Grouped Item misbehaviour

[Tallisman]

This may be a bug.

if you have two items that are the same length, but that are on different tracks and you group them, then they will re-size together.

if you have 2 items that are the same size, and you drag one onto the other so that they show overlapped in lanes (the whole items in this case) and group them, they no longer re-size together.

If you have another same-sized item on another track that is part of the group and you re-size that item, then all items (including the 2 on the single track) re-size together as expected.

if you re-size by grabbing the edge of one of the items in the lane, then that one, and the item on the track by itself re-size together, leaving the second item in the lane behind.

http://stash.reaper.fm/oldsb/32776/group%20size.png

many greetings
T.

[Tallisman]

does this affect/bother anyone else, or am I alone with this?
:)

[aldi]

yepp, bothers me too, but as i was nitpicking too much for "cut under mouse" and some color missbehavior and complications i haven't posted it ;)

[simplecarnival]

if you have 2 items that are the same size, and you drag one onto the other so that they show overlapped in lanes (the whole items in this case) and group them, they no longer re-size together.

Hmmm... That doesn't sound right. I don't quite understand why Reaper lets you do this, but what is the practical application for dragging one region totally on top of another one if it's not to replace one region with another?

I'm not sure I understand the rest of your post. I do agree with what you said in another thread (and I think you're describing it in your last paragraph) that it's odd that if you drag one edge of a region in a group and it's not lined up with another region in the same group, the other regions don't move with it.

[Tallisman]

Hmmm... That doesn't sound right. I don't quite understand why Reaper lets you do this, but what is the practical application for dragging one region totally on top of another one if it's not to replace one region with another?

I'm not sure I understand the rest of your post. I do agree with what you said in another thread (and I think you're describing it in your last paragraph) that it's odd that if you drag one edge of a region in a group and it's not lined up with another region in the same group, the other regions don't move with it.

I'll try to explain this using images as it will probably be easier. First, though, this comes in very handy when using Multi-out VSTis and when you render to stems to conserve CPU, or to circumvent the midi loop glitch.

In the first image here, you will see that I have a folder/group track for Stylus RMX gr RMX1. I had rendered that to a stem and thus the audio items on that track.
The Next track is the VSTi Container. It holds the Plugin and routes its audio to the midi/audio tracks below it.
The next 3 tracks are midi/audio tracks. They hold the midi items that drive the VSTi and serve as audio returns from the plugin:

http://stash.reaper.fm/oldsb/32915/grouping.png


In this next image i have done several things. I enabled show overlapping items in lanes (because I cannot render a stem to a new take), as the show takes in lanes does not apply to this (unfortunately). Next I selected the 3 midi/audio tracks and the vsti container track and invoked my (Bvosss') freeze macro. Finally I trimmed heads. I deleted the item from the VSTi container track as It is not needed, but selecting it offlines the VSTI, conserving the CPU and Ram:

http://stash.reaper.fm/oldsb/32911/grouping%201.png


Now in this third image I select the newly rendered stem and the midi that drove it and group them. The Idea here is that if i split them, Drag copies, resize them, i am editing both the audio and the midi. So if I bring the VSTi back on line later, I can re-render it and have less midi tweaking to do before hand. Also, another benefit to this is that as I continue to add to the project, and as the mix builds, I retain control over the mix-elements of the VSTi - I can boost the high-hats, eq the kick, etc. as I am not dealing with a static stem of the instrument as summed in a stereo submix stem.

The problem is also illustrated in this image. Note that on the third midi/audio track 6 Scratchy perc I have re-sized the bottom (midi element) of the track's grouped items. But Alas! the corresponding audio stem is not moving; not resizing. This behaviour occurs regardless of which end of the item is dragged:

http://stash.reaper.fm/oldsb/32912/grouping%202.png


Now the fourth image illustrates a point from my first post If you have another same-sized item on another track that is part of the group and you re-size that item, then all items (including the 2 on the single track) re-size together as expected.Note that the items in track 4 are grouped together, and the items in track 5 are grouped together, but this is not 1 large group, it is 2 groups selected together. (the same behaviour occurs, though, even if it is on big group). With these 2 groups selected, I re-sized the bottom item. The 2 items directly above it re-sized correctly and as desired, but the top one decided to rogue out on me - as you can see it did not resize.

http://stash.reaper.fm/oldsb/32913/grouping%203.png


Ideally, I'd love to see a new Reaper feature: Render Selected Items on Selected tracks as New Takes. It is a render, as it would need to process midi data and return the Audio from the plugin (it could also include any FX in the chains). This would enable the midi and Audio to be treated as per the current Lane/Takes faculty, and that would be terrific. I believe that it would accomplish exactly what I am longing for: a Pseudo Multi-Channel VSTi Freeze, that would allow basic midi editing (by editing the audio counterparts) and Mix/Level tweaking even after the VSTi has been offlined to conserve CPU and RAM!

The request to revisit the grouping behaviour was me trying to be patient until the v.2.x version that sees real Freeze implemented. But I tell ya, I would be in no need of real freeze if I could render these items on these selected tracks to stems as new takes!

I hope that this is clear

many Greetings.