. However, I have learned from a lot of sessions, to leave well enough alone. Hope someone in here knows what I am trying to accomplish, or is familiar with this phenomenon, psingman

[planetnine]

how long are we talking after the last drum beat? Those samples are recorded to several seconds (especially the ambiences), and the meters might twitch as the room sounds die out.

If it's audible "world bleed" you ought to isolate the instrument and the velocity and let TT know -it may not have been faded-out at the point where audio meets the noise floor.


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[psingman]

Ok, now it is really getting frustrating. There is a definite scrubbing of some sort going on after the drum loop has completed its run and it is just on the midi drum area. I suppose I could render it as a wav and take it into Adobe Audition and get a noise profile and clean it up that way, but I really want to figure out why it is still running some sort of drum pattern in a added attraction mode.

I am hoping some in here, by the way, thanks PlanetNine for assisting, can help me out to arrest this occurence. I even added an empty item to fill in the space and then tried to clean it up, but the sound doesn't get caught by that item, but is spilling over from the last notes played on the drum pattern chosen. So, hope you can help me overcome this noise, as it is quite evident, thanks, psingman

[planetnine]

preserve your MIDI source. Split out and solo the drums so you can narrow it down to the channel. During beta testing occasionally samples get discovered (remember there are hundreds if not thousands of samples per library) where one particular sample associated with one particular velocity will not have been trimmed/faded at the correct place and a piece of world-bleed or even talkback is found.

It would have to be pretty low-level to escape the attention of the testing team and out to release though. First thing though is to isolate: the library, the instrument, the drum used, the channel and the velocity level that triggers it.


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[psingman]

OH,well, I am not sure what you are asking about in regards to preserving the midi source. It really is quite audible, not sure why it spills over. If I can accomplish this without a whole lot of hoopla that would be great, but TBH, any other method would probably be beyond my scope.

I thought I could Reafir it somehow but no dice. I guess you can't fiddle with midi like you can with wavs. I know how to get out all sorts of noises with Adobe Audition as I am an ole Cool Edit Pro guy. I usually do a bit of that cleansing at the end of my rendering, so it sounds smooth before I do my basic mastering.

Anyway, is there any way, ehhe, that I can put something in that area where it makes some noises and silence it out, right on the track? I can render the midi right, to a wav file, can't remember if you lose the midi track, will have to readdress that issue. I am basically a songwriter, so I go through these woes or throes about twice a year. The good news, is, the song sounds very good and with each session getting much better at tracking, Reaper rules and reigns, psingman

[Fex]

Originally Posted by psingman

I can render the midi right, to a wav file, can't remember if you lose the midi track, will have to readdress that issue.

You won't lose the MIDI. Editing the wav is probably the way to go.

[planetnine]

If what you are saying is the case, a particular channel at a particular velocity will be causing it. Take a copy of the project and pull the routing to bits to find it, but don't change the MIDI.

Another option is check the TT updates are current.


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[bibz1st]

Originally Posted by psingman

I recorded my newest Christmas song...

I noticed this last year also...

Hmmm, reindeer hooves maybe

[Fex]

When you hear hoofbeats, think horses, not reindeer. Or zebras. Or zebralettes. Or llamas. Or elk. There.

If psingman isn't going to take the time to troubleshoot the problem (I don't blame him), I expect Toontrack would appreciate a copy of the MIDI (or the rogue note, at least).

[Lokasenna]

Could you at least render a .wav for us so we can hear the problem? There isn't a hell of a lot when can do without hearing it.

[psingman]

Well, disgruntled reindeers that couldnt get what they want on Black Friday, are blocking my assistance, hehe. Anyway, will render the midi later today and see if the sound is on there. I cannot understand why a midi item is still making sounds well after the last cymbal is played...but like PN said, the velocity of the notes might be causing this..then how come you don't hear it all through the song, hmm, maybe because the drum parts and instruments mask it and you can hear it when there is silence before the next verse begins.

Can I ask a personal question of those who post on these forums? When I talk about things like spillage or copying and pasting of verses or choruses and a lot of other natural tracking "happenings"...you do know what I am inquiring about, right. Like this is recording chitchat that anyone who uses Reaper in a studio must be experiencing, all the time. I read a lot of posts since using this and other forums and it seems to me, maybe just me, that sometimes it gets too technical, and the need to get the song recorded and completed, should be top priority. Anyway, just contemplating, appreciate lending an ear, psingman

[planetnine]

What I was trying to say is it might be a sample in your Drum VSTi that has not been faded and/or trimmed early enough and might contain a recording of studio bleed from the sample recording session. This is speculation as I have experienced it in pre-release products before and I haven't heard the sounds from your project (I don't even know the library it is coming from). If so, this sample will be of a particular channel of a particular instrument/ambient and will be one of possibly several triggered at a particular MIDI velocity. Following?

To nail this, you need to save a gash copy of your project, mute anything that is not drums, and if you can still hear it, mute instrument/channel at a time until you find it and can reproduce the note and output that causes it on its own. Make a note of the velocity of this note on the piano-roll too.

If you can get this far and still hear the unwanted sound at the end of the drum sample, it becomes easily "reproduceable".

I hope this helps.


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[Fex]

Originally Posted by psingman

When I talk about things like spillage or copying and pasting of verses or choruses and a lot of other natural tracking "happenings"...you do know what I am inquiring about, right?

Right. And, fixed that for ya.

Originally Posted by psingman

I read a lot of posts since using this and other forums and it seems to me, maybe just me, that sometimes it gets too technical, and the need to get the song recorded and completed, should be top priority. Anyway, just contemplating, appreciate lending an ear, psingman

Huh? It seems to me that whole sections of the forum devoted to pure math(s). Presumably, that's how all this 'stuff' just keeps getting 'beter' and 'better.' I'm eternally grateful for it. I don't go there, of course; it's absolutely terrifying.

I believe that noobs almost always get the help they need here, unless perhaps they're not English speakers or they're Mac users, or, as is sometimes the case, barking mad.

[Lokasenna]

Just as an example, some of the toms on their Metal Machine expansion have a LOT of ringing after the initial hit - the resonance even comes back up in volume for a bit, which can make your noise gate act a bit weird.

[psingman]

So, maybe setting up a noise gate would work. See, at the end of verses and choruses often I use a cymbal or ride ringing, to keep the end of the measure sounding until the next versing or chorusing. However, the drum sound is usually only needed for example for one bar, but somehow, I cant hear it, but later on in the quiet area, there is vu meter movement and a scrubbing sound. Well, will keep working on, thanks for the offerings.

[Lokasenna]

If it's something like my tom example, where the level of a particular drum is coming back up after the initial hit, your best bet is to play with the release time on your gate. You want to set the threshold high enough that only the initial peak of the drum hit triggers it, but then have a longer hold/release time so that you get as much of the drum sound as you want before the noise shows up.

[whiteaxxxe]

Originally Posted by psingman

... that sometimes it gets too technical, and the need to get the song recorded and completed, should be top priority. Anyway, just contemplating, appreciate lending an ear, psingman

well, digital recording IS technical ... you dont want to have lots of "this trick works only in this context, and only in this special context" - workaround without getting to the bottom of the problem. btw this rules for anything, not only digital recording. you hve to understand in depth a problem other wise you can address a solution to a given problem apropriate.

[psingman]

Gotit. A good example of why often it gets difficult to explain how to accomplish something in music regarding recording. At college we had to use MIDI for our final project in Orchestration. Nobody, I mean noone on the faculty or any of the students knew what they were doing, but just had to do the Larry the Cable Guy format....GIT ER DONE. It is really hard to teach MIDI usage and like computer learning curves, even harder to understand, amen, psingman