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Old 12-04-2019, 01:18 AM   #121
fred garvin
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Originally Posted by Strange Ways View Post
the most ridiculous thread of all time - "Compression is for kids", then all of a sudden everyone is an expert and can set you straight.
I thought that compression thread was amazing... an in-depth discussion by working pros and other yes, expert-level types on how they use one of the most important tools in audio processing. I was going to write a thank you post but decided no one would give a rat's but now... Coachz and all participants, thanks for that awesome thread.

I'll take that over yet another complaint thread any day.
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Old 12-04-2019, 02:12 AM   #122
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I find the people here with the most posts, are usually the most negative, are hardly ever helpful, and it seems like they have nothing to do but argue / find a way of negating shortcomings and feature requests / attempt to sell cumbersome work arounds for all of the shortcomings / have an excuse for every improvement suggested...

Just mention a better workflow on another DAW - and watch them go in like vultures to attack.
( Usually drummers and guitarists )

I'm amazed that you guys have so much time for forum responses and relentless arguing - I now understand after dropping in here for the last few years that you guys probably don't make much music at all.
All puffed up with WAY too much spare time on your hands.

Back to your endless posturing posts !!!

PS - Robert is a gem !
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Old 12-04-2019, 02:49 AM   #123
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Originally Posted by mschnell View Post
I totally disagree.

A "-1" comment should be as valid as a "+1" comment.

Meaning: here is (exactly) one person who thinks that a prioritization of this issue vs others would (not) be welcome.

Feels like democracy .

-Michael
Haha yeah, no hard feelings at all, some people are more open to democratic conversation and after all we’re in the same boat
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Old 12-04-2019, 02:59 AM   #124
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I hope you see the irony there (sort of like punching someone in the face then saying 'see, they aren't very nice'), your jabs at the forum and it's members was an attack on real and living people - otherwise, I'd not have responded - proverbially blurring the faces of those people with via wording doesn't make it not a personal attack of sorts.



Any person who has disagreed with you in the past here potentially falls under that knife whether you meant it to or not. I reread ^that, it wasn't part of the joke best I can tell.

Now, to be fair, I reread all my posts and best I can tell, they weren't super nice, but were civil and I was calling out "behavior" not calling you names or degrading you as a person. I was always taught to call out behavior not people.

Otherwise, water under the bridge as far as I'm concerned, other than we both apparently owe ivan a paypal payment or something.
.... as an old fart struggling along on a SS pension reduced by the US government by 50% BECAUSE I don`t live in the US any more, I`ll PM you BOTH my Paypal address.

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Old 12-04-2019, 03:26 AM   #125
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Originally Posted by ChristopherT View Post
I find the people here with the most posts, are usually the most negative, are hardly ever helpful, and it seems like they have nothing to do but argue / find a way of negating shortcomings and feature requests / attempt to sell cumbersome work arounds for all of the shortcomings / have an excuse for every improvement suggested...

Just mention a better workflow on another DAW - and watch them go in like vultures to attack.
( Usually drummers and guitarists )

I'm amazed that you guys have so much time for forum responses and relentless arguing - I now understand after dropping in here for the last few years that you guys probably don't make much music at all.
All puffed up with WAY too much spare time on your hands.

Back to your endless posturing posts !!!

PS - Robert is a gem !
I would hold karbomusic as my first exhibit as to why that is not true.

He has a metric ton of posts, is regularly helpful to people in the forums, and posts a lot of music here.

...and he's not the only one.
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Old 12-04-2019, 03:27 AM   #126
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Not too long ago I started a post asking for a suggestion on how to handle a minor MIDI problem that I continue to have. Zero responses. I posted it again a week or two later in the bug section, not even sure if it was a bug or just me. Zero responses.

The original poster here is correct. If you start a thread about something like "Reaper Sucks" or - the the most ridiculous thread of all time - "Compression is for kids", then all of a sudden everyone is an expert and can set you straight.

Chalk up a win for the OP.
I don't start new threads asking for help often, but a fair proportion of them have gone unanswered.

I don't take it personally, and still try to help others when I can.

I certainly don't presume that people read the post, know how to solve my problem, but simply decide to ignore me.

Last edited by Judders; 12-04-2019 at 05:05 AM.
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Old 12-04-2019, 04:25 AM   #127
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Originally Posted by fred garvin View Post
I thought that compression thread was amazing... an in-depth discussion by working pros and other yes, expert-level types on how they use one of the most important tools in audio processing. I was going to write a thank you post but decided no one would give a rat's but now... Coachz and all participants, thanks for that awesome thread.

I'll take that over yet another complaint thread any day.
You bet. I agree. The thread was extremely educational with great opinions for and against using compression. For some sad reason, some people on the internet just like arguing and will argue against anything. Really weird.

I'm guessing those same people also have not made any killer music in Reaper. I have a new album coming out done all in Reaper and yesterday we drove out into the country listening to it in the car to check it out. It sounds great and I can't say enough good about Reaper. Make some great music people!
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Old 12-04-2019, 04:27 AM   #128
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I would hold karbomusic as my first exhibit as to why that is not true.

He has a metric ton of posts, is regularly helpful to people in the forums, and posts a lot of music here.

...and he's not the only one.
He's also runs a wicked soldering iron.
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Old 12-04-2019, 04:30 AM   #129
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Originally Posted by Judders View Post
I start new threads asking for help often, but a fair proportion of them have gone unanswered.

I don't take it personally, and still try to help others when I can.

I certainly don't presume that people read the post, know how to solve my problem, but simply decide to ignore me.
In my experience if a thread is ignored then it is usually a pretty niche topic that many don't know the answer to. Having good descriptive subject titles is helpful too I find.
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Old 12-04-2019, 05:06 AM   #130
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In my experience if a thread is ignored then it is usually a pretty niche topic that many don't know the answer to. Having good descriptive subject titles is helpful too I find.
Yeah, most of my questions are answered by searching, but if searches don't turn anything up there's a good chance it just isn't common knowledge.
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Old 12-04-2019, 05:26 AM   #131
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Yeah, most of my questions are answered by searching, but if searches don't turn anything up there's a good chance it just isn't common knowledge.
I use this search. I don't know why it seems to work better than the forum search but it does for me.

https://cse.google.com/cse?cx=002458...%3Anbhva-j9iic
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Old 12-04-2019, 05:54 AM   #132
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I use this search. I don't know why it seems to work better than the forum search but it does for me.

https://cse.google.com/cse?cx=002458...%3Anbhva-j9iic
Yeah, I just search "reaper forums [question]" in google.
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Old 12-04-2019, 06:30 AM   #133
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I am not going to point any fingers, but some of the replies in this thread have been very effective at proving Robert's points about the forum to me, and it has been very frustrating to read some of the replies.

Just as a reminder, here is all the topics/issues that Robert has brought out about REAPER:
Takes, Scripts, Theme, Text Boxes, Routing, Modulation, Helping, COCKOS, Options, Whiners, Instruments, Remote, Hotkeys, ReaPack, Navigator, Monitor FX, Macros, Sample Browsing, NRPN/Sysex, Docking, Envelope Points, Future Looks...

Last edited by BirdBird; 12-04-2019 at 06:49 AM.
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Old 12-04-2019, 08:02 AM   #134
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I find it very very weird that Cockos allows the Lounge to exist, and that the main forums aren't moderated better. Insulting other forum members and politics/religion shouldn't have any place in a company's user forums, especially when the forums are the primary place for customer support and pre-release testing.
The gotcha there is that the very thing that makes the Cockos forums unique, a company run by, what, 1 or 2? with 2, 3 or 4 directly involved in day to day of the product (I'm just guessing) with no marketing to the users of extras, so the forums tend to be user populated with the occasional post by Cockos when necessary or helpful, means there simply isn't the person-power available to moderate more. It's nearly a full time job on a such an active company support board. Perhaps if Cockos hires an office person for something they've been handling themselves they can have them lightly moderate the forums as well. But to go from here to more moderated would cost time and money, and I'm happy they choose to spend it elsewhere (even if the Lounge is one of the off-topic forums anywhere most in need of moderation, at least it was before I bailed. But that's the risk taken anywhere when opening an OT forum.)
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Old 12-04-2019, 08:14 AM   #135
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Regardless of moderation, I would think the very invention of "lounge" sub forums in forum software is to specifically keep noise unrelated to the product out of the main forum - In that regard, it reduces moderation needs on the "main highway". That said, I've seen users who have never actually even posted outside the lounge, or just one or two posts and I'm not even sure if they make music or use reaper LOL.
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Old 12-04-2019, 08:20 AM   #136
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The gotcha there is that the very thing that makes the Cockos forums unique, a company run by, what, 1 or 2? with 2, 3 or 4 directly involved in day to day of the product (I'm just guessing) with no marketing to the users of extras, so the forums tend to be user populated with the occasional post by Cockos when necessary or helpful, means there simply isn't the person-power available to moderate more. It's nearly a full time job on a such an active company support board. Perhaps if Cockos hires an office person for something they've been handling themselves they can have them lightly moderate the forums as well. But to go from here to more moderated would cost time and money, and I'm happy they choose to spend it elsewhere (even if the Lounge is one of the off-topic forums anywhere most in need of moderation, at least it was before I bailed. But that's the risk taken anywhere when opening an OT forum.)
It is not at all uncommon practice for boards to be moderated by volunteers, so that is a possibility. I personally think the current system works quite well, surprisingly. I've been on far, far worse boards (unfortunately). Most people here are very helpful and I see almost no rudeness, at least to any concerning degree. It's going to happen from time to time though.. you can't get all bent out of shape if one or two people get out of line here and there. I mean.. you can, but you'd be making a mountain out of a molehill, imo. That said, I'm not close to a long termer here, so I concede some of you have been here long enough to have had enough from "the usual suspects".

Anyways, Cockos.. keep all your money tied up in development If this board needs moderation though, I guarantee you can find people to do it for free. however, as I said earlier in this thread, that always sounds like a great idea on the surface. I've seen that stir up a lot of drama too, as sometimes you get the opposite problem.. over moderation. And god forbid you'd over moderate an American! :P (I kid, I kid)
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Old 12-04-2019, 08:25 AM   #137
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It is not at all uncommon practice for boards to be moderated by volunteers, so that is a possibility.
As far as I know it already is, see the moderators list. Except I don't know if all of them, have mod rights for the entire forum, some are for sub forums those users suggested, then subsequently manage:

https://forum.cockos.com/showgroups.php

I do know they try really hard (cockos) to urge participants to police themselves and only moderate heavyily when they have no other choice. I have seen that taken advantage of though at times. However, call people names and insult them personally very much and they'll get banned temporarily at first and if it continues it becomes permanent, seen that quite a few times. Name calling seems to be a ban trigger which I obviously agree with.
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Old 12-04-2019, 08:31 AM   #138
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tbh the premise of this post is something the internet doesnt need more of
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Old 12-04-2019, 08:33 AM   #139
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As far as I know it already is, see the moderators list. Except I don't know if all of them, have mod rights for the entire forum, some are for sub forums those users suggested, then subsequently manage:

https://forum.cockos.com/showgroups.php

I do know they try really hard (cockos) to urge participants to police themselves and only moderate heavyily when they have no other choice. I have seen that taken advantage of though at times. However, call people names and insult them directly very much and they'll get banned temporarily at first and if it continues it becomes permanent, seen that quite a few times.
Ahh OK, that to me is generally a good way to go about it. Unfortunately, posts will sneak through from time to time that people are offended by. The thing is, what offends a handful of people isn't necessarily going to be the same as what offends the majority of people. It's not easy to moderate, and you get a lot of bickering about that with one side pulling towards "you need to rid the forum of these posts" and the other side "you need to let me say what I want". As long as they do well to keep personal attacks under control, I think that system works. I'm surprised there's no "report" button here though, that would help. As someone who has moderated other forums before, it can be hard to catch everything.
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Old 12-04-2019, 09:02 AM   #140
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Ahh OK, that to me is generally a good way to go about it. Unfortunately, posts will sneak through from time to time that people are offended by. The thing is, what offends a handful of people isn't necessarily going to be the same as what offends the majority of people. It's not easy to moderate, and you get a lot of bickering about that with one side pulling towards "you need to rid the forum of these posts" and the other side "you need to let me say what I want". As long as they do well to keep personal attacks under control, I think that system works. I'm surprised there's no "report" button here though, that would help. As someone who has moderated other forums before, it can be hard to catch everything.
There is a report button. Little red triangle.

I use it when I spot spam. Never reported a user though, although one who was insulting me did get banned. Don't know if a mod spotted it or another user reported them.
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Old 12-04-2019, 09:03 AM   #141
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Reaper sucks - making me nervous.
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Old 12-04-2019, 09:06 AM   #142
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I am not going to point any fingers, but some of the replies in this thread have been very effective at proving Robert's points about the forum to me, and it has been very frustrating to read some of the replies.

Just as a reminder, here is all the topics/issues that Robert has brought out about REAPER:
Takes, Scripts, Theme, Text Boxes, Routing, Modulation, Helping, COCKOS, Options, Whiners, Instruments, Remote, Hotkeys, ReaPack, Navigator, Monitor FX, Macros, Sample Browsing, NRPN/Sysex, Docking, Envelope Points, Future Looks...
I am not going to point any fingers...



...but bitching about people bitching without addressing any of the points you feel are worth discussing is being the person you dislike.

It's not like this is a feature request, and when you stick "you guys are unhelpful snobs" amongst a load of information, it is human nature to respond to that part.
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Old 12-04-2019, 09:07 AM   #143
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There is a report button. Little red triangle.

I use it when I spot spam. Never reported a user though, although one who was insulting me did get banned. Don't know if a mod spotted it or another user reported them.
Ahh, thanks.. missed that.
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Old 12-04-2019, 09:15 AM   #144
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It's not like this is a feature request, and when you stick "you guys are unhelpful snobs" amongst a load of information, it is human nature to respond to that part.
I'm pretty sure I could literally reword the entire first post, get the exact same issue concerns across and it wouldn't spin for 100+ threads about attitudes and be far more constructive. And... I'll be labelled as offensive but I think "break up letters" in forums are silly, sorry, it's just my opinion because again, they bury the actual need in appeals to emotion, which fuels unnecessary back and forth.
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Old 12-04-2019, 10:42 AM   #145
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It's human nature and it's all relative. Humans are tribal and they do defend what they like, correctly or not, and it all comes down to relativity. Anywhere there's tons of people on a forum there's always going to be some of that.

On the "relatively scale" as relates to defensiveness and unnecessary drama Gearslutz and KVR are probably at the top, or the worst. So many people there think their choices and preferences are the ONLY valid choices and preferences and the defenders think almost all complaints about whatever they love are unwarranted.

All DAW product forums have some of that, some more than others. I can safely say without being wrong that there is a tiny bit more "defensiveness" here than in some other DAW product forums, but they all have "defenders".

One clear notable stand out to that is MOTU Nation, those guys are way out there. If you say you don't like something about DP it's like you raped their sister.

But like someone earlier said, with so many people posting here all day every day, it's unavoidable... and as someone also said, the initial post here appeared to be designed to do exactly that, the way it was worded, to cause a little drama. Airon could have touched on each of those points and not annoyed anyone.

Anywho, there is no perfect DAW. My dream DAW would have Reaper's audio engine, Studio One's UI, Cubase MIDI deepness, Ardour's mixer flexibility and staging, and some other things.

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Old 12-04-2019, 03:02 PM   #146
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One clear notable stand out to that is MOTU Nation, those guys are way out there. If you say you don't like something about DP it's like you raped their sister.
Oh my. That's pretty extreme.

(also... totally correct).

If we're going to say all things are relative, and that "that place" is in the mix, then these forums are a 99.99/100. It's easier to just forget they exist as to not throw off the averages
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Old 12-04-2019, 07:50 PM   #147
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Edited by mod - one post?

A new user with one post is going to spam porn on here?

You guys have to be a bit more crafty, come on

Last edited by pipelineaudio; 01-20-2020 at 12:07 PM. Reason: Entitlement
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Old 12-06-2019, 07:23 PM   #148
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A search on Sucks (Titles) found only 38, though there would be more.. scared to search/know more, but it was funny to, me.
Not counting titles that use the insinuate method...
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Old 12-07-2019, 03:19 AM   #149
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Reaper sucks - making me nervous.
my wife too but I love it.
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Old 12-08-2019, 03:45 AM   #150
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my wife too but I love it.
Don't worry, it's normal for your wife to make you nervous.
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Old 01-19-2020, 02:59 PM   #151
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[*] Hotkeys - I've written a fairly well-received article/video about how I interact with REAPER using the keyboard, but it's a workaround. REAPER has SO MANY SHORTCUTS. Many of them poorly named, subtly different or completely opaque (i.e. you have no idea what they do until you try them a few times). I think that most folks would consider me a "power user", and I still struggle with REAPER's actions every single day that I use it.
For me, the easiest way to navigate REAPER's enormous list of actions is by using a script to enable multi-key shortcuts, so that you can type easy-to-remember commands such as "sdt" to delete all stretch markers in the time selection, instead of some obscure modifier+key combination.
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Old 01-19-2020, 05:28 PM   #152
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I thought this daw was about making music not messing about with other stuff. Ok could be better it does what it says on the tin. I can record anything all the rest is just details. I have came to think computers has become to central. Try out your music in a band format anything but the studio, bedroom et all. I come from a live original music background. Everything sounds different live. I have used reaper on stage it does work
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Old 01-20-2020, 03:20 AM   #153
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I thought this daw was about making music not messing about with other stuff. Ok could be better it does what it says on the tin. I can record anything all the rest is just details. I have came to think computers has become to central. Try out your music in a band format anything but the studio, bedroom et all. I come from a live original music background. Everything sounds different live. I have used reaper on stage it does work
Unfortunately not all of us have the luxury of having a band at our beck & call to record our stuff. I DO have a band, but they are all too busy to sit around in my little studio doing demo versions. I do miss the old days of living in a band house, etc., but these days I also have a home of my own, a wife & until fairly recently when the last one left, a family of my own. Life is good.
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Old 07-07-2020, 04:05 AM   #154
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[*] Options - I keep a comprehensive list of my REAPER settings, and I can say for certain that if you sat me down in front of a vanilla REAPER install, it would take me weeks to get it setup in a way that doesn't irritate me. I'm ok when there's a prescribed workflow as offered by other products, and of course this comes with tradeoffs. I feel like REAPER sets you up with "Everything sucks until you fix it".
It's awesome that REAPER allows you to set things up in a precise manner, however I find that often I'm left to make many either/or decisions that I must weigh against other tradeoffs. Unless you have a fairly simple workflow, you basically have to master the software before you can begin to start beginning to set it up so you can use it. (Yes, I typed that how I wanted.)
[*]Scripts - I love REAPER scripts. What I don't like is how often I have to find a script to do a task that's simple in other products, or remember which script I use for X or Y process.
Yes, this does mean REAPER has a huge edge in the DAW word for complex tasks, but the frequency of simple tasks far outweighs the complex for many of us.
These are my main two. Reaper can do it all but you have to dig for it. The most popular DAWs are the ones that require the least amount of customisation out of the box.

This is a considerable problem for anyone approaching the DAW for the first time. The level of proficiency required to come up with decent custom menus, toolbars and keyboard shortcuts could take months or even years to hone—an instant turn-off for someone who just wants to get a musical idea down quickly before it fades.

When you've finally got it all configured to your liking, there's a very high probability that options could turn into distractions if you are a compulsive tweaknut, and you might end up endlessly tweaking your perfect menus and toolbars instead of using the software for its intended purpose: making music.

In short, Reaper is the best DAW for customization.
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Old 07-07-2020, 04:33 AM   #155
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I mostly use Reaper for rather unconventional stuff (e.g. creating an instrument for live playing). Here I use a lot of scripting / programming / sophisicated setups, ... I am rather sure I can't do this kind of work in a satisfying way with any other DAW.

I also use Reaper in a very standard way for recording and mixing / processing multitrack material. I never felt the need to create or use a script for this. Supposedly because I never used any other DAW that would have taought me to do things in a certain way, while in reaper it's better don in some other way.

The only thing I miss is a fairly automatic way to create a tempo from my audio to allow for decently adding Midi tracks. I tried some scripts but this was far from "automatic". Maybe somebody comes up with such a tool (which supposedly would best be based on ARA.)

I understand Melodyne can do that, but some DAWs seem to have some built-in tools that might be rather usable. I don't really think this qualifies as "not complex", anyway.

- Michael
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Old 07-07-2020, 04:52 AM   #156
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fred garvin View Post
I thought that compression thread was amazing... an in-depth discussion by working pros and other yes, expert-level types on how they use one of the most important tools in audio processing. I was going to write a thank you post but decided no one would give a rat's but now... Coachz and all participants, thanks for that awesome thread.

I'll take that over yet another complaint thread any day.
Unrelated, sorry - but where is the "Compression is for kids" thread? Forum search didn't find it, nor did Karbo's custom Google search.
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Old 07-07-2020, 05:17 AM   #157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juan_r View Post
Unrelated, sorry - but where is the "Compression is for kids" thread? Forum search didn't find it, nor did Karbo's custom Google search.
https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=225897

https://forum.cockos.com/archive/ind.../t-147339.html

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/q-a-...sion-kids.html

https://www.reddit.com/r/audioengine...bruce_swedien/
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Old 07-07-2020, 05:48 AM   #158
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EpicSounds View Post
I used to say the forum is the best place for help. Now I don't think I will.
I am also confused about what he said about this forum.

I always thought this forum to be excellent and helpful.

Maybe I just didn’t read, or just missed the bad posts.
Either way the OP could be a bit more sober, instead of
believing he is very funny just because he watched Don Rickles.

Last edited by JDSStudios; 07-07-2020 at 05:57 AM.
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Old 07-07-2020, 06:14 AM   #159
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I suspect this thread is clickbait, but its funny Randolph, after years on other platforms from 2" through to over 20 yrs on PT and Pyramix I have arrived at Reaper wishing I had found it years ago.

The philosophical intent of reapers creators is bold and refreshing, and the fertile community of developers here on thee forum is both truly remarkable and very humbling.

After years of Avid subscriptions, I cancelled last year, and am now happily invested into this insanely diverse application.
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Old 07-07-2020, 06:20 AM   #160
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Thanks Coachz
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