Old 08-07-2008, 02:58 AM   #1
charles.monteiro
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Default can't control midi track volume

I am using the Roland Sound Canvas DXi. I used Reaper to generate the 16 tracks pre-configured with the appropriate midi routing settings. I made my track housing the Roland DXi as the folder for the generated midi tracks. I inserted a midi file on the first generated track. It plays fine, it mutes fine and so forth. But I can't control its volume from Reaper. I can on the Roland VSC panel but not from Reaper. In Reaper I can control the volume for the folder which does affect said track but I cannot control the specific track.

I have done as much in the past and have not had any issues. I am running the latest Reaper release.

tia
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Old 08-07-2008, 03:35 AM   #2
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Sorry, being a bit thick today.

Can you clarify exactly what you are doing to control the volume of the track that the MIDI file is on?

Also, can you post a screenshot of the tracks?
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Old 08-07-2008, 05:02 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkStar View Post
Sorry, being a bit thick today.

Can you clarify exactly what you are doing to control the volume of the track that the MIDI file is on?

Also, can you post a screenshot of the tracks?
no problem, I'll try to get to a screenshot but all you'll see is a track within a folder. The only thing I'm doing to control the volume of the track being discussed is to use my mouse to move the fader, and I have actually tried it with my Alphatrack and get the same result. The track thinks its volume is being manipulated i.e. it shows the db incrementing/decrementing but audibly nothing happens. Again, I can control the volume indirectly by moving the fader on the enclosing folder track.

I didn't think to look at the routing but since Reaper generated it I would assume it was correct unless somehow a bug has crept in.

thanks
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Old 08-07-2008, 05:27 AM   #4
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You are not doing anything wrong. It's a missing feature in Reaper.

The track faders are only effecting audio volume. To effect midi volume they would have to send midi controller 7 on the channel you wish to effect.
Neither do Reapers track faders send any midi controller nor is there a midi out channel select for tracks so that they would know which channel they should send the controller on.

Both would be worth a Feature Request.

You could try and see if there are automation parameters for the sound canvas volume that you could use.
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Old 08-07-2008, 05:55 AM   #5
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okay, but I think that if the VST was a multi-channel VST and had I also generated the audio channels that in that case I would effectively be able to control the volume from the generated track. Right? I have that setup in another project I believe. In this case, the DXi was not a multichannel. I suppose that it would be nice to have that option. Not a huge deal, I can control the volume on the DXi instrument panel.
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Old 08-07-2008, 05:57 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by charles.monteiro View Post
The only thing I'm doing to control the volume of the track being discussed is to use my mouse to move the fader, and I have actually tried it with my Alphatrack and get the same result. The track thinks its volume is being manipulated i.e. it shows the db incrementing/decrementing but audibly nothing happens. Again, I can control the volume indirectly by moving the fader on the enclosing folder track.
I thought that might be the case, and gofer has described the situation clearly.

The faders on the MIDI tracks (currently) only control audio on those tracks and there is none.

The fader on the folder track is controlling the audio being output by VSC.
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Old 08-07-2008, 07:14 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkStar View Post
I thought that might be the case, and gofer has described the situation clearly.

The faders on the MIDI tracks (currently) only control audio on those tracks and there is none.

The fader on the folder track is controlling the audio being output by VSC.
I just thought of something , one can mix both audio and midi segments within the same track in Reaper. Not in front of Reaper but I'm guessing one can and in that case the fader would control the audio as you say but not the volume associated with the midi data. Interesting if so.
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Old 08-07-2008, 08:07 AM   #8
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Yes, if you can find tallisman's guide to setting up a multitimbral multi-out VSTi you can:

- have 16 MIDI/audio tracks,
- send the MIDI from them, each on a different MIDi channel, to the VSTi,
- send the audio from the VSTi back to each of the tracks (you have to enable feedback in Project Settings)
- control the audio with the faders on each track,
- add FX to each track
etc etc

I tried searching for tallisman's guide to setting all this up but have not found the right keywords yet.

And there are a few templates around illustrating this too (for kontakt among others). Here's a brand new one, for three tracks:
http://stash.reaper.fm/v/1584/MultiAudioMidiRoute.RPP



HTH
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Old 08-07-2008, 08:30 AM   #9
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that's not what I mean, I'll try it later. I mean have both audio and midi data within the very same track.
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Old 08-07-2008, 08:54 AM   #10
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Here's thought ...

I tried this with ReaSynth ...

Install a midi loopback (eg MIDIYoke)

In preferences set up a control surface ... I used HUI (partial)

Set the MIDI output to go to Midi Yoke 1

Then in your track i/o send the midi hardware output to midi yoke 1

Then, in the reasynth panel, use the learn facility and select volume, and then move the channel fader.

This then makes the control messages from the fader on yhe track generate midi control which is then mapped to the volume of the synth ...

So, perhaps a bit of playing around with this idea might be fruitful?

On the other hand ...

cheers,

db
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Old 08-07-2008, 08:59 AM   #11
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sure, but I for now rather just control it on the VSTi panel,
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Old 08-07-2008, 09:16 AM   #12
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Charles,

I've been using Reaper as a master sync'd to either Sonar, Voyetra midi composer or Powertracks to run hardware, These are not ideal though.

Try Terry's minimix or midimix,

http://rekkerd.org/terry-west-releases-minimix/

This will allow you control pan, volume and other CC for each track. Doesn't name the patches but does save channel and program change also. Can be a bit unstable if you are adjusting things in real time, but this is a good patch until we have the functions built into Reaper.

Still haven't had much luck with Brunette's plugin, but probably just something I'm missing. Another possibility

John
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