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12-14-2018, 04:53 AM
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#241
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 12,792
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07-23-2019, 08:21 AM
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#242
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 981
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I make it a policy to keep every take in my clients' sessions. There have been more than one time when I send over final mixes, only to be asked if I could replace something with a previous take (vocal line, bass track, guitar solo, etc). I keep EVERYTHING, so it would be wonderful if the Take System was like everything else in REAPER: simple to use on the surface, but powerful enough to make numerous changes via Preferences and Menus.
My biggest issues with the take system are best exemplified in Robert's first post: Issues #3 and #4. I don't think Splits should be introduced into a track unless they are specifically made by the user.
Time is money, and when I'm working with clients I am very aware that they want to get things done and not wait around for me to mess with the computer. When we are tracking, we are tracking, not editing. Punch-ins are part of the tracking process, and I hear myself saying, "give me a couple minutes to clean up these edits and then we'll listen back" on more than one occasion.
Having all those Items can cause problems when editing across multiple tracks. I do that a LOT: multiple drum tracks when recording drum set, bass DI and bass amp, two microphones on guitar amps, etc. Using the studio's physical plate reverb and/or analog outboard delays on any instrument automatically adds another track or two. One slip of the mouse and and comps can be incorrect across multiple tracks, which happens on occasion.
I could duplicate tracks, crop to active takes on the duplicate, glue, then save the original track just in case. But why do that when a playlist or other feature could keep everything in one place and out of the way?
I would love for REAPER to have a take system that doesn't auto-split items, allows me to comp parts quickly and cleanly and allows for switching between takes to not require a lot of clicking and selecting, as we see in Issues #3 and #4.
A New Take system should allow the user to comp multiple takes into one, and hide the unused takes in case they are needed later. The comped take should then be considered an Item (without Gluing or Healing). Item FX would work easily on the comped Take, since there are no unwanted Splits. Any Action on an Item would be available for the Comp (for example, you could Comp multiple Takes then use "Item Properties: Normalize Item" without having to Glue or Heal).
I think the Take system would be more flexible and powerful if this were the case.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Justin
Thanks, I'm digesting this and finding ways to address some of these behaviors without changing anything big, stay tuned..
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Justin, It was great to see you chime in on this thread. Have you given this any more thought?
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07-23-2019, 09:39 AM
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#243
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,269
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Quote:
I would love for REAPER to have a take system that doesn't auto-split items, allows me to comp parts quickly and cleanly and allows for switching between takes to not require a lot of clicking and selecting
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That's not really required as it is but I sort of gave up trying to teach people - it seems the psychological barrier is too strong for the force. Whatever they do, don't take the splits away permanently, they are far, far too valuable to me. FWIW, I also edit multitrack drums with multiple takes and so on.
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
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07-23-2019, 10:36 AM
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#244
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 981
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karbomusic
That's not really required as it is but I sort of gave up trying to teach people - it seems the psychological barrier is too strong for the force.
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I'm not really sure what you're talking about. It's doubtful that it has anything to do with psychological barriers... maybe you didn't explain it well. Maybe it's not addressing my points. Did you make a video on YouTube about this or something?
Quote:
Originally Posted by karbomusic
Whatever they do, don't take the splits away permanently, they are far, far too valuable to me.
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I don't think the splits should be taken away either. It should be optional, like everything else in Reaper! As I said in my post:
Quote:
Originally Posted by citizenkeith
it would be wonderful if the Take System was like everything else in REAPER: simple to use on the surface, but powerful enough to make numerous changes via Preferences and Menus.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karbomusic
FWIW, I also edit multitrack drums with multiple takes and so on.
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I'm happy that you're happy with the current system, but that doesn't mean it's ideal. FWIW I have been editing "multitrack drums with multiple takes and so on" with Reaper for years, but that doesn't make it ideal either.
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07-23-2019, 10:46 AM
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#245
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,269
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Quote:
Originally Posted by citizenkeith
I'm not really sure what you're talking about. It's doubtful that it has anything to do with psychological barriers... maybe you didn't explain it well. Maybe it's not addressing my points. Did you make a video on YouTube about this or something?
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The best I can think of to sum it up is... A number of things people complain about with takes, is a can't get comfortable issue, used to X previously issue, or a just unaware issue, not an efficiency issue. I can't argue what someone likes or doesn't like, I can argue for getting the same result (a finished song) with as or more efficient steps, and with less errors, using the current take system - especially where punches, overdubs, lots of takes and splits are concerned.
That said there are legitimate issues in this thread, but I'm not talking about those.
I really want to make a video, I just haven't come up with the format on how to present it in a way that is valuable and the time to do so. IOW, it has to be narrated and explain so that concepts make good sense, animated GIFs and silent videos won't do it. What I'd most prefer is to do an entire session, including the multiple takes and doing punchins etc. then the editing and so on, instead of faking it but that takes a lot of time.
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
Last edited by karbomusic; 07-23-2019 at 10:52 AM.
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07-23-2019, 10:47 AM
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#246
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: India Mumbai
Posts: 816
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On a side note, i don't know if Robert is still on this forum , but his lua tutorial was very clear and i hope he would have made more. I donated too and i hope he finds reasons enough to like reaper in the future/!! )
peace
zook
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07-23-2019, 11:54 AM
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#247
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 12,632
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I've posted before on this and I'll not repeat all that again beyond just the first bit: The take system in Reaper with the new recorded takes inserted into the single original audio item is the default. But it's only the default... You can hate it and move on! There's the lanes system which I like. There's the ability to group newly recorded together items which lets you click on one to select the group - which leads to multitrack workflow where working in just a single track makes all the selected together items follow. I prefer that.
Other people are doing a "3rd" system where they put multitrack into multi-channel items in lieu of the 'selected group'.
There are probably a few more workflows that I have no clue exist.
But the Reaper thing above all is: If you find yourself at odds with some default... you can change it. I prefer the simple DAW-style workflow that the lanes method facilitates, so I changed to that right away. YMMV
Some people prefer the analog tape style workflow (with simulated punching in/out and the whole works) even though you have literally unlimited tracks in a DAW. And Reaper (and many other DAW apps) have all those features available too.
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07-23-2019, 12:20 PM
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#248
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 981
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karbomusic
The best I can think of to sum it up is... A number of things people complain about with takes, is a can't get comfortable issue, used to X previously issue, or a just unaware issue, not an efficiency issue. I can't argue what someone likes or doesn't like, I can argue for getting the same result (a finished song) with as or more efficient steps, and with less errors, using the current take system - especially where punches, overdubs, lots of takes and splits are concerned.
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Ok, that's probably why I was confused. I'm not discussing "can't get comfortable," "used to X previously" or "unaware." I'm perfectly comfortable using Reaper the way I use it now. I just think it could be implemented better. Which is why I added my comments here, probably the most-watched thread about the Take System.
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07-23-2019, 01:00 PM
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#249
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,269
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I did mean being uncomfortable with how to handle lots of splits and things like multi-take drums and so on. So I'm saying that some things that are considered slow and bad implementations aren't really, not if we concentrate on the job at hand from an accuracy and efficiency standpoint which I assume is top of the list - that isn't true for everything though.
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
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07-23-2019, 01:16 PM
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#250
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,269
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Quote:
Originally Posted by serr
Some people prefer the analog tape style workflow (with simulated punching in/out and the whole works) even though you have literally unlimited tracks in a DAW. And Reaper (and many other DAW apps) have all those features available too.
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It isn't about preferring outdated track limitations at all FWIW - it's because takes are far more modern and superior than multiple tracks; 100 tracks representing 100 takes would be a farking huge mess to manage in comparison - or even 10 takes for that matter. I remember the early days of Logic when Emagic still owned them, auto-takes just added a new track, horrible by today's take standards.
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
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07-23-2019, 03:11 PM
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#251
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Cologne
Posts: 1,640
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Quote:
Originally Posted by citizenkeith
My biggest issues with the take system are best exemplified in Robert's first post: Issues #3 and #4. I don't think Splits should be introduced into a track unless they are specifically made by the user.
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yes that's it. you summed it up perfectly.
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07-23-2019, 11:49 PM
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#252
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,714
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Quote:
Originally Posted by citizenkeith
I would love for REAPER to have a take system that doesn't auto-split items, allows me to comp parts quickly and cleanly and allows for switching between takes to not require a lot of clicking and selecting, as we see in Issues #3 and #4.
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How would you prefer REAPER to handle incomplete, overlapping takes?
Would it work better for you if REAPER creates full-length takes by inserting silence, rather than splitting and inserting empty takes?
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07-24-2019, 12:05 AM
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#253
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 417
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I prefer to use the lane system, but the big problem is that Reaper doesn't group takes across tracks, and it is a great hassle when editing various takes of multitrack drums: I have to manually group the takes, wasting a lot of time and sometimes mistakely grouping items from different takes...So I think playlist editing is a much needed feature in Reaper.
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07-24-2019, 05:16 AM
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#254
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: South
Posts: 587
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxdis
I prefer to use the lane system, but the big problem is that Reaper doesn't group takes across tracks, and it is a great hassle when editing various takes of multitrack drums: I have to manually group the takes, wasting a lot of time and sometimes mistakely grouping items from different takes...So I think playlist editing is a much needed feature in Reaper.
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Yeah - it is slow and cumbersome, so I do it on ProTools in no time using playlists WITH track grouping - plus mixing is MUCH faster with proper track grouping.
(especially when you are recording or mixing song after song for an album with lots of overdubs)
It is what it is....
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07-24-2019, 06:18 AM
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#255
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 12,632
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxdis
I prefer to use the lane system, but the big problem is that Reaper doesn't group takes across tracks, and it is a great hassle when editing various takes of multitrack drums: I have to manually group the takes, wasting a lot of time and sometimes mistakely grouping items from different takes...So I think playlist editing is a much needed feature in Reaper.
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SWS group newly recorded items. Enable it.
Every recorded together bunch of multitrack is grouped.
Then enable 'selecting one item in a group selects the whole group'.
Working with multitrack is now literally like working with a single track.
This with lanes mode is my preferred workflow. Straight to the point. Move as fast as you or the client thinks or speaks.
Maybe a "takes" system based around the lanes method would be appealing? Not sure what that would look like. The take system puts multiple audio streams into a single item and then lets you click to select the active stream (take). The "item" is the thing split. If you have multiple audio streams (takes) in there, they all get split at the same places. Otherwise you need to invent a system to split within an item. Items within items or something.
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07-24-2019, 07:05 AM
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#256
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2006
Location: NA - North Augusta South Carolina
Posts: 4,294
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It seems to me the "problem" is that you guys want a system that reconciles advantages of the present system for comping single tracks (vocals, guitar) with tracking drums/ensembles?
You want the takes hidden in groups that you'd access via the playlist in PT?
You want something like a "Ensemble/Drum Takes Collating Mode"?
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07-24-2019, 08:06 AM
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#257
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 981
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chip mcdonald
It seems to me the "problem" is that you guys want a system that reconciles advantages of the present system for comping single tracks (vocals, guitar) with tracking drums/ensembles?
You want the takes hidden in groups that you'd access via the playlist in PT?
You want something like a "Ensemble/Drum Takes Collating Mode"?
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I said what I wanted in my post that bumped this thread yesterday.
I don't think Splits should be introduced into a track unless they are specifically made by the user (or there should be an option for that not to occur). This would free up individual takes to be whole Items, allowing for Item FX and Item Actions to be used on each take (since there would be no Splits).
In my mind, that would lend itself to further organization of Takes... whether that's a "playlist" or "ensemble mode" would be open for debate.
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07-24-2019, 08:10 AM
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#258
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 417
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Quote:
Originally Posted by serr
SWS group newly recorded items. Enable it.
Every recorded together bunch of multitrack is grouped.
Then enable 'selecting one item in a group selects the whole group'.
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I've tried that action sometime ago, but it didn't worked with exploded takes in FIPM...now it seems something has changed, because it is working EXACTLY as I want, that's great! I think I solved my big issue with Reaper take system, thank you!
Only minor issue, the tracks should be have FIPM toggled on BEFORE starting to record; if I record some takes, and AFTER that I explode the takes and toggle FIPM on, all the takes grouping infos are lost; it would be great if grouping infos would be keeped when takes are exploded:
https://imgur.com/qYt6Nef
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07-24-2019, 08:29 AM
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#259
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,269
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Quote:
Originally Posted by citizenkeith
I don't think Splits should be introduced into a track unless they are specifically made by the user (or there should be an option for that not to occur).
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I think it's better to understand it's not the splits, it's that the takes are in a single container. I used Cubase for years, they were splits there too, just not the same container. In the beginning I wanted Reaper to be like cubase (I have some posts from 10 years ago of me asking) but in that format, it wasn't really the splits that mattered, it was that the bottom most take was what was audible- a particular feature I wish Reaper offered but still, there were splits involved, just not in containers.
That said, it's the actual problems that one deals with when the entire container is split that should be expounded on and explained. That's important because I've seen a few presented that were real issues, I've seen others that were not actual issues at all and the user didn't know how to address the situation.
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
Last edited by karbomusic; 07-24-2019 at 08:35 AM.
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07-24-2019, 08:37 AM
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#260
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 981
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karbomusic
That said, it's the actual problems that one deals with when the entire container is split that should be expounded on. That's important because I've seen a few presented that were real issues, I've seen many others that were not actual issues and rather the user didn't know how to address the situation.
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I appreciate that some users may not know how to address a particular situation. That doesn't mean that the current method of addressing a situation is the best method.
My point: Splitting the entire container should be OPTIONAL. And I think the benefits of not splitting that container would give users more control and flexibility over their work. Win win.
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07-24-2019, 08:45 AM
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#261
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 29,269
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Quote:
Originally Posted by citizenkeith
I appreciate that users don't know how to address a particular situation. That doesn't mean that the current method of addressing a situation is the best method.
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I think it's extremely relevant that if it isn't the best method, then how is it not the "best" method. It may be painful to figure out but it is crucial. This bring us back to the getting work done/efficiency part vs what one is used to or other reasons. What other options can there be in determining not best?
Meaning, is it not best because of what one is used to or not best because it is less efficient or more likely to cause mistakes. I'm not being argumentative or obtuse, I'm trying to figure out what is real and what is not liking or simply uncomfortable (assuming the efficiency or errors are reasonably equal). Those two need to be demonstrably separated. If efficiency is not the same, that also needs to be shown so that it is clear.
__________________
Music is what feelings sound like.
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07-24-2019, 09:47 AM
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#262
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,714
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Quote:
Originally Posted by citizenkeith
I don't think Splits should be introduced into a track unless they are specifically made by the user (or there should be an option for that not to occur). This would free up individual takes to be whole Items,
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This is exactly what recording in free item positioning mode does: each take is a whole item.
Furthermore, items that were recorded in FIPM can easily be padded with silence to align them precisely, and it is straightforward to incorporate new recordings that may be sent to you from another studio.
Last edited by juliansader; 07-24-2019 at 11:37 AM.
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07-24-2019, 11:02 AM
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#263
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 981
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juliansader
This is exactly what recording in free item positioning mode does: each take is a whole item.
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As far as I can tell by reading the REAPER manual, FIPM is applied to tracks, not takes. I'll have to spend some time again with FIPM when I have time outside of work. If it does apply to takes, I'll be really happy to try that out!
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07-24-2019, 01:39 PM
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#264
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 373
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Whenever I look at the Grouping window, I often find myself wishing for two check-boxes that aren't there: "Item Edit" and "Insert FX". If "Item Edit" were an option in that window, do you all think that would solve any of these issues?
Last edited by Mr. Green; 07-24-2019 at 05:56 PM.
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08-04-2019, 12:46 PM
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#265
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Seattle
Posts: 35
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Thank you for this post, I'm glad someone's bringing the much-needed improvements in the take system to light, especially #3 which is endlessly obnoxious for me. I have no idea why crossfades aren't used either, like every other DAW out there. Those short fade outs/ins are hardly transparent on many sources.
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08-12-2019, 02:12 AM
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#266
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 560
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Quote:
Originally Posted by serr
I've posted before on this and I'll not repeat all that again beyond just the first bit: The take system in Reaper with the new recorded takes inserted into the single original audio item is the default. But it's only the default... You can hate it and move on! There's the lanes system which I like. There's the ability to group newly recorded together items which lets you click on one to select the group - which leads to multitrack workflow where working in just a single track makes all the selected together items follow. I prefer that.
Other people are doing a "3rd" system where they put multitrack into multi-channel items in lieu of the 'selected group'.
There are probably a few more workflows that I have no clue exist.
But the Reaper thing above all is: If you find yourself at odds with some default... you can change it. I prefer the simple DAW-style workflow that the lanes method facilitates, so I changed to that right away. YMMV
Some people prefer the analog tape style workflow (with simulated punching in/out and the whole works) even though you have literally unlimited tracks in a DAW. And Reaper (and many other DAW apps) have all those features available too.
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Is there a video on the lanes system? I can't seem to find anything anywhere about it.
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08-12-2019, 07:44 AM
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#267
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 981
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Multibomber
Is there a video on the lanes system? I can't seem to find anything anywhere about it.
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There's a little bit of info on page 61 of the Reaper Manual.
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08-18-2019, 10:55 AM
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#268
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 3,127
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I agree that the creation of Splits as the take-boundary separator creates more harm than good. It's too destructive of a process for such a delicate task, and removes our ability to actually use the split tool for what it's actually intended for. Won't beat it to death as it's been discussed a thousand times in this thread, but rather want to pitch some potential ideas:
1. Recording layers simply records layers, without creating splits at overlap points
2. When viewing the layers, what would have been splits could be replaced by clickable 'zones' that toggle between the different takes. Those zone boundaries would adhere to what would have been the split points. The selected 'zone' determines what gets promoted to the Top Layer (what you hear)
3. The layers are freely movable, splittable, manipulatable in their lane and don't affect other lanes
4. The "top layer" aka the comp, is a New Contiguous Item dynamically created from the selected zones. It doesn't have splits by default, but if you did add splits to it (to crossfade clicks and pops between the underlying takes) those splits do not affect the underlying take layers, they are unique to the top layer.
5. If you fly in an item on top of the Top Layer, rather than do some weird crossfade insanity it just becomes a new layer and behaves the same as the others
...just thinking out loud here. Thoughts?
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08-18-2019, 11:13 AM
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#269
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 981
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ferropop
I agree that the creation of Splits as the take-boundary separator creates more harm than good. It's too destructive of a process for such a delicate task, and removes our ability to actually use the split tool for what it's actually intended for. Won't beat it to death as it's been discussed a thousand times in this thread, but rather want to pitch some potential ideas:
1. Recording layers simply records layers, without creating splits at overlap points
2. When viewing the layers, what would have been splits could be replaced by clickable 'zones' that toggle between the different takes. Those zone boundaries would adhere to what would have been the split points. The selected 'zone' determines what gets promoted to the Top Layer (what you hear)
3. The layers are freely movable, splittable, manipulatable in their lane and don't affect other lanes
4. The "top layer" aka the comp, is a New Contiguous Item dynamically created from the selected zones. It doesn't have splits by default, but if you did add splits to it (to crossfade clicks and pops between the underlying takes) those splits do not affect the underlying take layers, they are unique to the top layer.
5. If you fly in an item on top of the Top Layer, rather than do some weird crossfade insanity it just becomes a new layer and behaves the same as the others
...just thinking out loud here. Thoughts?
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I love it.
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08-18-2019, 11:23 AM
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#270
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 12,632
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ferropop
I agree that the creation of Splits as the take-boundary separator creates more harm than good. It's too destructive of a process for such a delicate task, and removes our ability to actually use the split tool for what it's actually intended for. Won't beat it to death as it's been discussed a thousand times in this thread, but rather want to pitch some potential ideas:
1. Recording layers simply records layers, without creating splits at overlap points
2. When viewing the layers, what would have been splits could be replaced by clickable 'zones' that toggle between the different takes. Those zone boundaries would adhere to what would have been the split points. The selected 'zone' determines what gets promoted to the Top Layer (what you hear)
3. The layers are freely movable, splittable, manipulatable in their lane and don't affect other lanes
4. The "top layer" aka the comp, is a New Contiguous Item dynamically created from the selected zones. It doesn't have splits by default, but if you did add splits to it (to crossfade clicks and pops between the underlying takes) those splits do not affect the underlying take layers, they are unique to the top layer.
5. If you fly in an item on top of the Top Layer, rather than do some weird crossfade insanity it just becomes a new layer and behaves the same as the others
...just thinking out loud here. Thoughts?
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What you call layers are called lanes in Reaper.
If you want to edit takes as individual items in lanes, then it would in fact create more harm than good to use the take system that puts multiple takes into a single item. Use the lanes method instead of the take method.
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08-18-2019, 11:53 AM
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#271
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 981
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Quote:
Originally Posted by serr
What you call layers are called lanes in Reaper.
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What ferropop is describing is not lanes but a different concept all together. Lanes do not behave the way he describes them in his post.
Quote:
Originally Posted by serr
it would in fact create more harm than good to use the take system that puts multiple takes into a single item.
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I'm not sure I follow.
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08-18-2019, 11:58 AM
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#272
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 3,127
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NOTE: this is a mockup proposal, this does not exist in Reaper...
In this... Zone Handles are what are created when recording overlapping takes. They're freely movable (and you can create new ones) and their sole purpose is to define the zone boundaries that generate the Top Layer. Each Zone Handle could also have a Crossfade handle so that they fade smoothly into each other.
Each Take Lane's items are freely movable/stretchable/everything'able, and doesn't affect any other take lane. ie, Splits only affect the specific take in the lane you choose and no others. There's your ProTools playlisting.
The beauty of this is that your SOURCE takes are clean, never cut/split/screwed up in any way in the comping process. The Top Layer is what you hear, and the method of determining the Top Layer is totally non-destructive, just some handles.
...also this would remain compatible with ARA2. Reaper would just report the Zone Handle locations as though they were the Active Take boundaries.
Last edited by ferropop; 08-18-2019 at 09:23 PM.
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08-18-2019, 04:32 PM
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#273
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 373
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ferropop
In this... Zone Handles are what are created when recording overlapping takes. They're freely movable (and you can create new ones) and their sole purpose is to define the zone boundaries that generate the Top Layer. Each Zone Handle could also have a Crossfade handle so that they fade smoothly into each other.
Each Take Lane's items are freely movable/stretchable/everything'able, and doesn't affect any other take lane. ie, Splits only affect the specific take in the lane you choose and no others. There's your ProTools playlisting.
The beauty of this is that your SOURCE takes are clean, never cut/split/screwed up in any way in the comping process. The Top Layer is what you hear, and the method of determining the Top Layer is totally non-destructive, just some handles.
...also this would remain compatible with ARA2. Reaper would just report the Zone Handle locations as though they were the Active Take boundaries.
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If you don't mind me asking, would you or someone else who knows kindly share the hidden secret to using Free Item Positioning without having ALL the overlapping items play back at once? I have no use for that, but DESPERATELY need some way to have alternate versions of takes with different edits, lengths, etc - and I'm doing a lousy job of finding that out on my own. :-(
plz
thnku
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08-18-2019, 04:37 PM
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#274
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 4,820
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Quote:
Originally Posted by serr
If Use the lanes method instead of the take method.
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Hmm excuse me but what is this lanes method?
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08-18-2019, 04:48 PM
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#275
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 1,429
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Green
If you don't mind me asking, would you or someone else who knows kindly share the hidden secret to using Free Item Positioning without having ALL the overlapping items play back at once? ......
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You can mute items. Double click item to get Media item Properties....Or if you're doing this a lot, Preferences> Appearance> Media> Media item buttons.
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08-18-2019, 05:03 PM
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#276
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 373
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goldreap
You can mute items. Double click item to get Media item Properties....Or if you're doing this a lot, Preferences> Appearance> Media> Media item buttons.
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My apologies - I'll try to clarify a bit more.
I've seen frequent comparisons of free item positioning to Pro Tools playlists, in that you can have multiple items in separate lanes and select which lane you wish to hear, but I've never been able to get that to work without hearing ALL items above or below each other playing back at the same time. How do I hear just one selected lane?
btw - in my case, since edited items being muted are often a significant element needed in alternate takes, muting/unmuting lane-length groups of items is simply not a realistic approach for me, as that process would ruin any muting edits applied.
Last edited by Mr. Green; 08-18-2019 at 05:18 PM.
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08-18-2019, 05:33 PM
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#277
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 1,429
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Green
My apologies - I'll try to clarify a bit more.
I've seen frequent comparisons of free item positioning to Pro Tools playlists, in that you can have multiple items in separate lanes and select which lane you wish to hear, but I've never been able to get that to work without hearing ALL items above or below each other playing back at the same time. How do I hear just one selected lane?
btw - in my case, since edited items being muted are often a significant element needed in alternate takes, muting/unmuting lane-length groups of items is simply not a realistic approach for me, as that process would ruin any muting edits applied.
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My apologies, I'm not familiar enough with what you describe, but I'm interested in this whole takes/lanes/layers/free item positioning stuff.
ferropop's ideas above look extremely interesting.
But re the mute buttons, you probably are aware that you can select a whole 'lane' of items then mute just one button to mute them all. Not what you're asking for exactly but might help?
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08-18-2019, 05:50 PM
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#278
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 373
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Goldreap
My apologies, I'm not familiar enough with what you describe, but I'm interested in this whole takes/lanes/layers/free item positioning stuff.
ferropop's ideas above look extremely interesting.
But re the mute buttons, you probably are aware that you can select a whole 'lane' of items then mute just one button to mute them all. Not what you're asking for exactly but might help?
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Nevermind the mutes - just this...
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08-18-2019, 06:00 PM
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#279
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Near a big lake
Posts: 3,943
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ferropop
In this... Zone Handles are what are created when recording overlapping takes. They're freely movable (and you can create new ones)...Each Zone Handle could also have a Crossfade handle so that they fade smoothly into each other.
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Splits can/do function the same way. You need to enable a setting in preferences:
Project -> Media item defaults -> Overlap and crossfade items when splitting (length, crossfade shape)
When you position the mouse cursor over the center of the X of the crossfade, you can slide it around (hold shift to ignore grid snap settings). Since the split is non-destructive, repositioning it isn't a problem.
The other part of what you said, that's different of course. I don't really want the rest of what you're saying since having the "top layer" isn't relevant to me, and I don't ever want more than 1 take playing at a time. If I want to just see the active takes and hide the rest, it's just one key command to do that (and then I can still toggle between takes per section).
Last edited by JamesPeters; 08-18-2019 at 06:07 PM.
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08-18-2019, 07:51 PM
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#280
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Human being with feelings
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 3,127
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesPeters
Splits can/do function the same way. You need to enable a setting in preferences:
\
The other part of what you said, that's different of course. I don't really want the rest of what you're saying since having the "top layer" isn't relevant to me, and I don't ever want more than 1 take playing at a time. If I want to just see the active takes and hide the rest, it's just one key command to do that (and then I can still toggle between takes per section).
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I don't understand, the "top layer" is just the same as hitting Ctrl-L to expand/collapse and show/hide all the takes in an item. I'm just proposing that it show you the top layer too, but that's not necessary at alll...the main point of my thread was the 'zones' thing, where what you hear is determined by the zones and not by the splits.
Last edited by ferropop; 08-18-2019 at 07:56 PM.
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