Reaper versus other programs

[Simple Please]

Ive viewed lots of videos re: Midi but have not found my answer so I'm asking for a general consensus of opinion. Ive never delved into VST and at 60 yrs old have probably left it a little too late. Ive only ever used Midi sequencing software but my keyboard (Tyros 5) with its 2000+ voices has kind of made it redundant. I was only ever allowed access to 127 voices. I use it to program the music I am trying to learn to play from books so I can hear how it ought to be played and I saved the midi file to a USB stick. The midi stick connected directly to the keyboard and played it for me 9no need to have a computer tagged to it.
I still want to continue with this but because I can play a little bit better now I was wanting to save midi files to compliment and enhance and play along with what I am able to play to make it sound a bit more interesting.
The videos Ive seen focus really on VST's and I can see the advantage of them. However I want someone to confirm that I can save created files as midi on to a stick so as it plays my keyboard directly and all of its voices as opposed to VST voices. I assume it will but how do I map midi to my keyboards voices and drums ???
Would I do better with a less complicated program since much of what Reaper has I just wouldn't use. If I buy the program I might delve into VST's a bit but I am never going to be a Pro.

[SonicAxiom]

Originally Posted by Simple Please

Ive viewed lots of videos re: Midi but have not found my answer so I'm asking for a general consensus of opinion. Ive never delved into VST and at 60 yrs old have probably left it a little too late. Ive only ever used Midi sequencing software but my keyboard (Tyros 5) with its 2000+ voices has kind of made it redundant. I was only ever allowed access to 127 voices. I use it to program the music I am trying to learn to play from books so I can hear how it ought to be played and I saved the midi file to a USB stick. The midi stick connected directly to the keyboard and played it for me 9no need to have a computer tagged to it.
I still want to continue with this but because I can play a little bit better now I was wanting to save midi files to compliment and enhance and play along with what I am able to play to make it sound a bit more interesting.
The videos Ive seen focus really on VST's and I can see the advantage of them. However I want someone to confirm that I can save created files as midi on to a stick so as it plays my keyboard directly and all of its voices as opposed to VST voices. I assume it will but how do I map midi to my keyboards voices and drums ???
Would I do better with a less complicated program since much of what Reaper has I just wouldn't use. If I buy the program I might delve into VST's a bit but I am never going to be a Pro.

Welcome to the Reaper Forums, Simple Please!

You should definitely give Reaper a try. It offers a lot of features but you can easily just concentrate on those few functions that you really need and simply ignore the rest.

You can use Reaper to record and playback MIDI data to/from your Tyros 5. What you should check:

- is the Yamaha USB MIDI driver for the Tyros installed?
- is the Tyros connected to the computer via USB?
- enter the FUNCTION -> MIDI -> System menu on the Tyros and set Local control to OFF everywhere.
- in the RECEIVE and TRANSMIT tabs, make sure to have reception and transmission of MIDI data enabled.
- in Reaper program prefs -> Audio -> MIDI device you have to enable the Tyros under MIDI input and output devices and also make sure to have the reception of MIDI controller data enabled for the MIDI input.

When all this has been set up correctly, do the following:

- create a new track in Reaper
- set the track's input to MIDI -> Tyros 5, all channels
- record-arm the track and enable monitoring
- select the Tyros as the track's output destination (MIDI hardware output)
- right-click into the track and set "MIDI track controls" -> "Link track volume/pan to MIDI channel" to MIDI channel 1
- load the ReaControlMIDI plugin into the track fx of the track
- select MIDI channel 1, enable the "Bank/Program select" area and type in the numbers corresponding to the sound the Tyros should play. You can look up these numbers in the Tyros' data sheet (not the user manual). For example, typing in MSB "0", LSB "0" and program "11" will select the sound "Vibraphone2".

Once a sound has been selected, the Tyros should play it when you hit the keyboard provided that the track is record-armed and you have the monitoring button in the track enabled.

You may wanna set the Tyros back to "Local On" again (MIDI menu -> System) when you wanna play with it while the computer is not running.

I hope you can get it to work. Please also download the Reaper user guide and read through it.

.

[Simple Please]

Just the reply I was hoping for. Thanks SonicAxiom. Credit Card at the ready.
You have covered Reaper playing the Keyboard very nicely. Are you able to extend that a little to cover saving the file as midi onto a stick to play independently from a computer. Many Thanks

[azslow3]

For ReaControlMIDI you do not need type numbers, you can download mappings for Tyros from http://www.jososoft.dk/yamaha/ins_files.htm . After loading the file in ReaControlMIDI, you can then select bank / patch by its name (as long as the file is correct, but that is simple text file and you can edit it).

Reaper MIDI editor does not support importing note names from INS files (useful f.e. for drums). But it support separate files with mappings (possible to create in a text editor from the same INS).

Reaper is a fascinating "all-rounder" music program, very well written, has reasonable price, user friendly license and has consequent logic in all options and operations.

But exporting MIDI is one of (not many) weak places at the moment. Reaper can export MIDI, but it does not correctly "render it" (may be just a bug):
1) patch selection in ReaControlMIDI will not be saved into MIDI file (sometimes it will when it is in Item FX, sometimes not even in this case). You will need to manually enter corresponding events into the Event List as a workaround.
2) TrackFX processors (Reaper has a big set of nice MIDI manipulation scripts!) are ignored on MIDI export (TakeFX processors are applied). As a workaround, you can use TakeFX only or "Apply FX" before exporting.

[SonicAxiom]

Originally Posted by Simple Please

Just the reply I was hoping for. Thanks SonicAxiom. Credit Card at the ready.
You have covered Reaper playing the Keyboard very nicely. Are you able to extend that a little to cover saving the file as midi onto a stick to play independently from a computer. Many Thanks

you're most welcome, SP!
With regard to exporting MIDI from Reaper: I never had to do this in the past so I'm not familiar with the process. As azslow3 stated, you can export Reaper project MIDI from the file menu. However, the MIDI will most likely not sound the same as when played back from inside the Reaper project because of parameters being discarded during the export process. You'd have to allocate as much MIDI data as possible (besides the note events) into the respective items via MIDI editor's list view instead of into the track fx (things like bank patches, volume, expression, pan, fx, etc.).

You may wanna load the Tyros 5 reabank file which I uploaded to the Reaper stash yesterday into ReaControlMIDI. However, trying to find particular patches this way is a nightmare because due to the arkward structure of reabank files and also the inconsistent organization of the Tyros' voices, the patches are spread all over the place in one of the 212 (!) banks which makes it virtually impossible to find a certain patch. You should rather look up the sound's name either in the Tyros' display or in the supplied data list and enter its MSB, LSB and Program no.. The corresponding patch name will then be displayed in ReaControlMIDI as a sort of confirmation.

.

[Simple Please]

So pleased to get such frank replies from the 2 of you, SonicAxiom & azslow3.
With my limited ability I think I could manage the initial midi programming but would struggle with the saving of a working midi file.
Can you maybe recommend another simpler program? Reaper is still a possibility and I might download the 60 day trial.
Again many thanks to you both
I know you both love your music & Reaper. How do you find the time to produce songs. I imagine it would be very hard to recognize when a project is finished because you can always find fault and tweaks. Good luck

[SonicAxiom]

Originally Posted by Simple Please

So pleased to get such frank replies from the 2 of you, SonicAxiom & azslow3.
With my limited ability I think I could manage the initial midi programming but would struggle with the saving of a working midi file.
Can you maybe recommend another simpler program? Reaper is still a possibility and I might download the 60 day trial.
Again many thanks to you both
I know you both love your music & Reaper. How do you find the time to produce songs. I imagine it would be very hard to recognize when a project is finished because you can always find fault and tweaks. Good luck

You will have to adopt to some sort of particular workflow regardless the daw you will be choosing. It might be a good idea to take one of your MIDI files that play nicely on the Tyros, import it into Reaper and then study its content, i.e. look what kind of MIDI data besides the pure MIDI notes is stored in each MIDI track (PC, CC, Sysex). Once you know what data is required, you can easily make sure to include it in your own MIDI items/tracks before exporting the final MIDI file.

ReaControlMIDI is not a good solution if you wanna eventually export MIDI. Most of the MIDI information will not get exported. You should rather put the data right inside MIDI items. Here's how you can define what sound patch will be played for a resp. MIDI item:

- double-click an item to open it in the piano roll
- switch the controller lane to "Bank/Program Select"
- double-click into the controller lane at its left edge (beginning) to insert a bank/program change event. You can load the bank/patches file for the Tyros (provided that you have downloaded it)



You can allocate such bank/program changes wherever you like to switch sounds. You can add further controller data like pan etc.. This data will get exported when you save the project MIDI as a MIDI file even if you have programmed multiple MIDI tracks. Just make sure to assign a different MIDI channel to the items on each track (by selecting all notes inside an item in the piano roll editor by hitting CTRL+a and then right-clicking them -> note channel).

I just made a few tests and exported several MIDI items set to play different sound patches at different volumes/pans/etc. and when I imported the resulting multichannel MIDI file, it played exactly the way it should. So I guess if you put such a file on your thumb drive and play it back with the Tyros, it should play correctly without the computer being involved.

.

[azslow3]

"Old" DAWs, Cubase and Sonar, which was developed and used during the era of hardware MIDI equipment, are more friendly to such hardware (simpler patch selection, automatic note names corresponding to selected patch, proved by time import/export to/from Tyros, a lot of information).
Both are "heavy" in terms of money, size and resource demanding. And Sonar is in the owner changing transition.

So I would suggest to give Reaper a chance. Reaper is the only DAW without strict "plans" and rapid developers reaction. F.e. Sonar has many bugs for more then 10 years, while real bugs in Reaper are fixed within hours/days. And in case Justin and/or John can be convinced MIDI export should get some love, it will be improved within days