Old 04-16-2013, 04:08 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by Breeder View Post
I'm not having problems with BPM over 240 here. It's all normal.

Can you please pm with the problematic project and the settings you're using for converting?
Hey Breeder, okay, I'll try put something together. I tried it on both an old XP as well as a newer Win7 and got the same results.

Let me see what I can do.
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Old 04-16-2013, 04:18 PM   #42
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Okay, here you go. I've got both the project file before tempo mapping and after.

Keep in mind, I have no problem with BPMs of 139 and less.

https://stash.reaper.fm/16182/Tempo%2...20Test%201.rar
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Old 04-16-2013, 04:29 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by Tod View Post
Okay, here you go. I've got both the project file before tempo mapping and after.

Keep in mind, I have no problem with BPMs of 139 and less.

https://stash.reaper.fm/16182/Tempo%2...20Test%201.rar
I don't see anything strange here. Can you please elaborate what do you expect to obtain and what conversion settings you're using?

In your example project you've put marker on every start of the measure in 4/4 at 240 BPM.
If you've typed 2 in Markers per measure (in SWS conversion dialog) it means that 2 markers represent 1st and 3rd marker of the measure and so on...So naturally 240 will turn to 120 as seen in the after project (two measures of 240 are equal to one measure in 120)

edit: I'm much more interested in your first screenshots where you're getting 120 all the way instead of 240 at double tempo:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tod View Post
Hi G-Sun, Breeder, and all.
Did you by any chance use time selection option (while changing markers per measure) ?

Last edited by Breeder; 04-16-2013 at 04:38 PM.
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Old 04-16-2013, 04:42 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by Breeder View Post
I don't see anything strange here. Can you please elaborate what do you expect to obtain and what conversion settings you're using?
I'm not sure what you mean about conversion settings, the only settings I know about are in the "Project Settings"?

Quote:
In your example project you've put marker on every start of the measure in 4/4 at 240 BPM.
If you've typed 2 in Markers per measure (in SWS conversion dialog) it means that 2 markers represent 1st and 3rd marker of the measure and so on...So naturally 240 will turn to 120 as seen in the after project (two measures of 240 are equal to one measure in 120)
I haven't used any SWS actions on this. I looked for actions to do this in your SWS actions but couldn't find anything to simply create Tempo Marker from Project Markers. Maybe I missed something there. This is the basic macro I'm running.

Time selection: set starting point
Markers: go to next marker/project end
Time selection: set end point
Create measure from time selection (detect tempo)
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Old 04-16-2013, 04:50 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by Breeder View Post
edit: I'm much more interested in your first screenshots where you're getting 120 all the way instead of 240 at double tempo:

Did you by any chance use time selection option (while changing markers per measure) ?
No, I just continuously ran the macro I show above. I've never had any problems with this before but then I'd never used BPMs as high as 240.
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Old 04-16-2013, 04:56 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tod View Post
I'm not sure what you mean about conversion settings, the only settings I know about are in the "Project Settings"?
I haven't used any SWS actions on this. I looked for actions to do this in your SWS actions but couldn't find anything to simply create Tempo Marker from Project Markers. Maybe I missed something there. This is the basic macro I'm running.

Time selection: set starting point
Markers: go to next marker/project end
Time selection: set end point
Create measure from time selection (detect tempo)
Ah...well, this has nothing to do with SWS. I just tried the native method (that macro you just posted) with the test project and indeed it's results are kinda strange. But that is something you should create bug report about in the cockos tracker.

SWS method doesn't have any problems like that.
Download the latest beta of SWS from here:
https://code.google.com/p/sws-extension/downloads/list

Once you download and install SWS extensions, find this in the action list:SWS/BR: Convert project markers to tempo markers...
Once run, you will be presented with the dialog:

It should be fairly simple to get the hang of it (word of advice: avoid gradual tempo changes for tempo mapping since they are harder to manipulate afterwards) If you're having problems you should check out the wiki (linked in the first thread of this topic)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tod View Post
I'm not sure what you mean about conversion settings, the only settings I know about are in the "Project Settings"?
Yeah, I was reffering to the settings in the dialog posted above. When it comes to SWS - project settings, except timebase, have nothing to do with converting project markers to tempo.
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Old 04-16-2013, 04:57 PM   #47
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No, I just continuously ran the macro I show above. I've never had any problems with this before but then I'd never used BPMs as high as 240.

Yep, it seems it's some sort of bug in reaper. Just use SWS method explained in this thread and you will be ok
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Old 04-17-2013, 12:49 AM   #48
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A side-note:
If your result exceeded 240bpm you should really consider scaling down your time-signature 50%
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Old 04-17-2013, 10:02 AM   #49
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Hi guys,

Aha, I missed the SWS/BR: Convert project markers to tempo markers the other day when I was looking for a "SWS/BR" action to do this.

Heh heh, I just ran it and that was quick an easy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by G-Sun View Post
A side-note:
If your result exceeded 240bpm you should really consider scaling down your time-signature 50%
You mean use 32nd instead of 16th, 16 instead of 8th, etc. and probably 2/4 instead of 4/4?

Yeah but this was all just an experiment in an effort to help finzic out the other day.

Quote:
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Yep, it seems it's some sort of bug in reaper. Just use SWS method explained in this thread and you will be ok
Thanks for checking it out, with your extensions it's rather a mute point.
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Old 07-11-2013, 10:48 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G-Sun View Post
"sws/br: Convert project markers to tempo markers.."
This no loger exists, ay? i don't see it in my list of actions (and I do have sws installed, latest beta as of today (sws_2.3.0.4.exe).

Last edited by pixeltarian; 07-11-2013 at 11:27 PM.
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Old 07-12-2013, 06:02 AM   #51
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That's the latest official release, not beta

https://code.google.com/p/sws-extension/downloads/list
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Old 11-09-2013, 03:52 AM   #52
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I noticed Reapers time-line display gets messed up when having lots of tempo-markers. Any way to change that?
(So it's displaying 14.1.0 instead of eg. 14.2.5)
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Old 11-09-2013, 03:53 AM   #53
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Yes, it's extremely annoying.
Afraid not, it's up to Cockos to fix that one :/
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Old 11-09-2013, 10:53 AM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Breeder View Post
Yes, it's extremely annoying.
Afraid not, it's up to Cockos to fix that one :/
Ok, thanks for chiming in!

BTW: Had to import a session from Sonar 8 today. Getting the tempo, midi and audio into Reaper was not the easiest, but your actions helped a lot! Thanks!
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Old 11-09-2013, 11:18 AM   #55
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Originally Posted by G-Sun View Post
Ok, thanks for chiming in!

BTW: Had to import a session from Sonar 8 today. Getting the tempo, midi and audio into Reaper was not the easiest, but your actions helped a lot! Thanks!
Hi Geir, did you save your Sonar midi tracks as a Midi File 1? I had several video projects in Sonar that I brought in to Reaper and that's what I did. I was surprised because everything went very smoothly.
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Old 11-09-2013, 11:42 AM   #56
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Hi Geir, did you save your Sonar midi tracks as a Midi File 1? I had several video projects in Sonar that I brought in to Reaper and that's what I did. I was surprised because everything went very smoothly.
Oh, have to check.
Did you have tempo-data embedded?
That's was the hard thing for me. Had to record a click-track via a virtual loop into Reaper.
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Old 11-09-2013, 02:23 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by G-Sun View Post
Oh, have to check.
Did you have tempo-data embedded?
That's was the hard thing for me. Had to record a click-track via a virtual loop into Reaper.
yes, in Sonar I take out all the audio tracks and all the other non midi tracks. Then I save it as a Midi1 file and it not only has all the tempo changes, but also includes all the markers.
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Old 11-09-2013, 02:52 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tod View Post
yes, in Sonar I take out all the audio tracks and all the other non midi tracks. Then I save it as a Midi1 file and it not only has all the tempo changes, but also includes all the markers.
ok, thanks! Next time..
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Old 02-04-2014, 07:07 AM   #59
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Breeder:
Those "select peak/dip env points"
Did they make it into the sws build?
(couldn't find them)
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Old 02-04-2014, 07:08 AM   #60
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they will get included in the next SWS build
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Old 02-04-2014, 07:54 AM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Breeder View Post
they will get included in the next SWS build
Good, needed the compress-action
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Old 02-04-2014, 08:59 AM   #62
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btw: That "Compress point by adjusting to point before"
Is that coming as well? That's a simple one isn't it?
How about an action that adjust to point behind as well?
So, using both actions would give pretty good results.
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Old 02-04-2014, 10:48 AM   #63
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As we discussed in private some time ago - when new build arrives you will be able to get the behavior you asked for (compressing peaks and dips in tempo map while preserving positions of points in front) with this macro:

Code:
SWS/BR: Select peaks in envelope
SWS/BR: Decrease tempo marker 01 BPM (preserve ovarall tempo)
SWS/BR: Select dips in envelope
SWS/BR: Increase tempo marker 01 BPM (preserve overall tempo)
Just replace Increase/Decrease actions with type of your choosing

Also, next build will have these actions too:
+SWS/BR: Unselect envelope points outside/in time selection
+SWS/BR: Save/Restore envelope point selection (5 slots)

So you can limit compression to time selection and/or preserve current point selection after compressing

Code:
btw: That "Compress point by adjusting to point before"
Is that coming as well? That's a simple one isn't it?
How about an action that adjust to point behind as well?
So, using both actions would give pretty good results.
If you mean on your request about compressing tempo points with dedicated dialog - it will not be in the next build. It will probably get incorporated in a fashion that will include all envelopes, not just tempo map (can't say when - things are busy).
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Old 02-04-2014, 01:41 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Breeder View Post
As we discussed in private some time ago - when new build arrives you will be able to get the behavior you asked for (compressing peaks and dips in tempo map while preserving positions of points in front) with this macro:

Code:
SWS/BR: Select peaks in envelope
SWS/BR: Decrease tempo marker 01 BPM (preserve ovarall tempo)
SWS/BR: Select dips in envelope
SWS/BR: Increase tempo marker 01 BPM (preserve overall tempo)
Just replace Increase/Decrease actions with type of your choosing

Also, next build will have these actions too:
+SWS/BR: Unselect envelope points outside/in time selection
+SWS/BR: Save/Restore envelope point selection (5 slots)

So you can limit compression to time selection and/or preserve current point selection after compressing
Cool
Quote:
Code:
btw: That "Compress point by adjusting to point before"
Is that coming as well? That's a simple one isn't it?
How about an action that adjust to point behind as well?
So, using both actions would give pretty good results.
If you mean on your request about compressing tempo points with dedicated dialog - it will not be in the next build. It will probably get incorporated in a fashion that will include all envelopes, not just tempo map (can't say when - things are busy).
No. No dedicated dialog. You've already made it (I just couldn't find it in latest build). The action that adjust point some % to the value of the previous.
I was just thinking of combining it with an opposite action.
Would work better than the above macro I believe.
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Old 02-04-2014, 04:32 PM   #65
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I frequently use tempo mapping

I use the "SWS/BR:Convert project markers to tempo markers" and the "SWS/BR:Move tempo marker forward" and back. BIG THANKS !!!!!!


I have a problem now.
After converting many markers in a project and adjusting half of the track I realize that in a part I inserted less markers than I had to, resulting in the tempo to be half of what it has to be for that part. so I need to insert more bars there somehow. Having a hard time to do it.

In another part I did a mapping for 4/4 with triplets... but now I think it doesn't make sense and it is better to introduce a signature change to 3/4.
my question is... How can I re-map part of the midi track? The midi is already glued to the new tempo markers and if I just delete the tempo markers it would lose the original timing.

The main reason I can't remap things is because I cannot set the midi track to be time based.. and the item to ignore tempo changes and setting tempo to xxx value. because the tempo is not a fixed xxx value. It is already changing within the item. I have see the actions "SWS/BR: split selected items at tempo markers" but that is a mess splitting my midi notes too. Maybe it is the only solution.

Is there a way to "unglue" items from midi beats into a time based position?

Lesson learned: never glue without duplicating the track first to have a backup of the original midi.
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Old 02-04-2014, 05:05 PM   #66
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The main reason I can't remap things is because I cannot set the midi track to be time based.. and the item to ignore tempo changes and setting tempo to xxx value. because the tempo is not a fixed xxx value. It is already changing within the item. I have see the actions "SWS/BR: split selected items at tempo markers" but that is a mess splitting my midi notes too. Maybe it is the only solution.
Hmm...tricky. First idea that comes is this (you need some kind of virtual cable for this):

1. Send track with midi in question to virtual cable
2. Create new project tab and create track that receives from that same virtual cable
3. Record midi from old project into new project
4. New project should contain midi file that has all the events spaced the same way old project has them, but at one tempo only.
5. Ignore tempo for the newly record item and tempo map it in that new project

Not really the most elegant thing in the world, but I guess it should work.

edit: When it comes to automated solution here's an idea.
I could add new action to SWS that pastes selected midi item at edit cursor with midi events relative time positions preserved. So you could copy your item to part of project without tempo markers, ignore project tempo for it and move it to old item's position and tempo map it again. Also convoluted, but faster than recording through virtual MIDI cable.

Last edited by Breeder; 02-04-2014 at 05:14 PM.
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Old 02-04-2014, 06:15 PM   #67
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Thanks Breeder
The idea of the midi cable to another project could work. Not ideal, but maybe it can save me.

The automatic paste into an area without tempo markers preserving time would be great! The second part of setting ignore tempo of that new item and move it back to original position, could be automatic too. I mean, moving new item and remove tempo markers of original time selection sounds easier than calculate new midi item that preserves time. But not complaining to do it manually if needed.
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Old 02-04-2014, 07:02 PM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heda View Post
The automatic paste into an area without tempo markers preserving time would be great!
Here's a quick python script that does exactly that before I create it for real in SWS. A bit slow for big items, but should work.
Also note that any text events aren't preserved. On, and you need the latest reaper pre!
Code:
from reaper_python import *

createdItems = []
editCursor = RPR_GetCursorPosition()

def GetNewPpq (ppq, oldTake, newTake):
	oldStart = RPR_GetMediaItemInfo_Value(RPR_GetMediaItemTake_Item(oldTake), "D_POSITION")
	newPos = RPR_MIDI_GetProjTimeFromPPQPos(currentTake, ppq) - oldStart + editCursor
	return RPR_MIDI_GetPPQPosFromProjTime(newTake, newPos)


if (RPR_CountSelectedMediaItems(0)):

	RPR_Undo_BeginBlock2(0)
	RPR_PreventUIRefresh(1)

	for i in range(RPR_CountSelectedMediaItems(0)):
		currentItem = RPR_GetSelectedMediaItem(0, i)
		currentTake = RPR_GetActiveTake(currentItem)

		midiEvents = RPR_MIDI_CountEvts(currentTake, 0, 0, 0)
		if midiEvents[0] == 0:
			continue

		endtime = RPR_GetCursorPosition() + RPR_GetMediaItemInfo_Value(currentItem, "D_LENGTH")
		newItem = RPR_CreateNewMIDIItemInProj(RPR_GetMediaItem_Track(currentItem), RPR_GetCursorPosition(), endtime)
		createdItems.append(newItem)
		newTake = RPR_GetActiveTake(newItem)

		for i in range(midiEvents[2]):
			note = RPR_MIDI_GetNote(currentTake, i, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0)
			RPR_MIDI_InsertNote(newTake, note[3], note[4], GetNewPpq(note[5], currentTake, newTake), GetNewPpq(note[6], currentTake, newTake), note[7], note[8], note[9])
		for i in range(midiEvents[3]):
			cc = RPR_MIDI_GetCC(currentTake, i, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0)
			RPR_MIDI_InsertCC(newTake, cc[3], cc[4], GetNewPpq(cc[5], currentTake, newTake), cc[6], cc[7], cc[8], cc[9])
		for i in range(midiEvents[4]):
			sys = RPR_MIDI_GetTextSysexEvt(currentTake, i, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0)
			RPR_MIDI_InsertTextSysexEvt(newTake, sys[3], sys[4], GetNewPpq(sys[5], currentTake, newTake), sys[6], sys[7], sys[8])

	if (len(createdItems)):
		RPR_Main_OnCommand(40289, 0)	# unselect all items
		for i in range(len(createdItems)):
				RPR_SetMediaItemInfo_Value(createdItems[i], "B_UISEL", 1)

	RPR_PreventUIRefresh(-1)
	RPR_UpdateArrange()
	RPR_Undo_EndBlock2(0,"Paste selected MIDI items at edit cursor with preserved relative time position of events",-1)

Last edited by Breeder; 02-04-2014 at 07:10 PM.
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Old 02-05-2014, 01:15 AM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Breeder View Post
Hmm...tricky. First idea that comes is this (you need some kind of virtual cable for this):

1. Send track with midi in question to virtual cable
2. Create new project tab and create track that receives from that same virtual cable
3. Record midi from old project into new project
4. New project should contain midi file that has all the events spaced the same way old project has them, but at one tempo only.
5. Ignore tempo for the newly record item and tempo map it in that new project

Not really the most elegant thing in the world, but I guess it should work.
Yes, I believe that's the current solution to that issue
Quote:

Here's a quick python script that does exactly that before I create it for real in SWS. A bit slow for big items, but should work.
This is just a very helpful tool!
Time-based midi-events have been an FR for a long time.
I'll test your script.
Would it be a good idea to have slots save/load midi item?
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Old 02-05-2014, 04:11 AM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Breeder View Post
Here's a quick python script that does exactly that before I create it for real in SWS. A bit slow for big items, but should work.
Also note that any text events aren't preserved. On, and you need the latest reaper pre!
Wow. It works! Thank you so much Breeder. That was quick! Much better than the midi virtual cable I'll test it a bit more later tonight.
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Old 03-19-2014, 01:08 AM   #71
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Hi

First i want to thanks you for all your Tempo Actions they are great

But I have some issue while trying to tempo map midi based only project. It appears that "Convert project markers to tempo makers" Loop my all Midi item, for no reason, so they overlap.

Here is a video of the issue :
Video

and here is the project :
Project
What did i do wrong ?

Thanks

EDIT : OK, i just found the wiki article about tempo map midi items after the sws "ignore project tempo" and setting the item into "time" mode, all is ok ! (and glued midi itemps)
but i have an other issue the "onvert project markers to tempo makers" only works for the first time selection i make (based on the first item). If based on the second one, i have "Not enough markers in time selection to peform time conversion, despite the fact that two markers are on the begining and the end of the time selection. Any advice ?
(I succeed what i tried to do with the standard "Measure from time selection (new time signature)", but i'm curious to know what i'm doing wrong with the SWS action.)
Here is a video of the problem.

Last edited by X-Raym; 03-19-2014 at 11:33 AM.
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Old 03-19-2014, 10:38 AM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Raym View Post
Here is a video of the problem.
Ah, rounding issues, the root of all evil
Fixing for the next build. In the meantime, just disable snap and expand time selection in both direction (small amount will suffice, just enough to cover markers within time selection, not on it's edges)

Quote:
Originally Posted by heda View Post
How can I re-map part of the midi track? The midi is already glued to the new tempo markers and if I just delete the tempo markers it would lose the original timing.
The latest SWS pre (2.4.0.4) now includes the actions to deal with these type of situations:

Code:
+SWS/BR: Delete tempo marker and preserve position and length of items (including MIDI events)
+SWS/BR: Delete tempo marker and preserve position and length of selected items (including MIDI events)
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Old 03-19-2014, 11:48 AM   #73
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Ah, rounding issues, the root of all evil
Oh, that was that :P I thought i was doing something bad !
Thank you, your trick worked, but until the update, i will use standard action (which can do what i want without adjusting the time selection). :P

Last edited by X-Raym; 03-19-2014 at 11:55 AM.
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Old 03-23-2014, 06:57 AM   #74
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The latest SWS pre (2.4.0.4) now includes the actions to deal with these type of situations:
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+SWS/BR: Delete tempo marker and preserve position and length of items (including MIDI events)
+SWS/BR: Delete tempo marker and preserve position and length of selected items (including MIDI events)
Hi Breeder. Thanks it's very promising.
I've tested both actions and it seems they sometimes work but sometimes the midi item is messed up in a strange way. I cannot help to determine when it is working and when it is not. It seems like random but it can't be... I must test it more. Maybe I am doing something wrong?


edit: added a licecap example.

Last edited by heda; 03-23-2014 at 08:15 AM. Reason: added gif
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Old 03-23-2014, 07:29 AM   #75
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Maybe I am doing something wrong?
It is sometimes so difficult to tell when this is the case. Your post, heda, makes me think of similar situations which boggle my mind. For example, it is quite common for me to wish to work on the parts of a composition which are sandwiched between other completed parts. Adjusting time signatures being the issue in this thread. What may happen to the MIDI items makes no sense to me. Please consider the following simple gif, and explain if you can. Someone?



Is this out of place here? If so I will delete...

edit- this gif displays the ADDING of a time sig marker 3/4 in a bare 4/4 project. I used undo to ensure a speedy screen cap. The shortening of the beats PLR timebase items (project/track default) confuses me. It seems to contradict the definitions found in 'timebase help.'

Last edited by FnA; 03-23-2014 at 07:44 AM.
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Old 03-23-2014, 08:12 AM   #76
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FnA... I have a lot of problems too when using 3/4 and 4/4 signature changes inside a project.

Try to glue the midi items before the tempo manipulation. It helps if you don't need the hidden notes of the items due to adjusting start and ends of items
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Old 03-23-2014, 08:53 AM   #77
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Thanks heda. I have noticed that constant gluing of modified items is practically a necessity. Also it seems that it some cases setting the items to time timebase temporarily may help. But it seems to me that an item of Beats (position, length, rate) timebase should behave as if written as notation. Sections should never disappear because of a time signature change. Alas...
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Old 03-23-2014, 08:56 AM   #78
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edit: I think I know what's going on...eh, fixing...

Last edited by Breeder; 03-23-2014 at 09:13 AM.
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Old 03-23-2014, 09:31 AM   #79
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edit: I think I know what's going on...eh, fixing...
Hi Breeder (and thanks for the new functions ). The odd behavior in heda's gif - maybe it's related to this: I have noticed that the last cc123 (in midi items) doesn't move to the end of item when changing the length by f.ex. SetMediaItemLength(). Changing the length manually always moves the last cc123 to the end.
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Old 03-23-2014, 10:02 AM   #80
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Hi Breeder (and thanks for the new functions ). The odd behavior in heda's gif - maybe it's related to this: I have noticed that the last cc123 (in midi items) doesn't move to the end of item when changing the length by f.ex. SetMediaItemLength(). Changing the length manually always moves the last cc123 to the end.
The problem seemed to be in a fact that while editing notes, they changed their id's due to change in their position.
So now I cache everything and not just positions, a bit slower but oh well...

edit: there doesn't seem a way to move that last CC123 to right position by API (except editing chunk?) :/ we should definitely report this.

Last edited by Breeder; 03-23-2014 at 10:10 AM.
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