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Old 08-02-2015, 07:13 AM   #121
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The error message indicate several things
  • you may an obsolete version of REAPER which doesnt have this tags
  • or you may have make a mistake in the name
It tells you that because it is not recognized, if you save the project, it will be delete.


The project token for markers and regions subtitle is a bit complex.

If I remember well, for regions subtitles, it shoudl look like this
Code:
    <S&M_SUBTITLE 1073741825
      |bla bla bla bla bla
    >
    <S&M_SUBTITLE 1073741826
      |bla bla bla bla bla
    >

Look how the ID is right abobe the project token. and the first number will be 1073741825 not matter what.



For markers subtitles, it start from another number.


--
The heda's script can convert item start point as marker.
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Old 08-02-2015, 07:22 AM   #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Raym View Post
The error message indicate several things
  • you may an obsolete version of REAPER which doesnt have this tags
  • or you may have make a mistake in the name
It tells you that because it is not recognized, if you save the project, it will be delete.


The project token for markers and regions subtitle is a bit complex.

If I remember well, for regions subtitles, it shoudl look like this
Code:
    <S&M_SUBTITLE 1073741825
      |bla bla bla bla bla
    >
    <S&M_SUBTITLE 1073741826
      |bla bla bla bla bla
    >

Look how the ID is right abobe the project token. and the first number will be 1073741825 not matter what.



For markers subtitles, it start from another number.


--
The heda's script can convert item start point as marker.
I am using REAPER 5 RC9.

I am generating below and it appears to work apart from the strange warning.

See screenshot.

The ID of the S&M_SUBTITLE (7) maps to the MARKER (7)

Code:
MARKER 7 2.48000000 "Flash Cue Navigation" 0 0

<S&M_SUBTITLE 7
|This is a Flash Cue Navigation comment
>
Are you saying that the IDs I am generating should start from that high number, not 1?
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Old 08-02-2015, 07:26 AM   #123
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Hmmm weird... DOes it works if you save ?

Try to create a copy of the project and add the notes manually with the notes editor.

Then compare the difference between subtitles imported by vordio beta and by hand. there may be a tiny difference that change everything.

(you will not have such problems with text items he he :P)
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Old 08-02-2015, 07:31 AM   #124
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Raym View Post
(you will not have such problems with text items he he :P)
Don't worry. I am adding your text item method too. Should it only apply to regions though?

Items without durations are almost impossible to see and I am already adding standard markers so no need to convert them with a script.

There will be a checkbox saying something like 'create text item track for regions'.
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Old 08-02-2015, 07:38 AM   #125
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Thanks !

The heda script works with tracks labels

Here how it works

Quote:
Originally Posted by heda
Label the tracks containing your items with a suffix "Markers x" or "Regions x" Where x is a number that will be used as the start id number for the markers. You can have several tracks, with different starting numbers to avoid markers to have the same id. You should avoid different tracks with same id markers. For example you could have these tracks, with 100 items in each.
- EXPORT Regions 1
- Structure Regions 100
- Lyrics Regions 200
- Annotations 30
(so two tracks are necesassry, one for region if any, one for markers if any)

Yep, but markers item doesn't need to be tiny, you can make 1 or 2 seconds wide by default. Only the start points will be used as markers, and it doesn't matter if they overlap.
If any problem, the Nudge Items functions can be used to extend or reduce items size on this tracks.
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Old 08-02-2015, 07:48 AM   #126
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Raym View Post
Thanks !

The heda script works with tracks labels

Here how it works



(so two tracks are necesassry, one for region if any, one for markers if any)

Yep, but markers item doesn't need to be tiny, you can make 1 or 2 seconds wide by default. Only the start points will be used as markers, and it doesn't matter if they overlap.
If any problem, the Nudge Items functions can be used to extend or reduce items size on this tracks.
OK. Two tracks. Making markers 1 second long seems sensible.

I have just realised that this is going to be insane with FCPX. If anyone uses markers the way I do ,the REAPER project will have hundreds of them!

I use markers as snap points to line things up such as SFX and also marking beginning of interesting points in sentences that could be cut and still make sense.

Also in FCPX, markers and regions belong to individual clips, not the timeline. FCPX doesn't really have things belonging to sequences and tracks. It's all individual objects with connection relationships.

From FCPX manual..

"Markers are classified as standard markers (blue), chapter markers (orange), to-do items (red), or completed to-do items (green)."

Maybe I should restrict them to chapter markers & todo markers only for FCPX?

The ideal would be to translate to audio item markers but REAPER can't do that. I would actually love it if it could. Item markers as snap points are really handy.
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Old 08-02-2015, 08:11 AM   #127
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I don't use FCPX but sure, having some restrictions on type of marker could be helpful as the audio editors doesn't need every infos of the video editors.

There is also Chapter Marker in Premiere Pro.
Maybe we can use the same principle here.

this will left some marker for "image" information to stay to the video editor side only.

It is a bit sad that FCP XML don't have more meta infos about markers that would allow us to filter them.
Using keywords as name isn't a good solution I think... But we coudl imagine that all marker prefix "Vordio" could be treated, and all other ignored.. I tell that just to gave ideas for filtering markers, I don't especially need this kind of thing for the moment.

I think we just open a pandora box.
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Old 08-02-2015, 08:46 AM   #128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Raym View Post
I don't use FCPX but sure, having some restrictions on type of marker could be helpful as the audio editors doesn't need every infos of the video editors.

There is also Chapter Marker in Premiere Pro.
Maybe we can use the same principle here.

this will left some marker for "image" information to stay to the video editor side only.

It is a bit sad that FCP XML don't have more meta infos about markers that would allow us to filter them.
Using keywords as name isn't a good solution I think... But we coudl imagine that all marker prefix "Vordio" could be treated, and all other ignored.. I tell that just to gave ideas for filtering markers, I don't especially need this kind of thing for the moment.

I think we just open a pandora box.
Yes. Only XML from FCPX makes a distinction between marker types, not Premiere. Chapter markers in FCPX can even specify a thumbnail frame relative to to the marker.

I think I will only translate chapter markers and todo markers from FCPX. (These are most similar to timeline based markers)

Todo markers seem like a sensible way to send instructions to the sound editor.
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Old 08-02-2015, 08:51 AM   #129
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Just to know : There is another way to export markers from premiere pro, it is to use the export markers as HTML (with thumbnail) or as CSV, which is very useful.
I thought about making a script for parsing these files but it was too much works for my needs, I only had couple of markers to send to REAPER ^^
And an integrated solution (within Vordio) will make far more sense.
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Old 08-02-2015, 12:15 PM   #130
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I think I know what to do with excessive markers - ones that relate to clip rather than timeline.

I'll just add their names and comments to the audio item notes.

That way it doesn't make the project messy but the info is still there if you want to see it.
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Old 08-02-2015, 12:34 PM   #131
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I have just discovered that FCPX markers already have a duration in the XML but there is nothing in the UI yet that can change it!
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Old 08-03-2015, 03:48 AM   #132
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I can also put all the marker information in the item notes.

I put a time position for each marker that is relative to the item's position.

See screenshot from an FCPX test.

There are some markers that belong to the clip rather than the timeline. Put those here for Premiere too?
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Old 08-03-2015, 04:15 AM   #133
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Items notes for clip markers seems ok to me.

Hoping that one day, we could have item marker in REAPER (marker that are not mixed with the project markers).

Meanwhile, it seems nice to me !
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Old 08-03-2015, 04:21 AM   #134
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Raym View Post
Items notes for clip markers seems ok to me.

Hoping that one day, we could have item marker in REAPER (marker that are not mixed with the project markers).

Meanwhile, it seems nice to me !
One thing I am not sure about is whether the marker time stamp should be relative to the clip start or relative to the source media?

Clips can contain markers that are currently out of range for the clip but they would appear if you extended one edge or if you previewed media source in the viewer.
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Old 08-03-2015, 04:27 AM   #135
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Quote:
Clips can contain markers that are currently out of range for the clip but they would appear if you extended one edge or if you previewed media source in the viewer.
Source media is better :P
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Old 08-03-2015, 05:05 AM   #136
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Raym View Post
Source media is better :P
Thinking about it a bit more, I just added both. First number is item position, second is source position.

Comments added after the marker header if there is a comment. See screenshot.
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Old 08-03-2015, 05:30 AM   #137
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Why not :P
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Old 08-03-2015, 07:05 AM   #138
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The weird REAPER warning message is still confusing me.

Comparing the texts I really can't see any difference between the way I am saving S&M_SUBTITLE and the way REAPER does saves it when I hit save.

Also, it says 2 S&M_SUBTITLE items, but there are 7 S&M_SUBTITLE items!

Code:
  <EXTENSIONS
    <S&M_SUBTITLE 1
      |This is a normal comment
    >
    <S&M_SUBTITLE 2
      |This is a Weblink comment
    >
    <S&M_SUBTITLE 3
      |This is a chapter comment
    >
    <S&M_SUBTITLE 4
      |This is a segmentation comment
    >
    <S&M_SUBTITLE 6
      |This is a Flash Cue Event comment
      |Blah 
      |Blah
      |Blah
    >
    <S&M_SUBTITLE 7
      |This is a Flash Cue Navigation comment
    >
  >
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Old 08-03-2015, 07:20 AM   #139
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except the error message... does it work good ?
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Old 08-03-2015, 07:50 AM   #140
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Raym View Post
except the error message... does it work good ?
It worked fine despite the warning. It was just annoying me a lot so wanted to make it disappear.

I have now stopped the warning by making markers and regions use their own counters. So markers start from 1, regions start from 1. Before I had a single counter for both.

That was a crazy guess... Why does that make the error disappear????? The error obviously doesn't mean what it appears to say.
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Old 08-03-2015, 08:25 AM   #141
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrlimbic View Post
It worked fine despite the warning. It was just annoying me a lot so wanted to make it disappear.

I have now stopped the warning by making markers and regions use their own counters. So markers start from 1, regions start from 1. Before I had a single counter for both.

That was a crazy guess... Why does that make the error disappear????? The error obviously doesn't mean what it appears to say.
Oh dear. My fix has a bad side effect of making S&M notes not work correctly. S&M notes expects a unique ID across both markers and regions.
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Old 08-03-2015, 08:49 AM   #142
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I don't know if it is related but remember that sws subtitles at id 1073741825.

Well... you will have far less trouble with text items :P (I already say that ? :P)
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Old 08-03-2015, 08:52 AM   #143
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Raym View Post
I don't know if it is related but remember that sws subtitles at id 1073741825.

Well... you will have far less trouble with text items :P (I already say that ? :P)
Yes I understand your point now.

Adding 0x40000000 to the ID is a hack in S&M notes to avoid the problem that marker IDs and Region IDs can conflict in REAPER.

I just tried this and it fixed it! New release coming very soon..
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Old 08-03-2015, 08:58 AM   #144
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That was fast !!

Nice work !
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Old 08-03-2015, 09:30 AM   #145
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Raym View Post
That was fast !!

Nice work !
Ready! Come and get it. Metadata metadata metadata!!!

There is no 'text item track' support yet but you could script them into existence from the markers, regions and S&M notes.

http://vordio.net/vordio-4-3-2-release/
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Old 08-03-2015, 09:48 AM   #146
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You are right. Scripts can be used, and so integration of text items into Vordio is not an absolute necessity.

I already script the regions to item part.



I can do the same easily for text markers, with a customizable item length

EDIT: Oh sorry but it fact a native support would be great

We can't return subtitles notes from SWS extensions, we can't access the "extensions" part chunk of the project and there is no function to "get" them. I made FR for that months ago but... no answer.

So... text items native support would be great hehe !
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Old 08-03-2015, 09:57 AM   #147
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Raym View Post
EDIT: Oh sorry but it fact a native support would be great

We can't return subtitles notes from SWS extensions, we can't access the "extensions" part chunk of the project and there is no function to "get" them. I made FR for that months ago but... no answer.

So... text items native support would be great hehe !
I am going to make VORDIO dump reports soon. There are potential uses of video project metadata that are not only useful to the sound editor.

I could actually dump all markers, regions, comments etc into a CSV file in the project directory.

I am going to do a similar thing for my 'alternate dialogue takes' script. Dump all the scene/take/clip numbers to a text file, so the script can use that as a look up table.
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Old 08-12-2015, 06:49 PM   #148
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Have you plan to make some video tutorials to showcase REAPER video editing czpabilities and Vordio's workflow ? V5 is out now :P
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Old 08-13-2015, 03:11 AM   #149
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Raym View Post
Have you plan to make some video tutorials to showcase REAPER video editing czpabilities and Vordio's workflow ? V5 is out now :P
Yes I plan to make a couple VORDIO workflow videos, one for FCPX, one for Premiere.

I also want to make an introduction to REAPER overview video. I spent an evening with a Protools user trying to do an edit in REAPER, and wrote notes down every time she got stuck. There were a lot of notes, so it will be quite long.

I doubt if I will make a video specifically for REAPER's video features (why don't you?). I have opened some FCPX edits in REAPER 5 to see what happened and it mostly worked, but it didn't play so well with projects that use very heavy uncompressed footage.

EDIT: Yes I bought V5 yesterday. One of the good thing about V5 being official now is Lua for everyone. I much prefer Lua to EEL and have some ideas for scripts.
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Old 08-13-2015, 04:13 AM   #150
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That will be awesome, I shew Vordio to people on french forums who have concerns about REAPER 5 for video post productions, and it seems that they like it very much :P

I don't plan to showcase video capabilities for the moment, as I am in a Lua Scripting Video Tutorials series these times :P

Can't wait to see what your scripts could do !
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Old 08-13-2015, 05:00 AM   #151
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrlimbic View Post
Yes I plan to make a couple VORDIO workflow videos, one for FCPX, one for Premiere.

I also want to make an introduction to REAPER overview video. I spent an evening with a Protools user trying to do an edit in REAPER, and wrote notes down every time she got stuck. There were a lot of notes, so it will be quite long.
Interesting. Can you share this list of concerns here as well ? I'm likely to encounter these concerns with other editors here.
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Old 08-13-2015, 05:04 AM   #152
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@mrlimbic
Since Vordio now works on Window, you chould post a new thread in Q&A How to Tricks forum, because windows users don't go in OSX subforums at all (except if they know this post of course :P).
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Old 08-13-2015, 05:22 AM   #153
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Quote:
Originally Posted by airon View Post
Interesting. Can you share this list of concerns here as well ? I'm likely to encounter these concerns with other editors here.
Yes I will share them later. She is coming for another session next week. Will be interesting to if anything is still confusing after she has practiced with REAPER a bit since last session. I know she is desperate to ditch Protools and will not renew her license when it expires.

Someone on twitter yesterday told me they just switched from Protools to REAPER because of the things I was posting there! REAPER seems to be becoming pretty popular with game audio people due to their non typical workflows. REAPER's flexibility helps a lot with that.
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Old 08-13-2015, 05:27 AM   #154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Raym View Post
@mrlimbic
Since Vordio now works on Window, you chould post a new thread in Q&A How to Tricks forum, because windows users don't go in OSX subforums at all (except if they know this post of course :P).
Good idea. I forgot this was an OSX forum.

I have discovered some odd things with Premiere related to timings (which the reconform feature doesn't like much but am trying to workaround in the new reconform engine coming soon). So for now reconform works much better with FCPX than it does with Premiere.

Take a look at this screenshot. The same audio file copied and pasted 3 times has different duration each time it is copied!
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Old 08-13-2015, 06:40 AM   #155
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Hmmm that's weird... I just tested without problem, even if the audio items was just a section of an audio files.
Can you show me that as an animated gif ? it is very curious !
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Old 08-13-2015, 10:38 AM   #156
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Raym View Post
Hmmm that's weird... I just tested without problem, even if the audio items was just a section of an audio files.
Can you show me that as an animated gif ? it is very curious !
Are you using Premiere 2015 or an old version? I think it is probably a recent bug. I got an experienced Premiere teacher to do same and he could repeat the problem. He also discovered it leaves tiny sub-frame gaps when you zoom in (which probably accounts for the extra duration).
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Old 08-13-2015, 10:40 AM   #157
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2014 for the moment.

But if someone could reproduce it... that's bad for Adobe !

They should correct it quickly if it is reported, it is not the kind of bug we can leave in place.
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Old 08-13-2015, 10:52 AM   #158
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It's gotta be sample rounding
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Old 08-13-2015, 10:56 AM   #159
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@EpicSounds
maybe more frame rounding :P
But there is 2 frames different. that's a lot.
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Old 08-13-2015, 03:22 PM   #160
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This might be interesting for you:

RF64 read support
RF64 write support

New 5.01 pre1.
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