Old 02-06-2011, 09:20 AM   #1
DBMusic
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Default A sense of entitlement

Maybe it's just me but far too often these days I get an uneasy feeling when reading all the endless whining and grumbling about missing and/or poorly implemented features/functionality, how Reaper doesn't compare to other DAW's in terms of "professional", the unfortunate feelings some people get when using it, how Reaper must do this or that before it can ever get where someone's idea of where it needs to be, etc. I'm just happy the Cockos team has thick skins...or can at least deal with the negativity in constructive ways. Sometimes I think the transparency and user inclusiveness of the Cockos development paradigm invites a degree of entitlement that fosters tunnel vision in regard to what we think Reaper should be and we begin to define it's ultimate value in narrow terms of what it isn't or doesn't do.

Now I'm all for constructive criticism with clearly articulated suggestions for improvement. But when the criticism is held up to nebulous concepts of professionalism or how Reaper is somehow profoundly deficient because it doesn't do this or that feature to be more like some other DAW, I find myself feeling very leery about the possible destructive nature of those statements...destructive in a way that would have a negative impact on the tireless effort and devotion that obviously goes into Reaper.

I just hope Cockos keeps all this in perspective and it doesn't undermine the love and enthusiasm for the creative and amazing work they have done and continue to do.

Regard,

DB
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Old 02-06-2011, 09:33 AM   #2
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Negative comments aren't necessarily destructive. If people want to point out things that REAPER doesn't do that they wish it did do, that's all fine, even if it's phrased in somewhat negative or aggressive ways. Nobody likes a mean person, but information is information.

Meta-conversations on the other hand, like threads about other threads (eg, this one), or "I have this feeling about REAPER development" type of threads, are neither constructive nor destructive, because they don't really have any bearing on how REAPER is made.
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Old 02-06-2011, 09:34 AM   #3
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I just hope Cockos keeps all this in perspective ...

DB
It doesn't seem to me that it's ever Cockos that loses perspective on these things. It's users who seem to get offended or overly defensive.

JCS tend to wear their big boy pants.

"I can't believe that you still can't see waveforms in PT when moving a clip!"
"Yeah, what a piece of shit that software is."

"I can't believe Reaper still has no ASIO DM."
"Stop trolling."

Last edited by Lawrence; 02-06-2011 at 09:41 AM.
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Old 02-06-2011, 01:11 PM   #4
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Where as "I can't believe logical audio editing is still just as bad as it always has been" is a completely objective statement!

Just winding people up!

Lawrence is right though, there is no one daw to rule them all
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Old 02-06-2011, 01:32 PM   #5
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Maybe it's just me but far too often these days I get an uneasy feeling when reading all the endless whining and grumbling about missing and/or poorly implemented features/functionality, how Reaper doesn't compare to other DAW's in terms of "professional", the unfortunate feelings some people get when using it, how Reaper must do this or that before it can ever get where someone's idea of where it needs to be, etc.
I don't think those people intend to focus their angst at Cockos. What happens is that a fanatic tells them that Reaper does everything that every DAW has ever done better than any other DAW ever, and they get frustrated when it doesn't.

I think Reaper is going to be the hands-down best DAW ever... Eventually. The strongest feature it has is the process that goes into it's development and evolution. But it pisses me off to no end when I see people touting it as already there.
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Old 02-06-2011, 02:12 PM   #6
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Welcome to software development in the socialnetworklized XXI century.

As Steve Wozniak said once, "I believed that people would become programmers and not need companies as much. You can see how laughable that was."

If you thought Baby Boomers were whiners, you've seen nothin' yet.
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Old 02-06-2011, 02:37 PM   #7
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What happens is that a fanatic tells them that Reaper does everything that every DAW has ever done better than any other DAW ever, and they get frustrated when it doesn't.
Maybe I'm not sensitive enough, but I really fail to see those fanatics. Either nobody ever has tried to tell me rubbish like that or if it happened I just didn't take it serious and soon forgot about it.
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Old 02-06-2011, 02:44 PM   #8
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I have seen these threads poping up putting down people making requests/complaining a little bit. SO WHAT! They are the customers!! They have EVERY right to ask for features that we dont currently have.

I'm in the MIDI love camp and think REAPER devs need to get up to speed in that dept in a big way.
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Old 02-06-2011, 03:00 PM   #9
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i see it as something for forumites to do inbetween alpha builds.

say if your fave feature hasn't appeared in 30 builds/2months you kind of get bummed and seeing as v4 is the main reason for being here these days, and theres a short wait for each build, people mouth off a bit.

i know we are customers etc. but you also pay up for what you're given not a future version - i don't buy a 1 litre little car and then expect the makers to give me a 3litre turbo just cos i'm a customer and asked for it!.

i paid for v3.0 - so comparing v4.9 (when my license expires) to v3.0 i imagine i would feel very smug about what my measly £30 has got me.
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Old 02-06-2011, 03:08 PM   #10
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I have seen these threads poping up putting down people making requests/complaining a little bit. SO WHAT! They are the customers!! They have EVERY right to ask for features that we dont currently have.

I'm in the MIDI love camp and think REAPER devs need to get up to speed in that dept in a big way.
Yeah, people are generally excellent about feature requests around here. Why would it bother someone so much?
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Old 02-06-2011, 03:13 PM   #11
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As a professional user (who bought a commercial licence) I do feel I have some right to point out weaknesses and functionality gaps in the software (VCAs, optional dB markings on the controls..? ), but when I think of the functionality that I have got, and the improvements that I've gained since buying the licence, I am humbled enough to remember to ask for these features nicely...

...but yes, it is all too easy to forget what you have and feel you have been shortchanged when your requests aren't jumped on and added next update ( it's easy, all you have to do is program it my way..!)

>
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Old 02-06-2011, 03:32 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by DBMusic View Post
Maybe it's just me but far too often these days I get an uneasy feeling when reading all the endless whining and grumbling about missing and/or poorly implemented features/functionality, how Reaper doesn't compare to other DAW's in terms of "professional", the unfortunate feelings some people get when using it, how Reaper must do this or that before it can ever get where someone's idea of where it needs to be, etc. I'm just happy the Cockos team has thick skins...or can at least deal with the negativity in constructive ways. Sometimes I think the transparency and user inclusiveness of the Cockos development paradigm invites a degree of entitlement that fosters tunnel vision in regard to what we think Reaper should be and we begin to define it's ultimate value in narrow terms of what it isn't or doesn't do.

Now I'm all for constructive criticism with clearly articulated suggestions for improvement. But when the criticism is held up to nebulous concepts of professionalism or how Reaper is somehow profoundly deficient because it doesn't do this or that feature to be more like some other DAW, I find myself feeling very leery about the possible destructive nature of those statements...destructive in a way that would have a negative impact on the tireless effort and devotion that obviously goes into Reaper.

I just hope Cockos keeps all this in perspective and it doesn't undermine the love and enthusiasm for the creative and amazing work they have done and continue to do.

Regard,

DB
I find it annoying when ppl. say this as well. When I came to REAPER from Sonar there were functions in REAPER that just drove me crazy. I would right click & there were functions in the menu that would not even be pertinent based on the action. I got over it now I just don't care because I have an understanding of what REAPER is menat to be & I accept it. But the argument that I find most laudable is the "it's a showstopper, I can't use REAPER until this is done like DAW a, b, c, whatever."

I just remind myself that even if my DAW (REAPER) isn't like the others it's Cockos difference in business model that is a definite bonus.

have a good one
3Eo
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Old 02-06-2011, 03:48 PM   #13
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One can choose to make music or excuses.

I make excuses, but that's because I am a moron who has used a tiny 3 x 1 LED and a hardware sequencer for 27 years.
I just broke down and bought Kontakt videos, and 2 x different Reaper tutorials.
So in a few weeks now that I have these impressive tools, I will make music.
6 nights a week 44-50 weeks a year with 2 x different contractors and sparse session work has taken its toll.

Now I am a weekend warrior for at least six months.

I have killer DAW's and an impressive hardware stage rig, and now the tools I need to make music.
If I fail, it's on me, not some softy sequencer or softy sampler........
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Old 02-06-2011, 03:54 PM   #14
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Now I'm all for constructive criticism with clearly articulated suggestions for improvement. But when the criticism is held up to nebulous concepts of professionalism or how Reaper is somehow profoundly deficient

Regard,

DB
I'm inclined to agree with you, especially when - as has happened and does sometimes happen - people actually complain about REAPER being deficient or not good enough without even being prepared to give examples of exactly what it is they don't like!
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Old 02-06-2011, 04:30 PM   #15
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Maybe I'm not sensitive enough, but I really fail to see those fanatics. Either nobody ever has tried to tell me rubbish like that or if it happened I just didn't take it serious and soon forgot about it.
It tends to happen a fair bit on other forums,
with ReaEvangelists hi-jacking threads on other topics to preach the gospel.

Example:

Poster 1: "Hey look, Logic/ProTools/Cubase version Z is out now, looks pretty cool, anyone had a chance to try it yet"

Poster 2: "Lol, i cant belive you proFOOLS are still stuck in yesterDAW. Reaper will smite you with its awesomeness and the unbelievers will be driven out!!!11eleven!!one!!"

Poster 3: "Sigh... not this shit again"
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Old 02-07-2011, 11:18 PM   #16
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One can choose to make music or excuses.
That's such a weak argument.

A tool is supposed to HELP you get a job done, not HINDER it.

What's happening is the tools is hindering that.

The ONLY tools I can fully endorse is PreSonus Stuio One. That is the lest mouseclicks you are going to get on a DAW.

(I mean.. aside from the fact it doesn't work for me with it's erratic buffering issues).. but beside that, for most people it seems to work so go try it and download a demo.)

If Cocko's wants to improve their program, they need to take the best (Studio One), and then enhance it and make it that much better. Instead Cocko's developers are too interested in re-inventing wheels and coming up with their 'own' ideas and work-flows. You don't engineer like this. You engineer by copying and improving the best (which is Studio One). Everyone in the audio world is too busy trying to re-invent wheels and this is why we aren't moving forward.

Thank goodness for PreSonus stepping up to the plate and trying to make a DAW from a customers perspective - NOT a developers.
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Old 02-07-2011, 11:34 PM   #17
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Old 02-07-2011, 11:38 PM   #18
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Well, in my own ineffective way I was only trying to be supportive and appreciative of the work you guys do. My intent was a constructive one. But obviously you don't need my help in this regard. In the future I'll endeavor to keep my meaningless meta-conversations to myself.

DB
Thanks

-W
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Old 02-08-2011, 12:08 AM   #19
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I know myself and a few other users complain/make suggestions about the midi functionality in Reaper.

I think it would be easy to misinterpret, but this is mostly done to give the Dev's ideas and feedback about potential changes or different ways of doing things. Sure; we may allude to functionality within different hosts but that is because those functions work in a way we are familiar with in those hosts. If Cuckos was to come up with a more efficient way of doing things, that would be of equal use.

I think the Dev's are to smart to take anything personally or worry because people may not like the way a particular function is implemented. We all have opinions, as long as discussion renames productive it can always be of some assistance. :')


Ps Schawa, more midi love please.
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Old 02-08-2011, 12:28 AM   #20
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This forum and reaper gets way more love than "others"

I agree, midi love would be great, but in fact as is and with fingers extension it's still better than studio one. I'd argue that with x1's current issues it's better than sonars.

Since my first version it's improved allot. Now that doesn't mean I wouldn't like to see a few things

But if someone wants to try very hard (which I think some of what the op is saying is) to get something implemented, so be it. There is a really good chance the reaps are listening.
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Old 02-08-2011, 01:42 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by TheDriller View Post
It tends to happen a fair bit on other forums,
with ReaEvangelists hi-jacking threads on other topics to preach the gospel.

Example:

Poster 1: "Hey look, Logic/ProTools/Cubase version Z is out now, looks pretty cool, anyone had a chance to try it yet"

Poster 2: "Lol, i cant belive you proFOOLS are still stuck in yesterDAW. Reaper will smite you with its awesomeness and the unbelievers will be driven out!!!11eleven!!one!!"

Poster 3: "Sigh... not this shit again"
Poster 2 would clearly fall into the "not to be taken serious" category and he has made all efforts to make that obvious. Quite clear to see that such a post is totally free of any sense and meaning, no? I doubt that anyone a) would be tempted to try Reaper because he read that and b) would be disappointed when he finds that Reaper doesn't live up to BS like that.
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Old 02-08-2011, 01:53 AM   #22
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Well, in fact, that argument DOES happen.

I usually recommend reaper in that case
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Old 02-08-2011, 02:13 AM   #23
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I don't think those people intend to focus their angst at Cockos. What happens is that a fanatic tells them that Reaper does everything that every DAW has ever done better than any other DAW ever, and they get frustrated when it doesn't.

I think Reaper is going to be the hands-down best DAW ever... Eventually. The strongest feature it has is the process that goes into it's development and evolution. But it pisses me off to no end when I see people touting it as already there.

I think all the recent 'negativity' is because Reaper is currently at a point, where the developers are short of losing it. some of us see it and spread words of warning, some don't.

The number of actions increase and increase, yet there is no category, sub-category etc. system -or at least not exposed to the user. The number of options increase and increase and it becomes harder and harder to find certain settings (i.e. to recall what function is affected by which option(s) and where that option is). The menues grow. The configurability keeps increasing. Many of the core program-functions become more and more convoluted in an attempt to make them more powerful (to satisfy user-requests). And now with WALTER, two different installations of Reaper on two different machines will soon even look completely different. So what is Reaper? What is the 'face' of Reaper? What is its 'character'? What is it supposed to 'do' for me as the user?

I think questions such as these need to get answered soon (and development needs to be steered accordingly) else it will be a dead end. I successfully predicted the (near) death of two sequencers already and I do so a third time now. Whether Cockos listens to us is their business entirely. But I think we (the whiners) have actually to be regarded as death messengers, because that what we are. Deny it and you will only support them at failing.

Last edited by jens; 02-08-2011 at 02:19 AM. Reason: typos... as usual.
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Old 02-08-2011, 02:17 AM   #24
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Meta-conversations on the other hand, like threads about other threads (eg, this one), or "I have this feeling about REAPER development" type of threads, are neither constructive nor destructive, because they don't really have any bearing on how REAPER is made.
Perhaps... but it's always easier to just continue doing what you do than to halt and think about the concept of this doing, i.e. to analyze its meaning, purpose and sense. So of course I would expect you to say that either way.
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Old 02-08-2011, 02:26 AM   #25
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Poster 2 would clearly fall into the "not to be taken serious" category and he has made all efforts to make that obvious. Quite clear to see that such a post is totally free of any sense and meaning, no? I doubt that anyone a) would be tempted to try Reaper because he read that and b) would be disappointed when he finds that Reaper doesn't live up to BS like that.
Yes that's exactly what happened to me and now I'm finding out I'm getting burned.

If someone will listen to my honest opinion. Go check out Studio One as it's the best I have tried of all the DAW's. Watch some youtube vids, Download demo and be the judge. You don't even need a manual. Just drag stuff where you feel it should go and things will happen for you.
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Old 02-08-2011, 05:16 AM   #26
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Go check out Studio One as it's the best I have tried of all the DAW's.
hey crush, do you know if studio one supports audio channel splitting and parameter modulation? i didn't see either of these (for me) must have features in the videos. thanks!
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Old 02-08-2011, 06:41 AM   #27
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I successfully predicted the (near) death of two sequencers already
Which two?
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Old 02-08-2011, 06:51 AM   #28
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The number of actions increase and increase, yet there is no category, sub-category etc. system -or at least not exposed to the user. The number of options increase and increase and it becomes harder and harder to find certain settings (i.e. to recall what function is affected by which option(s) and where that option is). The menues grow. The configurability keeps increasing. Many of the core program-functions become more and more convoluted in an attempt to make them more powerful (to satisfy user-requests). And now with WALTER, two different installations of Reaper on two different machines will soon even look completely different. So what is Reaper? What is the 'face' of Reaper? What is its 'character'?

This is raising a very, very good point, schwa. Stuff like these (categorizing the actions in a tree-like structure, see Photoshop!) indeed should be dealt with before v4 hits the streets. And I mean it.
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Old 02-08-2011, 06:52 AM   #29
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I had a wife. She had bad and good things. We talked and agreed we should just be friends. I'm divorced now. We have a beautiful daughter and spend some time together because we were right, we're just fine as friends. She still wants to do things in her own way but that doesn't piss me off anymore, that's her life and I just learned to take and use what I need, she does the same.

Hi, my name is David and here's my ex-wife REAPER and my daughter 'Music', thanks for listening.
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Old 02-08-2011, 07:12 AM   #30
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So many personal wants and opinions under the disguise of "us" or "we"

I could also say that a massive amount of power users (don't like the term but you know what I mean) have found the perfect DAW for them. "We" like it like this.

I'm up for making things as best as possible for new users and everyone else as it's in my interest to make sure reaper keeps doing well (and I love what it stands for too in my eyes anyway) BUT..

The way some of you threaten is a sorrowful and childish affair and makes me feel for the devs, I don't absolve my self of this either but I don't go round pretending that it's going to be the end of reaper if the devs don't do what I want right away. I'm sure they will get round to it if enough people want it.

As for studio one, I agree that it's a pretty good daw but in it's current iteration it has no where near all the features I need personally and even then the way reaper now interacts with my hardware controllers makes me very happy.

Let's not loose sight of a good thing and let our cancerous comments drive new users away or turn this forum into a crapfest.

All hail reaper! lol
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Old 02-08-2011, 07:13 AM   #31
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I think all the recent 'negativity' is because Reaper is currently at a point, where the developers are short of losing it. some of us see it and spread words of warning, some don't.

The number of actions increase and increase, yet there is no category, sub-category etc. system -or at least not exposed to the user. The number of options increase and increase and it becomes harder and harder to find certain settings (i.e. to recall what function is affected by which option(s) and where that option is). The menues grow. The configurability keeps increasing. Many of the core program-functions become more and more convoluted in an attempt to make them more powerful (to satisfy user-requests). And now with WALTER, two different installations of Reaper on two different machines will soon even look completely different. So what is Reaper? What is the 'face' of Reaper? What is its 'character'? What is it supposed to 'do' for me as the user?

I think questions such as these need to get answered soon (and development needs to be steered accordingly) else it will be a dead end. I successfully predicted the (near) death of two sequencers already and I do so a third time now. Whether Cockos listens to us is their business entirely. But I think we (the whiners) have actually to be regarded as death messengers, because that what we are. Deny it and you will only support them at failing.
I personally like it that the 'character' is approaching anything *I* want it to be. You have to admit, this flexibility alone sets Reaper apart from most software. Perhaps someone may design a 'character' for Reaper, complete with theme, menus, actions etc. Cockos seems to have taken the stance that they will provide the tools, and the fine user community - especially specific 'experts' will provide the final character of the product.

We already have custom themes, menus, actions, and script-ability. A few more improvements like that and Reaper will be a wonderfully customizable music making engine. Maybe some people don't want to spend the time tweaking the UI and expect a finished product, but I'm certain that others will.

Last edited by drybij; 02-08-2011 at 03:56 PM.
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Old 02-09-2011, 12:42 AM   #32
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Which two?

Tracktion and eXT/XT2


(each with very different circumstances)
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Old 02-09-2011, 12:45 AM   #33
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*sigh*

I feel so bad about those too as I own them both
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Old 02-09-2011, 12:59 AM   #34
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You have to admit, this flexibility alone sets Reaper apart from most software.
Yes, but I think the problem is that if they continue like this, then soon they'll reach a level of complexity where few people will want to bother to cope with it all anymore. People will start lusting for something more, simple, direct, easy, comprehensible.

For instance I normally quantize by hand since Schwa revamped the MIDI quantizing function. It usually just doesn't do what I want it to do. I'm not sure I just don't understand it or whether it's somehow buggy and tbh I can't be bothered to attempt to find out.

So for me at least, some program functions have already reached a level of complexity where I just don't bother with them anymore - and I am not one of those users who want everything über-simple - But when I constantly have to think 'how on earth does that work again', 'damn, that's not what I want, what did I do wrong', 'damn, I'm sure there was an option for that somewhere', or just 'FUUUUUU!', then all the flexibility isn't really worth much to me anymore.


B.t.w.: I'd be curious to know, who of the Reaper developers really uses (at least more or less) all program functions himself
(because, if you only use a small subset of functions, it'll of course not appear as moloch-like to you as if you have to deal with it all).

Last edited by jens; 02-09-2011 at 01:06 AM.
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Old 02-09-2011, 01:56 AM   #35
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B.t.w.: I'd be curious to know, who of the Reaper developers really uses (at least more or less) all program functions himself
(because, if you only use a small subset of functions, it'll of course not appear as moloch-like to you as if you have to deal with it all).
i doubt you could find many users who use all the features......

prophecies of doom and gloom aside, I see two areas where people are discontented - small stuff and big stuff.

ONe persons flow killer nitpick is a complete non-issue to another. As well a complete necessity of a feature for one is a mere afterthough to another.

Me, I'm all about the loose end's. THere's a few big things I'd like to see, though persoanlly I think just refining what exists would take reaper to a DEVASTING new level

details, that's my vote (not that I'm overly concerned atm anyway)

seems things are progressing well enough, though sometime I wonder (and no offense to cockos coding skills) if it would take a bigger team to really take it to the next level -

I mean there's sooo much Reaper can already do, no doubt, though always I see how much MORE it can do too, and no doubt the More list just grows and grows - how to keep up? lol

Last edited by gwok; 02-09-2011 at 02:02 AM.
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Old 02-09-2011, 02:56 AM   #36
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I constantly have to think 'how on earth does that work again', 'damn, that's not what I want, what did I do wrong', 'damn, I'm sure there was an option for that somewhere', or just 'FUUUUUU!', then all the flexibility isn't really worth much to me anymore.
Developers usually take the mindset of 'this is a good idea, if the users understands he must do x,y,z.' Or 'all he has to do is open this and click that'. That's easy for them because they are designing it and it's their logic. We don't share their logic though and probably don't want to. We just see something, want to do something to it, and hope that the software doesn't get in the way.

This is why developers should always be managed closely. Now SOME developers are talented enough to understand the KISS principle, but most don't unfortunately.

In Studio One, you select your midi notes, right click, and the menu gives you options to quantize, quantize 50%, quantize less, humanize, humanize less. That sort of thing. I just quantize 50% a lot of the time and that works best IMO. I bet that's the sort of thing you were going for. Or you can set a custom number to the left. The quantize works very well in Studio One actually.

When you record vocals, you go to the fx chain to the right (one mouse click). You grab the 'Vocals' one and just drag and drop it on the wav. You will now have 3 fx on that channel. Compression, reverb, eq. All 3 set to specific preset from PreSonus. You can also download these chains from users. There are presets that hold settings for all 3 of them at once.

So in 2 mouse clicks, we have full effects on a track for vocals.

And not only that, you can have multiple chains so you can test them side by side. http://dawsession.com/pics/2010-04-29_1218.png

This is all done so easily.

And envelopes? Just see below what default behavior SHOULD be in any DAW (aside from the loud protests of the fanboys)

http://dawsession.com/pics/follow.gif

Customers don't want to jump through hoops and play games to get a tool working. If there's advanced options, then bury them away. The default option should be the most logical. Clicking on a button and arming things when NO OTHER DAW does this is simply illogical. If I highlight, I should be able to hear what I'm playing. Do NOT let fanboys tell you otherwise.

At this stage of the game, it's possible for reaper to be #1 due to the price point. Already they have this:

http://www.gearslutz.com/board/music...aw-poll-3.html

It's critical they implement KISS principles and NOT listen to fanboys on the forum.

I just have a hunch they are paying too much attention to fanboys more than the average potential consumer and not keeping to basic software design principles.
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Old 02-09-2011, 03:09 AM   #37
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seems things are progressing well enough, though sometime I wonder (and no offense to cockos coding skills) if it would take a bigger team to really take it to the next level -

I mean there's sooo much Reaper can already do, no doubt, though always I see how much MORE it can do too, and no doubt the More list just grows and grows - how to keep up? lol
The next level has already been reached by Studio One.

Imagine an electric car getting unveiled from Ford that was kept a secret from the industry. It would need recharging once a month and for 10 min. Barely any electrical draw to recharge.

Obviously, the competition would be taking apart the car and copying it/improving on it in every way.

From all the DAW's I've recently used there is a game changer that is poised to take over, this is not a time for new ideas. It's time that almost every DAW get their act together and start to copy Studio One. I never had to read a single help file and was able to create a whole track with NO HELP, NO LEARNING CURVE..

We don't need fanboy ideas at this time to further sabotage the software and over complicate it. We need the devs to purchase studio one, install it, and COPY it.

Look what a drag and drop will get ya:

http://img44.**************/img44/599...ofmidipart.gif

Last edited by Crush; 02-09-2011 at 03:17 AM.
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Old 02-09-2011, 03:34 AM   #38
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Why would anyone a mere copy of Studio1 if the can get the original instead, price tag aside?

And if you are so happy with S1, then what are you doing here?

I agree with some of what you say, but I strongly disagree with most of the rest.

Reaper is a FANTASTIC sequencer application in its own right.
There's a lot of great stuff the S1 developers should perhaps have a look at.

The problem is only, that they tend to throw in new functions, without imo taking nearly enough care of HOW and WHERE they are exposed to the user and how they RELATE to existing functions.

There are many features, settings and options that a) are somewhat hidden and/or b) named inappropriately and/or c) compete with or even contradict other features, functions and options. There's no sane order within the interface-structure.
Reaper is a bit like an attic stuffed with cardboxes full of antique gems that are very dusty and sometimes even partly broken.
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Old 02-09-2011, 03:45 AM   #39
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The next level has already been reached by Studio One.
Studio One is good to be sure, but ease of use is not worth several hundred dollars. Especially to a community/industry full of people who already suffered the learning curves of their current DAW. Little things that improve workflow go a long way in getting/keeping a crowd:

- VST3 is a deal breaker for some people (which means Cubase).
- Reaper has wider function and utility, at a price that for-profit companies can't compete with.

You can go down the list of successful DAWs, and they each bring something to the table that keeps them in the game. As much as people want to believe the market is over-saturated with options, the successful DAWs respond to different needs from different people.

Garage Band was a gimmick, not a breakthrough. Catering to the crowd that doesn't want to work in order to record/mix/master is entirely different from catering to professionals who need tools that get the job done efficiently and effectively. Don't get me wrong, there is a separate market there that someone can/will champion. But taking a DAW and streamlining it to work more like the Windows user generation expects it to is not new, and it is not going to change the game.
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Old 02-09-2011, 05:35 AM   #40
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Tracktion and eXT/XT2 (each with very different circumstances)
I what way are they 'dead'? They're still available - or is there some announcement I've missed that states development has ceased?
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