Old 07-12-2021, 09:52 AM   #1
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Default v6.32+dev0712 - July 12 2021

v6.32+dev0712 - July 12 2021
  • * Includes feature branch: MIDI editor note reordering
  • * Includes feature branch: media item lanes
  • + Dockers: fix FX chain docker restoration when loading projects (requires re-save of existing projects)
  • + FX: allow pin mapper dialog to be very large when first opened if the track has many channels
  • + FX: remove global option for plugin bridging, bridging options should be controlled per-plugin via FX browser
  • + JSFX: ensure IDE is not completely offscreen when showing [t=255478]
  • + Media item properties: improve sizing behavior with scrollbar visible
  • + ReaScript: add GetSetMediaTrackInfo support for getting/setting track VU mode
  • + Render: don't display file extension during dry-run render
  • + Theme: fix customizing master track VU readout text color in TCP [t=255486]
  • + Track VU: support metering RMS, LUFS-M, or LUFS-S
  • + Wildcards: fix $namenumber wildcard [t=255473]
  • # Render: fix format output display when normalizing stems to master but not rendering master
  • # Render: handle UTF-8 correctly when right-justifying filenames in stats
This thread is for pre-release features discussion. Use the Feature Requests forum for other requests.

Changelog - Pre-Releases

Generated by X-Raym's REAPER ChangeLog to BBCode
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Old 07-12-2021, 09:59 AM   #2
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+ Track VU: support metering RMS, LUFS-M, or LUFS-S
Very handy
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Old 07-12-2021, 10:09 AM   #3
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I'm curious if we can get something like MCP or TCP for monitoring effects? I really love the embedded JS metering functionality, and I love the monitor FX functionality - I just wish I could put these features together. Set up my monitoring FX once, dock it in my main window, and be done with it.
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Old 07-12-2021, 10:39 AM   #4
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+ Track VU: support metering RMS, LUFS-M, or LUFS-S

Thanks for this!

Any reason it shows as mono? Hopefully this is just the first iteration

I recall stereo being an option for the master mixer but would be great if tracks can have the option of being stereo or ideally multichannel (at least for RMS).

Not being able to see rms on multichannel stops this being useful for film work which is a place where integrated meter readings are very useful

Also. For live recording. An option to have the meter showing rms but have the readout showing peak would be great (so we can easily see clipping)

Right now, clipping doesn't even show up as red on the channel.
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Old 07-12-2021, 11:52 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by musicbynumbers View Post
[*]+ Render: don't display file extension during dry-run render
Great, looks clearer.

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[*]+ Track VU: support metering RMS, LUFS-M, or LUFS-S
Nice but the meters disappear when selecting a track.
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Old 07-12-2021, 11:54 AM   #6
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Nice but the meters disappear when selecting a track.
Guessing you have the preference set to automatically record-arm tracks when selecting? A record-armed track will always show peaks on the meter.
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Old 07-12-2021, 11:55 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by alexgameaudio View Post
I'm curious if we can get something like MCP or TCP for monitoring effects? I really love the embedded JS metering functionality, and I love the monitor FX functionality - I just wish I could put these features together. Set up my monitoring FX once, dock it in my main window, and be done with it.
+1!

Alternatively, I have made a FR a while back about adding the monitoring FX chain as a section on the master MCP/TCP, which would serve the same purpose: https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=253883
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Old 07-12-2021, 11:58 AM   #8
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  • + Track VU: support metering RMS, LUFS-M, or LUFS-S
Oh, great!
For the loudness readout in TCP and MCP, I tried to Set the color in rtconfig.

TCP:
readout.color (Peak) is working in both horizontal AND vertical VU.

TCP:
rmsreadout.color (Loudness) is working in vertical VU, but NOT if displayed horizontally (as in the Default theme)

MCP:
both readout colors are working as expected in Track and Master VU.
*Edit 07-13:
Just discovered if VU is displayed horizontally (eg. multichannel and compact mixer height), the rmsreadout.color isn't working either. So, not working for any horz. meters in tcp/mcp.

Quote:
  • + Theme: fix customizing master track VU readout text color in TCP [t=255486]
TCP Master:
readout.color AND rmsreadout.color are working (again), in both horz. AND vert. VU.


.

Last edited by PhelixK; 07-13-2021 at 09:48 AM. Reason:
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Old 07-12-2021, 12:07 PM   #9
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Guessing you have the preference set to automatically record-arm tracks when selecting? A record-armed track will always show peaks on the meter.
Yes you are right, turning record arming off makes the meters appear.

However I don't even see peaks, no meters at all. I guess that is because it switches to input metering as opposed to output metering? That makes little sense when the input is MIDI in my opinion..
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Old 07-12-2021, 12:42 PM   #10
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Yes you are right, turning record arming off makes the meters appear.

However I don't even see peaks, no meters at all. I guess that is because it switches to input metering as opposed to output metering? That makes little sense when the input is MIDI in my opinion..
Is the behavior of +dev0712 different from the behavior of previous versions when a track is record-armed?
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Old 07-12-2021, 01:10 PM   #11
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+1!

Alternatively, I have made a FR a while back about adding the monitoring FX chain as a section on the master MCP/TCP, which would serve the same purpose: https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=253883
Kinda! I could see the value in that, but want to see if I can get this without having the master visible - i usually just keep it hidden, though now I'm using it for monitoring. Takes up a lot of unnecessary space for me, since I never change anything on my master track.
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Old 07-12-2021, 01:37 PM   #12
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Is the behavior of +dev0712 different from the behavior of previous versions when a track is record-armed?
Yes, also because it only affects the new loudness metering modes.

In standard peak mode (in +dev0712 as well as in all previous Reaper versions) I have always been able to see the peak levels from the playback of items in the arrange view and from VSTs when selecting tracks with auto rec arm active. At least when the input is set to MIDI (which it is 90% of the time on my tracks). Would have to check how it works with tracks that use an audio input as I don’t remember exactly. Can do tomorrow if neccessary.
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Old 07-12-2021, 02:46 PM   #13
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+ FX: allow pin mapper dialog to be very large when first opened if the track has many channels
Is this meant to address the situations where track has many channels and "Plug-in pin connector" window size is too small when opening it, requiring user to resize it each time, before making changes to routing?

If so, it does not yet solve the problem, as far as I've tested:





I suggest that as "Plug-in pin connector" window is opened, it is automatically expanded so that all channels and plug-in outputs are visible, and user does not need to resize it manually.

Perhaps that should be optional - but as someone who opens and closes that window a lot, and has to expand it much of the time, I'd very much welcome it expanding automatically.
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Old 07-12-2021, 02:46 PM   #14
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+ ReaScript: add GetSetMediaTrackInfo support for getting/setting track VU mode

Nice!

While you are in this function, we also recently noticed that there is no Get/Set Track lock state for this function. Would be handy to have!
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Old 07-12-2021, 02:48 PM   #15
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Is this meant to address the situations where track has many channels and "Plug-in pin connector" window size is too small when opening it, requiring user to resize it each time, before making changes to routing?

If so, it does not yet solve the problem, as far as I've tested:
What OS is that? Do you have the system display scaling set to something other than 100%?
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Old 07-12-2021, 03:04 PM   #16
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What OS is that? Do you have the system display scaling set to something other than 100%?
Windows 8.1 x64, system scaling at 149% (for cursors of old Adobe apps) for all displays, two 4K displays used


In REAPER's "Advanced UI/system settings":
[v] Scale UI elements of track/mixer panels, transport, etc, by: "1.50"
HiDPI mode: "Multimonitor aware (recommended)"
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Old 07-12-2021, 03:31 PM   #17
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[*]+ Track VU: support metering RMS, LUFS-M, or LUFS-S
Thank you!
Any chance this could be added to 'Preferences > Track/Send Defaults' (or similar) so we could set a default metering for new tracks (currently it's fixed to peak metering, no?).

Quote:
[*] * Includes feature branch: MIDI editor note reordering
Been pointed out several times that note reordering resets when switching to Piano roll and back to custom note view (by me and e.g. here) without any reply or change so far that I'm wondering if you're planning to leave it this way, I hope not tbh. edit: Or maybe there were just other things in development focus...

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Old 07-12-2021, 04:28 PM   #18
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+ Track VU: support metering RMS, LUFS-M, or LUFS-S
Thanks Devs, almost dropped my beer when I read that!
I'm insanely happy to see this feature here!

A few notes on this:
- Stereo option for RMS meter would be great.
- RMS, LUFS-M and LUFS-S are all pre-fader, despite pre-fader metering being switched off.
- A loudness meter offset (incl. definable min and max meter values) for track meters that is independent of the master meter would be great. Ideally I would like to be able to configure the track meters so that -18dB for RMS or -20dB for LUFS-M is my new 0dB. So we can do something like this:


Last edited by Zeno; 07-13-2021 at 02:45 AM.
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Old 07-12-2021, 11:18 PM   #19
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I’m not really sold on offsets on track meters.
In my opinion this is needed when aiming for a target level on a musical programme, but that’s clearly a dangerous practice on track basis, especially when dealing with percussive sounds.
And there are some implications that could be misleading due to people not understanding EBU R68-2000.
If the goal of this offset is gain staging, the maximum allowed peak level shoud be -9dBfs +/-3dB to compensate for user errors, so -6dBfs peak is your max peak value when aiming for -18dBfs RMS.

This can’t really be taken into account with only an RMS or LUFS meter and can lead to clipping on most percussive/hi frequency sound sources.

LUFS and RMS on separate tracks are very useful in multimedia productions, podcasts etc and in those situations you really want to read absolute values 😃

Maybe i misunderstood the point, but that’s just my humble opinion on this topic... 😀
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Old 07-13-2021, 02:55 AM   #20
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I think an offset can be useful in certain areas. For game audio work, definitely. Having the meters have the classic green/amber/red areas and be able to set a target LU would be faster "at a glance" for getting multiple sounds in the right ballpark.

And for some it would allow a rough emulation of VU metering.

It's not the end of the world if we don't get it but would be nice.

Multi channel metering is my main concern at the moment though (as an option).
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Old 07-13-2021, 03:44 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by bigjoe View Post
I’m not really sold on offsets on track meters.
In my opinion this is needed when aiming for a target level on a musical programme, but that’s clearly a dangerous practice on track basis, especially when dealing with percussive sounds.
And there are some implications that could be misleading due to people not understanding EBU R68-2000.
If the goal of this offset is gain staging, the maximum allowed peak level shoud be -9dBfs +/-3dB to compensate for user errors, so -6dBfs peak is your max peak value when aiming for -18dBfs RMS.

This can’t really be taken into account with only an RMS or LUFS meter and can lead to clipping on most percussive/hi frequency sound sources.

LUFS and RMS on separate tracks are very useful in multimedia productions, podcasts etc and in those situations you really want to read absolute values ��

Maybe i misunderstood the point, but that’s just my humble opinion on this topic... ��
Yes, your explanation is absolutely correct. Relying purely on a loudness meter when leveling percussive material is dangerous anyway, a meter offset doesn't change that. But nobody does that and there is a master meter for monitoring peaks, isn't there?

With a meter offset for loudness you can define a reference. That helps in the heat of the moment because with a -18 reference for 0, -6 first tells me more in describing the difference than -24.
And definable min and max meter values for loudness meters on tracks would allow to increase the meter resolution for the range that is important for the task.

Keep in mind that on a VU meter, for example, the range between -3 and +3 is about 50% of the meter. Since the meter values in Reaper are arranged linearly, this is hardly possible (unless the devs additionally focus on the various meter scales and ballistics), but an offset with definable min-/max values like in the picture above comes very close.

I mean, why not? The metering options is one of the few things I really miss in Reaper: Pro Tools: Metering options.
Very powerful, implemented for (almost) all possible audio applications.

Last edited by Zeno; 07-13-2021 at 04:55 AM.
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Old 07-13-2021, 06:57 AM   #22
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- Stereo option for RMS meter would be great.
As would be a mono option for peak meters.
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Old 07-13-2021, 09:47 AM   #23
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Edit to Post #8:
I just discovered if VU is displayed horizontally in the mixer (eg. multichannel using meter expansion and compact mixer height), the rmsreadout.color isn't working either. So, custom loudness readout color not working for any horz. track meters in TCP and MCP.

Also in present state, I think there's no clear indication of metering type on tracks, as we have in the mixer master. I suggest they re-use RMS bars from meter_strip_v_rms, furthermore a supplemental theme object: "meter_strip_h_rms", and for fall-back: VU RMS Meter top/middle/bottom theme-color.
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Old 07-13-2021, 12:54 PM   #24
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Yes, your explanation is absolutely correct. Relying purely on a loudness meter when leveling percussive material is dangerous anyway....
...
I mean, why not? The metering options is one of the few things I really miss in Reaper: Pro Tools: Metering options.
Very powerful, implemented for (almost) all possible audio applications.
Yes, i see your point, i was a ProTools user for a decade and i’m used to work with analog consoles and, on track basis it’s very uncommon to hit the meter over -2dbVU because of possible overloads and master bus bottleneck.
Snares and Kicks were touching -7VU on the loudest hits back in the days, and most of the time you and up not using half of the meter unless you where metering the master bus, that’s why british at BBC called the VU meter the “Virtually Useless Meter” and started using PPMs.
But that’s analog world.
Back to digital realm, yes, you absolutely can do whatever you want these days but i’d rather prefer a log scale with absolute values in dBfs instead of a relative scale.
I found ProTools VU meters utter garbage (just like the Profile and SC48 consoles ones...) the balistic feels off to me so i never used nothing but SPM.

I’m sorry for being annoying but that’s a BIG change, and if implemented shoud be given as an option, instead of a fixed meter (just like the crappy meters in S1...they are truly pointless).
And again, i feel like this kind of offset is most useful on master fader than on single tracks were you want to hit different targets for different assets (dialogue, BGM, SFX, Foleys etc...).

Last edited by bigjoe; 07-13-2021 at 12:56 PM. Reason: Typo
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Old 07-13-2021, 01:16 PM   #25
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if implemented shoud be given as an option, instead of a fixed meter.
Of course as an option!
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