v5.60pre5 - September 24 2017

[Edgemeal]

v5.60pre5 - September 24 2017
+ Automation Items: improve threadsafety when removing/reordering AIs
+ Automation: fix potential incorrect memory access in write mode
+ ReaTune: manual edit window follows arrange mousewheel mappings when possible
# Envelopes: in automation-item-only mode, show new envelopes in media lane only in automation write modes; otherwise show in envelope lane
# RubberBand: fix reset of timestretch in certain instances

Full changelog - Latest pre-releases

[Alkamist]

I posted this elsewhere but I'll post it here I suppose.

I found a small bug with automation items. It's not major, just a minor inconvenience.

- Draw a MIDI item.
- Draw an automation item underneath.
- Make sure to set envelope points to move with media items.
- Copy the media item (ctrl + left drag for me).
- Keep dragging, but let go of ctrl.
- The automation item should be left behind allowing you to separate the media item from it.

[EvilDragon]

Originally Posted by Edgemeal

+ ReaTune: manual edit window follows arrange mousewheel mappings when possible

AMAZING!

Things noticed:

* Horizontal zoom in ReaTune now doesn't work, either via mousewheel, or via dragging the edges of the scrollbar - it's only possible via +/- button in the lower right corner of the GUI. My shortcut for horizontal zoom is Alt+HorizWheel, by the way (if helps)
* Vertical scrollbar in ReaTune cannot even be dragged on the edges to zoom in/out, this seems only possible on horizontal scrollbar? Then again, I see the same behavior in arrange/MIDI editor, so I guess that's not new. Perhaps this dragging the edge of scrollbar behavior should match between horizontal and vertical scrollbars, across Reaper?


Thank youuuuuu! You have no idea how awesome this makes using mousewheels in Reaper, and having the zoom/scroll match!

[schwa]

There are some other changes to envelope behavior that were just too long to describe in changelog lines.

If an envelope is in automation-item-only mode, and contains no automation items, then:

- If the envelope is set to display in the media lane, but is activated by the user via action, menu, envelope dialog, etc, then the (empty) envelope will be moved to an envelope lane. This applies to new envelopes, or existing envelopes that have had all of their automation items deleted by the user.

- If an envelope is automatically activated in any automation write mode, for example by moving a plugin knob, an automation item will be automatically inserted. If the project is playing back, that new automation item will be the target for the automation that will immediately be written by that parameter.

- The automatically inserted automation item will be sized to the time selection if the edit cursor is within it, or to the range of selected media items if the edit cursor is within them, or one measure.

[mccrabney]

Originally Posted by schwa

- If the envelope is set to display in the media lane, but is activated by the user via action, menu, envelope dialog, etc, then the (empty) envelope will be moved to an envelope lane. This applies to new envelopes, or existing envelopes that have had all of their automation items deleted by the user.

i'm not a fan of this. i don't plan on using envelope lanes at all - this just causes me extra work in order to return the AI to the media lane.

[schwa]

It only applies if the user specifically tries to show a specific envelope, which in this case would effectively not be shown. Can you give an example of when this behavior is not wanted?

[mccrabney]

Originally Posted by schwa

It only applies if the user specifically tries to show a specific envelope, which in this case would effectively not be shown. Can you give an example of when this behavior is not wanted?

sure, and maybe there's just workflow i'm not aware of that you can help me find. note that i no longer will be using automation that is not contained in an AI. from here on out, all envelope activity will be AI.

1- touch a track param
2- Script: mpl_Insert 1 measure long automation item for last touched parameter.lua
3- return envelope back to media lane

maybe we just need "create AI for last touched param" in the "param" dropdown menu in the FX window, that way i can enable an envelope, create an AI, and immediately have it dropped into the media lane where it'll eventually end up due to my track count and limited screen size

mpl's script doesn't apply to Volume, Pan, and other TCP controls anyway so a more complete function for "create AI for last touched" would be very helpful

[Bri1]

AMAZING!
Thank youuuuuu! You have no idea how awesome this makes using mousewheels in Reaper, and having the zoom/scroll match!

Agreed-cockos are truly lordlyke!, >but on the other hand,< after longer periods of scrollings and mouse wheelings..the 'ol pinkies are not in favour these days-- i've even today (funny enough) just figured in edge on this forums,,space bar goes down lil bit,shift space goes up pages lil bit-- that's kinda nice having tap options too!! think of the pink! ies.. =)
I did'nt even realize i could ctrl mouse wheel on windows desktop to scale icons!! lol! ain't we all just a lil bit slack some days.

Oh! post #4 is what the manual could be! informative from the first point of info source.
Defining critical functions are paramount imo./

Grand work by cockos at hand.thanX.

[EpicSounds]

REATUNE WOW! Love these improvements!

no more second guessing about how scrolling and zooming will work

[vanhaze]

Can someone help me please with this ?

Situation:

An AI with some envelope points in it.

Workflow:

- I select the AI (clicking on bottom bar of AI).
- I type CMD+A (i'm on mac) : all envelope points in AI become selected.(nice !).
- Now i drag an envelope segment in AI vertically, in the assumption that all envelope points in AI wll move along vertically.

But for me, this doesn't happen: only the segment i drag vertically moves, the other points stay foot.

- Is this normal behaviour ? or ..
- Am i overseeing some setting ?

[vanhaze]

Originally Posted by EpicSounds

REATUNE WOW! Love these improvements!

no more second guessing about how scrolling and zooming will work

Yeah, just noticed the improvements too; so very welcome ; welldone Cockos ! 🙏🏼

[EvilDragon]

Don't drag the segment, drag by the point, then everything moves. Or use the baseline slider in AI properties.

[schwa]

Originally Posted by mccrabney

1- touch a track param
2- Script: mpl_Insert 1 measure long automation item for last touched parameter.lua
3- return envelope back to media lane

Instead, you could put the project or track in global automation write mode, touch the param, and then put the project or track back in trim/read mode.

It's not any shorter than what you're doing, but I feel like we should avoid a situation where users can have envelopes that are completely invisible and cannot be modified without magically knowing they are there.

[vanhaze]

Originally Posted by EvilDragon

Don't drag the segment, drag by the point, then everything moves.

Ahum .. how could i .. pfff.. nevermind.

Ed, you're a Hero. 💪🏼🙏🏼

[EpicSounds]

bug - tons of yellow flashing in transport after inserting ReaTune, even with no processing happening. Audio is glitchy as well, with auto and manual correction OFF. Glitches only when plugin is visible.

Screen cap

http://youtu.be/0iQjKDCa1zQ

[mccrabney]

Originally Posted by schwa

I feel like we should avoid a situation where users can have envelopes that are completely invisible and cannot be modified without magically knowing they are there.

agreed, but that wouldn't happen if A, the envelope is created when an AI is inserted and B, removed if the last AI has been removed from the envelope (which is logical, if you're using AI only mode). this would also solve the issue i mentioned in the last pre:



to add to the above gif, my expectation would be that the blue AI would resize to the entire media lane and the 2nd AI's mini-lane would disappear altogether

Instead, you could put the project or track in global automation write mode, touch the param, and then put the project or track back in trim/read mode. It's not any shorter than what you're doing

yeah...i've never played much with different modes and honestly would prefer if automation recording could be linked directly to regular old Record mode but that's a whole other topic. i'm just looking for a one-step way to drop an AI for the last touched param into the media lane.

[Justin]

Originally Posted by EpicSounds

bug - tons of yellow flashing in transport after inserting ReaTune, even with no processing happening. Audio is glitchy as well, with auto and manual correction OFF. Glitches only when plugin is visible.

Screen cap

http://youtu.be/0iQjKDCa1zQ

Thanks, looking into this... Worth noting this behavior is in 5.50 and 5.40 too. If you put ReaTune on a normal track that isn't record armed, this will be mitigated (normally you do this anyway, since if you're using tabs 2/3 it means you're using correction, which tends to work better with anticipative FX).

[Gianfini]

Originally Posted by schwa

It's not any shorter than what you're doing, but I feel like we should avoid a situation where users can have envelopes that are completely invisible and cannot be modified without magically knowing they are there.

Or you could add a visual indication of tracks with active hidden envelopes.. if not too tricky WALTER-wise

G

[ovnis]

If the envelope is set to hide, the behaviour beetwen VST and volume/PAN is not the same on my computer. Expected behaviour ? I'm alone to have this kind of behaviour ?

[schwa]

Originally Posted by ovnis

If the envelope is set to hide, the behaviour beetwen VST and volume/PAN is not the same on my computer. Expected behaviour ?

Yes, that is the intended behavior. Volume/pan/etc envelopes combine with the track knobs, so there is no need to chase automation item values. FX parameter envelopes take over the FX knobs, so the values need to be chased (or in the case where there is no previous automation item, the value is set to the start of the first automation item).

[ferropop]

Notice that the parameter only latches to the AI upon first touching it, after that it retains the correct value. If you were automating pink-noise, hitting play in the above example would create a pitched-up effect up until hitting the AI when it latches the correct initial value. Notice that on the second play it correctly latches.

Or is this intended? My understanding was that the first point of the first AI sets the initial value of the parameter, no?

[RobU]

ReaTune manual corrections overlap the keyboard at time pos 0.0

https://stash.reaper.fm/31678/ReaTuneGfxOverlap.jpg

As a result of this, left-click over the keyboard starts drawing a manual correction.


FR #1 - Vertical scroll in ReaTune when the mouse is on the keyboard area, like it does in the Midi Editor & TCP

FR #2 - it has been mentioned a couple of times during this pre, but having the ReaTune timeline reflect the arrange timeline settings would rock quite hard.

Cheers

[Gass n Klang]

Is there an option for automation items to change the length of all pooled items?

[ovnis]

Originally Posted by schwa

Yes, that is the intended behavior. Volume/pan/etc envelopes combine with the track knobs, so there is no need to chase automation item values. FX parameter envelopes take over the FX knobs, so the values need to be chased (or in the case where there is no previous automation item, the value is set to the start of the first automation item).

And is it not possible to have the same behaviour for both ? It would be more logical and less unclear.

[vanhaze]

I experience something very strange:

When i do a "show media item take envelope" for an Item FX parameter, the envelope just doesn't show up in the item.

- Tried several themes, including Default: nogo.
- Tried to do "show media item take envelope" with different plugin parameters from different plugins on the item: nogo.

- Tried in different Projects: nogo
- Tried in empty Project with only 1 item: nogo.

OSX 10.12.6
Reaper 5.60pre5 / 64

[Dannii]

Originally Posted by Edgemeal

+ ReaTune: manual edit window follows arrange mousewheel mappings when possible

Oooh! This is exciting!
Must give this a test.

[schwa]

Originally Posted by ferropop

Notice that the parameter only latches to the AI upon first touching it, after that it retains the correct value. If you were automating pink-noise, hitting play in the above example would create a pitched-up effect up until hitting the AI when it latches the correct initial value. Notice that on the second play it correctly latches.

Or is this intended? My understanding was that the first point of the first AI sets the initial value of the parameter, no?

Again, in this mode, the parameter is not automated outside of automation items. The parameter is "live" outside of automation items, just as if there were no envelope at all.

The automation item chase-on-seek feature in this mode is intended solely to ensure that playback sounds the same every time as long as the user does not move the parameter knob or edit the envelope. If you want the parameter fully automated, you need to use a regular envelope.

[Mercado_Negro]

Originally Posted by Edgemeal

# Envelopes: in automation-item-only mode, show new envelopes in media lane only in automation write modes; otherwise show in envelope lane[/COLOR][/URL]

That's an elegant way to solve what we were discussing, yes Thanks, Schwa!

[schwa]

Originally Posted by vanhaze

When i do a "show media item take envelope" for an Item FX parameter, the envelope just doesn't show up in the item.

Fixing.

[vanhaze]

I love you guys @ Cockos, thx so much !

[Mercado_Negro]

Originally Posted by schwa

Again, in this mode, the parameter is not automated outside of automation items. The parameter is "live" outside of automation items, just as if there were no envelope at all.

The automation item chase-on-seek feature in this mode is intended solely to ensure that playback sounds the same every time as long as the user does not move the parameter knob or edit the envelope. If you want the parameter fully automated, you need to use a regular envelope.

I don't quite understand the reasoning behind this behavior, Schwa. Could you please explain the reason for this? It doesn't make sense to me:

[EvilDragon]

He just did, above:

Originally Posted by schwa

The automation item chase-on-seek feature in this mode is intended solely to ensure that playback sounds the same every time as long as the user does not move the parameter knob or edit the envelope. If you want the parameter fully automated, you need to use a regular envelope.

[Mercado_Negro]

Originally Posted by EvilDragon

He just did, above:

And does that behavior make sense to you? I just don't see the reason why it has to chase next or previous points. Just to ensure that playback sounds the same every time? I thought the reason for no automation at all outside of automation items was to move parameters freely.

[ferropop]

Originally Posted by Mercado_Negro

And does that behavior make sense to you? I just don't see the reason why it has to chase next or previous points. Just to ensure that playback sounds the same every time? I thought the reason for no automation at all outside of automation items was to move parameters freely.

My understanding is that you can move them freely, but if you haven't then it will chase. If the last thing you did was to automate a +30 dB boost on something (not uncommon in sound design) do you really want that to be the last thing it remembers when you're playing another part of your track? Surely it's a special event, and should happen only at the location of the AI.

[EvilDragon]

Originally Posted by Mercado_Negro

And does that behavior make sense to you?

It does, to me. If you wanted to keep your tweaked value before playback, write it down in the AI (latch preview?), or just use a regular envelope

[Meo-Ada Mespotine]

I posted it into the thread of 5.50rc23 already, but I think, it's good to repost it with some more words than I used then

I found a lot of bugs, crashes, annoyances in Reaper, and I made a screen-video of them, where I show, how to make them appear: http://phantastika.org/stuf/ReapBugs.webm

The project and script, that crashed Reaper in the "Bug1" section of the video can be downloaded here:
http://phantastika.org/stuf/ReapBugProject.zip

Oh, I used Windows7 and SWS2.8.8 as well.

The following bugs are covered in the video.

Bug 1: My Luascript crashed Reaper. I couldn't find out why. The script and the project, that does the crash can you find here: http://phantastika.org/stuf/ReapBugProject.zip
The script itself is intended to be able to pull out a take out of a MediaItem, though it's an early prototyped one.

Bug 2: When zooming in, and splittin an Item, autocrossfade becomes smaller, than what is set in the preferences.

Bug 3: If I have set the following pref-options:
Plugins->Only allow one FX-Chain window open at a time
Plugins->Open track FX-window on track selection change
Plugins->Only if any FX window is open

and I change selection of tracks, Reaper doesn't remember, when I have closed a VST-Plugin, that is opened in it's own window instead of the FX-Chain window. Instead, it reopens it again and again which is quite annoying, especially with large Plugin-windows

Bug 4: With the same settings as in Bug 3: The FX-window is only updated, when I do track-selection-change with tracks 1 to n. It does not change, when I select the Master track. This leads me often to change plugin-settings in the wrong track, while I wanted to change the Master-track-plugins.

Bug 5: In the Region/Edit-marker-window: When I click into an editable field, the whole text is selected. But: if I click again into the text to position the cursor, I get kicked out of the "editmode" again. It should delete the textselection and position the editcursor into the text instead(it makes me nuts all the times I use markers...)

Seems to be a Windows-only-problem, according to some Mac-Users I talked to.

Bug 6: Not sure if this has been fixed yet, but Media Items are were set offline, when I chose a different application. Not sure, if it's a bug or nothing major...

Bug 7: there are some Lua-functions missing. for example: string.gfind(), table.getn() (though I'm not sure, if this has been removed). (In the video, I had module as well, but as this is deprecated in Lua, it's not among the missing commands...)

Bug 8: When I have maximum peak, I get a red square in the levelmeters with the peak-value written above it. On the meter of the master-track however, the peak value is only partially written above the red square, partially outside of it. This makes it hard to read, with some color-settings even unreadable. It would be better, if the peak-value is fulle "backgrounded" by the red-peak-square.

Bug 9: In the Project Settings-window: when I select the default pitch shifting mode, the selection of "pitch shifter parameters" disappears often(not always) either partially or completely.

It reappears however, when I click on it.

Bug 10: Similar to Bug 2 - When I have set automatic FadeIn/FadeOut, I zoom into the project, at split items, at some point of zoom-level, the fadeins/fadeouts become smaller than what I have set in the prefs.



PS: Out of curiosity, when I have multiple instances of a Reascript running, how can I find out, which instance a given script is? reaper.get_action_context() seems not to give me that information...

[Edgemeal]

Originally Posted by mespotine

Bug 6: Not sure if this has been fixed yet, but Media Items are were set offline, when I chose a different application. Not sure, if it's a bug or nothing major...

Not a bug,
Preferences > Media > [X] Set media items offline when app is not active.

[ferropop]

I made this video to explain what I find weird about the latching behaviour right now. If I'm still not understanding something here I'll happily bugger off, it just doesn't make sense to me. In my mind, the point of getting rid of the envelope is because it's literally sitting there between AI for no reason when the param could just latch the values between the AI.

This shows how it changes its value in a strange way.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0By...010ZHNONEtkVEE

[mpl]

Originally Posted by mccrabney

mpl's script doesn't apply to Volume, Pan, and other TCP controls anyway so a more complete function for "create AI for last touched" would be very helpful

Hmm maybe I can deal with that using Undo_CanUndo2() and GetLastTouchedTrack() APIs (though I`ll parse last action name, so it will fails for non-English interfaces)

[schwa]

From our testing, and feedback here, it seems like the automation item chasing behavior is causing more problems than it is solving.

For the next build we are going to try something different. In "envelope bypassed outside of automation items" mode, by default, parameters will always return to the last value that was physically set by the user, as has been suggested a couple of times up-thread. The parameters will remain "live" outside of automation items, but any time you move a knob, that changes the baseline value that will be restored outside of automation items.

That way, automation items will act like somebody grabbing the parameter knob away from you, but giving it back to you in the state you left it. There will also be an option not to restore this baseline value, in which case automation items will act like somebody grabbing the parameter knob away from you and leaving it in whatever state they let go.