Automating Program Changes With Amplitube 4+5

[Afghamistam]

So as some of you may know, recently an upgrade to amp sim Amplitube came out.

In the previous version 4, I'd made a lot of use out of automating preset changes using MIDI items triggering these changes with CC numbers.

It worked because the VST loaded up with a premade list of 100 programs



which the MIDI item could freely switch between.

Now with Amplitube 5 (and pretty much every other amp sim I've tried, come to think), this feature is missing. When you load up the vst,



there is no dropdown list of programs. And therefore no way of controlling the plugin like I did before.

So my question is, what part of Reaper is telling Amplitube 4 to generate 100 blank presets for me to use? I can't find an ini or an fpl file anywhere. And I can't get the same functionality to appear in the new version - user created presets are just ignored by MIDI.

[pipelineaudio]

Be aware that you still can't use MIDI on the VST3 version of amplitube. Its MASSIVELY improved on the vst2 version in many ways over Amplitube 4 though

[DarkStar]

Originally Posted by Afghamistam

So my question is, what part of Reaper is telling Amplitube 4 to generate 100 blank presets for me to use? I can't find an ini or an fpl file anywhere. And I can't get the same functionality to appear in the new version - user created presets are just ignored by MIDI.

Reaper does not tell AT5. AT5 tells Reaper (that it has 100 preset slots)

In AT5, those preset slots are stored in the VST data chunk, not in a separate file.


https://cgi.ikmultimedia.com/ikforum...hp?f=5&t=26372

[Afghamistam]

Originally Posted by DarkStar

Reaper does not tell AT5. AT5 tells Reaper (that it has 100 preset slots)

In AT5, those preset slots are stored in the VST data chunk, not in a separate file.


https://cgi.ikmultimedia.com/ikforum...hp?f=5&t=26372

Oh hey, alright, mate?

So actually I was just in the middle of replying to that post with an apology as the video I thought represented my case actually doesn't. In that video, the guy uses the patch banks to change presets - but I never actually touched them, I just used the prorgam change in the MIDI item to directly change the equivalent preset (as seen here https://streamable.com/9pcz2i).

The biggest issue with feature you pointed me to (aside from that it doesn't work in VST3 - cheers to Pipelineaudio for pointing that out), is that there are only 128 of them.

In any one project I'll have two or three guitar parts + bass each with a dozen or so changes set to go off over the duration of a song.



Using AT5's preset banks, not only will they be completely filled up by about five projects' worth of songs, but while composing there's no way to switch and swap them around on the fly - you have to somehow know ahead of time exactly what chain you're going to be using and where to keep things in a coherent order. Any method that involves more than one guitar in a single project quickly turns into chaos, so far as I can see.

So I guess what I need to know now is what is a VST data chunk and how can I get that old preset dropdown behaviour back?

[DarkStar]

"VST data chunk" is just the term I use for the data that the plug-in passes to the host (Reaper) to save when the project is saved. It is in the Reaper porject file, but is not editable, as the format is data is not known.

I'm a bit confused - AT4 had 100 preset slots that were listed in Reaper's drop-down menu (as you showed in the IKMM forum)- how did you set that up for the hundreds of patches?

In AT5, if a project has <128 programs, then the Preset Mode should work. the defined presets will be saved in the Reaper project (and you could Export them as a Reaper Preset Library (.rpl file). Give that a go, with jut a few presets to start with.

Another project could have another set of up to 128 presets, and those could be saved into a different .rpl file..

-------------------------------------
Alternatively, if you did not wish to use AT5's Preset mode, you could save up to 128 Reaper presets into that drop-down menu. That would emulate the AT4 method, I think.

I have not done this for AT5, but here is a pic from DuneCM, showing the 8 "User presets" that I had saved and the "built-in programs" as notified to Reaper by the plug-in:



Note that, in this example, Program Changes 0-7 select the User Presets and PC 8 onwards select the built-in programs.

[Afghamistam]

Originally Posted by DarkStar

I'm a bit confused - AT4 had 100 preset slots that were listed in Reaper's drop-down menu (as you showed in the IKMM forum)- how did you set that up for the hundreds of patches?

The beauty of that is that you don't need to. The patches aren't really "saved" as it were, all that happens is that the CC message recalls an image of the state of the plugin at the point at which the MIDI item occurs in the project.

https://streamable.com/9pcz2i

So here where I have Program 1 recalling the AT preset "Red Z Clean Delay", if I wanted to swap that to "Red Z Heavy Delay", I would just select that from my Amplitube directory and it would stay like that forever, until I change it to something else. Even changes to given parameters are preserved in this method - without having to save the related preset in AT.

And since this functions independently from every other instance of Amplitube on every other track or project, it saves room - I only need to make use of a few Program entries in the Reaper dropdown, because the dropdown for every other instance of Amplitube in the project is unaffected. The only organising of presets I need to do is in Amplitube itself.

In contrast, trying to replicate this by manually saving presets in Reaper results in the same presets appearing for every other instance of Amplitube in every other project. And the only possible way of using them is to hard save each one as a Reaper preset - which even in a single song could easily balloon a list up to 30 different entries in the dropdown menu, which, like AT's patches, isn't searchable or even sortable.

Honestly, I'm feeling like this makes Amplitube 5 entirely unusable in this state. I don't know how others have been using this plugin in their projects - it feels like I'm the only one to have discovered this technique.

[DarkStar]

OK, I think I understand now - it's an area I have not used much. Sorry for wasting your time having to explain it

Let's see if I have got it:
-- AT4 has a built-in list of 100 program slots and publishes that list to Reaper
-- Reaper puts that list of 100 program slots into the preset list,
-- the program in any program slot can be changed jut by changing the gear models,
-- the program in any program slot can be selected just by sending the appropriate PC message.

-- AT5 does not publish any program slots to Reaper,
-- the above mechanism is therefore not possible,
-- the only option is to build your own presets one by one,
-- each preset can be changed by selecting it, changing the gear models, then saving it again,
-- this is, at best, impractical..

If I have understood, then, yes, that is a big step backwards. My suggestion would work but would be a lot of work and inflexible.

[Afghamistam]

Hey mate, sorry for being so late getting back - I somehow missed this reply.

Originally Posted by DarkStar

Let's see if I have got it:
-- AT4 has a built-in list of 100 program slots and publishes that list to Reaper

That's right. It appears in Reaper labelled as "VST Built-in programs". Each 100 slots are unique to that particular instance of the Amplitube plugin.

-- Reaper puts that list of 100 program slots into the preset list,
-- the program in any program slot can be changed jut by changing the gear models,

Yep. Any change you make in Amplitube is 'committed' to that Program.

-- the program in any program slot can be selected just by sending the appropriate PC message.

Exactly.

-- AT5 does not publish any program slots to Reaper,
-- the above mechanism is therefore not possible,
-- the only option is to build your own presets one by one,
-- each preset can be changed by selecting it, changing the gear models, then saving it again,
-- this is, at best, impractical..

That's right. The major issue is, though I suppose you can still use PC messages to change the state of Amplitube, you are limited to the 128 slots Amplitube gives you. So if you use say, thirty of them in one project, your next project forces you to start assigning presets from No.31 - since the same slots persist across plugin instances and projects. You can see how you would quickly run out.

Thanks for going through this with me. I've also escalated this to the official support in the meantime, as well.

[DarkStar]

No problem; it took me a while to grasp the problem.

Please add it to the AmpliTube 5 Wish List on the IKM forum or even start a thread there, explaining why it is important to get that feature back.