Old 06-02-2017, 10:53 PM   #1
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Default RME vs Prism

Financially, ready to upgrade from Layla 3G Echoaudio PCI card AD/DA interface (2008). Test = asio4all drivers set at 68 samples. Echoaudio stopped updating software years ago. Me messing on guitar to show Layla 3g converters in action: Clean. Decent. Do the job. 74' Tele w/EMG 85's. NO FX except amp sim EQ or guitar pickup. Layla - Test gtr jam

Studio Needs:
1) Convert 4 tracks (Teac 3340S) 15ips analog reel tapes to digital
2) Send stereo mixes (with plugins) to analog racked Telefunken v672 (solid state) stereo then back to Reaper
3) Record guitars w/live or amp sims; quality clean vocals; bass DI

Power PC - do you sacrifice conversion quality going for low latency? Heard Zoom-UAC8 (USB3.0) low latency talked about here and then listened to it on Youtube. People here say it's converters could be better. Then there's RME. Loved by the best. Might just as well buy a prism Lyra 2. Or the Apogee Quartet + Macbook pro! Expectations: hundreds or thousands? /or keep the Laya 3G and buy bitcoins?

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Old 06-03-2017, 02:02 AM   #2
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There is a price difference between those two. RME all the way. It's good engineering. Has the best drivers - which is very important - and some nice software features. Their devices are there to stay, a long time.
USB3 is only necessary when you go in MADI range channel counts. No other advantage.
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Old 06-03-2017, 02:25 AM   #3
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Thanks. That's what I hear - RME has great support + engineering.

RME 802 is now 1700.00 - price drop - it's USB Type B = USB 3.0? 1 x FireWire 400, 1 x FireWire 800, 1 x USB Type B

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Old 06-03-2017, 02:48 AM   #4
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Interesting - how to turn a sata disk into thunderbolt w/mac

RME 802 Coldplay Tech - talking about RME w/Live Shows - "reliability - solid clocking - quality of the audio / driver is ideal - it's great"

Then there's Prism PRISM LYRA 2 - amazingly great demo - crisp / power - 2695.00

Prism Titan = 3,495.00 - mastering quality - great for analog reel digitization / live vocals / guitar amps

Have the money. Where do you draw the line? - All my studio gear actually goes up in value - at what point does it become a buy?

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Old 06-03-2017, 03:33 AM   #5
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Look at how long the drivers are updated. RME is almost forever. Even their oldest hardware still works with the current driver.

Apogee had that advantage too, since they used a driver built into OSX. But Apple decided to drop the Firewire part of the driver. Not good if you own an Apogee.

Don't know about Prism. Frankly don't know any users anymore. And when I did, it never impressed me, compared to other high-end converters. They're all pretty good, if you ask me.
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Old 06-03-2017, 03:47 AM   #6
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Another big thumbs up for RME from me. The heart of my studio is an RME Fireface UFX and that has been one of the best purchases I've made. It is rock solid, sounds great, has first class drivers and very useful features (Totalmix FX is brilliant).

I also own various Zoom products and while they're good value for money and quite well built, RME is in a totally different league.

You won't regret buying RME.

I've also had great results recording guitar direct into the instrument inputs of my Fireface and into various guitar sims. I'm particularly fond of the results through bx Bassdude. Instant blues tone satisfaction here!!
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Old 06-03-2017, 10:11 AM   #7
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Have the money. Where do you draw the line?
Then I would buy a digital RME interface of your choice and independent conversion - best of both worlds, good RME drivers and the sound you can reach with your money. If there is a possibility for raising channel counts it scales better. Especially you don't have any hassle with different sample offsets due to different interface routings...
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Old 06-03-2017, 11:06 AM   #8
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Wow. Alot of good to think about. Firm believer a song needs to sound good on a cheap speakers - even smart phone (no bass) - as well as in a car. Having great ADDA converters will push me to a new dimension. Will listen to more videos on the RME.

Prism - For month of JUNE 2017 - can get ATLAS (8 mic pres) for same price as Titan. 4000.00 USD

RME vs Prism

Prism converters are "stunning" - even on youtube videos - but the usb software is reported to be shady. Then RME is said to be great but super complex to use. When spending this kind on money, maybe I ought to visit a studio that has an RME or a Prism and talk with the engineer - good points / things to watch out for. Really concerned about quality recording for acoustic guitar / vocals. Interesting to see how rock blues guitars - especially mic'd live with real amps - turn out with better converters. Noise is noise. Now the Telefunken V76 unit I use separates odd from even harmonics. Going from card based breakout box (Layla3G) to usb / firewire recording interface. Huge difference.

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Old 06-03-2017, 12:50 PM   #9
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Interesting the Prism Atlas does have an alt rout to a host computer - bypassing USB - Only for ProTools - Not Reaper!!

Multichannel Digital Input and Output (MDIO) expansion
Atlas & Titan support Prism Sound’s MDIO expansion cards, which provide alternative “host” connections. The “host” is usually a computer and the Atlas or Titan interface provides a means of connection between the host and the external analogue and digital audio I/O ports.

Without the MDIO expansion card fitted, the host connection would always be the default USB connection.

The MDIO expansion slot provides an alternative host connection. It does not necessarily disable the USB port, but in the case of the Pro Tools interface MDIO-PTHDX, the USB port is switched off when the Pro Tools interface is to be used.


Atlas Reference

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Old 06-03-2017, 01:04 PM   #10
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Stunning between two already expensive and good converters is a red flag of confirmation bias which does tend to run wild and unchallenged there. Better stated is there is no 2000.00 difference to be had.

I do agree with Dave, RME + TotalMix is pretty much fantastic. I have three RME devices (Fireface 800, Fireface UFX, Babyface Pro), all are rock solid and great. I also agree about the Zoom stuff, it's great econo stuff, it has it's moments but does the job. I have an H4N and Q8.
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Old 06-03-2017, 01:11 PM   #11
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Power PC - do you sacrifice conversion quality going for low latency?
First, understand that the only use for low latency is live sound or live performance work. Live performance being playing through the Reaper board with plugins (like an amp sim or MIDI instruments).

If you are doing live sound work, you need a total round trip latency for the system of < 11ms. Anything higher isn't a "compromise". It's a "this thing doesn't work and I can't play" situation.

If you're doing live work, you need an interface that supports lower latency at a reasonable block size. You don't want to be pushing your system with a 64 sample block size to just barely make < 11ms and have no headroom left for a few heavier plugins. Look to firewire or thunderbolt for lower latency.

If you are just mixing and/or your recording monitoring is handled by the mixer built into your interface (the SOP approach), then you can shop for fidelity of the AD/DA converters first and whatever the minimum latency of the device is is a moot point. You're setting the block size to 1024 samples anyway for system headroom.

Need both (max fidelity and lowest latency)? Now you get your wallet out and look at RME, Apogee, or Prism.
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Old 06-03-2017, 02:11 PM   #12
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Interesting the Prism Atlas does have an alt rout to a host computer - bypassing USB - Only for ProTools - Not Reaper!!

Multichannel Digital Input and Output (MDIO) expansion
Atlas & Titan support Prism Sound’s MDIO expansion cards, which provide alternative “host” connections. The “host” is usually a computer and the Atlas or Titan interface provides a means of connection between the host and the external analogue and digital audio I/O ports.

Without the MDIO expansion card fitted, the host connection would always be the default USB connection.

The MDIO expansion slot provides an alternative host connection. It does not necessarily disable the USB port, but in the case of the Pro Tools interface MDIO-PTHDX, the USB port is switched off when the Pro Tools interface is to be used.


Atlas Reference
MDIO is 802.3. A synchronous serial protocol for 10 Gb networks. It's another solution, but to me, it's at least a strange one now that Dante is growing fast and AVB ethernet should be getting somewhere. RME is going for Ethernet AVB, I think.

And those that do really high channel counts (>128) at high SR, seem to rely on MADI. But that depends a little on routing needs.
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Old 06-03-2017, 02:25 PM   #13
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How do I measure latency when recording guitar with amp sims in Reaper?

Bonus - found this link TT Dynamic Range Meter download (zip file) 32bit VST, while checking out live sound recording / mastering.

Will be reading - rereading / checking YouTube videos - what people are writing. It took years to get a powerful PC, and it's completely night / day experience: recording multiple subbuses with simultaneous plugins / sidechains vs imagining what final mixes might sound like while mixing down one plugin / track at a time. For an external unit, USB 3 seems wtg. Asus Z97-A motherboard is Thunderbolt ready, but cards can't be found.

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Old 06-03-2017, 03:29 PM   #14
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I also agree about the Zoom stuff, it's great econo stuff, it has it's moments but does the job. I have an H4N and Q8.
Agree, and one other reason I'd hesitate to use a Zoom product as a figurehead of a rig is that when oddities in Zoom products are discovered, some irritating, some nearly dealkillers, they tend to not fix what could be fixed in a timely manner with updates. Eventually a new model is out without the issue and that's where it stands. My experience with Zoom support hasn't been bad at all, but firmware/software/driver updates for the working recordist are definitely not their strong suit.

I'm not so worried about things like that when I'm buying a stompbox (love my Zoom B1Xon), but for a main interface I'd go RME.
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Old 06-03-2017, 04:48 PM   #15
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Listening tests -

RME Babyface Pro - Audio Test - YouTube - micpre not RME in recording
RME Sessions - Nick and the Sun Machine - Mountain -
Guitarist test - Preamp shootout (Metric Halo, Focusrite, RME, Zoom, Tascam)
Prism Sound Orpheus (47) - AK-47 - by School - I like this - open / present - vocals / guitar / drums / bass / keys

RME UFX+ USB3.0 = 2799.00. Prism Atlas = SAME PRICE as Titan for June 2017 = 3500.00 to 4000.00. Still, alot to spend. Difference between RME / Prism = 600.00 to 1000.00. The sound on Prism is better that RME. To me at least. The Zoom (using a separate mic/mic pre - not the built in mic) is better than the RME. RME Babyface Pro using separate mic/micpre is good. Prism is better than Zoom. Both Prism and Zoom are very good. Zoom doesn't have inputs / outputs to work with. RME converters seem to be needing something more.

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Old 06-03-2017, 09:19 PM   #16
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if you really dig into ebay you will find the 802 now and then for a little over half price... and I'm talking a brand new, fully waranteed unit...

RME is the way to go IMO
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Old 06-03-2017, 10:59 PM   #17
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Musical Instruments & Gear>Pro Audio Equipment>Audio/MIDI Interfaces>
RME Audio Fireface 802
“Less than 1 year old. Flawless condition and superior operation”
Ended: May 09, 2017 , 8:59PM
Sold for:US $999.99
eBay item number:172667240451


Didn't see a brand new unit 1/2 price - still the above is a good deal.
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Old 06-04-2017, 12:13 AM   #18
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I have a UAC-8 and like it, but RME is probably "better" overall.
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Old 06-04-2017, 04:22 AM   #19
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If you're doing live work, you need an interface that supports lower latency at a reasonable block size. You don't want to be pushing your system with a 64 sample block size to just barely make < 11ms and have no headroom left for a few heavier plugins. Look to firewire or thunderbolt for lower latency.
I know that you know that there are USB interfaces (for example the ones discussed in this thread) that have better round trip latency at the same sample rate and buffer size than some Firewire or Thunderbolt interfaces. You keep saying this same inaccurate thing, and you keep ignoring PCIe, which is the best for low latency and performance. Because it's not in the Appleverse you inhabit and promote.
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Old 06-04-2017, 04:40 AM   #20
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I know that you know that there are USB interfaces (for example the ones discussed in this thread) that have better round trip latency at the same sample rate and buffer size than some Firewire or Thunderbolt interfaces. You keep saying this same inaccurate thing, and you keep ignoring PCIe, which is the best for low latency and performance. Because it's not in the Appleverse you inhabit and promote.
Do you know any other USB interface that can show the low latency Zoom has accomplished? I don't.

Makes you wonder why the other interface builders seem incapable of showing the same low latency.

But it's undeniable that Zoom seems to make the biggest progress of all in driver dev. Way back when the R16 was new, they were kind of struggling.
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Old 06-04-2017, 05:31 AM   #21
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I know that you know that there are USB interfaces (for example the ones discussed in this thread) that have better round trip latency at the same sample rate and buffer size than some Firewire or Thunderbolt interfaces. You keep saying this same inaccurate thing, and you keep ignoring PCIe, which is the best for low latency and performance. Because it's not in the Appleverse you inhabit and promote.
The "Appleverse" supports those too. I used to use pci interfaces. I was trying to write a general comment.

I wanted to make these points:

1. Understand if you even need to run your system at low latency. This comment because "low latency" is thrown around like a buzz word now and you get people dialing their latency down using up their processing power and... then they were just mixing and never monitoring live inputs in real time.

2. In general, firewire and thunderbolt are the lower latency supporting choices. By all means mention your favorite USB or PCI choices you know make the cut.

Also nowadays the desktop model machines with PCI slots are the more expensive setups. People don't usually invest in those outside of pro video work. But I probably should have still mentioned PCI in my comment. Not nearly as many of this style interface made anymore. Back in the day it was the only choice.

There's a latency round up thread thread. Look at the USB interfaces there. Most can only let you dial the system down to between 10 & 11ms with a 64 sample buffer. Yeah, you could pull it off with careful plugin choices. All I'm saying is that if live low latency work is your main goal, set yourself up with more headroom than that out of the box. If you can come in below 11ms with a 128 sample buffer, you're golden for just about any plugins.

I've been pissing and moaning about Apple dropping their pro line of machines and releasing sloppy versions of OSX for a couple years now. I'm thinking I'm not going to be getting that promoter gig.

What I'm a little fuzzy on and need to research more are the networking options. This is more for larger systems as well but it's clearly the direction this system is going in.
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Old 06-04-2017, 05:35 AM   #22
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Do you know any other USB interface that can show the low latency Zoom has accomplished? I don't.

Makes you wonder why the other interface builders seem incapable of showing the same low latency.

But it's undeniable that Zoom seems to make the biggest progress of all in driver dev. Way back when the R16 was new, they were kind of struggling.
Uhm the RME UCX? It has that super low latency since years. That thing by Slate comes to mind too. Also Zoom's marketing text on their website gives me creeps, especially regarding better performance due to USB3 with less then 20 channel.

Real low latency? Use PCI-Express or Thunderbold .
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Old 06-04-2017, 06:11 AM   #23
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The "Appleverse" supports those too. I used to use pci interfaces. I was trying to write a general comment.
Via adapters that go through additional protocols... not ideal. Not native.
Quote:
I wanted to make these points:

1. Understand if you even need to run your system at low latency. This comment because "low latency" is thrown around like a buzz word now and you get people dialing their latency down using up their processing power and... then they were just mixing and never monitoring live inputs in real time.

2. In general, firewire and thunderbolt are the lower latency supporting choices. By all means mention your favorite USB or PCI choices you know make the cut.
No, PCIe is the lowest latency protocol. Thunderbolt adds latency at the hardware level per jump... this is irrespective of measured latency, it means that it's always going to be possible to have a more efficient PCIe interface. It looks like Thunderbolt performance is reduced compared to PCIe under load too.

There are crappy Firewire and crappy USB interfaces when it comes to latency. There are USB interfaces that perform better than Firewire/Thunderbolt systems. As with all technical products, the devil is in the detail and going for a interface that uses one connection protocol over another purely on that basis is missing the point altogether.
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Also nowadays the desktop model machines with PCI slots are the more expensive setups. People don't usually invest in those outside of pro video work. But I probably should have still mentioned PCI in my comment. Not nearly as many of this style interface made anymore. Back in the day it was the only choice.
Why are you going on about PCI when we are talking about PCIe? Every desktop computer made today has PCIe slots you can plug things into... apart from Macs. Which are the most expensive price/performance computers you can buy.
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There's a latency round up thread thread. Look at the USB interfaces there. Most can only let you dial the system down to between 10 & 11ms with a 64 sample buffer. Yeah, you could pull it off with careful plugin choices. All I'm saying is that if live low latency work is your main goal, set yourself up with more headroom than that out of the box. If you can come in below 11ms with a 128 sample buffer, you're golden for just about any plugins.
Have a look at the variable Firewire results too. What you are saying is that there are slow 4 wheeled vehicles so if you want to go fast you should buy a motorbike.
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I've been pissing and moaning about Apple dropping their pro line of machines and releasing sloppy versions of OSX for a couple years now. I'm thinking I'm not going to be getting that promoter gig.
But you love them, in an adorable way. That's okay, but there are other websites where the outpourings are appreciated and returned.
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What I'm a little fuzzy on and need to research more are the networking options. This is more for larger systems as well but it's clearly the direction this system is going in.
Yes, that seems good. Probably the adapters required on the Mac side will degrade the performance though.
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Old 06-04-2017, 06:53 AM   #24
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Sorry, miscommunication. I was abbreviating PCIe to PCI. My bad.

I was only referring to PCIe above.

re: "Via adapters that go through additional protocols"
Is this based off the miscommunication? I've never seen any indication that PCIe slots on Apple desktop models are adapted or converted. If you meant adapted from thunderbolt for laptop users, that's kind of where my omission of mentioning PCIe came from. (ie. thinking most folks have laptops these days)

I like many Apple machines produced between 1996 - 2012 that I've had my hands on yes. Adorable? Alright...

Fair enough that I should have mentioned PCIe (and possibly first in the list).

Remember when PCIx was changed to PCIe and Protools users eyes got real big and smoke started coming out their ears?
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Old 06-04-2017, 09:11 AM   #25
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Uhm the RME UCX? It has that super low latency since years. That thing by Slate comes to mind too. Also Zoom's marketing text on their website gives me creeps, especially regarding better performance due to USB3 with less then 20 channel.

Real low latency? Use PCI-Express or Thunderbold .
What was the slate interface using? I seem to remember it wasn't USB?

And, yes, RME's UCX and a few other RME USB based interfaces can do it too. But I was thinking of the lesser gods. Like Focusrite, Tascam, Steinberg...
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Old 06-04-2017, 09:26 AM   #26
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What was the slate interface using? I seem to remember it wasn't USB?

And, yes, RME's UCX and a few other RME USB based interfaces can do it too. But I was thinking of the lesser gods. Like Focusrite, Tascam, Steinberg...
True, the Slate one didn't used USB, forgot about that.

The irony with Steinberg: they once sold a Steinberg labelled interface engineered by RME but since they were bought by Yamaha that collaboration is history.
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Old 06-04-2017, 10:29 AM   #27
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Do you know any other USB interface that can show the low latency Zoom has accomplished? I don't.
As mentioned RME, and going by serr's criteria (less than 11ms at 44.1kHz/128 sample, the buffer size he runs at with roughly that latency) interfaces from these manufacturers would suit(mostly)....

RME
Mackie
Zoom
Avid
Audient
Presonus

((mostly) from here.)

Prism Orpheus firewire doesn't meet this criteria with 13ms. Other firewire interfaces don't either. It's impossible to tell what's good or bad just from the interface type. Which is my point, not the USB is superior, but that it's not inferior and what interfaces are better can only be ascertained on a per product basis.
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Makes you wonder why the other interface builders seem incapable of showing the same low latency.

But it's undeniable that Zoom seems to make the biggest progress of all in driver dev. Way back when the R16 was new, they were kind of struggling.
Yes, they outsourced/licensed their drivers/firmware from another Japanese company. Incidentally, I read that you can get 30 microsecond round trip latency (for just a message to and from a device) with USB3.

To put that into perspective, Thunderbolt adds at least 10 microseconds per device to whatever the round trip latency would be with PCIe. That's more than the entire round trip to a graphics card for CUDA data transfer discussed here...

https://devtalk.nvidia.com/default/t...o-decrease-it/

(scroll past the slow EEC memory (Mac Pro is an example of a computer that uses this memory) to see the real/fast results).

And preliminary testing from DAWbench is indicating that the performance of Thunderbolt is more like USB than PCIe in terms of load on system/performance under load.

(edit: I'm not sure if that's a total of 10 microseconds per device or 10 out, 10 in = 20)
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Old 06-04-2017, 10:55 AM   #28
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Incidentally, I read that you can get 30 microsecond round trip latency (for just a message to and from a device) with USB3.

To put that into perspective, Thunderbolt adds at least 10 microseconds per device to whatever the round trip latency would be with PCIe. That's more than the entire round trip to a graphics card for CUDA data transfer discussed here...

And preliminary testing from DAWbench is indicating that the performance of Thunderbolt is more like USB than PCIe in terms of load on system/performance under load.
So you are telling by the bigger bandwith of USB3 you can get lower latency? Because that's a diametral standpoint to what the RME guys are telling everyone who asks why only the high channel count devices get USB3 - no advantage with low data rate.
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Old 06-04-2017, 11:23 AM   #29
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So you are telling by the bigger bandwith of USB3 you can get lower latency? Because that's a diametral standpoint to what the RME guys are telling everyone who asks why only the high channel count devices get USB3 - no advantage with low data rate.
It's nothing to do with the bandwidth and just something I read on Stack Overflow when I was looking into USB3 latency...

https://stackoverflow.com/questions/...ncy-of-usb-3-0

See the first answer (and the comment to it which alludes to 50 microseconds). That's an average for a message, I don't know how that translates into reliable real time data transfer to and from an audio interface. I do know that my USB interface has a 1.1ms roundtrip latency at 192kHz/32 samples, which is only 0.6ms or so over the 32+32 samples + AD/DA convertor latency.

But this is the audio world, where Studio One introduces a low latency mode that increases latency and people talk about how it sounds more like hardware. There's really very little hope once a couple of manufacturers have said that X is better because they want to sell more boxes.
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Old 06-04-2017, 11:29 AM   #30
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The problem is that only a limited subset of hardware developers understand latency. Or even care. Have you ever seen an Asian design shop? Me wouldn't wanna work there, bwana.

Higher throughput doesn't necessarily mean lower latency. It all depends on the hardware at hand.

From past experience with latency (not even audio latency), I'd say RME probably knows what they're doing. I see other serial interfaces performing better with USB 1.1 than with faster ports. The manufacturing industry has known that for ages. In these environments, old ports die very, very slow. Still lots of USB 1.1 devices around.

And look what happened to the USB Audio class spec. Painless in version 1. Not so evident in USB 2 audio class. And a completely wrecked standard in the USB3 version. So bad, MS decided to drop it altogether in Win 10.

Quote:
As mentioned RME, and going by serr's criteria (less than 11ms at 44.1kHz/128 sample, the buffer size he runs at with roughly that latency) interfaces from these manufacturers would suit(mostly)....

RME
Mackie
Zoom
Avid
Audient
Presonus
Mackie's out. Driver updates!
Avid's out. Corporate rubbish. Besides, very mediocre hardware.

That leaves Audient and Presonus. I've always liked Presonus. Help is available and their drivers last a long time too. Only, it's a bit of a jungle to find the right one. At least on a Mac.

Audient announces 1.6 ms. Great! Or not? It's the latency when you use "zero latency monitoring" in their interfaces. Roundtrip latency is 7ms at 44.1k with 64s ASIO buffer, according to the Slutz. Pretty good in my book. But i'm not laying awake with latency nightmares.

Audient notes 4.24ms at 96k with a 32 sample buffer. At 44.1k it's 6.33ms. That's pretty low. But hardly anybody seems to be able to achieve these numbers...

FWIW. Serr's number, as a ballpark, is what it should be. You'll see 15 msec, but I know that's an old number. Too many people who can hear 15 msec. Hec, I know a couple that perform less when dealing with 9 msec. Is this the performer's problem? I don't think so...

Again, FWIW. The same thing happens with network chips and almost any port in or out of the computer. If your computer doesn't have anything but USB. Use it. Yeah, PCIe is better, if it works for you. Choice of cards is a bit limited and laptops are out. That makes Thunderbolt a somewhat viable alternative.
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Old 06-04-2017, 04:19 PM   #31
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Too many people who can hear 15 msec.
I would think so since ~10 ms is the general threshold where two distinct hits meld in to one, just below that is where musical feel lives so even when you can't hear it, you feel it. However, somewhere under 3-5, we start imagining things and latency becomes very irrelevant because we are getting within the time it takes for the instruments sound to travel from your hands to your ears even without a computer involved. The only possible need for less there is to account for other places latency still makes its way in and gets added to it, bringing it back to being noticeable.
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Old 06-04-2017, 06:44 PM   #32
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Can anyone give me perspective how the EchoAudio Layla3G PCI sound card matches up to the RME interfaces? Or even Prism or Zoom? Like to get a sense of where my card fits in the sound converter timeline. Sound seems clean. Hard to tell from YouTube Videos what sound may really be re: converters. Anyone have a RME recording online that shows the quality of the ADDA conversion? Thanks.

Last 2 days underwater reinstalling fresh win 10 pro / Creator's version - now back to hear more.
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Old 06-04-2017, 07:01 PM   #33
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Put a sound in both channels in stereo and then add a delay to just one of them. Start increasing the delay starting at zero. You'll hear Haas effect up until about 11ms and then it splits into two images.
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Old 06-04-2017, 09:01 PM   #34
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Marc JB - Producer Profiles - RME Fireface UFX+

12:10 - Perceived Quality from the client

"He's got the mic, the speakers, acoustics, he's got the interface....."

"I want people to come in and go This is where we want to record becasue you get crystal clear beautiful quality sound "

"unbelievably quiet"
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Old 06-04-2017, 10:07 PM   #35
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Interesting article on using RME to record classical music...

http://www.synthax.co.uk/latest/2015...lands-and-rme/

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Since acquiring all the pieces of his full MADI solution, Phil says the system gives him “reliability, convenience and sound quality in one package. The reliability is second to none, and I’ve found it to be incredibly convenient since introducing the MADI components. RME is totally unfussy, and just works – it’s always best to have something that you can trust and you don’t have to think about. RME gives me that. The minute you’re thinking about the technology, you’re not thinking about the music anymore.
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Old 06-04-2017, 10:13 PM   #36
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Listening Testing - Private Soundcloud - at least it's only here for a few days

Drum tests - then parts of two songs - shown on Youtube (mentioned above) as recorded with either RME or Prism

RME vs Prism - is the Prism coloring the sound? Prism definite presence, not clear as the RME.

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Old 06-04-2017, 10:18 PM   #37
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From my own personal experience, the mic preamps on the Fireface UFX are extremely clean, quiet and uncoloured. If you want colour and texture, get Neve or API. If you want transparency and accuracy, RME will give you that.

Same thing regarding the A/D and D/A. I've found it to be pretty much transparent. It doesn't get in the way of what I'm recording.

For the first track of my new album, I recorded my entire synth rig live along with my good friend playing his custom 28 string harp guitar.
I mic'd the harp guitar with two Rode NT2a LDCs and my own custom made PZM through the RME preamps and I am delighted with the results.

The mic preamps in the Fireface are VERY similar to those in my Sound Devices 744T field recorder which is an industry standard unit worth around $5500 and known for its transparent preamps.
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Old 06-05-2017, 12:50 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Fusion View Post
RME vs Prism - is the Prism coloring the sound? Prism definite presence, not clear as the RME.
Man, this and the rest of the link aggregation you did above tells me you really like to overthink stuff. I bet all the legendary classic recordings were made on an equipment leagues worse than those laboratory grade hi tech future items you're comparing and trying to nitpick.
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Old 06-05-2017, 09:00 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeekat View Post
Man, this and the rest of the link aggregation you did above tells me you really like to overthink stuff.
1) It's alot of cash to put on the table.
2) Great to hear input from people who actually have high end interfaces.
3) You are absolutely right!!! Thank you!!

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Originally Posted by zeekat View Post
I bet all the legendary classic recordings were made on an equipment leagues worse than those laboratory grade hi tech future items you're comparing and trying to nitpick.
Let's see - legendary songs (70's - 80's) were usually (not ALL) cut with Sure SM57 / 58 and Neumann mics, Neve mic pres / consoles, Telefunken V76 and V672 mic pres, Ampex - Studer - Revox multitrack tape units running 15 to 30 ips - gear that easily overpowers digital by quality of sound recorded.

When it comes to ADDA converters - where else but here can you get great knowledge and experience?

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Old 06-05-2017, 09:55 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Fusion View Post
Ampex - Studer - Revox multitrack tape units running 15 to 30 ips - gear that easily overpowers digital by quality of sound recorded.
I'm totally overstepping my expertise (which I have none of), just from what I read/heard on the internet from pretty respected people. There's a very cool Ethan Winer's presentation on youtube, which shows specs of those famed studio tape machines of the yesteryear and they are worse by basically every possible measure than pretty average modern digital equipment. Microphones, I guess, didn't change that much, as you don't have digital microphones usually

If I were buying this stuff I'd go with RME instantly, as even without being a pro I know how annoying bad (or even non-existent) drivers are.
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