Cockos Incorporated Forums

Cockos Incorporated Forums (https://forum.cockos.com/index.php)
-   REAPER General Discussion Forum (https://forum.cockos.com/forumdisplay.php?f=19)
-   -   Revolver tracks! (https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=121131)

James HE 04-07-2013 01:10 PM

Revolver tracks!
 
Last time I checked out The S&M resources window, I missed that you could right click on the icons and set a Relative path to the Project path.

This means we can save templates per project. This gives us Revolver like tracks, which is a really cool feature in Samplitude Pro.

I just tested this out, and I am able to swap back and forth between A track with Addictive drums, and a track that is a 16 channel audio render of the plug-in. (both have the same routing) and or also another 16 channel render of a different take.

Amazing! Kudos to S&M!

(note to self - start doing your 16ch. renders directly to FLAC.. lol)

** oh heck, I just checked and FLAC can only to 8 channels. derf.

James HE 04-07-2013 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by danfuerth (Post 1156512)
LOL is this a joke?

Look at how samplitude does this and quit keep reinventing the wheel!!

If you are going to have a feature from other daw's copy it, improve it and impliment it properly.

The S&M extension absolutely kills the way REvolver tracks work in Samp.

All you can do in Samp is to revolve objects / takes/ and edits.

In REAPER you can revolve Track effects, INPUT Effects, envelopes, Routing, and media items.

EvilDragon 04-07-2013 02:15 PM

QED'd. :D

semiquaver 04-07-2013 02:18 PM

Which SWS actions are you using?

James HE 04-07-2013 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by semiquaver (Post 1156537)
Which SWS actions are you using?

Just search for open/close S$M resources window.

From the window you can manage Track Templates, Media Files, project templates, themes, FX Chains, and images.

looks like in the Media Files section, you can preview media through a track (and it's effects) haven't really tested it out yet.

hopi 04-07-2013 02:27 PM

Ok then James... plz give us the whole picture and tell more about how you are using it. Thanks.

Jeffos 04-07-2013 03:57 PM

OT: Following some reports, I moved the trollish stuff to http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=121067.
Please, PLEASE, do not feed.


On topic: ha ha! Thanks for the kind words, James :)
It has not been made with that in mind at all, but yes, as very far as I understand, "revolver tracks" is one of the things the S&M Resources can do. Here, for the track template part, we also intensively use it for comping too (comping preserving splits, etc..).

Lawrence 04-07-2013 04:06 PM

I've never personally used Revolver Tracks but aren't they just Samp's version of "Playlists"?

I mean, that's a pretty "snappy" name tbh, but I have no clue what they actually do.

James HE 04-07-2013 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeffos (Post 1156586)
OT: Following some reports, I moved the trollish stuff to http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=121067.
Please, PLEASE, do not feed.


On topic: ha ha! Thanks for the kind words, James :)
It has not been made with that in mind at all, but yes, as very far as I understand, "revolver tracks" is one of the things the S&M Resources can do. Here, for the track template part, we also intensively use it for comping too (comping preserving splits, etc..).


yes! you can have different splits - also you can have different slip edits to your comps.

One good use is to render a VSTi. THen tweak with insert FX. If you decide you need to change the render (a different patch or what ever) you can save the FX of the track, call up the original Vsti, change the patch, render, then apply the template for the previous FX if you want. All within the same track without interrupting sends or envelopes.

beatbybit 04-07-2013 04:16 PM

James, isnt this easier w/ PiP?
not sure, just asking.

James HE 04-07-2013 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by beatbybit (Post 1156604)
James, isnt this easier w/ PiP?
not sure, just asking.

I don't have PiP enabled. OK great, another REAPER rabbit hole for me to fall down in. THanks for remining me. :(

:D

I can see PiPs as an easily accessible container for Track templates, media, etc, to make changes seamless in the workflow, while keeping the track count minimal.

(I enabled Pip. I really can't run it in big projects. Old Dual Core Pentium and 2gb RAM here, so Pip just brings down the house. This is exactly why the SWS resources window is so helpful for me.)

mustgroove 04-07-2013 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by James HE (Post 1156595)
yes! you can have different splits - also you can have different slip edits to your comps.

One good use is to render a VSTi. THen tweak with insert FX. If you decide you need to change the render (a different patch or what ever) you can save the FX of the track, call up the original Vsti, change the patch, render, then apply the template for the previous FX if you want. All within the same track without interrupting sends or envelopes.

Whoa, I have been looking for ways to do these two exact things. Any chance you might be able to post some pointers on how to pull these off? Or a licecap even...

Sam C 04-07-2013 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lawrence (Post 1156593)
I've never personally used Revolver Tracks but aren't they just Samp's version of "Playlists"?

I mean, that's a pretty "snappy" name tbh, but I have no clue what they actually do.

Yes, same thing as PT Playlist.

mustgroove 04-07-2013 06:29 PM

Just tried the SWS Resources window for comps and it's an awesome system for sure, but for some reason the only action that's working for me is "Import Tracks From Track Template"... all the other options don't work no matter how I try... Reaper 4.33pre27, SWS 2.3.0.14

Spacemen Tree 04-07-2013 08:10 PM

Another curious passer by :D

EDIT: I mean me.

keyman_sam 04-07-2013 11:39 PM

WHAT the heck are you guys talking about?

Can someone please explain whats going on? I checked out resources. How does it give revolver tracks?

I thought revolver tracks show frequency content on the item. How does this accomplish that?

heda 04-07-2013 11:46 PM

I need a bit more explanation about this Revolver tracks thing.

James HE 04-08-2013 12:29 AM

my first licecap ever.. lol. I will improve. :)

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/104346507/rev%20templates.gif

James HE 04-08-2013 12:47 AM

Q: how can I make the .gif not autoplay?


Notice the Dbl-click to: dropdown box. There are several options there. You can apply part of the template. i.e you can paste just the items, or apply just the track template, or both, or you can even add it as a new track (import)

There is even a filter box, wow.

EricM 04-08-2013 12:59 AM

t
Quote:

Originally Posted by James HE (Post 1156778)
Q: how can I make the .gif not autoplay?

Not possible. Some upload sites give you the option
to include a thumbnail with a link, which is preferred
for large images/animations.

I recommend imgur.com ;)

Nice stuff btw, thanks for the gif. Didn't know about
this part of SWS yet :)

e

keyman_sam 04-08-2013 01:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by James HE (Post 1156773)
my first licecap ever.. lol. I will improve. :)

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/104346507/rev%20templates.gif

And thus I learned something new today.

Thank you, sir.

heda 04-08-2013 01:42 AM

this is very nice James HE
only a small consideration...
if you create a new project... it still has the templates of the previous project and you need to reconfigure the path again to be to the new project path.

is there any way to save this list per project? Then it would be useful.
edit: ok.. so it only takes two clicks to set the read folder to the project again when opening a new project.

Stu 04-08-2013 04:19 AM

Thanks for this James, I have already been using S&M resources as a tool to apply templates to existing tracks but I never thought of using it quite like this. It is certainly a powerful tool, funny how there is often talk around here about wanting features from other DAWs only to find out we had the functionality already!

semiquaver 04-08-2013 05:43 AM

thanks for the tip! yes I will be using this literally ALL the time....

hopi 04-08-2013 08:16 AM

James... you can't make the LICECap gif not auto play and repeat, but you could but something in it that clearly defines the end before it starts again.

you can do that with a text note... or you can even keep something like a notepad page with big text saying, The END, handy and just drag it into the LICECap window...

James HE 04-08-2013 09:25 AM

This makes project organization a snap. To archive old takes or scratch ideas, just make a track template for them and save them in the project directory.

There is a slight snag though. You will have to remember to manually copy the track templates folder for backup when using Save as into a different directory. The Templates directory will still point to the old project path, and if it's not there... well

For that reason alone, I think an FR is in order to make this native, at least for track templates -

You would set the path in Project settings (perhaps in a new tab - or under Media?) And A "Track Templates" section would need to be added to the Project bay. And a check box in the save as dialog to also save the Track Templates Folder, which would be greyed out if saving to the new directory.

This would be so super flexable, a hundred times better than PT playlists or Samps' Revolver tracks.

jnif 04-08-2013 10:50 AM

You can also use Playlist scripts in Reaper to get similar workflow.
See this thread:
http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=100461
There are also some example videos included in that thread.
The latest version (v36) of the Playlist scripts package is here:
http://forum.cockos.com/showpost.php...&postcount=268

Some advantages of Playlist scripts compared to S&M Resources:
- All edits are automatically saved. No need to click save button. No risk to lose any edits when switching to different comp.
- Better handling of multi-track comps.
- You can (optionally) see all comps at the same time.
- You can filter the visibility of comps based on time selection.
- You can audition alternative playlists/comps without changing the current active (main) playlist.
- You can clearly see which tracks have multiple comps. You immediately see which track each alternative comp belongs to. In S&M Resources you need to rely on template naming only.
- Everything is saved to normal project file. You (or other project members) don't need to install any extensions to get access to playlists/comps. Actually track templates saved by S&M Resources are also normal Reaper files, so I guess you could also import those to any project without installing S&M extension. But manually linking those template files to tracks in a project is still a bit awkward.


jnif

fwd0120 04-08-2013 11:06 AM

Awww man!
 
I came here expecting some stems from the Beatles album....

I still learned good stuff here though! Thanks OP!

heda 04-08-2013 12:01 PM

jnif
I am going to check these playlist scripts. Still catching up with all the discoveries in Reaper and this wonderful forum. thanks :)

Jeffos 04-08-2013 01:17 PM

James, thanks for explaining things so well.
I detailed the same thing in the past but, gien the feedback here, I miserably failed, apparently :) (I am bad at documenting things: my average English skills do not help but I also tend to confuse people with tiny details so that they often do not get the big picture...) => Beware! I will probably steal everything you said for documentation purpouse some day!
Quote:

Originally Posted by James HE (Post 1156969)
There is a slight snag though. You will have to remember to manually copy the track templates folder for backup when using Save as into a different directory. The Templates directory will still point to the old project path, and if it's not there... well

Thanks for entering the FR 560 in the SWS tracker: I'll post the progress there (if any ;))
I think it is doable.. Well, we can tie some files to user projects for sure, but I have to double-check it works for other file types than media files.
What I would propose then is a new option like "Tie to project X.RPP" for bookmarks (bookmark = when you click the tiny "+" button. Bookmarks have their own options, paths, etc..)

Quote:

Originally Posted by jnif (Post 1157026)
You can also use Playlist scripts in Reaper to get similar workflow.
See this thread:
http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=100461
There are also some example videos included in that thread.
The latest version (v36) of the Playlist scripts package is here:
http://forum.cockos.com/showpost.php...&postcount=268

Some advantages of Playlist scripts compared to S&M Resources:
- All edits are automatically saved. No need to click save button. No risk to lose any edits when switching to different comp.
- Better handling of multi-track comps.
- You can (optionally) see all comps at the same time.
- You can filter the visibility of comps based on time selection.
- You can audition alternative playlists/comps without changing the current active (main) playlist.
- You can clearly see which tracks have multiple comps. You immediately see which track each alternative comp belongs to. In S&M Resources you need to rely on template naming only.
- Everything is saved to normal project file. You (or other project members) don't need to install any extensions to get access to playlists/comps. Actually track templates saved by S&M Resources are also normal Reaper files, so I guess you could also import those to any project without installing S&M extension. But manually linking those template files to tracks in a project is still a bit awkward.

jnif,

This reminds me a post of yours in that thread which I really disliked, to say the least.
I did not replied to you at that time because it was some nice stuff, very good use of ReaScript and I did not wanted to discourage you.

This time I will reply though, I checked this bunch of scripts.
I won't discuss all points you mentionned here -which I could do- but just mention one "advantage" too.
My turn: the S&M Resources won't corrupt user projects, if you see what I mean.

Also, I take this opportunity to tell you something because there is a pattern I often see in your posts.
Please, take one step back before using words like "akward", etc.. For ex., when you compare a slow-gaz-factory-with-painful-install and a 1 click/dbl-click solution which works out of the box :) Thanks.

mustgroove 04-08-2013 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mustgroove (Post 1156661)
Just tried the SWS Resources window for comps and it's an awesome system for sure, but for some reason the only action that's working for me is "Import Tracks From Track Template"... all the other options don't work no matter how I try... Reaper 4.33pre27, SWS 2.3.0.14

Still not working with SWS 2.3.0.15 & 4.33pre28... Licecap:

https://dl.dropbox.com/u/7988988/s%2...ionsbroken.gif

jnif 04-08-2013 10:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeffos (Post 1157113)
jnif,

This reminds me a post of yours in that thread which I really disliked, to say the least.
I did not replied to you at that time because it was some nice stuff, very good use of ReaScript and I did not wanted to discourage you.

This time I will reply though, I checked this bunch of scripts.
I won't discuss all points you mentionned here -which I could do- but just mention one "advantage" too.
My turn: the S&M Resources won't corrupt user projects, if you see what I mean.

Also, I take this opportunity to tell you something because there is a pattern I often see in your posts.
Please, take one step back before using words like "akward", etc.. For ex., when you compare a slow-gaz-factory-with-painful-install and a 1 click/dbl-click solution which works out of the box :) Thanks.

Sorry, my post turned out to be a bit arrogant.
It was not meant to be like that.
My point is that Playlists are different than track templates in S&M Resources. My post was a reply to this:
Quote:

Originally Posted by James HE (Post 1156969)
, a hundred times better than PT playlists or Samps' Revolver tracks.

I tried to represent another point of view. A view that shows how Playlists, overall, are quite different compared to S&M Resources.
It was not meant to be a competition.
S&M Resources is very nice, I like it a lot.
And yes, there are clear advantages in S&M resources compared to Playlist scripts:
- S&M Resources is very easy to install.
- S&M Resources is fast. Implemented in fast C++, not in slow Python script.
- S&M Resources has a nice GUI.
- S&M Resources does not use any hackish manipulation of tracks/items like Playlist scripts does.
- S&M Resources is more reliable. There is a high risk of messing up the project when Playlist scripts are used. Those scripts should be considered as a proof of concepts and an experimental tool rather than a production quality feature.
- S&M Resources is overall much better for managing snapshots of tracks and FX chains, etc. Much more versatile and configurable in its own area of application.

Still you really can't mimic Playlist workflow in S&M Resources. They are very different. The main differences are related to
- Visual representation of alternative tracks/takes/comps.
- Auditioning of alternative tracks/takes/comps.
- Combining parts of tracks to other tracks, aka comping.

jnif

Jeffos 04-08-2013 11:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jnif (Post 1157338)
It was not meant to be a competition.

That was point too :) No prob jnif.. Yeah, it is not a "PT Playlist clone" for sure, I was even not aware of that when I made the Resources tool. I have one programming tip for you but let's do that in private..
Quote:

Originally Posted by mustgroove (Post 1157294)
Still not working with SWS 2.3.0.15 & 4.33pre28...

hey mustgroove, right-click the "auto-save" button for options and make sure the option "Include track items in template" is ticked (and "Include envs in template" if you need those too). Also, you do not need to save track templates by hand like in your anim (setting a path, name, etc..) , just click that auto-save button!

heda 04-08-2013 11:54 PM

I can't use this Resources templates system for this.
First of all.. I don't like each time you open a new project you have to clear all slots, set again the templates path to the project path, and autofill it again..

Also I can't use it, because I use some fixed global templates that I assign to some buttons in toolbar, Action: import track from slot 01 etc... to quickly add tracks that I use often.

Jeffos 04-08-2013 11:58 PM

heda, that is what bookmarks are made for: when you work on a song, make a bookmark for it (tiny button "+"), so that you never touch to the master bookmark "Track template" (so that your slot actions are never messed up)

heda 04-09-2013 12:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeffos (Post 1157360)
heda, that is what bookmarks are made for: when you work on a song, make a bookmark for it (tiny button "+"), so that you never touch to the master bookmark "Track template" (so that your slot actions are never messed up)

Yes I created a separated bookmark called Project Templates.
For some reason my toolbar actions still add tracks from the slots of Project Templates instead of the Templates bookmark.

What about automatic autofilling this Project Templates bookmark each time I open a new project?

mustgroove 04-09-2013 12:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeffos (Post 1157355)
hey mustgroove, right-click the "auto-save" button for options and make sure the option "Include track items in template" is ticked (and "Include envs in template" if you need those too). Also, you do not need to save track templates by hand like in your anim (setting a path, name, etc..) , just click that auto-save button!

Yeah it's cut off in that licecap, but the "include track items in template" and "include envelopes in template" options are both ticked in that example...

I'll see if I can get it working with the autosave button, but the way I was trying to do it in the licecap should also work shouldn't it?

mustgroove 04-09-2013 02:19 AM

Using the auto save button within the S&M resources menu definitely works, which is good enough for me I guess!! Glad to finally have access to this great feature!

James HE 04-09-2013 05:58 AM

My next adventure with this is quite interesting. Testing out using project tabs, and syncing the transports. And using the background project for access in changing the comps, etc.

(this seems lighter on the cpu than Pip)

You could have your various comps in the other tab(s), and move back and forth to edit them. And of course they would share the same path for the templates, so moving things back and forth is really easy.

Also since there are some options to open associated tabs, and save all projects, this can be helpful in saving everything. I've never used this, so have to learn how to do that.

Jeffos 04-09-2013 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by heda (Post 1157361)
Yes I created a separated bookmark called Project Templates.
For some reason my toolbar actions still add tracks from the slots of Project Templates instead of the Templates bookmark.

hummm.. all is ok here..
you have probably tied slot actions to this bookmark then, i.e. this option in the context menu:

https://stash.reaper.fm/16127/TieSlotActions.jpg

in your case, make sure this option is ticked for the master/default bookmark "Track Template"

Quote:

Originally Posted by mustgroove (Post 1157371)
I'll see if I can get it working with the autosave button, but the way I was trying to do it in the licecap should also work shouldn't it?

glad you got it working with the auto-save button!
about your Q: yes, this way should work too (and it will in the next SWS version ;) little issue on OSX, thanks for the report!)


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 11:42 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.