Old 01-11-2008, 07:57 AM   #1
lttoler
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Default Making overall mix sound warmer

Right now I'm using Reaper and a Line 6 Toneport UX2 to record with. I also use an AT4040 mic for vocals. I'm pretty happy with all my projects, but they usually sound "sterile" to my ears. Is there anything, maybe a VST, that can make my overall mix, or maybe even seperate tracks, sound warmer???
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Old 01-11-2008, 10:09 AM   #2
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You could try experimenting with some subtle EQing.

For example, try adding some 'warmth' with a little gain around the 150-300Hz range. Be careful though - too much will make things sound muddy and/or woolly.

Also try cutting a little around the 3000-5000Hz range. This will take some of the 'edge' off the sound, although again be careful, as this is where a sound's 'presence' often lives and if you cut too much you'll lose it in the mix.

Most importantly though, these are very broad brush rules of thumb and different instruments will react differently to these changes, so they are not a fix-all solution. Other sounds present in the mix can also make a surprising amount of difference, so try to tweak with the rest of the mix playing at the same time if you can.

Make small, incremental changes and listen carefully to the results as you go.
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Old 01-11-2008, 10:37 AM   #3
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Try the Electric blanket plugin that should help !!!!

there are some tube type plugins that will smooth/warm up the sound BUT it is usually what you recorded and HOW you recorded it , adding some room to the mix will help as well.

re-record the tracks using your mic in front of your monitors ( if you have them ?? ) onto another track and mix to taste

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Old 01-11-2008, 10:52 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lttoler View Post
Right now I'm using Reaper and a Line 6 Toneport UX2 to record with. I also use an AT4040 mic for vocals. I'm pretty happy with all my projects, but they usually sound "sterile" to my ears. Is there anything, maybe a VST, that can make my overall mix, or maybe even seperate tracks, sound warmer???

You can try plugins like Vintage Warmer...
But ideally you want to capture a better sound from the start.
That means mic/pre-amp, positioning, the room, and A/D.
The 4040 isn't bad... but ATs typically arean't the 'warmest' sounding mics. Pickup another mic that sounds a bit darker/warmer.
Try to further define what's missing/lacking/etc...
Determine what's causing your projects to sound 'sterile'.
Keep in mind that arrangement can also affect the mix.
Listen to commercial projects that sound good to you... and compare to your projects.


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Old 01-11-2008, 11:46 AM   #5
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As far as the mic, I have others that are warmer, but this is my favorite overall, it just needs a touch more warmth itself for my tastes. Is there a mic preamp I should get for this. I was looking at the Presonus Bluetube DP. How would this Do? Also, where can I download this Electric Blanket plugin?
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Old 01-11-2008, 11:51 AM   #6
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Jim you sound like you know what you're talking about.

I've been using a studio projects B1 and recently bought a B3 too that I haven't had a chance to check out yet. The B1 sounds bright to my ears though I've been told to use proximity to achieve deeper sounds.

Can you suggest a few $100 - $200 mics that are warmer?

I've been thinking about one from Kel Audio HM-1 for this purpose based on what they say.
http://www.kelaudio.com/hm1.html

I've also just picked up an inexpensive Nady ribbon mic RSM-4 (paid $70) with the intention of capturing more mids and lows.
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Old 01-11-2008, 12:08 PM   #7
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There are these certain VSTfx that make sounds warmer ...

Try e.g. TesslaSE, Rescue and Reaper fx badbusmojo_aa.
The complexity of use goes up in the order I meantioned them. Make sure you read the manuals of TesslaSE and Rescue while Rescue comes with some really good presets as a start.

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Old 01-11-2008, 12:57 PM   #8
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LT try re-amping the whole track as I suggested it will make a BIG difference !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Old 01-11-2008, 01:18 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soul&folk View Post
I've been thinking about one from Kel Audio HM-1 for this purpose based on what they say.
I've been using a Kel Audio HM-1 for a couple of years (vocals and acoustic guitar) and have been happy with the results. Smooth and warm.
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Old 01-11-2008, 02:50 PM   #10
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Quote:
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I've been using a Kel Audio HM-1 for a couple of years (vocals and acoustic guitar) and have been happy with the results. Smooth and warm.
what preamp are you running it through?
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Old 01-11-2008, 03:05 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichardM View Post
I've been using a Kel Audio HM-1 for a couple of years (vocals and acoustic guitar) and have been happy with the results. Smooth and warm.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mbuzz View Post
LT try re-amping the whole track as I suggested it will make a BIG difference !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

LAter
Buzz
These are good examples of what will get you closer to what you want, I used to run through 2 Martech MSS-10 mic pre's then back into the DAW and record the 2 channels. That's great to do, because you can slam the shit out of "Real" mic pre's and they'll just sound good period, better than any plug in I know of. Grab a stereo mic pre - or 2 mono blocks (people here will have reasons as to why not go with 2 mono mic pres).

Second, judicial use of compression will go a very long way, both buss compression and individual tracks. When I say judicial I mean start slamming the knobs, use more intense settings as opposed to timid settings. Be careful though, as almost all plugins don't react well to what I just said.

Third, the use of free and pay distortion plug ins. In the league of BadBussMojo (which I think someone else mentioned in this thread) will get you the sound you want quick. But you'll have to learn how to use distortion and what it's for and what types get you woof sounds and what types get you biting sounds.

Fourth, grab Nebula 2 free, and learn how to render effects to the track, and treat the rendered track as if it's the real track and apply whatever methods you do as usual.

Then you'll be in the ballpark. Or don't believe a word I say.
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Old 01-11-2008, 03:10 PM   #12
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That is probably one of the best ways to spend $130USD I can think of.

The HM-1 is a seriously nice mic. Very versatile.

You should get it.

Regards,
David

Quote:
Originally Posted by soul&folk View Post
I've been thinking about one from Kel Audio HM-1 for this purpose based on what they say.
http://www.kelaudio.com/hm1.html

I've also just picked up an inexpensive Nady ribbon mic RSM-4 (paid $70) with the intention of capturing more mids and lows.
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Old 01-11-2008, 03:12 PM   #13
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I think Jim's Vintage Warmer would be a good option.

If you go for the colored pre option, then everything will have that color...it might build up too much (unless you mix pres will recording).

If you get the VM, you can experiment putting on the master buss or any combinations of other tracks (drum kit, vocals, guitars) and achieve your desired level of warmth.


Cheers,
David

Quote:
Originally Posted by lttoler View Post
As far as the mic, I have others that are warmer, but this is my favorite overall, it just needs a touch more warmth itself for my tastes. Is there a mic preamp I should get for this. I was looking at the Presonus Bluetube DP. How would this Do? Also, where can I download this Electric Blanket plugin?
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Old 01-11-2008, 03:38 PM   #14
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Since no one has mentioned it yet, you might try using a dynamic to record some of your tracks. This goes along with the previously mentioned "capturing a better sound from the start." Also low pass filters, strategicly placed through-out the mix, can warm things up quite a bit.

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Old 01-11-2008, 04:30 PM   #15
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What is "warmer"?
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Old 01-11-2008, 04:51 PM   #16
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Quote:
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What is "warmer"?
More consistent, more lower harmonics. That's what I would classify as something that could sound warmer. Often associated with less highest harmonics. Transients more rounded than sharp.
Extremely subjective word, for sure!

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Old 01-12-2008, 10:09 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by soul&folk View Post
I've been using a studio projects B1 and recently bought a B3 too that I haven't had a chance to check out yet. The B1 sounds bright to my ears though I've been told to use proximity to achieve deeper sounds.

Can you suggest a few $100 - $200 mics that are warmer?

I've been thinking about one from Kel Audio HM-1 for this purpose based on what they say.
http://www.kelaudio.com/hm1.html

I've also just picked up an inexpensive Nady ribbon mic RSM-4 (paid $70) with the intention of capturing more mids and lows.

The Studio Projects B series mics use a 3-micron diaphragm.
This makes the B series great for capturing subtle detail.
IOW, You get the size imparted by the large diaphragm... and the detail typically associated with a small diaphragm mic.
This also means they aren't the warmest of all mics...
BTW, The B series is excellent on acoustic guitar!

Finding great/warm sounding mics in the $100-$200 range is tough.
The Kel is a good choice.
I can't think of too many 'budget' mics that sound particularly warm/dark/detailed in the same vein as an AKG C12 (about $5k).
At the $1k mark, the Neuman TLM103 is a good bet... but it wouldn't have the tube 'mojo' of the C12.
The Studio Projects T3 is warm sounding... with a little tube crunch/zing in the mids.

As has been mentioned, don't overlook using good dynamic mics.
- RE20
- MD421
- SM57

As far as 'warm' sounding mic pre's, I wouldn't bother with budget units. They're typically "starved voltage" design... and will impart more distortion than size/warmth.
The Brick is pretty decent... and the UA Solo 610 is also very nice.


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Old 01-12-2008, 10:33 AM   #18
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"As has been mentioned, don't overlook using good dynamic mics.
- RE20
- MD421
- SM57"

Just to add, the SM7B is also pretty well thought of.

Also, as I understand it and please correct me if I'm wrong, alot of the issue of "digital coldness" is it's equal reproduction of extreme highs and lows where as tape would roll those off a little. Add that to the high end hype you get from alot of lower priced condensers and you're going to get some build up in the high end. Especially if you use those mics on most of your sources. With all that high end going on it's no wonder things start to sound "brittle" after a while. I was having this problem myself and started to experiment using dynamics on everything except OH's. Since then I haven't noticed nearly as much hype in my mixes. Of course, if I get my hands on some great mics that could change. I do, however, wonder if this is the reason for the resurgence of ribbon mics over the last few years.

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Old 01-12-2008, 11:20 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Roseberry View Post
The Studio Projects B series mics use a 3-micron diaphragm.
This makes the B series great for capturing subtle detail.
IOW, You get the size imparted by the large diaphragm... and the detail typically associated with a small diaphragm mic.
This also means they aren't the warmest of all mics...
BTW, The B series is excellent on acoustic guitar!

Finding great/warm sounding mics in the $100-$200 range is tough.
The Kel is a good choice.
I can't think of too many 'budget' mics that sound particularly warm/dark/detailed in the same vein as an AKG C12 (about $5k).
At the $1k mark, the Neuman TLM103 is a good bet... but it wouldn't have the tube 'mojo' of the C12.
The Studio Projects T3 is warm sounding... with a little tube crunch/zing in the mids.

As has been mentioned, don't overlook using good dynamic mics.
- RE20
- MD421
- SM57

As far as 'warm' sounding mic pre's, I wouldn't bother with budget units. They're typically "starved voltage" design... and will impart more distortion than size/warmth.
The Brick is pretty decent... and the UA Solo 610 is also very nice.


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Old 01-12-2008, 11:32 AM   #20
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the i5 sounds nice and warm as a dynamic mic, and works wonders on acoustic guitars
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Old 01-12-2008, 01:15 PM   #21
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I'm big on the SM7B as well. I use 'em on everything.

I'm also looking into trying some of the Chinese ribbons.
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