Old 02-25-2011, 07:57 AM   #41
pattonfreak1
Human being with feelings
 
pattonfreak1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Omicron Persei 8
Posts: 3,240
Default

The loudness comes from GranComp on the folder. It has a built in limiter so you can find the "sweet" spot where it sounds loud without pumping. The girth comes from the buss comp. Solo'd by itself the buss sounds like shit. but blend it in juuuust right and you get nice thick sounds.
__________________
www.gigawatt.stereokiller.com
pattonfreak1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-25-2011, 09:16 AM   #42
thequietroom
Human being with feelings
 
thequietroom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,693
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PAPT View Post
I think the sound is very good.

It's also very well composed and played music.

What drums are you using?
Thank you, it is superior drums with metal foundry
thequietroom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-25-2011, 12:52 PM   #43
JohnnyMcFly
Human being with feelings
 
JohnnyMcFly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,343
Default

@Brian from IK
So, does this mean that we can see some IK MM stand alone heads, or will we have to use your cabinets. I know I asked you guys for that about a year and a half ago and never got a response. In fairness I asked you to release a freeware head, so, I kind of didn't expect a response anyways. However, five dollars is a good step..You'll probably do well at that..

You are moving along similar ideology as us with our Head case...
__________________
http://www.acmebargig.com/
JohnnyMcFly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-25-2011, 03:51 PM   #44
Brian @ IK Multimedia
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 41
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RuairiAU View Post
@Brian @ IK
So how is this new system going to work? Obviously there is some sort of base package you need to install on which you run these amps on; so how much will it cost to get started? Will you be able to demo amps before purchasing them?
These details will be revealed as we get ready to launch. We definitely have some surprises in store.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RuairiAU View Post
@On a side note, I'm not sure if you guys do this already, but it would be great if you had some tutorials on how to get a good sound and what clever techniques can be used when recording to get a full rich sound. I realize that's beyond the scope of what your software does, but people are buying your software to achieve good tone. And, as has become clear in this thread, post production techniques like layering, compression and EQ is where the magic happens. People like myself will just conclude that the amp sim is just not good enough because we're unaware of all these tricks.
There is an official guide coming out written by Michael Ross.
Great Guitar Tone with IK Multimedia Amplitube: The Official Guide.

AmpliTube 3 has dual chains, an extensive mic selection with 2 mics per cab and free mic placement, stereo room ambiance, and stereo rack processors. So full, rich sound and good tone is not beyond the scope of AmpliTube. That is what AmpliTube is for. It is meant to be used as an all-in-one solution (even giving you a pedal controller that doubles as an ASIO I/O device in AmpliTube 3 Pedal.)

I see AmpliTube 3 as a stand in for the entire guitar amp recording process. What you would normally do in the studio, you do in AmpliTube 3 instead, even your mic placement! Unlike a lot of other guitar amp modeling software, AmpliTube is not meant to be just a component in your guitar chain. We don't need to be followed by 3rd party cab IRs, outboard processors, or even room simulators.

You can go straight from AmpliTube 3 into your mixbuss, and do all of your guitar track processing inside of AmpliTube. We have compression, EQ, pitch shifters, harmonizers, and stereo imaging all available in the rack. The only thing we don't provide you with is the engineer...

Last edited by Brian @ IK Multimedia; 02-25-2011 at 03:58 PM.
Brian @ IK Multimedia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-25-2011, 04:13 PM   #45
pipelineaudio
Mortal
 
pipelineaudio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Wickenburg, Arizona
Posts: 13,309
Default

brian, I thank you guys for having the balls to make a harmonizer. After having approached developer after developer after developer and hearing how it couldn't be done, imagine my happy surprise at seeing it on amplitube (3? I think)
__________________
REAPER Shirts are Back! - https://shop.spreadshirt.com/pipelineaudio/
pipelineaudio is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 02-25-2011, 05:23 PM   #46
lxm
Human being with feelings
 
lxm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,629
Default

I didnt know there was such a thing .... 'good metal tone'
lxm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-25-2011, 05:27 PM   #47
JohnnyMcFly
Human being with feelings
 
JohnnyMcFly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,343
Default

Well my point Brian, is that it would be cool if AT was modular, so, the user is free to use what they want where they want. How would one go about using the Catharsis IR cabs with AT 3? If I'm correct, you would have to load the whole suite, then bypass the cabs? I don't know, is that possible in AT?

Although I respect and appreciate the amount of work it takes for a suite, I also respect the amount of work it takes to create a single head where you don't have direct control of other factors. Who knows what people will pair with it? There is a lot to be said for the modular approach too, and I know a lot of users who won't use suites because they want more control. So, I guess I'm just wondering whats in store for that? We're addressing this by separating all of the Head Case components. So, you get the suite, and all components separately..
__________________
http://www.acmebargig.com/
JohnnyMcFly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-25-2011, 07:59 PM   #48
ObiK
Human being with feelings
 
ObiK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Salt Lake City, UT
Posts: 1,095
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pipelineaudio View Post
brian, I thank you guys for having the balls to make a harmonizer. After having approached developer after developer after developer and hearing how it couldn't be done, imagine my happy surprise at seeing it on amplitube (3? I think)
Yeah I use it all the time for leads! That and the step slicer were great additions for me!
__________________
IKMultimedia.com
Musicians first. Follow us on Facebook, Twitter & Tumblr!
ObiK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-2011, 08:25 PM   #49
Brian @ IK Multimedia
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 41
Default

Hey Ken!
BTW, My response was not directed to you. I hadn't made it to this page yet when I posted...

But to answer your question, the cab section in AmpliTube can be bypassed, and it won't use CPU if it is. CPU usage is dependent on the models running at the time, so a full dual chain setup on Routing 2 will take about twice the CPU as a single chain configuration on Routing 1. AmpliTube will still takes the RAM that is required to load, however.

But as I've said before, I would really recommend sticking with the cabs in AmpliTube 3. You're going to have a lot more control over your cabs and miking configuration that way. The new VRM process in AmpliTube 3 really opens up so much more versatility than was ever possible before. What really amazes me about it is how accurately it reproduces the results of doing it in the studio. Even if you record miked live amps in the studio, you can still use AmpliTube 3 as a virtual laboratory for proof of concept testing, and save a lot of time and money on mics and setup. Figure out what you want to do in AmpliTube 3, and it will translate remarkably well to a live situation.
Brian @ IK Multimedia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2011, 12:11 AM   #50
JohnnyMcFly
Human being with feelings
 
JohnnyMcFly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,343
Default

Thanks Brian...
We are actually moving away from VRM, I think our execution of it was wrong.(I am assuming you mean Virtual room modeling). Instead we want to move away from the virtual part of it and have actual IR libs of spaces recorded. I'm not at all sure how that will turn out, but I don't think we ever quite got the virtual room modeling portion right, and, TBH I just don't want to spend any more time on it right now. We'll probably get back at it sooner or later once we have learned a little more.

I can certainly see how using "accurate" VRM as a prototyping tool would be useful.

Quote:
CPU usage is dependent on the models running at the time, so a full dual chain setup on Routing 2 will take about twice the CPU as a single chain configuration on Routing 1. AmpliTube will still takes the RAM that is required to load, however.
(Don't mind me while I do a little fishing..haha)

By Chain I assume you mean, stomp, head, cab, effects?
OK, so are you guys not employing SIMD?
That works out to Mono Stomps > Mono Head > Mono convo > Stereo Effects..
The first three processes can be represented as one SIMD channel, leaving room for 3 more. So, I am not sure why your processor usage would go up? It should be really similar using up to 4 channels. You could also save 1/2 CPU on the stereo effects after the fact.(if you employ summing on the stereo channels...) I could have misunderstood you completely though as I don't have AT and I'm not that familiar with it..

Still though, I definitely understand. If you were not using SIMD in the beginning, its a real PITA to implement. So, if AT3 is built from AT1 then it makes sense why you would not be employing it. If your older code is anything like mine, then setting up older projects to use SIMD is basically a re-write..

Nice Chattin..
__________________
http://www.acmebargig.com/
JohnnyMcFly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2011, 12:59 AM   #51
chrisharbin
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 16,031
Default

Well, I like the headcase approach a bit more than AT3 tbh. Although AT3 is a permanent fixture (until later versions are released) the "ambience" and mics (I use primarily the filter cabs) provide very desirable results. I also like the pan for all four (l/r and the same for the ambient) with the sliders. For my taste it seems a bit easier to dial in. With AT3 it's a bit harder to get the mic positions to "sit" the way I wish for heavy stuff. In fact for me, I like the heavy stuff more in headcase. Ymmv.
chrisharbin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2011, 01:26 AM   #52
Tedwood
Human being with feelings
 
Tedwood's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: South Coast UK
Posts: 14,303
Default

FWIW, I think one should be able to load ones own IR's into any amp sim, I have favourites, mostly in the form of Vox AC30 open back cabs. I don't seem to be able to get the same sound anywhere else.

I like suites if they do what I want but I still find myself adding comps and eq to chains so I also think modular suites will suit me best.

As far as prefs go, I like the sound of Acmebargigs, especially with the IFace and Filter cabs (still Beta though). If the gui was anything like as good as Amplitude 3, it would be a no brainer. Amplitude's gui is sweet, but when I demoed it although it was easy to navigate, I didn't find it so easy to get my idea my ideal sound.
__________________
The grass is greener where it rains
Tedwood is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2011, 01:38 AM   #53
chrisharbin
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 16,031
Default

The thing I'll give AT3 a "hand down" acclaim on it crunch. To me nothing is better. It's alive, and highly accurate. I don't use the "room" stuff much as I would prefer to get that from a delay or verb outside of box (mostly because using that is better on a bus where panning is possible/more flexible)

Just because I'm particularly chatty tonight I'll also say if you like to start "raw" there are many aspects of GR4 that at desirable. The only thing I don't like about GR4 is sometimes (without a LP cut) it's too fizzy. But then again, everyone is different......right?
chrisharbin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2011, 01:46 AM   #54
HOFX
Human being with feelings
 
HOFX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Oslo, Norway
Posts: 381
Default

@PattonFreak

Dude, just tried out your toneport preset, it was a bit too fizzy but I backed the gain off and I actually quite like it, for me it's very tight and clear.

Anyway, just letting you know...
HOFX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2011, 10:28 AM   #55
pattonfreak1
Human being with feelings
 
pattonfreak1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Omicron Persei 8
Posts: 3,240
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HOFX View Post
@PattonFreak

Dude, just tried out your toneport preset, it was a bit too fizzy but I backed the gain off and I actually quite like it, for me it's very tight and clear.

Anyway, just letting you know...
Nice! Glad you like it!
As I said though different guitar wood, strings, pickups, etc. Are gonna affect that chain differently.
__________________
www.gigawatt.stereokiller.com
pattonfreak1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2011, 11:06 AM   #56
jellotree
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Canada
Posts: 236
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by thequietroom View Post
I use high treb and presence to get the pick articulations but it sounds really fizzy.. I have to LPF in reaper pretty heavily to get rid of the fizz.
Quietroom, do you LPF before or after the cabinet? Where are you finding your fizz in Pod?

I've been LPF and HPF lately at 70-5000HZ, which is the frequency response of your typical Celestion guitar speaker. The bottom end will get shaved off some more in mixdown, but it does seem to help with some of that top end garbage.
jellotree is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2011, 12:25 PM   #57
soundguy84
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: New York City
Posts: 75
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RuairiAU View Post
Ok, I re-recorded the track. Here's they both are:

Old:
http://soundcloud.com/ruairiau/forewarned
New:
http://soundcloud.com/ruairiau/origi...warned-new-mix


You may have to hit refresh (F5) when opening up the page. It goes a bit funny now and then.
Guitars sound much better in the second one nice work.
soundguy84 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2011, 05:57 PM   #58
RuairiAU
Human being with feelings
 
RuairiAU's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Perth, Australia
Posts: 438
Default

@JohnnyMcFly
When is Head Case coming out? How do I get my hands on it? Also, can you guys get Danny Danzi to do more videos like this http://forum.cockos.com/showpost.php...postcount=151; his stuff is great.
__________________
Download AlphaTrack Pro
RuairiAU is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2011, 06:04 PM   #59
chrisharbin
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 16,031
Default

The thread that dannys vid came from has the link and how-to for head case (at least that is how I got ) I can't remember where exactly it's at though. Mr mcfly posted it though so you might be able to narrow the search.
chrisharbin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2011, 06:33 PM   #60
RuairiAU
Human being with feelings
 
RuairiAU's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Perth, Australia
Posts: 438
Default

Yeah I'm sold on Head Case, just ordering my pre-purchase now. JohnnyMcFly & Danny Danzi have really put a lot of effort into updating the Reaper community on their product and teaching people how to get great sound. And at $26.35US, it's a bargain.
__________________
Download AlphaTrack Pro
RuairiAU is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-2011, 09:17 PM   #61
thequietroom
Human being with feelings
 
thequietroom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,693
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jellotree View Post
Quietroom, do you LPF before or after the cabinet? Where are you finding your fizz in Pod?

I've been LPF and HPF lately at 70-5000HZ, which is the frequency response of your typical Celestion guitar speaker. The bottom end will get shaved off some more in mixdown, but it does seem to help with some of that top end garbage.
The pod tone is printed, so after the cabinet. The printed tone is really fizzy due to the pod kind of does that, and that i have the treb and presense so high. I feel like that boost helps get some of the picking scrapiness in there, and the fizz can be filtered after the fact and leave some of the pick articulation benefit from the boost.

With the patch I outlined earlier I have it passed in the FX chain @ 3253 with a bandwitdth of 1.65. This is with reaeq. I just go by ear here.. pull it down till it sounds like its starting to hurt the tone then back it off a bit.
thequietroom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2011, 12:22 PM   #62
Brian @ IK Multimedia
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 41
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyMcFly View Post
Thanks Brian...
We are actually moving away from VRM, I think our execution of it was wrong.(I am assuming you mean Virtual room modeling). Instead we want to move away from the virtual part of it and have actual IR libs of spaces recorded. I'm not at all sure how that will turn out, but I don't think we ever quite got the virtual room modeling portion right, and, TBH I just don't want to spend any more time on it right now. We'll probably get back at it sooner or later once we have learned a little more.

I can certainly see how using "accurate" VRM as a prototyping tool would be useful.
VRM (Volumetric Response Modeling) is actually our exclusive technology we developed for AmpliTube Fender to reproduce the authentic 3D sound of a stereo miked Vibratone rotary speaker. We were able to apply this technology to our cabs in AmpliTube 3 to bring continuous 3D mic placement. Our cabs are still based on IRs, BTW.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyMcFly View Post
(Don't mind me while I do a little fishing..haha)

By Chain I assume you mean, stomp, head, cab, effects?
OK, so are you guys not employing SIMD?
That works out to Mono Stomps > Mono Head > Mono convo > Stereo Effects..
The first three processes can be represented as one SIMD channel, leaving room for 3 more. So, I am not sure why your processor usage would go up? It should be really similar using up to 4 channels. You could also save 1/2 CPU on the stereo effects after the fact.(if you employ summing on the stereo channels...) I could have misunderstood you completely though as I don't have AT and I'm not that familiar with it..

Still though, I definitely understand. If you were not using SIMD in the beginning, its a real PITA to implement. So, if AT3 is built from AT1 then it makes sense why you would not be employing it. If your older code is anything like mine, then setting up older projects to use SIMD is basically a re-write..

Nice Chattin..
All of this is way out of my area of expertise. This is something best left for the development team...

I can tell you this, though:
The way AmpliTube works is we have two identical parallel rigs. There are a number of routing options that may employ parallel or serial STOMP chains, singular or parallel AMP heads, and singular or parallel CAB models. Each CAB has the option of one or two mics, and each CAB has a stereo room impulse. From there, you can either go into parallel RACK modules if you are using dual CAB sections, or serial RACK modules if coming from a single CAB. The RACK modules are also stereo.

So, if you are running routing configuration #1, you have two serial STOMP and RACK modules, and a single AMP and CAB. STOMP and RACK effects only use CPU on the effects currently engaged. If you choose routing #2, then you get two parallel chains from beginning to end, which is like running 2 full instances of AmpliTube. Perhaps you should try the demo to see what I'm talking about here. It is fully functional for 10-days.

Last edited by Brian @ IK Multimedia; 02-28-2011 at 12:27 PM.
Brian @ IK Multimedia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-28-2011, 01:11 PM   #63
JohnnyMcFly
Human being with feelings
 
JohnnyMcFly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,343
Default

haha Perhaps you should send me an NFR instead? Professional courtesy and all..

Anyways, ok well ignore my thoughts on SIMD,I had a different idea of what you were doing
__________________
http://www.acmebargig.com/
JohnnyMcFly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2011, 05:23 PM   #64
pipelineaudio
Mortal
 
pipelineaudio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Wickenburg, Arizona
Posts: 13,309
Default

Since we have a few amp sim developers here now I'd love to raise my biggest objection or concern about amp sims:

The final distortion, instead of adding to the previous distortion always seems to "cancel the previous distortions out". Sometimes the tone of the earlier distortion will be carried thru, but none of almost none of the sustain.

This is in contrast to using real devices, where the distortion and compression certainly adds, at the expense also of adding noise and some other artifacts.

In amp sims this just doesnt happen.

Fill the entire stomp section in amplitube with compressors or distortions, and then put in a high gain amp model. You will see that the previous effects are almost completely ignored

With Juicy 77 and their overdrive pedal the same thing happens, which is weird because theyre separate plugs so there cant be any feedforward of the complete clean signal

Same thing with simulanalog and their different distortions
__________________
REAPER Shirts are Back! - https://shop.spreadshirt.com/pipelineaudio/
pipelineaudio is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2011, 07:04 PM   #65
Brian @ IK Multimedia
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 41
Default

In AmpliTube, each stage passes on its signal to the next. Amps have a certain saturation threshold, beyond which they just cannot saturate any more. This is why you are not hearing much difference when stacking high gain distortion. The same effect happens in hardware tube amps, too. The difference is that with live tube amps, you probably aren't turning them up anywhere near their saturation point. Try setting your AmpliTube amps at more realistic volume levels, and turn your speakers up instead. Then try different distortion pedals, and you will hear their individual character coming through more clearly.
Brian @ IK Multimedia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2011, 07:31 PM   #66
pipelineaudio
Mortal
 
pipelineaudio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Wickenburg, Arizona
Posts: 13,309
Default

This would be true if we reached the point of pure stauration where a meter would show an almost ruler flat dynamic response. In fact, this is what happens in real gear, often quite early on, with just a few devices.

I can't say the mechanism that's causing the difference I hear between real world and simulation but I can guess. There may be a similar saturation mechanism involved in each stage so that the difference isnt as noticeble

I can show that there is in fact an issue because the noise just doesnt go up as it should
__________________
REAPER Shirts are Back! - https://shop.spreadshirt.com/pipelineaudio/
pipelineaudio is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-04-2011, 08:24 PM   #67
pipelineaudio
Mortal
 
pipelineaudio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Wickenburg, Arizona
Posts: 13,309
Default

(Edit - Just to be clear I'm not picking on Amplitube here, I see this same effect on every amp sim I try)

Ok, here are some examples

Both renders use this amp setting


Setting up a whole stomp board full of compressors, to really be sure of making as extreme a difference as I can, first we have this



Which results in this file
https://stash.reaper.fm/oldsb/478355/no-comp-bank.mp3

then, for the entire opposite of the spectrum we have this



And this results in this file
https://stash.reaper.fm/oldsb/478354/comp-bank.mp3

And now here are the files, one on top of each other to compare

__________________
REAPER Shirts are Back! - https://shop.spreadshirt.com/pipelineaudio/

Last edited by pipelineaudio; 03-04-2011 at 08:39 PM.
pipelineaudio is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2011, 08:47 AM   #68
chip mcdonald
Human being with feelings
 
chip mcdonald's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: NA - North Augusta South Carolina
Posts: 3,674
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pipelineaudio View Post
Just to be clear I'm not picking on Amplitube here, I see this same effect on every amp sim I try)
(very Soundgarden "4th of July")

My problem with sims is that there is a very forward/upfront coloration between 1-3k that seems uncorrelated with the input. As a previous poster noted, I tend to want to eq out 3.2k with Line6 Podfarm (although the built in eq doesn't work well IMO).

For "some reason", every time I use a modeler, when I run through the presets quickly in succession I hear this effect - as if there is an overtone in that region that is very limited and mixed in, a sort of "NY bus compression" sort of vibe. Inevitably, it has one lasting impression: "the pushed-up open A Townsend plays on the break in "Won't Get Fooled Again".

That's the one sound it seems all modelers can mimic exactly IMO. They seem to reduce all guitars to "that", and the only thing I can figure is that there's some math going on to subsonic frequencies that makes that occur as an overtone? That region always seems less linear to input than the highend/low end. It works out if what you're playing is very "safe" dynamically, and you set things up for that, but differences become ugly when you start doing "delicate" things expecting the upper mid range to correspond linearly with the top.

There's also the aspect that in my experience "cheap" electronics likes to "overly happy" in that region, and I relate that to my own subjective take on "cheap sound". In which case, modelers seem to spin me into tail chasing episodes in finding a mid range I'm content with; usually more than I'd prefer, and "cheaper" in nature.

/ $.10
// I hate using oblique terms/references, but I've grown weary of chasing more exacting terminology for little purpose online - sorry
__________________
]]]>-guitar lessons - www.chipmcdonald.com-<[[[
Experiencing Guitar: Essays from Teaching by Chip McDonald https://www.amazon.com/dp/1521877823..._QZJxAbA4GVDC1
chip mcdonald is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2011, 09:28 PM   #69
pipelineaudio
Mortal
 
pipelineaudio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Wickenburg, Arizona
Posts: 13,309
Default

I'd love to see some more comment from the builders on this phenomenon
__________________
REAPER Shirts are Back! - https://shop.spreadshirt.com/pipelineaudio/
pipelineaudio is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2011, 10:27 PM   #70
audioguytodd
Human being with feelings
 
audioguytodd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 1,050
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pipelineaudio View Post
(Edit - Just to be clear I'm not picking on Amplitube here, I see this same effect on every amp sim I try)

Ok, here are some examples

Both renders use this amp setting


Setting up a whole stomp board full of compressors, to really be sure of making as extreme a difference as I can, first we have this



Which results in this file
https://stash.reaper.fm/oldsb/478355/no-comp-bank.mp3

then, for the entire opposite of the spectrum we have this



And this results in this file
https://stash.reaper.fm/oldsb/478354/comp-bank.mp3

And now here are the files, one on top of each other to compare

Wow, that is interesting Pipe. Any comments from some developers???
__________________
Comp Specs: WIN XPSP3, Q6600, ASUSP5K, 3 GB PC6400 RAM, Focusrite Saffire, AlphaTrack, lots of plugins and hardware.
audioguytodd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2011, 09:33 AM   #71
junioreq
Human being with feelings
 
junioreq's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Buffalo NY
Posts: 1,091
Default

Kinda sick of all these guys making mic options, ROOM mics, compressors gadgets etc... Like, get it right first lol.. A single impulse has zero dynamics... How about multi impulse responses etc dynamically switched.. blah blah blah... Hearing anything through one impulse response is quite sickening to listen too. especially if you use ANY ampsim on the market on 2 tracks, You get the dreaded "tunnel of plastic guitar".... Just a BIT of dynamics would go a long way, with some randomness thrown in... I haven't really seen anything new in an ampsim since hmmm years.....Same ole stuff........... Trust me, I've used them all haha... But, thats just like reverbs....Still we have not even a single decent reverb... Just technically challenging I guess........

~Rob.
junioreq is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2011, 10:12 AM   #72
JohnnyMcFly
Human being with feelings
 
JohnnyMcFly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,343
Default

Pipeline, I'd like to respond to that intelligently, but quite frankly, I'm a moron today..haha. I really only have some vague thoughts about it anyways. I think you're definitely on to something though, I too notice that exact same thing...But don't get me started on it, I have finally almost got head case done and you know how I get distracted...I get on this it'll be another 6 months and I still will probably not solve it..I'm sure there are a lot of people more knowledgeable than I that have tried..

It was also mentioned the 1-3 k range and the mids, those are also problematic areas I think as well. Not that its related, I just wanted to mention I agree...

@RuairiAU
Thanks for your support man..Its really appreciated...

@chrisharbin
Thanks too man. That download of the rough beta of HC is on the same thread with the videos. I'm glad I stopped in, I was going to remove that download..I'll leave it up fr a while more..

Cya, back to work..
__________________
http://www.acmebargig.com/
JohnnyMcFly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2011, 06:37 PM   #73
pipelineaudio
Mortal
 
pipelineaudio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Wickenburg, Arizona
Posts: 13,309
Default

Thanks for confirming Johhny. I often get artists who want square wave rectumfrycation, which is easy to get in the real world with a few too many pedals and junk in a row, and the amp sims always seem to fail me for them
__________________
REAPER Shirts are Back! - https://shop.spreadshirt.com/pipelineaudio/
pipelineaudio is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2011, 10:34 PM   #74
Veech
Human being with feelings
 
Veech's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 153
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pattonfreak1 View Post
I love the free amp sims... namely TSE-X30, Lecto, Legion, and LE456.
Those alone smoke most of the payware out there.
However I usually record straight outta PODFarm.
I don't see how you can think PODFarm "just doesn't sound good" cuz IMO I feel its prolly the best payware amp sim going.

I mean seriously, this doesn't sound good?

http://www.box.net/shared/v4m9bbaoqn
Nice tone.. bass on this or just four guitars?
Veech is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-09-2011, 12:24 AM   #75
Planetary
Human being with feelings
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 31
Default

I use a Les Paul Standard or Fender American Standard into Guitar Rig Session I/O via USB 2.0, then run Guitar Rig 4 as a VST in Reaper.

I find that for the stuff I like to play -- blues, funk, reggae, and quite a bit of heavier stuff too at times -- Guitar Rig 4 has some really nice tones.

IF you use those tones as a starting point and fine-tune them from there. There's a massive difference in how different settings sound on the Strat and Les Paul, and I can only imagine how much different my presets would sound if I plugged a seven-string Ibanez in there.

At the same time, I think GR really excels at vintage-sounding tones...I can get awesome Hendrix tone on the Les Paul, some pretty sweek auto-filter funk, and a couple warm, bright jazz tones.

For the metal and punk guys, which is where I started as a kid with my first Strat, there's good stuff there too...I honestly don't think anyone will be able to nitpick those amp sounds, especially when you drop them into a full mix.
Planetary is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-09-2011, 08:55 PM   #76
ObiK
Human being with feelings
 
ObiK's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Salt Lake City, UT
Posts: 1,095
Default

Just double checked both files in reaper and flipped phase, they don't cancel out but this is still interesting, thanks for this pipeline!
__________________
IKMultimedia.com
Musicians first. Follow us on Facebook, Twitter & Tumblr!
ObiK is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-2011, 06:42 AM   #77
chip mcdonald
Human being with feelings
 
chip mcdonald's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: NA - North Augusta South Carolina
Posts: 3,674
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyMcFly View Post
It was also mentioned the 1-3 k range and the mids, those are also problematic areas I think as well.
I have a theory, but it's just that and I don't want to get into a pissing contest:

The notion that our hearing apparatus is limited to detecting 20-20k cycles of an *instantaneous* compression/rarefaction of air does not tell the whole story.

STANDBY FOR ARMCHAIR PHYSIOLOGY AND NEUROSCIENCE:

I think that our brain stem interpolates data across time to yield an *awareness* of repetitive miniscule sub-1 db fluctuations AND that we also have a built-in error-correction "routine" that is feedback-correlated to the mechanics of the tympanum.

In other words: a mathematical artifact that yields a result that is fractional to a db cannot be *immediately* recognized as such, but that over time it is interpolated and we develop an opinion based on that.

This is akin to the process perhaps proto-hominids used to distinguish the sounds of an animal in the distance - IMO the manner in which I contemplate sounds with a lot of complex high frequency content (cymbals, vocal fricatives, distortion overtones) is the same "mode of consciousness" I use when I'm trying to figure out if a rustling noise in the backyard is a cat or an escaped axe murderer.

I'm not making an *instantaneous* judgment of the upper mid/lower treble range, I am examining my "audio buffer" of what I've heard.

I understand this is not something than can be empirically tested, and I do not wish to get into a pedantic argument over the physical limitations of human physiology, it is just my $.10. This is in the realm of "the importance of aliasing artifacts", and thus explains what seems amusing when one person will say "this sampler sounds JUST like a cello!" and another will instantly get an expression of disdain and say "it sounds NOTHING like a real cello!". Then the third person will come in an whine about how it's impossible that one could tell a 44.1/16 recording from reality, when it's quite clear - even when listening to a song from the 80's over a crappy p.a. at a restaurant that they Fairlight string sound is faked.

/ purporting non-empirical theories online since 1989
__________________
]]]>-guitar lessons - www.chipmcdonald.com-<[[[
Experiencing Guitar: Essays from Teaching by Chip McDonald https://www.amazon.com/dp/1521877823..._QZJxAbA4GVDC1
chip mcdonald is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-2011, 03:37 PM   #78
pattonfreak1
Human being with feelings
 
pattonfreak1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Omicron Persei 8
Posts: 3,240
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Veech View Post
Nice tone.. bass on this or just four guitars?
Thanky.
4 tracks of guitar and 2 (blended) tracks of bass
__________________
www.gigawatt.stereokiller.com
pattonfreak1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-2011, 04:07 PM   #79
pipelineaudio
Mortal
 
pipelineaudio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Wickenburg, Arizona
Posts: 13,309
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ObiK View Post
Just double checked both files in reaper and flipped phase, they don't cancel out but this is still interesting, thanks for this pipeline!
You can actually change the tone quite a bit, its just that dynamic effects dont seem to stack and neither does harmonic density. Again, this isnt just amplitube or anything, this seems to happen with any amp sim I try
__________________
REAPER Shirts are Back! - https://shop.spreadshirt.com/pipelineaudio/
pipelineaudio is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-2011, 04:11 PM   #80
Sam C
Human being with feelings
 
Sam C's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Santa Monica CA
Posts: 1,011
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pipelineaudio View Post
I'd love to see some more comment from the builders on this phenomenon
It might be interesting to hear a better start tone for this test. Something cleaner maybe? Or maybe I don't understand the test objective...what should you expect hear with an initial distorted tone then run through 10 compression units?
__________________
Hobbyist
Please take a listen to My Tunes
Sam C is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 03:04 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.