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Old 09-28-2015, 04:57 AM   #121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by innuendo View Post
Please open the command prompt and enter following:
Code:
wmic qfe list brief /format:htable > "%USERPROFILE%\hotfix.html"
This might take a few minutes or more to run.
Then please upload hotfix.html
Do I type that in exactly as is or do I need to replace "USERPROFILE". Should I get rid of the inverted commas? I've tried doing the above exactly as is and nothing happened.

Also, for when I do get it to work, where will I find the hotfix.html?

Cheers
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Old 09-28-2015, 06:09 AM   #122
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So I'm going to continue working through methodically from where I left off (post #103).... (let me know if you want me to jump ahead to any of the later steps right away)
Yeah, I think we can go on then. Post #103 was just a general plan. Suggested implementation starts in further comments.

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I've always kept Windows Update off. I don't think I've had a single Windows update sine I built the thing in 2008. And just for the record, the PC has been rock solid up until now....
In that case please disregard post #116. That was to dump a list of all your installed updates, but if you are sure there were none recently then no need to bother.

Maybe you can think of some software you installed recently that might have system-wide effect?

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I have the vanilla Windows XP disc which will be *JUST* XP; no service packs. I can try sfc with that? I'll wait for your verdict there and go ahead with it if you say it's worth a try.

I also have a disc which has JUST Service Pack 3 on it but I presume that's no help here.
First option probably won't work but worth a try.
Reg. the second option, I'm not sure what you mean by just service pack 3. If the disc simply contains the installer for the service pack 3 then it won't work. If it contains a Windows installation with the SP3 embedded, then it should work.

In case neither option worked and you still want to attempt fixing SFC, then you should download an image of Windows XP with SP3 embedded. I can look up a link and send you privately if you like.
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Old 09-28-2015, 06:17 AM   #123
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Originally Posted by Max Dread View Post
Do I type that in exactly as is or do I need to replace "USERPROFILE". Should I get rid of the inverted commas? I've tried doing the above exactly as is and nothing happened.

Also, for when I do get it to work, where will I find the hotfix.html?

Cheers
It makes sense nothing would happen if you never installed updates. If it did create hotfix.html then it should be located in c:\Documents and Settings\yourprofilename
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Old 09-28-2015, 06:26 AM   #124
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Also just for control, please check whether there is still a crash in Chrome. AVG removal might have affected this.
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Old 09-28-2015, 06:52 AM   #125
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Let's look closer into the drivers/services.

- Please download the following tool:
https://download.sysinternals.com/files/Autoruns.zip
- Please unzip it and run Autoruns.exe
- Hit Esc to stop it from scanning
- Go to Menu>Options>Scan Options
- UNcheck "Scan only per-user locations" if it is checked
- Check "Verify code signatures"
- Check "Check Virus Total" (if a woodchuck could chuck wood)
- Check "Submit Unknown Images"
- Hit "Rescan"
- It should request your agreement with VirusTotal license
- Wait for it to finish scanning.
- Wait for it to complete submitting hashes and uploading unknown files to VirusTotal
- When it's done, please go to Menu>File>Save and save the data to a file
- Upload that file. You might prefer to send me the link privately since it will contain a lot of information about your software.
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Old 09-28-2015, 07:02 AM   #126
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Another question: does your ninited WinXP disk have integrated SP3? Or what service pack if at all?
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Old 09-28-2015, 10:17 AM   #127
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A quick 5 minute tea break... I've tried running sfc with the Windows Xp disc (no service packs) and it did not work. And to answer one of the later questions, no I don't have an XP disc with SP3. I only have them as two separate discs (XP on it own, SP3 on its own). I also have the nlited disc I made which is XP AND SP3 (so that answers the previous post), but obviously stripped of various functions/elements courtesy of nLite.

This could be completely irrelevant, but I noted in my Command Prompt - when first opened - that is says:

Microsoft Windows XP [Version 5.1.2600]
(C) Copyright 1985-2001 Microsoft Corp.

C:\Documents and Settings\Administrator>

Whereas the Command Prompt in the walkthough bluzkat linked me to says:

C:\Windows\system32

Just thought I'd point that out in case there is any relevance... Excuse my computer ignorance if it isn't (and feel free to laugh!!!).

Back soon...
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Old 09-28-2015, 10:50 AM   #128
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Originally Posted by Max Dread View Post

This could be completely irrelevant,
It is. If you happen to run cmd.exe as in an elevated rights session, it opens in system32 because your local user profile doesn't belong to that session.
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Old 09-28-2015, 10:56 AM   #129
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It is.
Thanks for confirming.... And welcome back....!
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Old 09-28-2015, 11:31 AM   #130
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First make sure in your BIOS that the computer is set to stay OFF if the power supply drops out. If there is a setting to warn you with audio when the computer is overheating, set that to ON.

Also you may need to open up your computer and clear out a bunch of dust if it's overheating.

Lastly, you may just want to take the computer into a repair shop and have them check for viruses/malware as there is a documented malware that causes the system to reboot in XP.
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Old 09-28-2015, 01:48 PM   #131
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does the pc still reboot automatically if you UNCHECK the option "Automatically restart" under Control Panel -> System -> System Properties -> Advanced -> Startup and Recovery - Settings?

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Old 09-28-2015, 04:07 PM   #132
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Originally Posted by bluzkat View Post
It sounds to me like your video card is acting up, the drivers should not just disappear like that. Do you have another video card you can try?
I don't unfortunately... I could look to buy a direct replacement when one comes up maybe? The card I have has passed Furmark successfully, but do you think it could still be problematic? If it is, do you not think the reboots would be more random than only happening when I open specific websites? I'll keep my eyes open for a replacement in any case. I don't suppose it would hurt to have a replacement card in the drawer for future reference anyhow.

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This I had already done a few days ago and again when the drivers disappeared for the second time yesterday. I did it before you posted the above. The DDU version I have is 13.6.4.1. I see the latest version is 15.5.0.0. I'm happy to install the latest version and run it again but I'm guessing the "deed has already been done" from the previous time I ran it.

Here are the logs from when I ran it yesterday... It seems the app makes two logs: one when I first opened it (in normal windows) and one when I opened it for the second time (in safe mode). I'll upload both logs.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5T...ew?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5T...ew?usp=sharing
For the sake of completeness I put the latest version of DDU onto my PC and have just run that in Safe Mode as per instructions in #111. Here are the logs:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5T...ew?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5T...ew?usp=sharing

Quote:
Originally Posted by innuendo View Post
Maybe you can think of some software you installed recently that might have system-wide effect?
There was a utility: Randy Rants SharpKeys. I have uninstalled that recently though just to ensure it was not causing problems. Other than that, nothing.

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Originally Posted by innuendo View Post
First option probably won't work but worth a try.
Reg. the second option, I'm not sure what you mean by just service pack 3. If the disc simply contains the installer for the service pack 3 then it won't work. If it contains a Windows installation with the SP3 embedded, then it should work.

In case neither option worked and you still want to attempt fixing SFC, then you should download an image of Windows XP with SP3 embedded. I can look up a link and send you privately if you like.
You were right - the first option did not work. And yes, I did just mean that "the disc simply contains the installer for the service pack 3". So that's out too.

If you are happy to look it up and send me a link that would be fantastic. I wouldn't mind doing it but wouldn't know where to start.

Quote:
Originally Posted by innuendo View Post
If it did create hotfix.html then it should be located in c:\Documents and Settings\yourprofilename
Yes, this file is there now. It only has three entries though. Here it is, though I doubt it is of any use:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5T...ew?usp=sharing

Quote:
Originally Posted by innuendo View Post
Also just for control, please check whether there is still a crash in Chrome. AVG removal might have affected this.
Yep, still crashing unfortunately.

Quote:
Originally Posted by innuendo View Post
Another question: does your ninited WinXP disk have integrated SP3? Or what service pack if at all?
Yes, I'm pretty sure it does. I wouldn't say I'm 100% because it was so long ago. But I'm thinking so.



Now going though #125...

Cheers!
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Old 09-28-2015, 04:19 PM   #133
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#125 is done (sysinternals.com - Autoruns). I'll PM you the saved logs. Wasn't sure what format it was best to save to, so I did both.

If anyone else reading would like to see them please ask.

Cheers
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Old 09-28-2015, 04:39 PM   #134
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@Nystagmus. Thanks for sharing your thoughts. The PC had a clean out not so long ago. I will give it another one soon, but it's not quite at the top of my list of priorities at the moment. I have been running some stress tests and monitoring temps and all seems to be ok in that department.

Whilst the ideas for diagnostics keep flowing here, I think I'll leave taking it into a shop. Perhaps if I totally run out of ideas.... Or maybe that will just force my hand to move onto Win7 earlier....

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Originally Posted by Nystagmus View Post
First make sure in your BIOS that the computer is set to stay OFF if the power supply drops out.
I'll check that out in the morning. I'm pretty sure there is a setting but cannot remember what it is set to! What would be the advantage of doing that?
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Old 09-28-2015, 04:45 PM   #135
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Originally Posted by SonicAxiom View Post
does the pc still reboot automatically if you UNCHECK the option "Automatically restart" under Control Panel -> System -> System Properties -> Advanced -> Startup and Recovery - Settings?
I've just tried it and it took me to a BSOD. Couldn't get passed the BSOD so had to manually restart the PC. Indicative of anything?

Thanks for the post.
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Old 09-28-2015, 04:49 PM   #136
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A last quick thought before bed.... I do have various services disabled. When I built the machine I had a very keen eye on DuX's long thread about nLite and optimizations for XP, and based my nLited install loosely around that.

Are any service required for sfc? If so, please can someone let me know which ones and I'll check to make sure they are not stopped or disabled.

Again, I'm just stabbing about in the dark here but thought it's worth mentioning these things just in case they are relevant.

Thanks everyone.
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Old 09-29-2015, 03:12 AM   #137
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I've been away from this so late back.. but back in post #51you replied to me..
Quote:
Originally Posted by Max Dread View Post
Hi all
.....
Good ideas which I've now tried. In Safe Mode, the website still crashes the PC and forces a reboot. I have not tried a different user yet. Would you still suggest I do? As for other browsers, I have an old copy of Opera installed and the webpage was fine in that.
So to be clear, the only time you get a reboot is when you open the particular webpage in Internet Explorer but its ok in Opera?

well...I know youve done a load since, but to me it still sounds like a plugin or IE itself. Is it ok if you run IE as described in this link? http://www.mysysadmintips.com/window...ithout-add-ons - if so its a plug in - if not, its IE. Then uninstall IE and reinstall it.

I would still also try adding a new user and check with IE too to see if its a user account problem.

Keys.
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Old 09-29-2015, 03:50 AM   #138
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Hi keys

Thanks for the post. You are partially right I use Chrome, so if you substitute Chrome each time you say Internet Explorer, then you've pretty much got it.

The only other thing I would add is that there are 2 known webpages that cause the crash/reboot. There were possibly others when the problem first started (and before I realised web pages where causes it). Since knowing it is certain webpages, I have only found two. And I have done a reasonable amount of surfing.

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Originally Posted by keys View Post
...if not, its IE. Then uninstall IE and reinstall it...
I seem to remember when I looked years ago that it is not possible to uninstall IE from XP. If it is possible, then I'll happily get rid of it. The version on here is antique!

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Originally Posted by keys View Post
I would still also try adding a new user and check with IE too to see if its a user account problem.
OK, I can try this when time permits. I'm not all that sure how to do it, but I reckon I can find out easily enough with a couple of google searches. I'll report back later when I've done it.

Cheers
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Old 09-29-2015, 04:09 AM   #139
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OK, so its a problem only in Chrome. Ignore what I said about IE - my misunderstanding.

You have reset Chrome (settings...advanced...reset to defaults) and tried that havent you?
If so, make sure you can still access the web with say Opera, then uninstall Chrome, reboot and re-install chrome.

keys.

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Old 09-29-2015, 04:40 AM   #140
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You have reset Chrome (settings...advanced...reset to defaults) and tried that havent you?
No. What I did was fully uninstall/re-install Chrome. And the problem still happened. That being said, I think innuendo has a more thorough uninstallation of Chrome in store. That was mentioned several posts ago.

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Originally Posted by keys View Post
If so, make sure you can still access the web with say Opera, then uninstall Chrome, reboot and re-install chrome.
So as above' I've already tried an uninstall/re-install. I'll await instructions on how to thoroughly uninstall it if that is still necessary. Also, I have uninstalled Opera... I only really kept it for very occasional use and felt I might as well just get it out of the way while all this is going on. I can always pt on a different browser for testing purposes if needs be.

Many thanks for the help.
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Old 09-29-2015, 05:39 AM   #141
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I see, but uninstalling it will not remove the extensions the next time you install. You need to do the reset to defaults to remove the plugins or go to settings..extensions and disable/delete them. Does it break in 'incognito mode'?
here's a link to removing chrome..
http://www.wintips.org/how-to-comple...google-chrome/
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Old 09-29-2015, 08:20 AM   #142
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When I uninstalled and re-installed, Chrome was totally virgin; at least on the surface at any rate. All my settings, extensions, bookmarks... everything was gone and reset to how it was the very first time I loaded it. That's not to say there wasn't a legacy left under the bonnet so to speak, and that there were still remnants of Chrome in the registry and system files. But certainly from a user experience it was right back to the beginning. In order to get it completely off the PC in every respect, I guess I have to use a utility/follow a procedure like the one you have kindly posted (thanks for that). So I'm happy to give that a try if it's worth doing (when I have more than a few minutes at the PC that is).

Just tried the webpage in Cognito and still got a reboot.

Many thanks for the help.
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Old 09-29-2015, 10:21 AM   #143
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I noticed that you mentioned the old DuX slipstreaming things...are you using the DuX "hacked" XP? If so, you will have a hard time diagnosing your issues. I tried it years ago, and while it is light and "un-bloated", it is still a "hacked" OS, so many of the suggestions here how to fix it do not pertain...and it is extremely difficult to know where to start. No offense to the brilliant DuX, but the best thing you could do is to move on and get a slightly more modern machine with a slightly more modern OS. Or if you are stuck with the computer you have, reinstall using a "normal" XP.
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Old 09-29-2015, 11:01 AM   #144
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OK, I think we should wait for you to get the untouched WinXP and attempt sfc /scannow with it (I PM'd you the link). Please keep us posted.
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Old 09-29-2015, 12:15 PM   #145
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Hi richie43

No, I didn't in the end.... I used nLite to make my own installation and I think it was a lot less light and merciless than DuX's. I did it partly so that I could slipstream SP3. It was so long ago I really cannot remember what I took out with nLite. I might have some notes from the time and will check as soon as I can. I do still have the installation disc I created, so I don't know if it is possible to tell from that what I took out of XP? I can't imagine so....

Cheers
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Old 09-30-2015, 05:18 PM   #146
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Not to keep beating a dead horse but I would like to respectfully make one last suggestion. Assuming that the rebooting only occurs with Chrome, and ignoring the fact that this only happens on certain web pages (the pages worked in Opera therefore it is likely that the issue is with Chrome and not the operating system), then applying the principle of Occam's Razor; the simplest solution is most likely the correct one.

So my suggestion is this: Download Firefox (Minimum XP SP3). Uninstall Chrome including the user settings. Do not re-install Chrome. Install Firefox.

I suggest Firefox simply because it is what I prefer. Keep in mind that Internet Explorer does not support XP beyond version 8, that is telling. As browsers continue to progress they will be aimed at the current operating systems and as a result incompatibilities with older OS are likely to occur.

If you no longer have an issue then we can assume the culprit is Chrome.

One additional comment; If you have not looked at CrystalDiskInfo I highly recommend it. It detects hard drive issues many other S.M.A.R.T. utilities miss.
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Old 09-30-2015, 06:40 PM   #147
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Quote:
Assuming that the rebooting only occurs with Chrome
Unless I misunderstood previously, it reboots doing multiple different things but chrome is a mostly sure fire repro.
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Old 09-30-2015, 07:31 PM   #148
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@karbomusic

Thanks, I somehow missed that reading through the posts.

I think I would still try uninstalling and not re-installing, which if I am not mistaken has not been tried (I could be wrong again), just to remove that as a possible cause.
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Old 09-30-2015, 07:33 PM   #149
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@karbomusic

Thanks, I somehow missed that reading through the posts.

I think I would still try uninstalling and not re-installing, which if I am not mistaken has not been tried (I could be wrong again), just to remove that as a possible cause.
Can't hurt at this point, that's for sure.
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Old 09-30-2015, 09:53 PM   #150
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Not to keep beating a dead horse but I would like to respectfully make one last suggestion.
Actually there are some more tricks in the sleeve, like replacing some suspicious kernel drivers with verified versions. It's just unreasonable to attempt this before we are 100% sure that sfc won't work on this system. So basically we are waiting for Max to run sfc with the untouched disk.
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Old 09-30-2015, 10:02 PM   #151
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Originally Posted by Dilettante View Post
One additional comment; If you have not looked at CrystalDiskInfo I highly recommend it. It detects hard drive issues many other S.M.A.R.T. utilities miss.
The HDDs are not just OK, they are perfectly healthy. This is not going to change with any number of tools. This is not an HDD issue.
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Old 10-01-2015, 03:48 AM   #152
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It has been my experience that when this sort of thing starts happening, it is time to save your files to jump drives and reformat the drive and re-install your operating system. (clean install)
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Old 10-01-2015, 07:31 AM   #153
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Seconded. innuendo is doing yeoman's work, but I would 1) Try a different power supply 2) Try a different video card 3) Reinstall the OS. If that fails it's time for a new mobo.

I long ago gave up trying to understand these type of problems; I don't have the time any more and don't find it as interesting as I once did, because these problems tend to be one-offs so finding out the root cause is of no value. Get it fixed and move on and forget about trying to learn why.

But if you have lots of time and no money and no spare SMPS or GPU then the current situation is the way to go.
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Old 10-01-2015, 07:44 AM   #154
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Quote:
I don't have the time any more and don't find it as interesting as I once did, because these problems tend to be one-offs so finding out the root cause is of no value. Get it fixed and move on and forget about trying to learn why.
One problem is being too far from stock. It's the primary reason I don't tweak the OS' much any more. Once you get a certain perecentage outside the norm the following becomes a risk...

- If you do have some issue, you probably won't find a quick answer on the net because the config is customized enough to place you in the .001 percentile.

- Weird things are more likely because of that same percentile. No one who writes OS'es or drivers ever test in wierd or other configurations other than stock.

- Troubleshooting becomes very difficult (as evidenced above) because key tools and the like are missing due to optimization.

Lastly when it's hardware, it often looks just like an OS issue and vice-versa because at the end of the day, it's all electrons. Now just to get it off my chest, removing things such as SFC to optimize for a DAW doesn't help the DAW one iota, it just makes us all feel better. This is often the case in some tweaking circles, removing some stuff that is never used or never has any effect on performance. Don't do that! - OK I feel better now.
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Old 10-01-2015, 07:49 AM   #155
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Good comments karbo.

I don't tweak the OS any more either. The last time I used Dux's XP it broke too many things I needed. I have made nLite discs before but not to remove things, but to add my name and preferences and the service packs of course to make installing much quicker.

XP is dead, sorry to say. We've since had Vista, 7, 8, and now 10. That means XP may as well be DOS. Forget about it.
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Old 10-01-2015, 07:53 AM   #156
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I suppose I'm still in the PSU or Video/video driver camp but who knows.
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Old 10-01-2015, 05:27 PM   #157
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Originally Posted by Max Dread View Post
I've just tried it and it took me to a BSOD. Couldn't get passed the BSOD so had to manually restart the PC. Indicative of anything?

Thanks for the post.
I can't believe nobody noticed this? What was in the BSOD? That could easily explain the culprit.

Don't post only the error code, but the component that caused it too (it should say a filename at the top)
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Old 10-01-2015, 11:29 PM   #158
innuendo
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Originally Posted by karbomusic View Post
I suppose I'm still in the PSU or Video/video driver camp but who knows.
It should not be the driver because the bsods still happen in the safe mode. It shouldn't be the graphics card or the psu since every possible stress test passed ok.
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Old 10-02-2015, 12:02 AM   #159
ChunkyBustout
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Max Dread, I had a similar issue and it all boiled down to going into Chrome settings/Advanced settings/System (on the bottom of the page) and disabling hardware acceleration and disabling running Google Chrome apps when closed. It won't hurt to try (I've read this entire thread to be certain this wasn't mentioned before

Good Luck!
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Old 10-02-2015, 12:35 AM   #160
innuendo
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Originally Posted by ChunkyBustout View Post
Max Dread, I had a similar issue and it all boiled down to going into Chrome settings/Advanced settings/System (on the bottom of the page) and disabling hardware acceleration and disabling running Google Chrome apps when closed. It won't hurt to try (I've read this entire thread to be certain this wasn't mentioned before

Good Luck!
This might in fact help for Google Chrome, but the drawbacks are that this will not solve system-wide corruption which is probably in one or more kernel drivers, and this will leave the OP with no hardware acceleration in Chrome.
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