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07-16-2019, 01:25 PM
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#201
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NL
Posts: 1,453
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Thanks for the suggestions Sju and Vagelis.
With a static input buffer, feedback would be non-trivial because it would mean that I would have to run two buffers, each with their own set of parallel grains for it to work. Would more than double the CPU cost. I'll think about it a bit more. Maybe it can be done differently.
Quote:
Originally Posted by foxAsteria
Shame about the drag and drop, but are you still gonna try to do sample loading some other way? It's usually enough to have a mousewheel/arrow guided dropdown for cycling the contents of a sample folder.
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Yeah, it's a real shame :/
But what you suggest is also not possible. The problem is not finding the location, the problem is that JSFX doesn't allow loading wave files outside the effects or data folders. Hopefully we get that FR granted one day. Until that day, recording it is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by foxAsteria
As far as the preset size, could there be an option to automatically truncate any areas of the sample outside the bounds of where the playhead actually hits with current settings? That way minimal info is stored, but presets will still sound the same.
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Yeah, something like that will probably end up happening.
Quote:
Originally Posted by foxAsteria
I know I asked before, but I still don't get why you're not making these projects as VST plugins? I really don't think there are many developers cranking out novel and good-quality plugins at the rate you are and well...all these jsfx limitations don't bother you?
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Too much non-fun hassle.
Sure some limitations bother me, and the CPU cost could be better, but the alternative is a lot more painful and not realistic (given that I have a dayjob).
With VST, every iteration of something would require a recompile. Debugging a C++ program takes ten times the time of a JSFX, especially one that might depend on outside input (need to code your own input/output for every test you do), meaning everything takes a lot more time to develop.
Much more potential for bugs when I'm handling the threading. Bugs also tend to produce much more notorious effects in non-sandboxed languages.
VSTs are not multi-platform by default unless you're using some middleware again. Writing GUIs for a VST is really painful, and usually, again, involves platform dependent code, two of which I don't regularly use (meaning bug reports that will be hard or impossible for me to locally reproduce). Also how you look for files is for instance platform dependent.
I could go on, but long story short, I'm lazy. It's a lot of non-fun additional work (unless you're willing to have no GUI, which I am not), and it's not likely that this will change any time soon. I'm keeping an eye on iPlug2 as it would be a contender for reducing a lot of these VST-related pains, but for the time being I'm going to stick with JSFX.
Think of it this way, without JSFX, these plugins would simply not exist at all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by zookthespook
ookk then . I just played a bit with these monsters !!
I don't know how you coded that stereo imager ! It beats the crap out the brainworx V3 which is a 200+ dollar plugin! And the Reflectosaurus is a beast which in some pockets is way superior to the GRM space echo !
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Ghehe. I don't know either of those plugins to be honest. But hope you find some use for these
Last edited by sai'ke; 07-16-2019 at 01:36 PM.
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07-16-2019, 02:56 PM
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#202
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Near a big lake
Posts: 3,943
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sai'ke
VSTs are not multi-platform by default unless you're using some middleware again. Writing GUIs for a VST is really painful, and usually, again, involves platform dependent code, two of which I don't regularly use (meaning bug reports that will be hard or impossible for me to locally reproduce). Also how you look for files is for instance platform dependent.
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Write Linux VST only. Problem solved.
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07-16-2019, 03:39 PM
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#203
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Oblivion
Posts: 10,255
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sai'ke
Think of it this way, without JSFX, these plugins would simply not exist at all.
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Sold. Thanks for the explanation and everything else!
So VST3 didn't address much of these dev issues, huh? Oh well.
Also, so far looks like I'll def be using Amaranth in the future. Wanna let me fiddle with colors again?
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07-16-2019, 04:12 PM
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#204
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NL
Posts: 1,453
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesPeters
Write Linux VST only. Problem solved.
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Yeaaaah...
Fwiw, If I had to pick two, it'd be Windows and Linux since I use both those platforms, even though I know half of the music people are probably on Mac.
Quote:
Originally Posted by foxAsteria
Sold. Thanks for the explanation and everything else!
So VST3 didn't address much of these dev issues, huh? Oh well.
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Not really, but middleware helps it get closer. I mean, there's JUCE and iPlug2 as middleware for instance. I think the former allows you to deploy onto all three platforms and abstracts a fair number of things. If I ever build something big like a synth, I would have to look into middleware for performance reasons. For creative monophonic effects, I'm ok with the current performance though. It's also nice that people can easily edit the plugins if they want to
I mean, it's a legit question and switching to VST has crossed my mind several times. But yeah, it really adds a lot of dead time. I need more hours in a day D:
Quote:
Originally Posted by foxAsteria
Also, so far looks like I'll def be using Amaranth in the future. Wanna let me fiddle with colors again?
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Yeah, might be fun in the future, but I want to get the thing up and running first.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vagelis
One thing that i noticed is that when I'm changing the pitch, it also changes the speed-size of the sample. It would be nice,if there was another mode too, that would allow to change the pitch wihout changing the speed-size of the sample.
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There is a little toggle next to ms now. It will make sure the number of grain samples taken scales with the number of samples for keeping the time constant when enabled.
I also added the first bit of envelope linking.
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07-16-2019, 04:22 PM
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#205
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Oblivion
Posts: 10,255
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sai'ke
I need more hours in a day D:
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Here's what you do: quit your boring day job and do what you want full-time!
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07-17-2019, 12:59 AM
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#206
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NL
Posts: 1,453
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foxAsteria
Here's what you do: quit your boring day job and do what you want full-time!
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Who says my job is boring?
Also, is that an offer to pay my rent and bills I hear? : o
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07-17-2019, 01:24 AM
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#207
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Larisa, Greece
Posts: 3,799
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sai'ke
There is a little toggle next to ms now. It will make sure the number of grain samples taken scales with the number of samples for keeping the time constant when enabled.
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Awesome!! Thank you Saike it works as it should : ))
Can i suggest something else?
Normally in most granulizers the overlap and size knobs are not linked together.Theres an extra link switch that multiplies length and size parameters.
If they are not linked, the one determines the length of the grain from 1-1000ms,(short grains(1ms - 20ms)sound like "spikes") and the other determines the time(in msec)from 1-1000ms.
If the time is smaller than the Length of the grain the grains will overlap.
I 'd suggest to try this software but i think you're on Linux?
https://www.accsone.com/download-granular-synthesis
Last edited by Vagelis; 07-17-2019 at 06:04 AM.
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07-17-2019, 10:03 AM
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#208
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Oblivion
Posts: 10,255
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sai'ke
Also, is that an offer to pay my rent and bills I hear? : o
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Hey, if I were in a position to be a benefactor to mad genius, I certainly would. Glad to hear you like your job tho, heheh.
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07-18-2019, 02:19 AM
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#209
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NL
Posts: 1,453
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The reason I linked the overlap to the grain size was because that way, I can calculate exactly how many grains I would need at maximum overlap for there to not be an insufficient number of grains. I have added options now to decouple the two, but then it's possible that you run out of grains. The reason this is not variable is performance. I may revisit it later allowing for higher grain counts, but for now, this is what it is.
I should probably add a little notification when that is occurring.
Just for the record, I did read the suggestions, but I will reply to them when I get to actually working on them or considering their impact in code
Changelog:
- Added feedback to Amaranth.
- Added option to set the distance between grains in absolute terms in Amaranth.
- Added option to set the variance between grains in absolute terms in Amaranth.
- Fixed issue with last touched parameter not being correct for Squashman when frequency cutoff was clicked.
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07-18-2019, 04:40 AM
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#210
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Larisa, Greece
Posts: 3,799
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sai'ke
The reason I linked the overlap to the grain size was because that way, I can calculate exactly how many grains I would need at maximum overlap for there to not be an insufficient number of grains.
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True, combining both gives the density.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sai'ke
I have added options now to decouple the two, but then it's possible that you run out of grains. The reason this is not variable is performance. I may revisit it later allowing for higher grain counts, but for now, this is what it is.
Changelog:
- Added feedback to Amaranth.
- Added option to set the distance between grains in absolute terms in Amaranth.
- Added option to set the variance between grains in absolute terms in Amaranth.
- Fixed issue with last touched parameter not being correct for Squashman when frequency cutoff was clicked.
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Thanks a lot! how do you come up wth such things so fast? Facinating
Feedback works well and the delay time changes with position
Size works well too with the new method,one thing i've noticed is that when the size and distance are turned to the left i don't hear the smallest grain size.
I hear it when the size is turned to the left and the distance is at 9 oclock.
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07-18-2019, 02:21 PM
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#211
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 685
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sai'ke
Changelog:
- Added feedback to Amaranth.
- Added option to set the distance between grains in absolute terms in Amaranth.
- Added option to set the variance between grains in absolute terms in Amaranth.
- Fixed issue with last touched parameter not being correct for Squashman when frequency cutoff was clicked.
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Thanks for the updates! Tested the feedback, and it doesn't quite give the super mangled effect that happens in Argotlunar, so I guess it has a different implementation than simple output->input... hmm... Looking at the source code (writeFeedbackBuffer in DelayLine.cpp), there seems to be a highpass there at least.
As an aside, wouldn't it be handy if you could move the position slider by dragging on the waveform display area?
Last edited by Sju; 07-18-2019 at 02:27 PM.
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07-19-2019, 03:00 AM
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#212
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Larisa, Greece
Posts: 3,799
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sju
Thanks for the updates! Tested the feedback, and it doesn't quite give the super mangled effect that happens in Argotlunar, so I guess it has a different implementation than simple output->input... hmm... Looking at the source code (writeFeedbackBuffer in DelayLine.cpp), there seems to be a highpass there at least.
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True,it propably needs to clip at a higher value in order to hear the resonance, distord effect.
Here's a great lecture from the master Curtis Roads, where he's using the feedback technique with a filter at the end of the feedback chain.
You can listen to it here:
https://youtu.be/Wz46bOMb3lU?t=1059
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07-19-2019, 03:38 AM
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#213
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NL
Posts: 1,453
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Filter in the feedback loop is actually on the to-do list. Was thinking of allowing choice between a basic SVF and my MS-20 SVF emulation, which saturates naturally without coloring much when the amplitude is low.
Currently I'm in the middle of a move though, so I won't have time to code on it for a few days.
Scrubbing play position on the waveform display is also planned.
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07-19-2019, 07:37 AM
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#214
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Oblivion
Posts: 10,255
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sai'ke
Was thinking of allowing choice between a basic SVF and my MS-20 SVF emulation
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Yes, please.
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07-19-2019, 07:46 AM
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#215
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Cologne
Posts: 1,362
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Hm, I really don't get what it is about grain modulation. How do you use it? I tested several vsts with grain modulation over the years but it never gave me a useful result or a wow-effect. Anyway. Its from Sai'ke. So it must be something good.
Greetings
Eli
__________________
☆.。.:*・°☆.。.:*・°☆.。.:*・°☆REAPER//✿◔‿◔)°☆.。.:*・°☆.。.:*・°☆
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07-19-2019, 08:05 AM
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#216
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Oblivion
Posts: 10,255
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eliseat
Hm, I really don't get what it is about grain modulation. How do you use it?
Eli
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You put some sound through it and it can do fairly natural "freezing" of particular moments in the sound so that you can e.g. convert any short sound into an infinite one. It can also do other glitchy, unnatural stuff.
Basically grains are chunks of variable audio time and the effect moves them about and processes them all in a number of ways, to reconfigure it into something new, but possibly maintaining the original tonality of the source.
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07-19-2019, 10:39 AM
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#217
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: London, UK
Posts: 2,581
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Hey Joep!
In Reflectosaurus, could you add a way to reset pan position, please?
I was thinking ALT+double-click or ALT+CTRL click.
Cheers!
Dax.
P.S. Just started playing, this thing sounds pretty interesting! I'm still yet to work out everything that its happening on the GUI. It's a bit like finding an alien artefact! Lots of fun!
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07-20-2019, 03:48 AM
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#218
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: India Mumbai
Posts: 816
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sai'ke
Stereo manipulator is an older plugin. Look for Stereo Bub II.
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This stereo bub is a fucking monster.
Love it !!
Big fan of your work saike
Zook
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07-24-2019, 07:45 AM
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#219
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 517
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Sorry but whats "RMB"? I am trying to add a lot of feedback to a pole so that i get a sustained delay and i am not sure if i am adding it correctly(mousewheel?)
OHH..right click + drag for feedback
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07-24-2019, 07:52 AM
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#220
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 517
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Still..is it possible that, even with full feedback (big circle), the delay doesnt get sustained? Looks like i am missing a bit more feedback
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07-24-2019, 08:48 AM
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#221
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Oblivion
Posts: 10,255
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reapero
Sorry but whats "RMB"?
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Right Mouse Button
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07-24-2019, 05:34 PM
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#222
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Brooklyn
Posts: 2,613
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No posts about Wahriffic? Did I miss them?
Thank you for this great addition, sai'ke : ) I have fun with Filter but despite having the wah filters I've been unable to get a decent wah setting out of it without it being Overloaded Violent Spaceship Crash Wah. It's me, I know.
Wahriffic answers that for me. Getting great sounds from it!
__________________
The reason rain dances work is because they don't stop dancing until it rains.
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07-26-2019, 05:48 PM
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#223
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NL
Posts: 1,453
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daxliniere
Hey Joep!
In Reflectosaurus, could you add a way to reset pan position, please?
I was thinking ALT+double-click or ALT+CTRL click.
Cheers!
Dax.
P.S. Just started playing, this thing sounds pretty interesting! I'm still yet to work out everything that its happening on the GUI. It's a bit like finding an alien artefact! Lots of fun!
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Added. Glad you're enjoying it
Quote:
Originally Posted by reapero
Still..is it possible that, even with full feedback (big circle), the delay doesnt get sustained? Looks like i am missing a bit more feedback
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It doesn't quite go to one yeah. I figured situations like that would be quite esoteric. Do you need it to go to one for anything in particular?
Quote:
Originally Posted by vdubreeze
No posts about Wahriffic? Did I miss them?
Thank you for this great addition, sai'ke : ) I have fun with Filter but despite having the wah filters I've been unable to get a decent wah setting out of it without it being Overloaded Violent Spaceship Crash Wah. It's me, I know.
Wahriffic answers that for me. Getting great sounds from it!
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Glad to hear it
Progress has been a bit slower than usual as I have moved country.
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07-27-2019, 04:11 PM
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#224
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NL
Posts: 1,453
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Changelog Amaranth:
- Added position bar in wave view.
- Added cropping for frozen waves (to prevent preset saves from becoming huge and slow).
- Added option to not save waveform in preset (for unfrozen ones this makes sense).
Just fyi, amaranth is still in alpha stage, so presets may still be lost due to design changes. Next up are filters... maybe over the weekend.
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07-28-2019, 03:11 AM
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#225
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Larisa, Greece
Posts: 3,799
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sai'ke
Changelog Amaranth:
- Added position bar in wave view.
- Added cropping for frozen waves (to prevent preset saves from becoming huge and slow).
- Added option to not save waveform in preset (for unfrozen ones this makes sense).
Just fyi, amaranth is still in alpha stage, so presets may still be lost due to design changes. Next up are filters... maybe over the weekend.
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Awesome!! I like the position bars and the crop function!
It might be better if when moving the start bar would move both start-end together with the position while the end bar would move only the bar and not the position? I think it would make it easier to move together as a loop by selecting portions of the sample.
Also a nice way to modulate the controls that i like in Reaktor except the envelopes, is when you record the movements of the parameters with the mouse. It's nice and easy way to experiment
Here's a video from Granite that uses this way of modulation too.
https://youtu.be/M2UKDwgTrrE?t=1478
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07-31-2019, 12:28 PM
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#226
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NL
Posts: 1,453
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The recording stuff looks neat, but would come at too much overhead in JSFX. I also prefer dealing with automation by hand.
Changelog Amaranth:
- Added two modulate-able filters.
- Added dedicated feedback grain buffer for when sound is frozen (doubles CPU when in use though).
- Fixed bug that prevented storage of trigger toggle.
- Enabled buffer reset button.
Changelog Squashman/Filther
- Fixed bug that prevented storage of trigger toggle.
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08-03-2019, 06:26 AM
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#227
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NL
Posts: 1,453
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Amaranth:
- Added modulatable pre and post-gain.
- Added filters: Voodoo, Modulatrix, Vowel, Monstro.
Edit: Also as a sort of demo for squashman, all distortion and saturation in this track was done with squashman: https://soundcloud.com/saike/draeic-mothership
Last edited by sai'ke; 08-03-2019 at 02:08 PM.
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08-06-2019, 12:29 AM
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#228
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Cologne
Posts: 1,362
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sai'ke
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The real sounding drums were pretty surprising after the cinematic intro. The song also reminds me of level-music for a video game, especially as I once saw a video that you are actually working on video games. Is this song for a game?
And by the way. Nice usage of your own distortion tool.
__________________
☆.。.:*・°☆.。.:*・°☆.。.:*・°☆REAPER//✿◔‿◔)°☆.。.:*・°☆.。.:*・°☆
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08-06-2019, 01:41 AM
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#229
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Larisa, Greece
Posts: 3,799
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Thanks a lot for the updates on Amaranth!!
It becomes better and better
I like a lot the new filters and the visual implementation of the feedback when the buffer is frozen.
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08-07-2019, 04:24 AM
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#230
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Jazz City
Posts: 5,065
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A question regarding Humonica:
Would it be possible to automate/Midi-trig the "Sample Audio" button in the "fixed" mode? Imagine how amazing a tempo-based or manual capture during the performance would be!
__________________
Windows 10x64 | AMD Ryzen 3700X | ATI FirePro 2100 | Marian Seraph AD2, 4.3.8 | Yamaha Steinberg MR816x
"If I can hear well, then everything I do is right" (Allen Sides)
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08-07-2019, 08:33 AM
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#231
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NL
Posts: 1,453
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I'm pretty sure humonica is geraint's plugin
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09-09-2019, 12:26 AM
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#232
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NL
Posts: 1,453
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Added storage of reference spectra to spectral analyzer (>A and >B buttons). Note however that changing the settings after spectrum storage invalidates it as a reference (as it is not updated). Also note that reference spectra are stored in preset data if you ever want to save them.
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09-09-2019, 03:48 AM
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#233
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: India Mumbai
Posts: 816
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sai'ke
I'm pretty sure humonica is geraint's plugin
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hahaha yes.. and one of the best vocoders
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09-10-2019, 02:39 AM
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#234
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NL
Posts: 1,453
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zookthespook
hahaha yes.. and one of the best vocoders
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Yea! He has a ton of great ones. I use padsynth pretty frequently.
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09-11-2019, 12:45 AM
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#235
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Beijing, China
Posts: 215
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Hey Sai'ke,
I really like how your envelopes work (well and all of your jsfx), especially with the GUI and interactions. Do you mind me taking your code as reference for my own?
Also, I see all your function have instance() local() and global(), do you type them out by hand? If so, what's the purpose of writing empty ones?
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09-11-2019, 11:26 AM
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#236
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NL
Posts: 1,453
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Feel free to take / use / mangle / re-release it.
Out of all those, I would say that global() is the only one that you should always consider adding even if it is empty. Because when global() is not there, you take everything from the global namespace, which usually makes code harder to reason about.
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09-20-2019, 06:24 AM
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#237
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Curaçao
Posts: 410
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Thanks for sharing your work! Such useful tools and I really like how you added the visual feedback. Heel goed!
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09-21-2019, 07:53 AM
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#238
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NL
Posts: 1,453
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Glad you like 'em
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10-06-2019, 06:28 AM
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#239
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NL
Posts: 1,453
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FYI, if you use them, I'd recommend updating Filther and Reflectosaurus. Both of them had critical updates this weekend
Changelog:
- Fix bug in Filther which hampered node selection in the spline shaper.
- Fix bug in Reflectosaurus which interfered with proper preset loading.
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11-06-2019, 12:09 PM
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#240
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 70
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Hi, loving the band splitter but the phase match plugin "RMB outside" is not adding a frequency cut for me. Also parameter linking the bands isn't working.
Also the phase match plugin is supposed to go on the first insert of the recombine buss?
Last edited by focusrite; 11-06-2019 at 01:21 PM.
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