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View Poll Results: Would you use / like this feature?
Yes, it is important and I would use it 19 79.17%
Yes, I owuld use it 3 12.50%
No, I do not need it 1 4.17%
Gone fishing 1 4.17%
Voters: 24. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 05-21-2020, 05:04 AM   #41
z.curve
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I think we'd have maximum flexibility if PolyAT can be manipulated just like existing CC...
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Originally Posted by z.curve View Post
It would also be good to have some means of identifying which keys have PolyAT data, irrespective of note events in the MIDI item. Options include populating the CC selector drop-down, or better still, some highlighting on the piano roll keys.
Perhaps like this:

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Old 05-21-2020, 06:08 AM   #42
n997
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I think it'd be simpler to just display a symbol ("•" or "*" or "p" or some other) in notes in the editor, or the keys on the left, or both.

Code logic could be something like this:

Code:
if MIDI item has PolyAT events
then 
	get note numbers from Poly AT events, save to table NOTENUMBERS_IN_PolyAT

for each note 
if note number is found in table NOTENUMBERS_IN_PolyAT
then 
	display "•" in note name
Probably doable already via ReaScripting, though I haven't tried it yet.
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Old 05-21-2020, 05:44 PM   #43
X-Raym
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@z.curve


How did you make this ?
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Old 05-22-2020, 12:35 AM   #44
z.curve
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Hi Raymond, it was three or four actual MIDI editor screenshots, showing existing CC stuff, but pixel edited in Fireworks to add new text and elements. These were imported into Flash as an image sequence, where I then added a separate layer for the pointer animation. Exported as GIF at 4 FPS for that authentic screen capture feel!
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Old 05-22-2020, 03:08 AM   #45
X-Raym
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z.curve
This screenshot was so well done I somehow thought I missed a REAPER feature ^^


Note sure if it is the best way to really integrate it I don't have enough expertise in Poly AfterTouch, how it is done in other DAW etc, I let others evaluate your proposition, but at least it seems to not need a complete rework of the interface on Cockos side.
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Old 05-22-2020, 10:12 AM   #46
Pando
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I think at the most basic functionality, a graphical pAT editor needs the capability of selecting a note, editing the pAT data for that note, and the ability to move/transpose the note with the pAT data following that note. PAT data should be anchored to the note-on event. And to really think about it, the pAT data should always follow the notes during piano-roll editing regardless if the graphical editor is active or not (this could be an option).

The graphical editing function is useful only when a single note is selected, as there is overlapping pAT data when a chord is played.

Looking at z.curve demo (great demo btw!), viewing the pAT data per KEY is useful as well, since this allows displaying the data present between note on/off events. But it should have the transpose/move functionality when a note is selected and moved. This is absolutely essential.

Last edited by Pando; 05-22-2020 at 10:25 AM.
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Old 05-22-2020, 01:17 PM   #47
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since this allows displaying the data present between note on/off events
In practice this is not possible to coax out of any hardware device that supports PAT, because PAT events are only sent while you keep the key pressed, nothing can happen in between keypresses.

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But it should have the transpose/move functionality when a note is selected and moved. This is absolutely essential.
Indeed, this is extremely important, and is also the reason why I feel using the CC lanes method to show PAT events is NOT the way to go, because it visually unlinks the PAT events from the note they're supposed to be tied to.
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Old 05-23-2020, 12:55 PM   #48
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In practice this is not possible to coax out of any hardware device that supports PAT, because PAT events are only sent while you keep the key pressed, nothing can happen in between keypresses.
Yes, this is true with any keyboard controller. If the key isn't pressed then it really can't send out pAT data. But in the previous page there was some discussion about EZDrummer sending this data after a zero-length note. Not sure if that's the case or not, but conceivably nothing in MIDI spec prevents the controller from doing that.

Quote:
Indeed, this is extremely important, and is also the reason why I feel using the CC lanes method to show PAT events is NOT the way to go, because it visually unlinks the PAT events from the note they're supposed to be tied to.
I made this mockup demonstrating how it can work just fine. If Reaper is aware of pAT data present between note-on and off events, it can move that data when the note is moved either in timeline or to a different key. This can even work when selecting multiple notes, but editing the data itself would require selecting a single note. This also allows to view the data for all notes in a single CC lane (faint lines for all notes should be visible).

As a keyboard player, this functionality would work perfect for my needs. I hope the developer considers this.



Last edited by Pando; 05-23-2020 at 01:13 PM.
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Old 05-23-2020, 01:34 PM   #49
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Seems also to be appropriate for MPE.

-Michael
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Old 05-23-2020, 03:33 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilDragon View Post
In practice this is not possible to coax out of any hardware device that supports PAT, because PAT events are only sent while you keep the key pressed, nothing can happen in between keypresses.
This is true for keyboard and pad style controllers, but I am pretty sure that edrum controllers with cymbal choke sensors can trigger aftertouch after the note off. The cymbal sound is a one-shot trigger which can be muted by poly aftertouch which is triggered by grabbing the cymbal’s edge. It wouldn’t make sense to retrigger the cymbal when you grab it to mute the sound.
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Old 05-23-2020, 05:06 PM   #51
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Some EDrum systems can be programmed to provide a note-off command after 15 seconds of note-on, which is meant to eliminate stuck keys in host applications. So you'd then have poly aftertouch events fall between note on-off commands.

Also, any midi from an EDrum in an note-on/off/pAT-choke format would be hard to see in piano roll anyway unless the note has some length. Once you add length, pAT associated with that key would then become visible/editable.

Last edited by Pando; 05-23-2020 at 05:18 PM.
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Old 05-24-2020, 10:22 AM   #52
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Seems also to be appropriate for MPE.

-Michael
The way Bitwig does it is much more appropriate for MPE.
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