Old 07-27-2021, 02:58 AM   #1
Geoff Waddington
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Default New EuCon project

[Edit] Here's the link -- https://stash.reaper.fm/v/42522/EuCon%20Exp.zip


CSI and EuCon don't really get along that well, to be honest

I finally realized it's because EuCon is itself a control system integrator.

It's like trying to bolt 2 suns together

We will now carve the EuCon support out of CSI and make it standalone.

We will also make it much more EuCon like, true to the EuCon design intent.

Mostly that means less customization/flexibilty than CSI, but more consistency.

EuCon and CSI can be run simultaneously in Reaper, so the 2 systems can be used together.

Really looking forward to any and all ideas, bring it on folks !
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Old 07-27-2021, 06:42 AM   #2
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This all sounds good to me. I'm hoping that this can be faster than the old-school Eucon beta, and can also include some kind of FX mapping support for folks who truly want the Eucon-like experience there on Reaper. For my own use-cases, CSI is handling the FX mapping though so that's not a high priority.

Definitely looking forward to seeing when you're cooking up for Eucon.
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Old 07-27-2021, 05:34 PM   #3
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Thinking about file structure.

Propose we follow the CSI lead and have a EuCon folder with a EuCon.ini and an FX folder for FX maps (aka Zones) -- I think modern EuCon has improved a lot in the FX mapping department.

We will build a GUI later but until we figure out what the GUI should look like, let's just use the .ini file for experimentation.

Thinking it should contain:

Max number of Channels

Max number of Sends

Max number of FX

Anything else ?
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Old 07-27-2021, 06:27 PM   #4
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The above sounds perfectly reasonable for me. Will the FX.zon syntax look like the CSI-Eucon syntax or something different altogether?
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Old 07-27-2021, 06:48 PM   #5
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The above sounds perfectly reasonable for me. Will the FX.zon syntax look like the CSI-Eucon syntax or something different altogether?
No idea at this point
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Old 07-27-2021, 06:32 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington View Post
Thinking about file structure.

Propose we follow the CSI lead and have a EuCon folder with a EuCon.ini and an FX folder for FX maps (aka Zones) -- I think modern EuCon has improved a lot in the FX mapping department.

We will build a GUI later but until we figure out what the GUI should look like, let's just use the .ini file for experimentation.

Thinking it should contain:

Max number of Channels

Max number of Sends

Max number of FX

Anything else ?
Will this be able to handle changing channel counts for metering purposes? From what I've been able to glean using the old Beta and the CSI eucon, it seems like changing channel counts requires eucon to reload the track, which I know you're trying to avoid with this approach
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Old 07-27-2021, 06:52 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by RobinGShore View Post
Will this be able to handle changing channel counts for metering purposes? From what I've been able to glean using the old Beta and the CSI eucon, it seems like changing channel counts requires eucon to reload the track, which I know you're trying to avoid with this approach
Don't know, will have to see.
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Old 07-29-2021, 03:13 AM   #8
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New build is up.

EuCon Exp.zip

VERY preliminary first cut of standalone EuCon support, make SURE you install the EuCon folder too, it's the same drill as CSI.
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Old 12-30-2022, 06:08 PM   #9
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Default new eucon projet

Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington View Post
Thinking about file structure.

Propose we follow the CSI lead and have a EuCon folder with a EuCon.ini and an FX folder for FX maps (aka Zones) -- I think modern EuCon has improved a lot in the FX mapping department.

We will build a GUI later but until we figure out what the GUI should look like, let's just use the .ini file for experimentation.

Thinking it should contain:

Max number of Channels

Max number of Sends

Max number of FX

Anything else?
yes Gregg frame jog and shuttle
as well as time feed to the Avid Artist Transport
it sure works better than the builtin one on Avid artist control and I can at least program FF and RW
using the Reaper Actions menu
I just wish that the Reaper time would be transferred to the avid Artist Transport
Display window everything else I can program with Eucontol settings
Hope this is something you can do
Cheers
Perry

Last edited by Old School Audio Guy; 12-31-2022 at 01:41 PM. Reason: Needed to add a line
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Old 01-04-2023, 10:44 AM   #10
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Hi Geoff,

Best wishes for 2023 !
I did some experiments using Avid S1 with Pro tools Ultimate then I came back to Reaper. I have a weird behavior like when I open my test Eucon Reaper session (16 tracks) that worked before, neither the S1 nor the Avid Control Application opens the tracks. Both of them are recognized in Eucontrol application. I reimported the Eucon plug-in but no success. I am using beta Reaper 6.73 Dev 0102. I tried with official Reaper version 6.73 but not better. Is there a way to reinitiate the Eucon plug-in ?

Thanx, Best
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Old 01-05-2023, 12:50 AM   #11
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Hi Geoff,

Best wishes for 2023 !
I did some experiments using Avid S1 with Pro tools Ultimate then I came back to Reaper. I have a weird behavior like when I open my test Eucon Reaper session (16 tracks) that worked before, neither the S1 nor the Avid Control Application opens the tracks. Both of them are recognized in Eucontrol application. I reimported the Eucon plug-in but no success. I am using beta Reaper 6.73 Dev 0102. I tried with official Reaper version 6.73 but not better. Is there a way to reinitiate the Eucon plug-in ?

Thanx, Best
I can now see tracks on S1 when I create them from a blank new session, one after one, but after I save the session, I reopen it, nothing happens, no tracks on the S1 neither on Avid control.
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Old 07-27-2021, 06:29 PM   #12
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Glad you haven't given up on Eucon just yet Geoff! I was pleasantly surprised when Eucon became part of CSI, but started losing interest when it became clear that Eucon and CSI were probably not gonna mesh well with each other. Looking forward to seeing what you can do with Eucon as a standalone project again, though keeping my expectations tempered as I realize the user base for this does not run too deep.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff Waddington View Post
Really looking forward to any and all ideas, bring it on folks !
To me the biggest things Eucon has over most MIDI/OSC surfaces are the high amount of visual feedback it can give (this is much more apparent if you're using the newer surfaces and/or the tablet app) and the navigation/organization features(layouts, VCA/Folder Spill, the tracks navigator in the app). Once the fundemental stuff like volume, pan, sends, and fx are working, it'd be great to take a look at getting some of these more "advanced" eucon features going in Reaper.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Funkybot View Post
...and can also include some kind of FX mapping support for folks who truly want the Eucon-like experience there on Reaper. For my own use-cases, CSI is handling the FX mapping though so that's not a high priority.
Two things worth noting about fx mapping:
  1. The lastest version of eucon includes fx mapping as a native feature (only took them like 15 years to add this!). It's a little limited in what it can do (no way to alias parameter names for instance, or change the thermometer styles), but I believe this means that if we can just have eucon read a list of plugin parameters from Reaper, we'll be able to map them from within the eucon app without any extra work on Geoff's part. I actually just tested and can confirm that eucon's new mapping feature works with the old eucon beta in reaper.
  2. Geoff's original eucon plugin from way back when included an fx mapping tool, that despite having a not so friendly ui, worked really well and was very powerful. Frankly it blows Avid's implementation out of the water as it allows you to do a lot of stuff that's not currently possible with the native eucon mapping tool. Hoping that old mapping tool can make it back into this new eucon project.
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Old 07-27-2021, 06:51 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobinGShore View Post
Glad you haven't given up on Eucon just yet Geoff! I was pleasantly surprised when Eucon became part of CSI, but started losing interest when it became clear that Eucon and CSI were probably not gonna mesh well with each other. Looking forward to seeing what you can do with Eucon as a standalone project again, though keeping my expectations tempered as I realize the user base for this does not run too deep.


To me the biggest things Eucon has over most MIDI/OSC surfaces are the high amount of visual feedback it can give (this is much more apparent if you're using the newer surfaces and/or the tablet app) and the navigation/organization features(layouts, VCA/Folder Spill, the tracks navigator in the app). Once the fundemental stuff like volume, pan, sends, and fx are working, it'd be great to take a look at getting some of these more "advanced" eucon features going in Reaper.
Yeah, that's what got me thinking, mea culpa, hadn't been keeping up with EuCon developments, they have really added a lot we can leverage

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobinGShore View Post
Two things worth noting about fx mapping:
  1. The lastest version of eucon includes fx mapping as a native feature (only took them like 15 years to add this!). It's a little limited in what it can do (no way to alias parameter names for instance, or change the thermometer styles), but I believe this means that if we can just have eucon read a list of plugin parameters from Reaper, we'll be able to map them from within the eucon app without any extra work on Geoff's part. I actually just tested and can confirm that eucon's new mapping feature works with the old eucon beta in reaper.
  2. Geoff's original eucon plugin from way back when included an fx mapping tool, that despite having a not so friendly ui, worked really well and was very powerful. Frankly it blows Avid's implementation out of the water as it allows you to do a lot of stuff that's not currently possible with the native eucon mapping tool. Hoping that old mapping tool can make it back into this new eucon project.
Cool don't have clue where mapping will end up, but we'll do the best we can
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Old 09-06-2021, 11:47 AM   #14
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Default EUCON connection failure

I have a working EUCON system and control surfaces. Everything works fine with NUENDO and DaVinci.

I want to use my potable setup with Reaper and downloaded the trial version of Reaper v6.36. Target system Win7 64bit. Intel i7. An old platform but works well enough for the moment.

1) Sound and video output with Reaper are AOK.

2) I downloaded and unpacked the most recent EuCOn Exp.zip. Since there were
no precise deployment instructions I copied the EuCOn directory into
/Reaper(X64/Plugins. I copied the reaper_csurf_eucon.dylib and the
reaper_csurf_eucon64.dll files into the /Reaper(X64/Plugins directory.

3) In Reaper preferences, options, Control/OSC/web the EuCon surface device
was selected.

The EuCon error "EuConManager::Initialize() failed with Code:2" appeared.


I have obviously done something horribly wrong and would appreciate some expert advice.

Thanks and regards.
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Old 09-06-2021, 12:08 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Williams View Post
I have a working EUCON system and control surfaces. Everything works fine with NUENDO and DaVinci.

I want to use my potable setup with Reaper and downloaded the trial version of Reaper v6.36. Target system Win7 64bit. Intel i7. An old platform but works well enough for the moment.

1) Sound and video output with Reaper are AOK.

2) I downloaded and unpacked the most recent EuCOn Exp.zip. Since there were
no precise deployment instructions I copied the EuCOn directory into
/Reaper(X64/Plugins. I copied the reaper_csurf_eucon.dylib and the
reaper_csurf_eucon64.dll files into the /Reaper(X64/Plugins directory.

3) In Reaper preferences, options, Control/OSC/web the EuCon surface device
was selected.

The EuCon error "EuConManager::Initialize() failed with Code:2" appeared.


I have obviously done something horribly wrong and would appreciate some expert advice.

Thanks and regards.
1. Copy the Eucon folder into your Reaper resource path. Do not put it in the plugins folder.

2. Copy the .dll (if Windows) or .dylib (if Mac) into the UserPlugins folder.

Here's what it looks like on Windows (but use the comparable locations on Mac).

Last edited by Funkybot; 09-06-2021 at 12:21 PM.
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Old 09-06-2021, 12:13 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Funkybot View Post
1. Copy the Eucon folder into your Reaper resource path. Do not put it in the plugins folder.

2. Copy the .dylib into the UserPlugins folder.

Here's what it looks like on Windows (but use the comparable locations on Mac).
Edit:
Sorry, missed the text in your picture..

It seems he wants this running on windows so I think he should be using "reaper_csurf_eucon64.dll" instead of the .dylib

Last edited by Heb; 09-06-2021 at 12:45 PM.
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Old 09-06-2021, 12:22 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heb View Post
Edit:
Sorry, missed the text I your picture..

It seems he wants this running on windows so I think he should be using "reaper_csurf_eucon64.dll" instead of the .dylib
I clarified the text of the post as well!
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Old 09-10-2021, 09:13 PM   #18
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Default Where do all the files go?

OK Where do all the file go?
It would be nice to have an installer for Mac or Windows in my case but there is not
No problem I just need to know where the new Eucon Control project files go
I loaded in the csurf files in that location and have some feedback from reaper to the Artist mixers and control but am not sure where the rest go and If I have c surf files which just were added to the folder with the original csurf file. Look like it will be working once I have everything in their proper place.
I have latest version on Reaper installed and the latest version of Eucontrol installed and all surfaces are being seen so I take it from what I have read I'm on the right track.
Aa little assistants please
Thanks
Cheers
Perry
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Old 09-10-2021, 09:28 PM   #19
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OK Where do all the file go?
It would be nice to have an installer for Mac or Windows in my case but there is not
No problem I just need to know where the new Eucon Control project files go
I loaded in the csurf files in that location and have some feedback from reaper to the Artist mixers and control but am not sure where the rest go and If I have c surf files which just were added to the folder with the original csurf file. Look like it will be working once I have everything in their proper place.
I have latest version on Reaper installed and the latest version of Eucontrol installed and all surfaces are being seen so I take it from what I have read I'm on the right track.
Aa little assistants please
Thanks
Cheers
Perry
See post #180 above.

https://forum.cockos.com/showpost.ph...&postcount=180
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Old 09-10-2021, 09:56 PM   #20
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Default Avid Artist Mixer

OK I followed post #180

no transport control no fader control
no softkeys menu faders only go up half way
but no control of Reaper
At least no error messages
obviously I missed something somewhere
Still need help
Cheers
Perry
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Old 09-10-2021, 09:58 PM   #21
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Oh yeah I forgot
I can't get to my Preference page either
Thanks
Perry
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Old 09-11-2021, 12:17 PM   #22
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Thinking of hard wiring the number of Sends and FX to 16, any reason not to ?

If not how about 24 ?

Pretty sure EuCon typically has hardwired limits for these things.
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Old 09-11-2021, 12:36 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Old School Audio Guy View Post
OK I followed post #180

no transport control no fader control
no softkeys menu faders only go up half way
but no control of Reaper
At least no error messages
obviously I missed something somewhere
Still need help
Cheers
Perry
Can you post a screen prints of:

1. Your Reaper\UserPlugins folder in Explorer or Finder
2. Your Reaper\Eucon folder
3. Reaper's Preferences\Control\OSC\Web
4. Your Eucon.ini (should be in Reaper\Eucon)

And when I say Reaper\ I'm talking about the Reaper resource path.

Note: it's very often that my surface doesn't talk to Reaper to my DAWs so I also do a quick "Restart EUCON Applications" from the taskbar when that happens. Did you try that?
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Old 09-11-2021, 08:14 PM   #24
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Default Eucon Setup

Quote:
Originally Posted by Funkybot View Post
Can you post a screen prints of:

1. Your Reaper\UserPlugins folder in Explorer or Finder
2. Your Reaper\Eucon folder
3. Reaper's Preferences\Control\OSC\Web
4. Your Eucon.ini (should be in Reaper\Eucon)

And when I say Reaper\ I'm talking about the Reaper resource path.

Note: it's very often that my surface doesn't talk to Reaper to my DAWs so I also do a quick "Restart EUCON Applications" from the taskbar when that happens. Did you try that?
Hi Funkybot
Geoff said you can help
I don't seem to have a Eucon.ini file anywhere on my workstation
Here are the file location pics you wanted to see some got zipped I should have done them all. It's late
I'm sure this will help
Thanks
Perry
Thanks
Perry

Last edited by Old School Audio Guy; 07-26-2022 at 03:48 PM.
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Old 05-23-2024, 04:56 AM   #25
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Default version combination

for me on osx Ventura,
stable and highest reaction speed when creating new tracks

Eucontrol 2022.12.1.34
reaper_csurf_eucon.dylib from 02.10.2021
reaper_csurf_integrator.dylib from 09.10.2021
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Old 05-23-2024, 05:39 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by henriknet View Post
for me on osx Ventura,
stable and highest reaction speed when creating new tracks

Eucontrol 2022.12.1.34
reaper_csurf_eucon.dylib from 02.10.2021
reaper_csurf_integrator.dylib from 09.10.2021
Awesome thanks for sharing! Any lag when instantiating a plugin or creating sends?
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