v6.73+dev1227 - December 27 2022

[sockmonkey72]

v6.73+dev1227 - December 27 2022

• * Includes feature branch: selected media item appearance changes
• * Includes feature branch: media item fixed lanes
• + Media item lanes: actions/mouse modifiers to move razor edit areas up/down rotate through fixed lanes
• + Media item lanes: add action/mouse modifier to copy razor edit area contents to first playing lane
• + Media item lanes: fix actions to solo, record into lane under mouse
• + Media item lanes: support naming/renaming fixed lanes
• + Media item lanes: support playing no lanes
• + Razor edit: add action/mouse modifier to set loop points from razor edit area
• + Razor edit: fix adjusting media item length when using timebase beats (position only) [p=2627203]
• + Razor edit: fix some behaviors when pasting razor edit areas to master track [p=2627688]
• + Razor edits: prevent moving razor edit areas to tempo envelope when using mouse modifier to move razor edit area ignoring envelope type [p=2627676]
• + ReaScript: fix extra characters being sent to gfx_getchar() when using AltGr on Windows [p=2627014]
• + Render wildcards: support case conversion for latin-supplemental accented characters [t=274162]
• + Render: update dialog when changing render region selection [t=274119]
• + Routing: display track parent name in routing dialog title
• + Timestretch: add new ReaReaRea mode that uses randomized overlapped windows and project resampling mode [t=266425]
• + Track grouping: prevent grouping razor edits on master track [p=2627694]
• + VST: add compatibility setting to pass channel silence flags to VST3 plug-ins [t=274038]
• # Media item lanes: support actions to solo, record into lane under mouse when mouse is over TCP lane buttons
• # Timestretch: improve ordering of simple windowed menu

This thread is for pre-release features discussion. Use the Feature Requests forum for other requests.

Changelog - Pre-Releases

Generated by X-Raym's REAPER ChangeLog to BBCode

[Vagelis]

Originally Posted by sockmonkey72

v6.73+dev1227 - December 27 2022[*]+ Timestretch: add new ReaReaRea mode that uses randomized overlapped windows and project resampling mode

This is really an awesome stretch mode I was missing and sounds very good! Thanks a lot <3

[ferropop]

Seeing some lane comping stuff starting up!

Devs whatever direction you've laid out for Round 2 of this, lots of support for Razor Edit actions/workflows to be developed along the way.

They can serve such a central (and precise) role in keeping Reaper's comping familiar - but with the added benefits of razors/lanes.

I'm sure you have something clever and thought out - just hope we can chime in a bit too and provide some perspective from active users grinding Reaper for hours a day.

[vitalker]

Good job, Cockos!

[vitalker]

Originally Posted by sockmonkey72

+ Routing: display track parent name in routing dialog title

Isn't it gorgeous?

[dub3000]

oh wow, ReaReaRea with some of the crazier options is *stunning* as a creative tool. thanks so much! brilliant fun.

[vitalker]

Regarding media item lanes:
I remember it was possible to show only one lane. It would be cool to get it back and also showing all playing lanes.

Lane names could be shown not only in tooltips, but also somewhere else. Perhaps those green ribbons as before?

Renaming lanes could work via double click as with tracks/TCP themselves. This way it would be easy to rename current lane, if there are many. Also still not possible to use Shift to activate all lanes between first clicked and last clicked lane button. Same with dragging that could work like mute/solo buttons in TCP.

When there are many lanes and arrows appear, it could be useful to be able to use mouse wheel to scroll through lanes in one lane mode (if there will be any). Actually it is cool to be able to hold Shift and solo previous/next lane. Ctrl button's behavior though (on Windows) is unexpected (or unintuitive, if I may):
In the second part I am also using Shift to change solo state, so I can use Ctrl again.

[Vagelis]

Originally Posted by vitalker

When there are many lanes and arrows appear, it could be useful to be able to use mouse wheel to scroll through lanes in one lane mode (if there will be any). Actually it is cool to be able to hold Shift and solo previous/next lane.

I think Items Lanes should have their own Mouse modifier context with they're special modifiers for comping/scrolling etc, when items exist in lanes.

Also I noticed that the actions from the lane header menu and the buttons don't work when a track is not selected.

https://imgur.com/a/2ZqsNQd

[Coachz]

Originally Posted by ferropop

Seeing some lane comping stuff starting up!

Devs whatever direction you've laid out for Round 2 of this, lots of support for Razor Edit actions/workflows to be developed along the way.

They can serve such a central (and precise) role in keeping Reaper's comping familiar - but with the added benefits of razors/lanes.

I'm sure you have something clever and thought out - just hope we can chime in a bit too and provide some perspective from active users grinding Reaper for hours a day.

If these features bring us to being able to do quick swipe comping I'll be glad to test it !! Just let me know when the parts are in place.

[Justin]

Originally Posted by dub3000

oh wow, ReaReaRea with some of the crazier options is *stunning* as a creative tool. thanks so much! brilliant fun.

Thank lewloiwc, this JSFX is a great demo: https://forum.cockos.com/showpost.ph...9&postcount=21

ReaReaRea is essentially similar fade logic, though we don't resample in it and instead pass that off to whatever resample mode your project is set to (which is also what Rrreeeaaa does for pitch adjustment).

[Embass]

[ferropop]

Originally Posted by dub3000

oh wow, ReaReaRea with some of the crazier options is *stunning* as a creative tool. thanks so much! brilliant fun.

It has completely replaced the "reverse reverb into a section" trick for me, reduced it down to a couple of clicks. Such a creative tool!

[daniellumertz]

after lane five they came muted????

[Phazma]

Originally Posted by sockmonkey72

[*]+ Timestretch: add new ReaReaRea mode that uses randomized overlapped windows and project resampling mode [t=266425]

Exactly the time stretch mode I hope for, thanks soo much!

One small thing I noticed is that it tends to have a small pitch updwards slide at the beginning, most noticable on drum samples and when pitching upwards.

Here an example of what I mean (original and rearearea with default settings at 4x stretch and +12 pitchshift): https://we.tl/t-qRUsYIBq7S (I could provide more examples if needed)

Not sure if that is wanted or not but I hope I could give useful feedback. Very happy with the stretch mode regardless of this small remark

[brtkstn]

Originally Posted by vitalker

Isn't it gorgeous?

Yes, it is. Thank you (Devs and Vitalker) for sorting it out.

[vitalker]

Originally Posted by brtkstn

Yes, it is. Thank you (Devs and Vitalker) for sorting it out.

I'm glad my idea (which I didn't think of at the beginning) made it real.

[alphoc]

Media item lane is a nice improvement, a feature I expected, but stacked lanes inside a vertically zoomed track would be useless. It would be better to open something like a tcp or autmation segment on the left for each lane instead. Other DAWs have a similar structure. Think of multiple tracks as such, a drum recording. I can only imagine how useless it would be.

Still, it's considered a good development.

[Vagelis]

Originally Posted by ferropop

Such a creative tool!

Granular synthesis is my fav for sound design and finally made it in Reaper with a creative form!

It would be great though if we could also automate the size in realtime with a take envelope or another stretch marker mode. It would be so awesome for precise time stretching and stutter/granular effects.

I have made an FR related to this:

https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=229526

That wway we could treat audio items like a granular sampler. Another nice addition would be if we could also sync the window size to tempo beats instead of ms.

[vitalker]

I was thinking about holding arrows, too. For now holding lane arrows with mouse do nothing, but it could enable/activate lanes like with normal left click, just more useful for many lanes.

[AZpercussion]

It seems the new time stretch mode sounds very similar to SoundTouch (High Quality option).
What benefits to use this new mode? Or advantages placed out of default settings?

[vitalker]

Originally Posted by AZpercussion

It seems the new time stretch mode sounds very similar to SoundTouch (High Quality option).
What benefits to use this new mode? Or advantages placed out of default settings?

There is a link to the thread. Maybe you'll find the answers there.

https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=266425

[Vagelis]

Originally Posted by AZpercussion

It seems the new time stretch mode sounds very similar to SoundTouch (High Quality option).
What benefits to use this new mode? Or advantages placed out of default settings?

You have more control over the window size, randomization and 3 window envelope types, which are kind of the base for granular synthesis. To my ears some of the other modes could be based on same principles, but this new mode gives us more control with the window size and it can be used for granular effects. Previously we couldn't get this robotic/granular effect, simple windowed mode was the closest but the quality was not very good. This new mode rocks

If you choose the smallest size it will sounds like noise, but if you add randomization it will start creating some weird effects. You could try also with longer sizes and randomization. Or without randomization, stretch the audio and play with different window sizes.
The window envelope types are useful to bring out the transients. For example if it's a percussive sound with tight transient, i think it's better to use the linear or rectangular window to sound more "clicky". For smoother transients sin would be the choice.

[AZpercussion]

Thanks for explanation, Vagelis!

So, I think, what about more informative naming?
Saying, it could be called "Flexi-Granular".
Because we already have Rreeeeaaa and the next mode, i feel, will be something like RePeeeeaPer
It's fun, but some confusing.

[operator]

Regarding ReaReaRea:

At first thx, it is really great seeing more "creative" stretch algorithms introduced.

My concern: It seems that this algorithm is somehow "unstable/unpredictable" (maybe even in a intended/superior way, who knows [not me] ) --> I let you be the final judge. Let me explain:
[BTW i have tested with 0% ranodmization]

It seems that this algorithm is a "feedback/feedforward" realtime audio processor rather than a items "manipulation" which would be baking the results into the "virtual" item.

--> When i stretch out a Drum Sample (e.g. Rimshot) and try to play it back it seems to matter where the playbackcursor is located --> the Audio which is playing back differs if I have the playcuror before or over the file --> the played back audio isn´t the same. During playback this kind of seems neglectable but what if I would like a certain part out of an audiofile and have it rendered:

This also comes into play when rendering Timeselection (action:"Render selected area of track") and I would only like to render a part out of the item I stretched but not inlcuding a certain beginning portion of the item (but still having the beginning section "affecting/ringing out" in the following (rendered) audio). e.g. not including the drum transient in the timeselection but still gettting its grainy character into the rest of file.

I am not sure if the "baked in" scenario is even possible/desired or worse, but for some (like me) this might be a reason to file a bugreport when audio playback vary on differnt cursor position --> especially if they don´t know the "fineprint" with this algorithm. (so just a "heads-up")

If it is intended, then all is good. Just wanted to let you know about my user-scenario.

[schwa]

Originally Posted by daniellumertz

after lane five they came muted????

I think that is maybe an artifact of some previous state that particular track had. Can you reproduce with a new track?

[operator]

How amazing would it be if we would get a rate(fade time) take-envelope. Or fine control over (free adjustable) milliseconds --> so we could tune it to certain musical notes.

Maybe even add new take-envelope in general which then could be someting like "Take Stretch Evnelope" --> with some algorithms like elastique it could be a take envelope for Formants and in others it could be to get fine-control over the rate (milliseconds) of the window/algorithm.

[Phazma]

Originally Posted by operator

Maybe even add new take-envelope in general which then could be someting like "Take Stretch Evnelope" --> with some algorithms like elastique it could be a take envelope for Formants and in others it could be to get fine-control over the rate (milliseconds) of the window/algorithm.

That sounds like a sick idea! And with preserve pitch disabled it could be like a take playrate/varispeed envelope (tor stuff like tape start/stop fx).

[vitalker]

Originally Posted by Phazma

That sounds like a sick idea! And with preserve pitch disabled it could be like a take playrate/varispeed envelope (tor stuff like tape start/stop fx).

There is an old FR about adding per-take(item) playrate envelopes, nothing new.

[bolgwrad]

Originally Posted by schwa

I think that is maybe an artifact of some previous state that particular track had. Can you reproduce with a new track?

If you create say 6 lanes with items and toggle (ie not) playing the last one, then drag the Lane 6 item up and down (thereby removing the lower lanes then reviving them), the toggled lanes retain their mute state.

[MonkeyBars]

+ Routing: display track parent name in routing dialog title

Underrated big UX improvement. Thanks guize

[vitalker]

Originally Posted by MonkeyBars

Underrated big UX improvement. Thanks guize

You are welcome.

[daniellumertz]

Originally Posted by schwa

I think that is maybe an artifact of some previous state that particular track had. Can you reproduce with a new track?

Ohhh thanks for the answer. No I cant, all good!

[Phazma]

Originally Posted by vitalker

There is an old FR about adding per-take(item) playrate envelopes, nothing new.

I know, I've been pushing it for a long time. But if we add a new take envelope I think it is a great idea to have a multi-function one that satisfies the needs/interests of many users. Take rate automation is a very cool feature but not everyone might use it. Same with stretch window automation or other timestretch parameters. But having 1 take envelope for all of these, depending on what is active, would make all the stretching modes more flexible and prove useful for many different users and sounddesign purposes.

[Vagelis]

Originally Posted by Phazma

I know, I've been pushing it for a long time. But if we add a new take envelope I think it is a great idea to have a multi-function one that satisfies the needs/interests of many users. Take rate automation is a very cool feature but not everyone might use it. Same with stretch window automation or other timestretch parameters. But having 1 take envelope for all of these, depending on what is active, would make all the stretching modes more flexible and prove useful for many different users and sounddesign purposes.

I think these features are equally important for different tasks imo. Take rate and varispeed are already available but with stretch markers and by disabling the preserve pitch option. Grain size automation is not but i hope it will be available in the future too.
The ideal setup for me would be if each time we change a stretch mode to show some additional parameters to automate in the take envelopes menu. So if we choose ReaReaRea to show a grain size take envelope for automation. Regarding another pitch envelope, i would prefer to use the same pitch envelope, but when we disable the option preserve pitch, to become a varispeed envelope that changes pitch and rate.

[Justin]

Originally Posted by operator

Regarding ReaReaRea:

At first thx, it is really great seeing more "creative" stretch algorithms introduced.

My concern: It seems that this algorithm is somehow "unstable/unpredictable" (maybe even in a intended/superior way, who knows [not me] ) --> I let you be the final judge. Let me explain:
[BTW i have tested with 0% ranodmization]

It seems that this algorithm is a "feedback/feedforward" realtime audio processor rather than a items "manipulation" which would be baking the results into the "virtual" item.

--> When i stretch out a Drum Sample (e.g. Rimshot) and try to play it back it seems to matter where the playbackcursor is located --> the Audio which is playing back differs if I have the playcuror before or over the file --> the played back audio isn´t the same. During playback this kind of seems neglectable but what if I would like a certain part out of an audiofile and have it rendered:

This also comes into play when rendering Timeselection (action:"Render selected area of track") and I would only like to render a part out of the item I stretched but not inlcuding a certain beginning portion of the item (but still having the beginning section "affecting/ringing out" in the following (rendered) audio). e.g. not including the drum transient in the timeselection but still gettting its grainy character into the rest of file.

I am not sure if the "baked in" scenario is even possible/desired or worse, but for some (like me) this might be a reason to file a bugreport when audio playback vary on differnt cursor position --> especially if they don´t know the "fineprint" with this algorithm. (so just a "heads-up")

If it is intended, then all is good. Just wanted to let you know about my user-scenario.

Pretty much every timestretch algorithm supported by REAPER will sound different based on where the playback begins, fwiw.

[Justin]

Originally Posted by AZpercussion

It seems the new time stretch mode sounds very similar to SoundTouch (High Quality option).
What benefits to use this new mode? Or advantages placed out of default settings?

Soundtouch analyzes the signal to decide when to fade to new areas... this new mode doesn't. So, there you go.

[ferropop]

Would excitedly encourage you guys to look at Mulab 8 Timestretch while on this subject. I've never been more blown away :

https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=270689

[vitalker]

Originally Posted by ferropop

Would excitedly encourage you guys to look at Mulab 8 Timestretch while on this subject. I've never been more blown away :

https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=270689

Do you mean Cockos should reverse-engineering it? Because I don't see any source there. And looks like it doesn't exist outside MuLab itself.

[BartR]

FIXED MEDIA LANES ergonomy

1. inserting the new empty lanes add it always on top of the list. I find it anti-intuitive.
Is it possible to add the option to add on the bottom of the list?

2. Recording into the specific media lane: intuitively just by selecting the media lane, up there should record. By right-click then record into lane, I find also anti-intuitive. Some solution may be: an aside button to arm that specific lane for recording. It is more immediate (evident and intuitive = useful).

3. Giving a name to a media lane, it's not in evidence anywhere but for a mouse over on the round button. If a name is given, it should be readable constantly as it is for markers/regions.

4. the media lane armed for recording has a small red dot. Wouldn't be better to have the round indicator all red? It's more visible.

5. items on fixed media lanes are dark colored. Even when selected. Is it temporary (just during development?)

6. I do remember in the past was possible to insert some marker inside each item on a media lane. Now not any-longer. Is that function definitely disabled?

[vitalker]

Originally Posted by BartR

FIXED MEDIA LANES ergonomy

1. inserting the new empty lanes add it always on top of the list. I find it anti-intuitive.
Is it possible to add the option to add on the bottom of the list?

3. Giving a name to a media lane, it's not in evidence anywhere but for a mouse over on the round button. If a name is given, it should be readable constantly as it is for markers/regions.

4. the media lane armed for recording has a small red dot. Wouldn't be better to have the round indicator all red? It's more visible.

5. items on fixed media lanes are dark colored. Even when selected. Is it temporary (just during development?)

6. I do remember in the past was possible to insert some marker inside each item on a media lane. Now not any-longer. Is that function definitely disabled?

1. Now you can select the number where lane will appear. If you have 4 lanes, you'll be able to insert a new lane at 1, 2, 3 or 4 position. So would be enough to allow insert lane at n+1 position, but it can be unintuitive, agreed.

3. That's what I said before. We've already had green ribbons in the arrange view, but they were just for numbers.

4. It could be a frame around this lane instead. Or yes, different color for armed lanes.

5. Looks like you didn't activate lanes. Active lanes should be yellow, while inactive are black.

6. You are talking about play markers. Yes, it was removed due to design. Probably will be available again after rethinking.