Old 04-27-2020, 08:16 AM   #1
Eisbein
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Post Korg NanoKontrol2 catch 22

Hi
Hope and trust all is well in these weird times we are in
During the lockdown I had some time to rethink/resetup my workflow and templates and has done a lot of customization that really make me appreciate even more this marvel that is called 'Reaper'

The last thing that I am struggling with (for now at least) is the very recently dusted off Korg NanoKontrol2.

I've downloaded and played with Klinke's and Pierousseau's drivers/plugins and although they have done amazing work, I can't find the answer to my dilemma.

I've also gone through a LOT of online info and forums and it seems that I am not the only one stuck in this particular catch22

In short:
Soft takeover seems to be the thing that causes me not to be able to use the Nanokontrol2 properly as I would like


The longer rambling:
Klinke's amazing driver is setup for use with motorized faders, so the moment you move from one bank to another, all the faders are where the data on the corresponding channels are for that time, so there's no issue (my goodness I now really regret selling my BCF2000 before I knew what I had)

The problem is that on something as simple as the Nanokontrol2 the lack of motorized faders can really wake you up if you catch it at the wrong time


Pierousseau's driver is beautiful in its simplicity, but that also lacks the bank changes, so you are stuck at channels 1 - 8 (or 1 -7 and a master)
What I like about his one though is you can easily assign (or remap) the settings, so it would be easy to do if I can just get the extra 'banks or scenes' changed.

So after my ramblings here are the things that (in my mind) would help:

Fixing it in Reaper:
If there is already something like this it would be cool if someone can point me there, but if not I will be heading off to the 'Feature request' section after I'm done with this essay

Fix1: Add a generic 'soft takeover' setting that you can switch on by default accross all the volume slider actions coming in, regardless of being setup via the control surfaces option in preferences or manually through actions. I think this will be the quickest of the options and will be the easiest from a user point of view as well, as everything in the Klinke driver is set up so well, that this one change will make it perfect for us 'non-motorised slider' folk.


Fix2: Add a Reaper function where you can assign a shortcut in actions so that you can group tracks that you can then 'page' through and assign controls to.
You can assign two buttons for up/down(or keyboard buttons for a finite amount) for these groups, also with an option to be able to set the amount of tracks in a group. (Although starting with a default of 8 would be good enough)

The behavior would then be (if you chose the 'group size' to be 8) that the control surface would control tracks 'selected up to selected+7' and when you hit the 'bank' up/down button it will change the 'selected' to the next or previous 'start track' (1, 9, 17 etc) and then have the faders on the control surface then control that and the next 7 again.

Fix3: Expand the current 'Track: Set volume for selected tracks' action to have 'Track: Set volume for selected+1 track' 'Track: Set volume for selected+2 track' and so forth and then have another button/action where you can then jump/cycle through selected tracks with either a shortcut (where you can hit 'shift+1 to go to track1, shift+2 to go to track 9 and so on)
This will need a bit of a think as I'm not sure what will happen if you end up ctrl-selecting multiple tracks and then start moving sliders around


Fixing it on the device:
Getting a firmware version that you can then use to use 'scenes' (by using the 'track up and down' buttons)
Then I can go into actions and map all of them manually through the banks, also choosing the 'Soft takeover' option

Even having a shortcut on the device that you can use to change the midi output channel that it operates on will give me the option to use midi channels 11 through 16 (as an example) to separate the 'banks' via 'actions'

I honestly don't see this happening at all though

Fixing it between the device and reaper:
Having some software that can 'catch' a midi CC value and then translate it to another one while sending it off would work a charm (especially if this can also catch an input message so that it knows when to switch)
I found something about it on the Korg forums, but man this seems clunky and MidiOx and Midi Yoke seems to not have recent upates

http://www.korgforums.com/forum/phpB...ic.php?t=69126


Fixing it in the Klinke driver:
In my mind there's two things that can be done here (and I realize that the Klinke driver isn't made for non-motorized control surfaces, but hear me out)

If one of two options could be included that'll fix my issue:
1 - have an option for something like 'soft takeover' that can be switched on and off or
2 - let the faders work like the pan knobs. In my testing it looks like the pan knobs are 'relative' (meaning that wherever you start to turn it starts to increase/decrease the value)
I realise this is because of infinite rotary knobs, but still - it will work way better for me in this way

Fixing it in the Pierousseau driver, implementing 'banks' that can be assigned to the 'track up and down' buttons (currently unused) would be all I need, as then I can only map those and then manually add CC control to the tracks via Actions

Hope my essay makes sense

I am looking forward for insight into this, as at the moment if there isn't a way to be able to get this right the NanoKOntrol2 is going straight back onto the shelf

(As a side note, I get that they added specific controls for different DAW's and then because of that took 'scenes' away from the NK1 to the NK2, but geez I really wish they kept it as an option)


Thanks all and be safe

Hope you all get through the pandemic with minimal physical, emotional and economic damage


Greetings from South Africa
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Last edited by Eisbein; 04-27-2020 at 08:27 AM.
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Old 04-27-2020, 02:01 PM   #2
airon
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Would you like to use CSI ?

It has integrated support for the Korg Nanokontrol 2. I just checked to make sure.

It's easy to customize what your surface does this way too.

The thread for the CSI project:
https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=183143

The beta download
https://stash.reaper.fm/v/38349/CSI%20beta.zip

The manual(in Wiki form)
https://github.com/malcolmgroves/reaper_csi/wiki
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Old 04-27-2020, 02:28 PM   #3
Eisbein
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I will definitely give it a checkout

Thanks for the headsup !
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Old 04-27-2020, 04:10 PM   #4
Eisbein
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That has been quite a ride

So after downloading midiox, this CSI plugin, chasing all the documentation and manually setting up mts and zone files I got it to talk to Reaper and move things around

So here's the 2 part dilemma (as far as I can see):
a) You cannot set 'soft takeover' on CSI and
b) it doesn't have 'banks' where you can go past the 1st 8 folders


After lots of fiddling I did get it to cycle through some channels, but in my opinion the Klinke driver does it WAAAAAY easier without me having to go and copy and paste lots of midi codes, but that still didn't help fixing the soft takeover thing

Thanks for the suggestion though
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Old 05-06-2020, 09:00 AM   #5
rmusmeci
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eisbein View Post
That has been quite a ride

So after downloading midiox, this CSI plugin, chasing all the documentation and manually setting up mts and zone files I got it to talk to Reaper and move things around

So here's the 2 part dilemma (as far as I can see):
a) You cannot set 'soft takeover' on CSI and
b) it doesn't have 'banks' where you can go past the 1st 8 folders


After lots of fiddling I did get it to cycle through some channels, but in my opinion the Klinke driver does it WAAAAAY easier without me having to go and copy and paste lots of midi codes, but that still didn't help fixing the soft takeover thing

Thanks for the suggestion though
... but I have nk2 too and no customizazion or midi codes whatsoever.
It works like expected with the nanoKontrol2 mst file out of the box.
But the latch mode is not present, even though I think that is a requirement for Reaper having the latch mode for the controllers.
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Old 05-07-2020, 07:03 AM   #6
Eisbein
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rmusmeci View Post
... but I have nk2 too and no customizazion or midi codes whatsoever.
It works like expected with the nanoKontrol2 mst file out of the box.
But the latch mode is not present, even though I think that is a requirement for Reaper having the latch mode for the controllers.
I only noticed after I went through everything that I could have just used the correct mst file


My bad


I just don't like the Reaper faders making jumps as soon as I 'page' to the next 'bank' and touch a fader

Ah well - it is not the end of the world

In the meantime I decided to use the NK2 in two other ways: Single (active) track fader control and setting expression, volume and vibrato parameters for Midi notes

I set the 1st fader to control volume on the active track in Reaper (with soft takeover on that). I also set the 1st turn knob on the NK to control 'pan' on the active track

Then I set the track forward/back buttons to switch the active channel one forward or back
The 2nd fader and turn knob on the NK2 is set to the master track in Reaper
The transport buttons and the 'marker set/forward to/rewind to buttons are set as per usual.

Then I set the right two faders and knobs to set volume, expression and vibrato for Kontakt instruments and my midi keyboard

So far it mostly healed a bit of my feelings towards the NK2

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Last edited by Eisbein; 05-07-2020 at 07:09 AM.
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