changes from v0_9:
A footswitch connected to Footswitch 1 can now toggle a selected track between Read and Latch mode. Press footswitch -> Latch mode, release -> Read mode.
I find this very handy for writing automation emulating touch sensitive knobs.
The usual disclaimer:
This is an unfinished version which could be improved (more buttons could be mapped to functions), but works quite well for me atm.
So use as is, I will update/revise probably when I see the need to.
But feel free to ask for help in this thread.
It's a good idea to backup your BCR presets first before sending the sysex file, just in case something goes wrong. (Everything worked fine here though.)
I'm trying to set up my BCR2000 so it can both control and get MIDI feedback from VST synths. I've followed the instructions for Klinke' MCU plugin as well as the instructions you provided. At this point I'm getting feedback for fader controls. The problem is I don't know how to get into plug-in mode. THe instructions say to hit alt-plugin. I see on your map that the third button from the left on the BCR top row of buttons is marked "plug-ins", but I don't see anything marked "alt". I've tried alt on the computer keyboard. What am I doing wrong?
Thanks for your helpful instructions. If it isn't obvious, this is the first time I've tried to set up a controller of this kind (to finally get away from mouse-tweaking).
there's as option in Klinke's plugin setup to use Alt on the computer keyboard instead of the control surface.
That option must be enabled.
When you've done that and keyboard-Alt + the plugin knob on the BCR still doesn't get you in plugin mode, try holding Alt+double click the plugin button (generally trying to click twice on a button to get a function is sometimes necessary, because I did some mistakes with setting up buttons wrongly as toggle/latch).
Sorry, I haven't set up my BCR atm, but I think it should work like this.
Also, are you using some kind of display emulation (like HuskerView), otherwise it's difficult to say if you entered plugin mode.
edit:
Having looked in Klinke's manual again, I remembered it wrong, there's no specific tickbox for using the keyboard Alt-key, but it's enabled when you use BCF2000 mode (which I recommend).
To get in the Klinke's plugin setup mode (the picture below), doubleclick on the MackieControl entry.
Unfortuanately MCU_FBF.exe file on the stash is not downloadable due to extension (if you uploaded this file, you should reupload in .zip or similar)
And all the links to HuskerView are dead...
Does anyone have either of these MCU transaltor apps? I'm really want to get midi feedback going with a BCR2000 and it seems that i need these to do so...
The second row of buttons is now used for the quickjump feature (='pads') and also for switching action banks.
The 'global view' button is useful when using folder mode (see Klinke's manual)
Also, the bottom eight encoders can now work as sort of a 'poor man's VU/level meters' (instructions included in the download)
Looks like this: http://s1100.photobucket.com/albums/...evelmeters.mp4
Thanks nofish for posting your work. I've just got hands-on with my BCR2000 and these templates are a great starting point.
I much prefer the BCR to the BCF because, apart from having more controls, the lack of physical faders means absolute quiet and less to break. It's a shame Behringer didn't provide a Mackie Control emulation mode as standard for the BCR.
I'm trying to get pentameter feedback for the bcr2000 as well. Is Klinke's utility pc only? On Mac the Bcr2000 has a control surface option (Bcf2000 preset 1) that works fine for assigning control to faders, pan, ect, and its learn mode makes assignment very quick and easy.
But still haven't figured out how to get my vsts assigned to the bcr with feedback. Anyone else have any luck with this?
Thanks for your work on this, nofish - there doesn't seem to be much love for getting the BCR2000 working with Reaper, so I appreciate your efforts.
But I'm in frustration mode right now, and I don't know where to start. From learning how the BCR2000 works out-of-the-box, to then using Klinke's plugin which wasn't even made for the BCR, to your solution, I'm absolutely lost as to how all this fits together. Yes, I've read the other threads on the subject, and it's all a blur, and most of it references the BCF.
My question at the moment is:
I've finally got your solution working for using it as a control surface. And that's on Preset 2.
Now, I've cleared Preset 3 and I want to use that to control a VSTi synth (a Superwave P8 preset I've imported with BC Manager, but it could be anything). But it only works if I've removed Klinke's plugin and reenabled Enable+Control on the BCR2000 device.
Above in this thread, the FX Plugin interface was mentioned, and I've read the description in Klinke's manual. Is this a workaround for no longer being able to control VSTs directly in Reaper? (Plus, I've tried using the ALT+Plugins with ReaEQ focused, for instance, and that didn't even load the map.)
I'm so confused. I assume there's something fundamental I'm missing here. All I want to do is control Reaper with one preset, and VSTs with some others.
I've finally got your solution working for using it as a control surface. And that's on Preset 2.
Now, I've cleared Preset 3 and I want to use that to control a VSTi synth (a Superwave P8 preset I've imported with BC Manager, but it could be anything). But it only works if I've removed Klinke's plugin and reenabled Enable+Control on the BCR2000 device.
From what I know, you're right. It's either using it in control surface mode with Klinke's plugin or the Enable+Control way.
For me, it depends, I use it sometimes the first way, sometimes the second (if I need more controllers to map and my main task is controlling VSTs).
However I vaguely remember that someone here on the forum with a BCF got it working for both modes at once, with the help of a virtual MIDI loopback (eg MIDIYoke), iirc.
I've never tried this method myself as I'm fine using one mode at once.
You'd have to search the BCF threads for this.
Quote:
Above in this thread, the FX Plugin interface was mentioned, and I've read the description in Klinke's manual. Is this a workaround for no longer being able to control VSTs directly in Reaper?
Well, in principle you're right. But I wouldn't call it workaround.
It's just the method controlling plugins when you use the BCR in control surface mode which Klinke implemented for his Mackie controll originally.
Quote:
(Plus, I've tried using the ALT+Plugins with ReaEQ focused, for instance, and that didn't even load the map.)
I'll do a screencapture.
Quote:
I'm so confused. I assume there's something fundamental I'm missing here. All I want to do is control Reaper with one preset, and VSTs with some others.
As said above, (from what I know) the options are:
- Use the plugin mode with Klinke's extension (then you'd also use my BCR/Klinke-preset for this)
- Try to get it to run in both modes which I can't help with unfortunately
- Or use the Enable+control way to control Reaper and the plugins (with 'learn'). One drawback with this method is that you don't get parameter feedback back to the BCR which is important to me.
Here's a video using plugin mode with Klinke's extension, hope it helps.
Forgot to mention, there exists a default map for all plugins (also 3rd party ones) meaning you don't have to go to the map-editor first to control them.
However when you want to define your own maps that's done via the map editor.
Here's a video using plugin mode with Klinke's extension, hope it helps.
Forgot to mention, there exists a default map for all plugins (also 3rd party ones) meaning you don't have to go to the map-editor first to control them.
However when you want to define your own maps that's done via the map editor.
1. Can we program BCR2000 encoders as logarithmic controls, rather than linear? Bitstream 3X allows this, and I like their behaviour more compared to BCR2000's default linear setting. For speeding up encoders we can use 96 192 384 768, but did not test it yet, how this feels compared to Bitstream 3X.
2. Can this Klinke's emu help in dealing with sws snapshots? Let us say having access to all sws snapshot features, yes, all, why not? If not, why do I need anything from Mackie for Reaper at all?
3. Which problems does Klinke's plugin solve and why do I have to care about it?
If I _think_ quickly for what I would want to use BCR2000 for normal Reaper tasks, rather than for live performance stories, I would want mainly sws snapshots, automation, loudness and send adjustments. Loudness and send would be too troublesome I can imagine, so let us forget those for now. Then at least snapshots and automation control. Especially both combined together.
__________________
Volume mixing via jogwheeling with mouseovering. Yeah!
Logarithmic bpm via oscii-bot and program change. Thanks Banned! boreg made it, never hanging notes in Reaper again! Thanks boreg! boreg & bang.
The second row of buttons is now used for the quickjump feature (='pads') and also for switching action banks.
The 'global view' button is useful when using folder mode (see Klinke's manual)
Also, the bottom eight encoders can now work as sort of a 'poor man's VU/level meters' (instructions included in the download)
Looks like this: http://s1100.photobucket.com/albums/...evelmeters.mp4
Watched your VU level meters video, BCR2000 offers even better ways of displaying VU meters.
See the token reference and .mode parameter there.
.mode <arg>
Possible values: off, 1dot, 1dot/off, 12dot, 12dot/off, bar, bar/off, spread, pan, qual, cut, damp
Determines the display mode for the LED-Ring of an encoder. Unfortunately the lower 24 encoders support only off, 1dot und 1dot/off.
So why not putting PAN there, and instead VU-meter moving to the top and getting much more beautiful VU-meter movements? Or even better I would put VOL to the bottom, PAN above, then finally your other row with 'Scrub' and 'Master'. Looks much more logical from bottom to top, volume, pan, some other stuff. At the top beautiful VU-meters.
I might try in the next days this Klinke Mackie thing and do what I described above, then post this version here. During my testing I _should_ probably take some notes and write down what I do not like or consider as waste of 'hardware control space', well I mean if there are mapped stuff which are not important enough to occupy the space. All 32 presets can be used, not only one, so why forcing everything into a single preset? Another curious question.
__________________
Volume mixing via jogwheeling with mouseovering. Yeah!
Logarithmic bpm via oscii-bot and program change. Thanks Banned! boreg made it, never hanging notes in Reaper again! Thanks boreg! boreg & bang.
__________________
Volume mixing via jogwheeling with mouseovering. Yeah!
Logarithmic bpm via oscii-bot and program change. Thanks Banned! boreg made it, never hanging notes in Reaper again! Thanks boreg! boreg & bang.
I setup my BCR2000 thanks to the invaluable work of Kinkle and Nofish.
It works as expected.
Now, since the BCR has so many encoders and we are using only half of them (not counting the brilliant "poor man's VU/level meters" that I'm not using) I'm wonder if and how we could put them in use.
I we could use them in plugin-mode, for example, and map them, there will be less needs of switching page/banks.
Or we can use them in pan mode "inside" the channle strip to control the send level (and switchng to the Send mode only for more in depth settings)
And so on.
Do you think is it possible?
Is it just a matter of setting on the BCR the appropriate CC? Or does it involve writing a whole different control surface plugin?
You're right, if we leave out the "poor man's VU/level meters" we have left 16 unused encoders (minus the scrub and the master). I also thought how can be made use of these from time to time.
I haven't come up with anything useful yet though.
My thoughts so far were that we're ("forced to") emulating the MCU with its 8 faders and 8 encoders so that's what we can only use also.
In other words, I tend to think we'd need a whole different control surface plugin for this.
But maybe I'm all wrong and if you (or anyone else) comes up with useful ideas how we could incooperate the unused encoders I'm all interested and would do an update of my MCU preset immediately.
I referred to this chart btw. for doing the BCR MCU preset, maybe it helps for getting ideas.
Hi,
My thoughts so far were that we're ("forced to") emulating the MCU with its 8 faders and 8 encoders so that's what we can only use also.
In other words, I tend to think we'd need a whole different control surface plugin for this.
Yes, this is my "fear" too :-/
If I understand correctly how the whole "control surface" thing works, when we set the BCR as Control Surface all the MIDI from the BCR goes to the Klinkle plugin, where the MIDI CC and notes are mapped to "do something in Reaper".
To be able to use the non used encoders, Would be necessary that anyting "unrecognized" by the Kikle plugin would be "passed on" to Reaper unchanged. This we we could then map some actions/controls.
But this is just pure elecubration, since I haven't checked anything deeper.
Maybe if Kinkle could chime in, he could clarify some points ;-)
Anyway, as soon I have some time, I'll do some test and I'll let you know.
Stefano
p.s.
Thanks for the link to the chart. I had it.
Will be my firt guidance for my future the tests
Hi guys, not too sure where to put this but this seemed like the best bet.
Recently got my hands BCR, it's working but I'm looking for the easiest to set it up so I can get feedback from plugins to the BCR itself so it doesnt become a nightmare to work with.
Pretty bewildered as where to start, whether this the Klinke MCU is the easiest way to achieve this or whether this really possible at all. Stayed up most the night reading about this and tbh i still feel like I dont really understand it whatsoever. If anyone has any tips or links to a comprehensive guide I'd be really grateful.
I have remapped my BCR already so I have assigned different CCs to certain encoders, and I know exactly how I want to map them, it's just getting the feedback to the unit from reaper I need to sort.
That's the method described in this thread and this way you get feedback back to the MIDI controller (BCR), also for plugins but the assignments of the encoders is fixed (see post #7).
Thanks Nofish. Became completely overwhelmed with OSC, BC Manager, OSCii-bot, puredata and everything else. It's really useful to know where we are up to with regards to with this. So there is either ultimate flexibility without feedback or feedback but you loose the ability to define your own parameters.
Do you know whether the ability to do both will be ever on the cards? It seems like such a straight forward thing but I fully appreciate this is never the way in works in the real life, that's why I'm a musician instead of a programmer.
Thanks again for taking time to answer my questions, much obliged.
Since you mention it, OSC(ii-bot), Puredata is another way to get MIDI feedback going, but I've never looked into it.
(check forum user 'Banned', he did something like this)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Famousbyfive
So there is either ultimate flexibility without feedback or feedback but you loose the ability to define your own parameters.
Well what plugin parameters concerns we are able to define the parameters we want because with Klinke's plugin comes a handy mapping editor so it actually is quite flexible.
You're right though what the mapping of the BCR encoders concerns, this is fixed with this method.
Quote:
Do you know whether the ability to do both will be ever on the cards? It seems like such a straight forward thing but I fully appreciate this is never the way in works in the real life, that's why I'm a musician instead of a programmer.
setup-guide to use Behringer BCR2000 as Mackie emu with Klinke's plugin
Linear Mode
