Old 09-21-2012, 05:02 AM   #1
reapercurious
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Default FX button on TCP opens wrong FX chain

fx button on TCP opens wrong FX chain in docker

Scenario: you have a number of tracks up and you want to change the eq on say, the vocals, so you click the FX button on the vocals and the docked effects chain shows up, but its the wrong one. an FX chain from a different track!
so obviously you start tweaking the fx because its the one that showed up and no changes are heard to the 'vocals' for example.

after i discovered this, i noticed all i have to do to reproduce this annoying bug is to repeatedly click the FX button on the track control panel of a track, and it will alternate between the FX chain on that track, and a random other track (probably a track routed to it or something.)

anyone else notice this?

i could be dead wrong, but when i hit the fx button on a track, i expect the fx to be that of the track whose fx button i am clicking, not the routing matrix, explorer or a different tracks fx.

to repeat the thing im talking about

1) start a new reaper project with the docker holding the fx.
2) create 2 new tracks,
3) load reaeq on one, reacomp on the other
4) repeatedly hit the fx button on the tracks, and they will cycle around in what shows up in the docker.

edit:
what the fx button appears to be doing is toggling the fx chain off and on. this would be ok but the default theme for reaper does not appear to indicate a "toggle" position or color variation, so its never obvious which state the toggle is in, and when there are a few tracks, it gets confusing knowing which fx chain is being shown or not. when a user hits the fx button, that tracks fx chain should be shown and selected, not toggled off and on, because the next fx chain will be displayed perhaps inadvertently, leading to workflow problems. please move to nitpicks if this isnt a bug but to the untrained eye it looks like a logical mistake.

Last edited by reapercurious; 09-21-2012 at 05:13 AM.
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Old 09-21-2012, 05:41 AM   #2
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The effect chain is not being toggled on/off, the visibility of its (docked) window is being toggled on/off.

Following your proposal, there would not be a way to toggle the visibility off again. I can see how it can be confusing, but this does not seem to be a bug.

Imho a better approach would be to make the toggle button show separate states for when the corresponding window is currently visible (whether or not it is docked) or not. Perhaps only the 'power switch' part of the button should switch colors between green/red/grey, with different colors for the "FX" part depending on the visibility of the effect chain window for that track.
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Old 09-21-2012, 06:21 AM   #3
James HE
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I cann't reproduce this here. Take a closer look at what you are seeing. You are not seeing a random FX window - it's just some other window that was already open.

If it is confusing, you should check in

Options > Prefs. > Plugins "allow only one FX chain window open at a time"


If docking FX, this really is the only option that makes sense.

Floating FX windows ignore this when clicked on from the MCP - so checking this dosen't mean you'll never be able to have 2 plugins open a at the same time - just never 2 docked chains.
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Old 09-23-2012, 04:03 AM   #4
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ok, maybe i am the one with the problem, but if there are 2 tracks with the same effects, and they're docking, it can get really confusing if you click the fx button of one track while that fx chain is open and it toggles that fx chain off and reveals another open fx chain that happens to be similar.

i had one project with more than 10 tracks, and for some reason when i click fx on say, the vocal track, then the fx chain for drumatic would show up first, then the correct fx after i click again. so its absolutely a fact that when you click the fx button on a track control panel, the corresponding fx panel will not always be the one that appears as focused in the docker.

basically, when you click fx, "that" fx chain isnt always the one that is chosen in the docker if there are multiple fx being docked. even if the conditions are rare that might lead to this experience, its still a bug or at the very least, unaddressed for now. just doing my duty and saying something.

basically, the fx button of a track shouldnt behave as a toggle switch, if you click on it, "that" fx chain should be focused and stay focused even if you click that fx button 10 times in a row. at current, if you do this while allowing multiple fx docked, the fx chain in question will turn on and off and on and off, that is a toggle sirs.

Last edited by reapercurious; 09-23-2012 at 04:08 AM.
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Old 10-03-2012, 05:31 AM   #5
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did you know that pushing the fx button twice in a row in the track control panel causes total chaos in the docker?

go ahead, click the fx button of a track up above and watch the docker go insane. (with default multiple fx windows enabled.)

you better hope you dont have two tracks with the same FX on it, or you might get lost as its really hard to know what tracks fx youre in without looking twice.
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Old 10-03-2012, 06:21 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reapercurious View Post
ok, maybe i am the one with the problem, but if there are 2 tracks with the same effects, and they're docking, it can get really confusing if you click the fx button of one track while that fx chain is open and it toggles that fx chain off and reveals another open fx chain that happens to be similar.

i had one project with more than 10 tracks, and for some reason when i click fx on say, the vocal track, then the fx chain for drumatic would show up first, then the correct fx after i click again. so its absolutely a fact that when you click the fx button on a track control panel, the corresponding fx panel will not always be the one that appears as focused in the docker.

basically, when you click fx, "that" fx chain isnt always the one that is chosen in the docker if there are multiple fx being docked. even if the conditions are rare that might lead to this experience, its still a bug or at the very least, unaddressed for now. just doing my duty and saying something.

basically, the fx button of a track shouldnt behave as a toggle switch, if you click on it, "that" fx chain should be focused and stay focused even if you click that fx button 10 times in a row. at current, if you do this while allowing multiple fx docked, the fx chain in question will turn on and off and on and off, that is a toggle sirs.
When they're not docking it can also be confusing (because they can be on top of each other).

But still, if the user does not remember how many windows he has opened, and does not look at the window titles, any resulting confusion is arguably user error, not a bug. Poor, even misleading UX design, sure. But basically, it *is* a toggle switch, that you want to behave as something different. Not a bug.
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Old 10-03-2012, 06:41 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reapercurious View Post
did you know that pushing the fx button twice in a row in the track control panel causes total chaos in the docker?

go ahead, click the fx button of a track up above and watch the docker go insane. (with default multiple fx windows enabled.)

you better hope you dont have two tracks with the same FX on it, or you might get lost as its really hard to know what tracks fx youre in without looking twice.
No, I didn't - because I normally never dock the "FX", nor click that button on the TCP or MCP, because I don't like to use the entire FX 'chain' window. (I typically use a keyboard shortcut (shift+F) to insert plugins from the FX browser, and open/close individual plugin windows from the MCP or via OSC, automatically opening the window of the targeted plugin, and closing it when switching to another one.)

But I just tried, and it seems to work fine, the docker seems to respond as expected here. But perhaps I missed some detail. Perhaps make a screen cap of the docker going insane?

Btw, did you know that clicking a button rapidly and repeatedly does not work very well in several places in REAPER? Go ahead, try deleting a few effects on the MCP, or deleting a few envelope lanes on the TCP.
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Old 10-07-2012, 02:53 PM   #8
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heres a quick formula:

1) start a new project with reaeq on one track and reacomp on another track
2) dock fx, (allow one fx only or all, it doesnt matter)
3) click fx in the track control panel in track 1
4) click fx in the second track
5) click the same fx button again, and the last fx that was open is shown. (it acts as a toggle with an 'off' state that is practically random.)

this can get confusing if you dont remember what fx button you last pressed was, especially if you already had the desired fx open at the time, because it will switch when you push the fx button, thus making it a little confusing to know if you are operating the right fx or fx chain. you might move sliders and hear no effect, because youre tweaking the wrong fx. stuff like that.

im trying to suggest that one click of an fx button on the tcp should do one thing, regardless of how many times its pressed, which is launching a docked or a non docked fx chain window, the very one that corresponds to the track that the fx button is on. click it once or twice it shouldnt toggle or hide or anything. i suppose some people use it as such, in which case, another option should be there. maybe such an option already exists?

thanks banned.
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Old 10-08-2012, 02:58 PM   #9
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Perhaps we should just ask for two things:

(1) make the current behaviour less confusing by showing the on/off state on (the left part of) the button (assuming it is supposed to toggle on/off, of course);

(2) add an option to change (the left part of) the button function to 'show fx chain window (for this track)' and make the button state show whether the window is already visible or not.
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Old 10-08-2012, 04:37 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Banned View Post
When they're not docking it can also be confusing (because they can be on top of each other).
One thing that would help with this confusion is to randomly offset the new FX window position by at least a few pixels or something similar. Currently, it creates the illusion the wrong one opened if the one you want was already open. Your brain doesn't realize multiple windows may be perfectly stacked, even very small differences in position may reduce the illusion and lower confusion.
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Old 10-08-2012, 05:01 PM   #11
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thanks for helping clarify the issue. i think the fx button in the tcp should 'either' be a toggle or not, as-specified in the options. its acting like a flipflop now, but i think it should have one action only, to display that fx chain. i know it was an intentional decision by one of you programmers out there, and i appreciate how hard it is to juggle so many functions with one program.

Last edited by reapercurious; 10-08-2012 at 05:17 PM.
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Old 01-22-2017, 04:19 AM   #12
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Default ini toggle single fx instance actions?

Quote:
Originally Posted by James HE View Post
... check in Options > Prefs. > Plugins

"allow only one FX chain window open at a time"
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Floating FX windows ignore this when clicked on from the MCP - so checking this dosen't mean you'll never be able to have 2 plugins open a at the same time - just never 2 docked chains.
quick question
can this be triggered via screensets/projectsettings, or actions /js/sws/lua/eel/ahk/python/something-i-haven't-yet-stumbled-upon?

thanks
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