Old 09-04-2019, 01:09 PM   #1
trolldemort
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Default Recording two mics at the same time

Hello
This is my first post here, please bear with me><

I'm currently using behringer 202hd interface with two dynamic microphones plugged in. I'm only actively using one for now though.

A while ago I've got an idea: to set both microphones to record in mono, one for the left channel and one for the right one, and then put both together, making a pseudo stereo track that could possible imitate 3d sound.

Does this idea make any sense for real-time processing?

If yes, can you help me achieve this effect? I created two tracks for mics, set them to force mono but I don't really understand how to proceed from there.

Routing is done with SAR since I need the microphone to work with Discord.
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Old 09-04-2019, 01:17 PM   #2
HowYouDAWin
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You're wanting to do this with vocals or an instrument? With vocals, you'll likely get phasing.
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Old 09-04-2019, 02:39 PM   #3
domzy
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i'm not sure i understand - if your aim is to combine two mono signals that are being recorded at the same time, why don't you just record onto a stereo file?
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Old 09-04-2019, 02:49 PM   #4
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Hi trolldemort and welcome. I am no expert but here's my thoughts. I am not sure it's "pseudo" stereo at all. It is normal to capture stereo in this way (search for stuff like A-B stereo and the ORTF technique for instance.)
Re the 3d aspect but I would think you could capture "the sound in the room" so to speak using this technique:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?reload=9&v=eok0uoo3MVY (assuming the room acoustic is worth capturing ! but that's whole other story!) Is this what you had in mind.

I also think phase issues are intrinsic to recording any sound source - here's a good detailed introduction: https://www.soundonsound.com/techniq...se-demystified

Other than that there are several ways though plug-ins etc. to simulate a stereo effect and depending on the genre and actual piece that may a thing to look at as well.
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Old 09-04-2019, 02:59 PM   #5
trolldemort
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HowYouDAWin View Post
You're wanting to do this with vocals or an instrument? With vocals, you'll likely get phasing.
Just vocals for now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by domzy View Post
i'm not sure i understand - if your aim is to combine two mono signals that are being recorded at the same time, why don't you just record onto a stereo file?
I'm not actually recording to file. I'm looking into achieving the effect live, with the stereo sound going straigth to streaming/communication software such as OBS or Discord

Quote:
Originally Posted by martifingers View Post
Re the 3d aspect but I would think you could capture "the sound in the room" so to speak using this technique:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?reload=9&v=eok0uoo3MVY (assuming the room acoustic is worth capturing ! but that's whole other story!) Is this what you had in mind.
Yes, this is precisely what I had in mind. However, I'm not sure how (if it's possible that is) to do that in real time. In future I could even grab specific mics and emply the "figure of 8" technique mentioned in the video but I still need to find out how to, with the help of reaper and sar, send the stereo spread (not sure if I use the correct term) where I need it to go.

Last edited by trolldemort; 09-04-2019 at 03:18 PM.
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Old 09-04-2019, 03:45 PM   #6
domzy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trolldemort View Post
I'm not actually recording to file. I'm looking into achieving the effect live, with the stereo sound going straigth to streaming/communication software such as OBS or Discord
I'm still not getting it, regardless of whether you are recording or just monitoring in Reaper, is there a requirement for you to have dual mono files at any stage? Your above post implies a stereo output, so why not just have a stereo input - ie two mics, one left & one right (or as figure of 8), going to a stereo track
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Old 09-05-2019, 12:51 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by domzy View Post
I'm still not getting it, regardless of whether you are recording or just monitoring in Reaper, is there a requirement for you to have dual mono files at any stage? Your above post implies a stereo output, so why not just have a stereo input - ie two mics, one left & one right (or as figure of 8), going to a stereo track
With sound from microphones being sent straight to OBS / Discord, there would be no recorded files at any point, isnt that right?

Quote:
ie two mics, one left & one right (or as figure of 8), going to a stereo track
I do have two mics, but I don't understand how to set them up to achieve this effect. My guess was that I had to set one of them to mono left channel and the second right as mono right channel (or keep both stereo if using figure of 8 but that's a different story).

In reaper it would look like this

with track 1 representing one channel and track 2 representing the second one. I would then require track 3 that somehow combines them and the result is sent to other software.

If it can be done using just one track (because I feel like you get confused with my attempts at making simple stuff overly complicated, sorry), the point still stands, I don't know how to put 2 inputs on one track.
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Old 09-05-2019, 03:26 AM   #8
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I thought you wanted to reverse phase the mics to get rid of the background :

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Old 09-05-2019, 03:27 AM   #9
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stereo...ording_methods

Just use them as a stereo pair; no need for separated mono tracks, unless you want to process them differently.
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Old 09-05-2019, 07:58 AM   #10
domzy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trolldemort View Post

I do have two mics, but I don't understand how to set them up to achieve this effect. My guess was that I had to set one of them to mono left channel and the second right as mono right channel.

If it can be done using just one track (because I feel like you get confused with my attempts at making simple stuff overly complicated, sorry), the point still stands, I don't know how to put 2 inputs on one track.
have the first mic plugged into In1 & the second plugged into In2
make a stereo track (should say "In1/In2" or similar)
voila!
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Old 09-05-2019, 09:32 AM   #11
serr
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trolldemort View Post
Hello
This is my first post here, please bear with me><

I'm currently using behringer 202hd interface with two dynamic microphones plugged in. I'm only actively using one for now though.

A while ago I've got an idea: to set both microphones to record in mono, one for the left channel and one for the right one, and then put both together, making a pseudo stereo track that could possible imitate 3d sound.

Does this idea make any sense for real-time processing?

If yes, can you help me achieve this effect? I created two tracks for mics, set them to force mono but I don't really understand how to proceed from there.

Routing is done with SAR since I need the microphone to work with Discord.
First, there's mono, stereo, surround, and 3D surround

The most common surround speaker array formats are 4.0 (quad) and 5.1.
3D surround adds height (ceiling mounted speakers). The emerging formats (Atmos, Aura, dts-x) also add "object channels". Their full arrays are over 60 channels.

Not sure if you meant "normal" surround (4.0, 5.1, 7.1, etc) or one of the new 3D formats with ceiling speakers and everything.

You can capture stereo content with 2 mics. This will be what it is. It's not going to be surround or 3D without mixing it that way. You take all your mono and stereo sources and you make a surround or 3D surround mix. In the same way you would take a mono source (eg a vocal) and pan it from one speaker to the other in stereo to create a stereo mix. It's an extension of that.

There are some things to know about the formats. There are encoded formats that let you squeeze surround mixes into stereo formats and decode them back to surround on playback. These formats range from lossless to pretty crude lossy. There are speaker arrays that can be a compromise too. The shitbar being a silly obvious toy.

But there's no mystery to surround behind the board. Just like stereo is simply two speakers and you get a pan knob to direct your sources - surround is simply 5 speakers (in 5.1) and you get a joystick to direct your sources.

Mixing stereo captured sources into a surround mix isn't always straightforward either. You have to decide how you're going to present that stereo field in your surround stage. Mixing into surround from all mono sources is actually more straightforward.

Hope that helps!
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Old 09-05-2019, 11:32 AM   #12
trolldemort
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Quote:
Originally Posted by domzy View Post
have the first mic plugged into In1 & the second plugged into In2
make a stereo track (should say "In1/In2" or similar)
voila!
I tried to do this and kept receiving signal from one mic. But after I scrapped reaper project and all settings and remade everything from scratch it started working. Thanks

Now I can capture both mics at the same time and while I'm listening on headphones it gives a nice effect if I change my position.

Too bad it turned out that Discord dumbs it down to mono anyways, heavy disappointment. Until that changes, it's going to work with recordings only. :<

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Hope that helps!
I appreciate it a lot. It's a lot of information though, so digesting it will take me a while
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