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06-20-2018, 04:26 PM
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#1
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: West Tennessee
Posts: 1,146
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Ryzen and You
I know this seems to be a black hole discussion, and opinions vary greatly.
Just wondering if any of you have built a system with a newer Ryzen chipset, and if so, how does it perform in Reaper for you?
I may be looking to build a new system and use my laptop for other things, and am kicking around the idea of a Ryzen 7 2700, but i still don't understand exactly how Reaper does with multi core processing. Isn't most of what I would nee for Reaper single?
It does seem the Ryzen does great for video work, though.
I may just end up sticking with an i5 or i7, but I am always a sucker for the underdog...
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06-20-2018, 04:36 PM
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#2
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 516
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mykrobinson
I know this seems to be a black hole discussion, and opinions vary greatly.
Just wondering if any of you have built a system with a newer Ryzen chipset, and if so, how does it perform in Reaper for you?
I may be looking to build a new system and use my laptop for other things, and am kicking around the idea of a Ryzen 7 2700, but i still don't understand exactly how Reaper does with multi core processing. Isn't most of what I would nee for Reaper single?
It does seem the Ryzen does great for video work, though.
I may just end up sticking with an i5 or i7, but I am always a sucker for the underdog...
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I bought a Ryzen 7 2700 with 16 gigs of ram, two SSD, I also added a hard disk with a backup OS in case of failure of the default system drive, it works great.
__________________
Linux on AMD Processor, 16 gig ram,Reaper 6, 60 inch quad screen.
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06-21-2018, 02:11 AM
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#3
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 293
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I also have a Ryzen PC running Reaper - no issues at all. And its as stable as a rock.
__________________
url]www.pennysound.co.za[/url] (Free & commercial Omnisphere patches)
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06-21-2018, 05:45 AM
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#4
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: La Düsseldorf
Posts: 31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Plazma
I also have a Ryzen PC running Reaper - no issues at all. And its as stable as a rock.
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Same here. Great CPU. Go for it ^^
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08-06-2018, 03:50 PM
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#5
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 30
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Hey guys!
Thanks for reassurance...
I have used the ryzen 2700X for a few weeks on windows 10 and its kinda micro lagging all the time, not at all stable as a rock, witch is why i bought a new computer in the first place...
Template or sessions takes like 10 minutes to open, and im using ssd on OS and Reaper
Can you mabey help me make it work now i know it should..?
Ive tried disable windows defender but no luck.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plazma
I also have a Ryzen PC running Reaper - no issues at all. And its as stable as a rock.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grobsen
Same here. Great CPU. Go for it ^^
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CDS
I bought a Ryzen 7 2700 with 16 gigs of ram, two SSD, I also added a hard disk with a backup OS in case of failure of the default system drive, it works great.
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08-06-2018, 04:51 PM
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#6
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Brighton
Posts: 1,989
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@Casperfren In reaper preferences audio>buffering turn off core auto detection, and set it to one less, and see if that will improve performance. If this doesn't help, try disabling cpu's multithreading in bios.
If you are using a lot of sample libraries and you are not loading them from ssd, but from a slow hdd like 5200rpms, then it might take that long. How many tracks/instruments do you have to load?
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08-06-2018, 05:08 PM
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#7
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikComposer
@Casperfren In reaper preferences audio>buffering turn off core auto detection, and set it to one less, and see if that will improve performance. If this doesn't help, try disabling cpu's multithreading in bios.
If you are using a lot of sample libraries and you are not loading them from ssd, but from a slow hdd like 5200rpms, then it might take that long. How many tracks/instruments do you have to load?
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Thanks, will check! Also, im not that computersavy yet that im doing stuff in bios, but i guess i will have to learn. I saw a youtubevid that you should mabey update your drivers for ryzen.
Im mostly mixing and just have a bunch of plugins that take a lot of time to load, use some samples with trigger 2 but not by default, and other plugins load far slower than trigger 2
For example when i have all plugins engaged, when i change the playback-cursor i likes to micro lagg mabey 4 seconds, and the same with inserting some plugins.
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08-06-2018, 10:15 PM
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#8
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Krefeld, Germany
Posts: 14,685
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Casperfren
kinda micro lagging
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audio hardware and settings ?
-Michael
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08-07-2018, 02:07 AM
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#9
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Birmingham, UK
Posts: 1,125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikComposer
@Casperfren In reaper preferences audio>buffering turn off core auto detection, and set it to one less, and see if that will improve performance. If this doesn't help, try disabling cpu's multithreading in bios.
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Would this be Ryzen specific advice, or applicable to any multicore CPU?
Would this be your "default" advice for a multicore/Ryzen, or just advice to combat the OP's issue?
Cheers
__________________
"As long as I stay between the sun & my shadow, I guess I'm doing well."
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08-07-2018, 05:15 AM
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#10
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Brighton
Posts: 1,989
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Quote:
Originally Posted by somebodyelseuk
Would this be Ryzen specific advice, or applicable to any multicore CPU?
Would this be your "default" advice for a multicore/Ryzen, or just advice to combat the OP's issue?
Cheers
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General troubleshooting for multicore.
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08-07-2018, 05:15 AM
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#11
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mschnell
audio hardware and settings ?
-Michael
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Interface saffire 40 with 48k samplerate and ~350 total ms buffer
Its weird because the render-speed can go from 0.6 to 2X normal speed, that seems odd to me, and may be fixed by above advice, will have to see when i get to the computer
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08-07-2018, 07:39 AM
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#12
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Krefeld, Germany
Posts: 14,685
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Of course if render speed is slower than realtime for more than a time related to the latency you set, audio to listen to can't be glitch free generated.
So you need a faster computer or need to pre-render parts of your project by using the glue or subproject features.
-Michael
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08-07-2018, 07:47 AM
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#13
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mschnell
Of course if render speed is slower than realtime for more than a time related to the latency you set, audio to listen to can't be glitch free generated.
So you need a faster computer or need to pre-render parts of your project by using the glue or subproject features.
-Michael
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Yeah. That is not the main concern, its just that i suspect something is off because before i get to that point it seems to microlagg not really related to the load
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08-07-2018, 06:33 PM
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#14
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 492
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Ryzen 1800+ here. 16GB of RAM and a bunch of SSD's (no mechanicals here) The only thing I did was to install a bigger power supply (the damned thing had a 450W!!! WTF???) and reinstalled Windows over the OEM version that was there (no crapware that way) and it's been 100% trouble-free and super solid. And, I'm running a (supposedly cursed) Presonus Studio 192 here with USB3 and I've had no dropouts, no stutters and I use a lot of plugins, too.
Sorry to hear others have had problems- from everything I've seen, it almost always seems to be the fault of folks trying to run with an OEM OS with stupid things like Symantec on it. Get rid of that crap and it's a pretty danged awesome machine.
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08-08-2018, 01:25 PM
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#15
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 251
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mykrobinson
I know this seems to be a black hole discussion, and opinions vary greatly. Just wondering if any of you have built a system with a newer Ryzen chipset, and if so, how does it perform in Reaper for you?
.....
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I built a mini-ITX system with a Gigabyte mobo, Ryzen 7 1700, 32GB RAM, Hybrid and SSD drives, Windows 10 x64. Reaper and midi works great, love it.
__________________
Registered Reaper 6, AMD Ryzen 9 cpu, 128GB RAM, Windows 10 x64, MuseScore 3 and 4, VST libraries.
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08-08-2018, 01:31 PM
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#16
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 58
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I'm planning for Zen in my next build, only problem is dubious compatibility with Win7.
Initially at least. I'm in process of migrating everything to linux, possibly before January 14th 2020.
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08-09-2018, 12:31 PM
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#17
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 30
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Ive checked my cpu in resource monitor, and every core works equally, at ~30% cpu- load and 425 plugins, but the sound i broken up, i have default 200 ms in reaper, is this normal behaviour? It works if i raise the buffer to like 1 sec or so, but i think its weird when the cpu is only at 30%
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08-09-2018, 12:40 PM
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#18
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Casperfren
Ive checked my cpu in resource monitor, and every core works equally, at ~30% cpu- load and 425 plugins, but the sound i broken up, i have default 200 ms in reaper, is this normal behaviour? It works if i raise the buffer to like 1 sec or so, but i think its weird when the cpu is only at 30%
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Check buffering tab in Preferences and tick Allow live multiprocessing on n-CPU (leave the default value there)
This should help
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08-09-2018, 12:57 PM
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#19
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew479
Check buffering tab in Preferences and tick Allow live multiprocessing on n-CPU (leave the default value there)
This should help
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That is on by default. and it says 8 cores, witch is what i have
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08-09-2018, 01:27 PM
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#20
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Casperfren
That is on by default. and it says 8 cores, witch is what i have
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Try right-clicking in Performance meter and select show realtime (RT) CPU.
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08-09-2018, 01:44 PM
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#21
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew479
Try right-clicking in Performance meter and select show realtime (RT) CPU.
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That is displaying 130%, atleast it makes sense
This is really strange, i raised the buffer and now RT CPU is about 4 %, then when i pause, after a few sec the cpu goes up tp 3000% when nothing is playing, and that is what i mean with micro freezing...
Last edited by Casperfren; 08-09-2018 at 01:50 PM.
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08-09-2018, 04:44 PM
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#22
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Ireland
Posts: 225
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If you have the below settings in your bios,
disable them,
* Global C-State control
* AMD cool'n'quiet
see if that helps.
You might then tell reaper to use only half of the available
cores on your chip, that way it might spring into life instead
of thrashing and wasting time sharing the load with all the cores.
Also make sure you have everything else, programs, notifications,
screen saver, usb suspend, hdd suspend, sleep, hibernate and turn off
screen all disabled or set to no, turn off wireless and networking,
these things all interrupt the processor and can cause glitches,
turn off windows update, anti virus, and any other programs that update
automatically.
I think you wrote it takes ten minutes to load a project, that does
not make for a good computing experience.
Are all your plugins 64 bit, if not that is more trouble,
If you’ve configured your audio program to use 64-bit audio and you use
a plugin that only supports 32-bit audio the host program will need to down
convert the samples to 32-bit before sending them to the plugin and then up
convert the result back to 64-bit. There are two problems here – you’ve lost
the audio quality you were trying to maintain by using 64-bit audio but
more importantly you’ve introduced two extra steps in the audio pipeline
(i.e: more work to do), as you can see, lots to ponder about, and were only
scratching the surface.
Last edited by Greenerpastures; 08-09-2018 at 05:15 PM.
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08-09-2018, 05:44 PM
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#23
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenerpastures
If you have the below settings in your bios,
disable them,
* Global C-State control
* AMD cool'n'quiet
see if that helps.
You might then tell reaper to use only half of the available
cores on your chip, that way it might spring into life instead
of thrashing and wasting time sharing the load with all the cores.
Also make sure you have everything else, programs, notifications,
screen saver, usb suspend, hdd suspend, sleep, hibernate and turn off
screen all disabled or set to no, turn off wireless and networking,
these things all interrupt the processor and can cause glitches,
turn off windows update, anti virus, and any other programs that update
automatically.
I think you wrote it takes ten minutes to load a project, that does
not make for a good computing experience.
Are all your plugins 64 bit, if not that is more trouble,
If you’ve configured your audio program to use 64-bit audio and you use
a plugin that only supports 32-bit audio the host program will need to down
convert the samples to 32-bit before sending them to the plugin and then up
convert the result back to 64-bit. There are two problems here – you’ve lost
the audio quality you were trying to maintain by using 64-bit audio but
more importantly you’ve introduced two extra steps in the audio pipeline
(i.e: more work to do), as you can see, lots to ponder about, and were only
scratching the surface.
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Thanks. Looked for it, diddent find it. Again, this is like my 3:rd ever time in bios.
"You might then tell reaper to use only half of the available
cores on your chip, that way it might spring into life instead
of thrashing and wasting time sharing the load with all the cores."
Would that happen automaticly if i disabled the settings in bios, or do you mean tell reaper manually thet i only have 4 cores instead of 8?
Yes, it doesent make for a great computing experience, and its frustrating because that is why i spend alot of money on a computer instead of spending some money on it
Update:
Ive isolated the problem to the plugins.
When i playback it works fine
When i stop, after a while plugins starts to crackle a bit and my cpu does 1500% usage
When i playback, disable all plugins and stop, nothing bad happens
Last edited by Casperfren; 08-09-2018 at 06:04 PM.
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08-10-2018, 06:51 AM
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#24
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Ireland
Posts: 225
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Good to hear you have made progress, finding what plug-in is causing the
Trouble would be nice.
Yes, in reaper settings you can change the number of processors to us, but this is something
to experiment with, and can can go either way depending on what the running programs are
trying to accomplish.
The bios settings were to keep the computer from idling in different states, this causes lag when
processing resumes again, it takes time, in Linux one can prevent the processors from throttling down,
and you can get low latency kernels, stop drives and busses from sleeping, all sorts of tweaks.
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08-12-2018, 06:26 AM
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#25
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 30
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Alright, this might have been a bit of user error, i belive i have fixed it, and learned some stuff on the way.
In my template i had like 50% 32bit plugins on masterfader etc.
And by familiaricing myself with PDC plugin delay compensation, i realised that ProQ2:s linear High setting, is , really. High. And i had it on master and music master, i will try and run my next session with replaced 64 bit versions, realised they were 32 bit after setting dedicated process per plugin on in reaper.
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07-06-2019, 11:23 AM
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#26
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 30
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This has fixed everything for me now 1 year later
overcklocking my ram from 2400 to 3200, works perfect.
Not overusing acustica audio plugins
Now i can have buffersize at 50ms in the END of my project and therefore do good automation whenever i want in the mix, before it was on 500ms in the end.
Also my starting template is smaller, but still
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07-06-2019, 09:35 PM
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#27
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Banned
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 391
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mykrobinson
I know this seems to be a black hole discussion, and opinions vary greatly.
Just wondering if any of you have built a system with a newer Ryzen chipset, and if so, how does it perform in Reaper for you?
I may be looking to build a new system and use my laptop for other things, and am kicking around the idea of a Ryzen 7 2700, but i still don't understand exactly how Reaper does with multi core processing. Isn't most of what I would nee for Reaper single?
It does seem the Ryzen does great for video work, though.
I may just end up sticking with an i5 or i7, but I am always a sucker for the underdog...
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Mine works great.
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07-06-2019, 11:54 PM
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#28
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Near Cambridge UK and Near Questembert, France
Posts: 22,754
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@Casperfren: I bet all those plugs on the master bus werent helping things. I use a sort of sub-master bus for plugins at the "end of the line", which does away with any issues with plugins on the actual master bus.
Funny how this little issue seems to have just passed into folklore I.E. "You shouldnt put plugins directly on the master bus",
This got me wondering why the devs havent actually done something to resolve this... maybe I should do a feature request or indeed a bug report.
__________________
Ici on parles Franglais
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07-07-2019, 11:14 AM
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#29
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Sweden
Posts: 7,416
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ivansc
@Casperfren: I bet all those plugs on the master bus werent helping things. I use a sort of sub-master bus for plugins at the "end of the line", which does away with any issues with plugins on the actual master bus.
Funny how this little issue seems to have just passed into folklore I.E. "You shouldnt put plugins directly on the master bus",
This got me wondering why the devs havent actually done something to resolve this... maybe I should do a feature request or indeed a bug report.
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Is not the issue that the Master track cannot do PDC, and so if you put FX there that require PDC, things flunk? This is well-known and "by design", I guess.
The folklore should be: "Do not put plugins with PDC directly on the master bus"
__________________
// MVHMF
I never always did the right thing, but all I did wasn't wrong...
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07-07-2019, 12:21 PM
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#30
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 373
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3'rd gen Ryzen is out now.
AMD has caught up. IPC performance is impressive.
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07-07-2019, 02:04 PM
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#31
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 1,725
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Looks like my next processor.
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07-07-2019, 02:57 PM
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#32
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Liverpool, United Kingdom
Posts: 58
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How's the real-world latency these days due to the multiple Zen chips on the same dye? Referring to this: https://www.scan.co.uk/3xs/info/audio-pc-processor
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07-07-2019, 09:24 PM
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#33
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Krefeld, Germany
Posts: 14,685
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They seem not to speak about hyperthreading at all.
Of course this is hidden for the user, but regarding audio realtime performance IMHO hyperthreading is something to keep an eye on.
- Adding another core on the chip also adds a 1st level cache, another hyperthread on a core does not.
- an OS thread switching the core or the core / hyperthread working on another OS thread involves dumping part of the cache content.
- filling / writing back the cache can take much longer than actually working on the data, and it additionally hampers the memory performance of the other cores
- The OS might even be fooled by the double (virtual) core count and assign two OS threads to the hyperthreads of a single core, leaving other cores unassigned, and hence using only at most some 3/4 of the available CPU / cache power.
Hence using electronic resources for hyperthreading might not be a good idea for realtime processing (while it supposedly does improve the power consumption / performance ratio).
-Michael
Last edited by mschnell; 07-08-2019 at 05:42 AM.
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07-07-2019, 11:57 PM
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#34
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: India Mumbai
Posts: 816
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AMD ryzen -1950x, 16 core processor .3400MHZ clock .
64GB ram
Asustek Motherboard
6tb ssds.
works like a boss. can handle a mix session with 200 tracks on a Mix buffer of 512, even lesser at times
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07-08-2019, 12:12 AM
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#35
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 119
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RYZEN 7 2700 here
I just built my first PC with the Ryzen 7 2700. It runs flawlessly. Its benchmarking at almost 3500. ITS FAST AF. ASUS ROG strix b450 MOBO, Gigibyte radeon 580 gpu. Liquid cooled. I have been a die hard MAC guy for the past 13 yrs. My iMac took a shit 2 months ago and every single OS and update apple has come out with past 6 years has SUCKED. My i5 mac would bog down doing the simplest recording tasks. My iPhone even sucks. Half of the stuff on it doesn't work right. I wont even get into iPhones. So I said screw it and built my first PC myself from the ground up. The new zen2 Ryzen 3700's are blowing intels i9 out of the water. I actually just bought $6000 worth of AMD stocks. You might want to consider doing that as well. AMD is gonna blow up. The chips are faster and half the price. I will never use intel again.
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07-08-2019, 12:14 AM
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#36
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2019
Posts: 119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by C-H
3'rd gen Ryzen is out now.
AMD has caught up. IPC performance is impressive.
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They are blowing intel out of the water. I just bought $6000 in AMD stock. My ryzen 7 2700 KILLS
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07-08-2019, 12:18 AM
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#37
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 507
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Threadripper
I'm running a threadripper system.
It's been a fantastic system.... hoping I can upgrade to 64 core / 128 thread by the end of the year.
Last edited by blumpy; 07-08-2019 at 12:34 AM.
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07-08-2019, 02:36 AM
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#38
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Berlin
Posts: 11,817
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I'm eyeing the 12 and 16 core variants.
To me the most interesting aspect for audio work was the "doubled the Floating Point performance" bit for the 3000 series.
The 12-core variant costs as much as an Intel 9900K, but uses 40% less power(less cooling/PSU required). Even at 750, the proposed price for the 16-core variant in a few months, it's a damn steal. Intel only has it's ~$2000 chips to counter that.
So all I'm looking at now are benchmarks, but it certainly looks promising. All the reviews confirm that Intels single-core performance is equalized or even beaten. It remains to be seen what we can get from all this.
Btw, I primarily mix dialogue and do sound designs. My 6700K is aching a little from time to time. Up goes the buffer size(256 usually, 512 if necessary).
... and I have to check with RME whether or not the USB ports on the X570 boards work well with my Fireface UC.
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07-08-2019, 08:13 AM
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#39
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Near Cambridge UK and Near Questembert, France
Posts: 22,754
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fabian
Is not the issue that the Master track cannot do PDC, and so if you put FX there that require PDC, things flunk? This is well-known and "by design", I guess.
The folklore should be: "Do not put plugins with PDC directly on the master bus"
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Absolutely, but I honestly think it would be kinda nice if the Devs had a look at this to see if it is do-able WITH plugins that use PDC
__________________
Ici on parles Franglais
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07-08-2019, 09:09 AM
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#40
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 3,201
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I'd also like to see PDC on the monitoring effects.
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