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MIDI learn/assign: using internal (e.g. played) MIDI CC events Issue Tools
issueid=1000 08-19-2009 02:31 PM
Mortal
MIDI learn/assign: using internal (e.g. played) MIDI CC events
MIDI learn/assign: using internal (e.g. played) MIDI CC events

Today, FX param learn & automation features are only possible with MIDI hardware inputs(*)(**).
It would be great if we could learn/assign MIDI CC events generated in reaper. The idea is to be able to use recorded-then-played MIDI items OR received (i.e. track routing) OR generated (e.g. JS effects) CC events to control FX params [edit] or to trigger actions.

Use case examples:
- MIDI automation items: for ex. FX params driven at "play time" through recorded midi items (standard midi items carrying CC data, it's different from a "written automation")
- multiple FX control through standard MIDI track routing
- complex FX control through JS effects (generating the CC events)
- triggering actions from "armed" controllers or from JS effects
- etc..

Optionnal, of course.

(*) without midi fake port
(**) possible with some VSTis, though. But this FR is for ANY fx + action triggering

Related threads:
my initial FR (post here for discussions):
http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=40456

in this thread, an interesting schwa's feedback about reaper's learn/assign/automation design:
http://forum.cockos.com/showpost.php...1&postcount=18

And:
http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=44817
http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?p=393475

WORKAROUND: a VST Extension does the job, it's available here (win x86 & x64)
Issue Details
Issue Type Feature Request
Project Deprecated REAPER issue tracker
Category MIDI recording and playback
Status Suggested
Priority 5 - Medium
Suggested Version 3.102
Implemented Version (none)
Users who would use this feature 59
Users who would not use this feature 0
Assigned Users (none)
Tags (none)

08-19-2009 03:40 PM
Human being with feelings
 
maybe i don't understand something,
but isn't this related to that ?
Reply
08-21-2009 05:02 PM
Human being with feelings
 
i think it has something in common if i got the op right, however, the main advantage is what i posted in an request, too:
it`s the ability to not only be able to link a cc to any parameter, but, if you conventionally record that cc as midi and play it back, that via playback that parameter is controlled too ... one of the biggest dissapointments in reaper, once i found out that this is not working ...
i.e. you have a vsti loaded, and you bind the modwheel (cc1) to the cutoff. now you can control the cutoff via the modwheel (cc1), but if you record that movement as conventional midi and play it back, the cutoff doesn`t respond ... see, i for example hate trackbased automations, i like the way you can do it via midi, as you actually have an item which contains the cc-data, you can move it around on every track, remap the cc to another cc or parameter, being able to control a different parameter on a different track/vst/i with the exact same cc curve ... no hassle with trackbound automation and its handling (that read/latch/write bull) ... in logic this is called hyperdraw, and it is availlable on _any_ track for _any_ parameter, so you could also use midi automation for the level of an audiotrack (cc7 in this case, but as reaper lets you freely assign the parameter ...). i`d like to see reaper being enhanced so that you could actually control _everything_ via midi cc`s on playback, too ...
in logic there`s 2 steps to take:
on the respective track select "midi" as automation from a dropdown, press record (just as if you record midi, which infact you are doing), and move the parameter on the vsti = voila, you`ve automated that parameter via midi. however this has some serious flaws in logic, as there are only 128 cc`s availlable in general, but as in reaper the parameters can be mapped as opposed to logic, you` d just map the respective cc to that parameter, so the other`s are still free ...

i think that is the difference he means ... the freedom to use midi for whatever you want ...
Reply
08-26-2009 10:26 PM
Human being with feelings
 
I agree 100 % with you. It is my main problem actually trying to useMIDI items as automation items.
I hope that this modification will occur soon...
Reply
09-19-2009 03:41 PM
Human being with feelings
 
I wrote a JS MIDI effect that lets you assign an automation event to a slider and it can send MIDI CC, MIDI after touch/channel pressure, or MIDI Pitch Bend to every FX following in the chain.

Just drop it into a JS folder such as C:\Program Files\REAPER\Effects\MIDI and use it. Works great for me to convert Automation to MIDI!

Get the script at the Reaper stash: https://stash.reaper.fm/v/3763/Automation_to_MIDI.zip
Reply
09-20-2009 10:02 AM
Mortal
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by zenmonkey
I wrote a JS MIDI effect <snip>
Thanks zenmonkey but I have to reply here...

Your JS should not be considered as a workaround for this FR, this is even not related to this FR (one random application example of this FR: doing the reverse, drawing an automation from a JS. This is impossible right now, whitout MIDI fake port).
Reply
09-20-2009 11:50 AM
Human being with feelings
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffos
Thanks zenmonkey but I have to reply here...

Your JS should not be considered as a workaround for this FR, this is even not related to this FR (one random application example of this FR: doing the reverse, drawing an automation from a JS. This is impossible right now, whitout MIDI fake port).
Jeffos, I agree completely it's not a fix to the FR. I merely posted here for those who want to do something now. I would like to see this native support in Reaper as well. It's something I miss most from FL Studio.
Reply
09-22-2009 12:15 AM
Human being with feelings
 
at the meantime this FR (and much more) can be done with my Parameter Modulator JS
you can download it via my signature
Reply
09-22-2009 08:06 AM
Mortal
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by whatsup
at the meantime this FR (and much more) can be done with my Parameter Modulator JS
Your JS should not be considered as a workaround for this FR, this is even not related to this FR (one random application example of this FR: triggering reaper actions while playing a midi item, using CCs of that item). There's NO WAY you can workaround this FR with a JS effect (and be sure I know what is a JS effect).

The only possible workaround is to use a fake MIDI port (e.g. MidiYoke, loopBe, etc..). If you don't understand that: you don't understand this FR.

There's a discussion thread available for your ads here: http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=40456. If you want to reply to me, do it there, please.

MODS!! Help! I fear these last unrelated posts (*) will prevent people from voting... and this FR can open many doors...
(*) except nym's one, a good sum-up of this FR
Reply
09-22-2009 09:39 AM
Human being with feelings
 
And from this thread: http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=25245

-----------------------------------------------------------
Meanwhile here's a pic of the features in XT2, for some ideas:

-- the CC80 lane is using CC events sent to the VSTi
-- the CC81 lane is an envelope, converted to CC events and sent to the VSTi
-- the Glide Time lane is an envelope, for a VSTi parameter
-- the second screenshot shows the CC events that actually sent to the VSTi.

[img]http://img132.**************/img132/3832/xt2dsvstcontrol.png[/img]
Reply
10-22-2009 09:23 AM
Human being with feelings
 
i think my comment was accidentally removed from this FR.
i ran into an instance yesterday where an item containing recorded midi cc was placed underneath an item containing recorded audio. i wanted badly to use this cc data to control the lowpass filter effect placed on this track.

the cc was already learned to the lowpass filter cutoff. when the cc is moved from external hardware, the lowpass filter responds. it is a logical step that then-recorded CC would have the same effect when played back.

since ccs are nothing but automation in and of themselves, there dearly needs to be less of a distinction between the two in reaper. i prefer not to have to "switch modes" into reaper's automation structure when my ccs are already assigned, established, and up until this point, working as expected
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