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04-07-2012, 01:53 AM
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#1
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: mcr:uk
Posts: 3,889
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floating toolbar nitpicks
1. Does anyone else think it's wrong that you can resize a floating toolbar to be smaller than the minimum area needed to display all of the buttons?
2. You should be able to drag the toolbar around by clicking on the empty space of a separator.
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04-07-2012, 02:52 AM
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#2
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: mcr:uk
Posts: 3,889
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3. If you resize a frameless floating toolbar so that the 'pin on top' button is no longer visible (which probably shouldn't be allowed anyway), it unpins the toolbar.
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04-07-2012, 03:02 AM
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#3
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: mcr:uk
Posts: 3,889
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4. As far as I can remember, every other program I've ever used has left aligned toolbar buttons but REAPER has center aligned buttons, which looks bad to my eye. Please could we get the ability to specify left, right or center alignment for individual toolbars?
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05-10-2012, 10:59 AM
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#4
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-blänk-
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 11,359
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1. Yes. Plus there should be automatic resize possible, so that when I switch to a one with less buttons it gets smaller and vice versa. Should be possible using toolbar tabs in a floating docker as well.
2. I sort of can, but it depends on where I click (works in ~ the lower half):
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3. I hate that thing on my floating toolbars by heart. Should definitely be in the context menu rather than an icon. With toolbars in a floating docker it doesn't even vanish if there's no room, but hovers above the buttons instead. I'd kill it if I could.
4. I don't mind. I'd like them to be always as small as possible (see 1).
adding:
5. I don't fancy the automatic reordering according to rows and columns. I would prefer more influence on how they are ordered. In double-row toolbars I find me inserting enough separators at the end of the list to define which should be the leftmost button of the lower row.
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05-10-2012, 11:07 AM
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#5
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Unwired (probably in the proximity of Amsterdam)
Posts: 4,868
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6. You can't select the docking position unless you have more than one toolbar opened.
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05-10-2012, 11:10 AM
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#6
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Unwired (probably in the proximity of Amsterdam)
Posts: 4,868
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7. Selecting toolbar buttons using actions does not work reliably.
Copied from this thread:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banned
Selecting a toolbar via actions (e.g. 41646, 41105, 41659, 40303) does not work when the toolbar dock is attached to the main window. When the Toolbar Docker is made to float (i.e. uncheck option "Attach Toolbar Docker to main window"), and then re-attached, everything works as expected. However, after quitting and restarting REAPER, it does not work as expected any longer, and one has to go thru this entire procedure to get the actions working as expected again.
This should probably be entered into the big tracker by now?
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05-10-2012, 11:50 AM
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#7
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-blänk-
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 11,359
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6. seems to work here (right click tab area or the thingie that indicates a "minimized" tab area -> "Attached docker position: ...")?
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05-10-2012, 12:14 PM
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#8
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Unwired (probably in the proximity of Amsterdam)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gofer
6. seems to work here (right click tab area or the thingie that indicates a "minimized" tab area -> "Attached docker position: ...")?
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Well, the point is that I have no "tab area" unless there's more than a single toolbar.
I hadn't noticed that I could also right-click that "thingie". Thanks!
It remains a nitpick nonetheless. Having to right-click on an area just a few pixels wide as the only means of access to a function is not my idea of a good UI at all. It could probably be integrated in a more general toolbar options menu. Probably somewhere under the main "View" or "Options" menu's.
7. is much more than a nitpick though. It highly frustrates the use of toolbars from a control surface. And they are the only means to reliably trigger actions from user plugins like the SWS extension from a control surface (as their action IDs can change). Hence, it is also a major stumbling block for using control surfaces.
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05-10-2012, 12:27 PM
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#9
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Unwired (probably in the proximity of Amsterdam)
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Oh, now I see: the tab area disappears (and changes into that "thingie") already when the toolbar docker is set to a height smaller than about four times the height of the toolbar itself. Definitely not an example of good UI at all. Who would want to keep a toolbar docker four times the height needed to display its buttons, only to be able to get a few extra pixels to right-click for getting access to a menu to set the docking position?
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05-10-2012, 01:11 PM
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#10
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-blänk-
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 11,359
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Concerning 7, you mean using OSC, right? Shouldn't it somehow be possible to call API functions via OSC and do a NamedCommandLookup with the custom ID? Counting toolbar buttons to reliably access an extension or custom action doesn't seem an awesome solution. What if you want to trigger an action without a toolbar button?
Doesn't mean the bug shouldn't be fixed, obviously.
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05-10-2012, 01:51 PM
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#11
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Unwired (probably in the proximity of Amsterdam)
Posts: 4,868
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gofer
Concerning 7, you mean using OSC, right? Shouldn't it somehow be possible to call API functions via OSC and do a NamedCommandLookup with the custom ID? Counting toolbar buttons to reliably access an extension or custom action doesn't seem an awesome solution. What if you want to trigger an action without a toolbar button?
Doesn't mean the bug shouldn't be fixed, obviously.
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Yes, I'm using OSC. And it is related to what we've discussed recently here, as you probably remember.
And while I'm the first to admit that using the toolbar to trigger actions from a control surface is only a workaround for missing features in REAPER, so is the entire SWS extension imho, and I'm using the OSC control surface support mainly as a workaround for the complete lack of high resolution MIDI control with parameter feedback in REAPER as well. How many workarounds would you like with your DAW, sir?
Anyway, I don't think calling an API function via OSC to ask for some action's ID, and then call that action by its ID is the solution here. As far as I'm concerned, when using OSC, REAPER's OSC specs should provide a solution without me having to dig into REAPER's API myself, and they should just support a more reliable scheme. I really don't see why actions can not be called using their command ID string yet. I'll add it to the OSC FR thread right away.
Also, imho many tried-and-proven SWS actions should be pushed to REAPER and become native actions. But that's a different topic, and the problem would still remain for any custom/experimental actions.
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Last edited by Banned; 05-10-2012 at 02:00 PM.
Reason: added link to FR
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05-10-2012, 04:35 PM
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#12
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Unwired (probably in the proximity of Amsterdam)
Posts: 4,868
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(I knew I forgot a few earlier...)
8. Toolbar dividers should not be eating up the limited number (only 16) of toolbar buttons that can be triggered using actions.
9. Seriously, 16 is not enough (see above).
See this thread for discussing a FR to change this behavior, and bumping up the number of toolbar buttons that can be triggered using actions.
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05-10-2012, 11:05 PM
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#13
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Croatia
Posts: 24,790
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Loading saved toolbars should not be dependent on the toolbar number they originated from. For example, what if I want to load toolbar that was Floating Toolbar 2, as Floating Toolbar 6? I can't, I have to edit the damn text file!
I agree with all the previously stated niggles. They indeed can be annoying.
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05-12-2012, 12:44 AM
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#14
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Unwired (probably in the proximity of Amsterdam)
Posts: 4,868
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(Continuing counting from ED's nitpick numbered as #10
When I open the Toolbar Docker, I typically get these toolbars (short names on tabs in Docker):
- Toolbar 1;
- Toolbar 2;
- Toolbar 3;
- Toolbar 4;
- MIDI 1;
- Toolbar 1.
11. The last one is a duplicate of the first. Why can there even be exact duplicates?
If the toolbars on the Docker are closed one by one, e.g. by clicking on the [x] checkboxes in the tabs, the Docker disappears.
12. When the Docker is opened again, *all the toolbars mentioned before have all returned, including the duplicative one.* Expected: the Toolbar Docker should require an explicit user action to "open" toolbars again (and, perhaps optionally, not disappear when empty).
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05-14-2012, 09:14 PM
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#15
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: I'm in a barn
Posts: 4,467
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13. Why can't we just simply change the name of the toolbar completely, and just lose the "toolbar" sufffix.
14. I'd like to be able, when I make a simple text toolbar, to have it vertically double, and the text drawn vertically. Or rather, if my dock stacks the button vertically - draw them vertically!
geee.. I hope those nit picks were worthy, we only have 2 left available in the toolbar! (:<P)
Last edited by James HE; 05-15-2012 at 04:59 AM.
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05-15-2012, 07:45 AM
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#16
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Unwired (probably in the proximity of Amsterdam)
Posts: 4,868
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Quote:
Originally Posted by James HE
[...] geee.. I hope those nit picks were worthy, we only have 2 left available in the toolbar! (:<P)
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To be a bit more precise, there are only 2 spots left for the luxury seats. I.e. buttons that can be triggered using actions. You can put a lot more in a toolbar, hence the need for more triggers. So we can add a lot of nitpicks, and make them compete for the 16 top positions. Not everyone may get a seat, but they can all come and watch the show.
Keep them coming folks!
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