Old 12-06-2012, 01:05 AM   #1
nalooti
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Default a good free contrabass vsti

First of all, Dave Brubeck is gone.

May he rest in peace...

I'd like to know recommendations for a good free double bass vsti. The kind often used in jazz or in Brian Setzer Orchestra.

I'm currently using Studio Instruments from Cakewalk but its sounds are very limited.

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Old 12-06-2012, 01:25 AM   #2
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Wish I could help, but I've never heard a free vsti with a decent sounding upright.They have all sounded thin and lacking in some other areas, making them too unrealistic sounding.Granted there may be a good free one I haven't heard. On top of that, I have Trilian, and honestly once you hear it you don't want to use ANYTHING else for an upright sound.

R.I.P. to Mr. Brubeck, from what I have heard from those close to him, he was a great man that lived 91 excellent years.
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Old 12-06-2012, 03:29 AM   #3
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Actually after listening to the sound samples for Independence Free, it may have a decent one...

http://pro.magix.com/en/independence...free.1013.html
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Old 12-06-2012, 03:42 AM   #4
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I was running into this by accident. The free Kontakt player has a free sound library which has an upright bass.
It's not very versatile but it's sounding quite convincing in my opinion.
With the free Kontakt player it runs in demo mode. So it's restricted to 20 minutes. You'd have to reload Kontakt to use it again.

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Old 12-06-2012, 04:11 AM   #5
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Had to check out Trilian.
Sounds really good.
Could be my Upright solution
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Old 12-06-2012, 04:15 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G-Sun View Post
Had to check out Trilian.
Sounds really good.
Could be my Upright solution
I think there are some really good upright bass vsti out there (e.g. Chris Hein), but...
Quote:
I'd like to know recommendations for a good free double bass vsti
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Old 12-06-2012, 05:52 AM   #7
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You could check http://acousticsamples.net/bundles/as-free-collection

The "Kontr" is certainly just a teaser for the complete instrument acousticsamples sell, but it may be useful anyway.
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Old 12-06-2012, 06:49 AM   #8
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[QUOTE=nalooti;1082024]First of all, Dave Brubeck is gone.

May he rest in peace...

Indeed... and his rest will probably be in a complex time signature...
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Old 12-06-2012, 06:55 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dumant View Post
You could check http://acousticsamples.net/bundles/as-free-collection

The "Kontr" is certainly just a teaser for the complete instrument acousticsamples sell, but it may be useful anyway.
I'm a newbie and Reaper is my first experience. Also I just have Cakewalk Studio Instruments VSTi that I use for Piano, strings and bass lines, very easily on a MIDI track that I write using piano roll editor. That's it.

And I think Trilian and Kontakt are something like my Cakewalk but much more sophisticated (bigger and richer samples libraries).
And I heard they're based on samples.

I know what is a sample in theory (sampling frequency 44/48 KHz with 16/24 bits, etc.). But I don't know how sampling can be used in a DAW in general and in Reaper in particular.

I often see VSTi products based either on samples (small recorded parts of an instrument) or whose sound is derived from a synth. Well if this is like Cakewalk/Kontakt/Trilian, it is easy to use. But often I see just "banks" of samples that we must load (?) somewhere...
I suppose the "kontr" is also such samples.

In short I need to understand how to use sampling in Reaper, what are different file types, how they integrate into the DAW, how they are mapped so I can use piano editor for writing a bass/drum/strings/etc line.

Where can I have good explaining tutorials on these for a newbie ?
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Old 12-06-2012, 07:17 AM   #10
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Samples are usually not used directly. They must be packaged and mapped so that you can easily play them using midi, and have them sound consistently.

There are a lot of possible packagings for samples, and many possible tools to play them. Most of them use proprietary packagings: for example, Kontakt uses .nki files that contain both the samples, the mappings, and potentially scripts that will help the performance.

There are some open formats like sfz (used by Cakewalk, Garritan/Plogue (Aria Player), linux sampler, ...) that can be helpful if you get a bunch of samples and want to package them properly.

In the case of "Kontr", what you get is a packaged instrument, that you can use directly with the free UVI Workstation, like you would do with a Kontakt instrument.
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Old 12-06-2012, 08:31 AM   #11
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Thanks for the info

Quote:
Originally Posted by dumant View Post
Samples are usually not used directly. They must be packaged and mapped so that you can easily play them using midi, and have them sound consistently.

There are a lot of possible packagings for samples, and many possible tools to play them. Most of them use proprietary packagings: for example, Kontakt uses .nki files that contain both the samples, the mappings, and potentially scripts that will help the performance.

There are some open formats like sfz (used by Cakewalk, Garritan/Plogue (Aria Player), linux sampler, ...) that can be helpful if you get a bunch of samples and want to package them properly.
So if I find some sample library/bank for a given instrument, either it has all the info (mappings, scripts) inside it so I can use it directly (how to know ?), or I should be able to find how that library can be made ready to be used ?
But sometimes I find a sample bank/library (for example in kvraudio.com) without explaining how to use it (mapping, etc.). Is there any standard process to do with these libraries ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dumant View Post
In the case of "Kontr", what you get is a packaged instrument, that you can use directly with the free UVI Workstation, like you would do with a Kontakt instrument.
That's cool!
How could I knew it ? (I probably need to enrich my vocabulary in the samples world)
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Old 12-06-2012, 08:50 AM   #12
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For "Kontr", it is explained in the "tech specs" tab on the site. And there is the UVI logo above.

Usually, it's pretty clear: people tell you whether they provide their instrument for Kontakt 2, 3 or 4, Battery, EXS24 (just to name a few), in sfz or sf2 format, or if they just provide a bunch of wav samples that you will have to package yourself using a sampler such as Kontakt, Mach 5, or notepad if you go the sfz way !
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Old 12-06-2012, 09:27 AM   #13
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Check out http://www.tx16wx.com/home

Here's some raw samples including double bass: http://www.philharmonia.co.uk/thesou...5594bd0tjicgb5

A whole orchestra (in sfz and wav): http://sso.mattiaswestlund.net/

Check out http://venusmusicband.blogspot.com/2...1_archive.html - "double_bass_pgm32.sf2" near the bottom of the page under "bass sound 2". This site might hold the record for the longest web page! Use your browser's Edit>Find function to find the file quickly.

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Old 12-06-2012, 10:01 AM   #14
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Check out some of the cool basses in SQL8. Mix and match.
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Old 12-06-2012, 12:46 PM   #15
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I've just installed the acoustic samples free collection.
You additionally have to download and install the (free) UVI Workstation 2 to be able to play the downloaded libraries.
Additionally it installs a licensing software (PACE).
Additionally it installs a Microsoft Visual C++ 2005 Redistributable version.
Overall about 500 Megabyte just for an instrument which isn't convincing at all (in my opinion).

I've just deinstalled all the stuff...

This is a quick and dirty recorded bass riff. Kontakt player and the above mentioned upright bass.
No other plugs or effects used.
This instrument has nearly no articulation options. But it's free...
https://soundcloud.com/michajo/motherslament
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Old 12-06-2012, 12:48 PM   #16
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Nice Michajo. Howzit on sustain?
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Old 12-06-2012, 02:04 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by msore View Post
Nice Michajo. Howzit on sustain?
Not that convincing...
And it's missing features which you'd expect from a real good bass vsti (such as slide modes, hammer on, pull off, bending,vibrato, etc.)
It's a velocity layered instrument.
You can vary the string noise's intensity.
I think that's all.

Here's the same bass accompanied by DVS Saxophone (which you've kindly recommend me in another thread...)

https://soundcloud.com/michajo/motherslament-001


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Old 12-06-2012, 02:47 PM   #18
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Somebody already mentioned acousticsamples and I can recommend that too: Check out their free samples here, it includes an upright bass too.

http://acousticsamples.net/as-free-collection

They have their own player nowadays too. I actually still use their older player and Kontakt libraries and not the new ones because of the iLok, but that free one doesn't need one, so chekck it out!

There are also demos on that page where you can hear the upright in action. It is no match to real thing but as free sample set it is pretty damn good.

Oh and hats off to mr. Brubeck! Time out is right there with Kind of Blue in the pantheon of holy albums!
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Old 12-07-2012, 01:23 AM   #19
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Thanks to all for your answers

Quote:
Originally Posted by gavriloP View Post
Somebody already mentioned acousticsamples and I can recommend that too: Check out their free samples here, it includes an upright bass too.

http://acousticsamples.net/as-free-collection

They have their own player nowadays too. I actually still use their older player and Kontakt libraries and not the new ones because of the iLok, but that free one doesn't need one, so chekck it out!

There are also demos on that page where you can hear the upright in action. It is no match to real thing but as free sample set it is pretty damn good.

Oh and hats off to mr. Brubeck! Time out is right there with Kind of Blue in the pantheon of holy albums!
I already visited that AS free collection page but it needs iLock, even the free one.

Based on what MichaJo says (don't sound good) I'm wondering if it is worth to work on specially for a newbie like me, with all the installation and configuration I have to understand and do.
The Cakewalk Studio Instruments I have is ready to go.

Are Cakewalk Dimension Pro and Kontakt, ready-to-go products ?
Can they be used (as Studio Instruments) as plugins in Reaper with just copying the driver files (dll) in the right folder ? (knowing nothing about samples, sfz, etc.)

Regarding Dave Brubeck, I'd add Young Lions and Old Tigers too, specially for "Michael Brecker Waltz" that I transcribed in Reaper. Michael Brecker (he's gone too, may he RIP) was and still is my preferred saxophonist. His solo on this one is a must; actually I wonder if he has any bad one
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Old 12-07-2012, 03:28 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nalooti View Post
...I already visited that AS free collection page but it needs iLock, even the free one.
It doesn't need an iLock. It installs as mentioned above a licensing software called PACE.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nalooti View Post
...I'm wondering if it is worth to work on specially for a newbie like me, with all the installation and configuration I have to understand and do.
I don't think that it's worth it. Probably their full bass instrument (AkousKontr) is worth it. In particular as it's controllable:
Quote:
The AkousKontr is German 4/4 four strings Upright bass recorded from both the pickup and with a pair of Electrostatic Microphones. Default interface On the top of the interface, you can control the behavior of the instrument: Legato mode: you can choose wether playing a legato will trigger Hammer ons, slides, sustains, or simply have no effect. .
But that's not free.
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Old 12-07-2012, 04:43 AM   #21
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Another vote for Kontakt free player's upright bass. Other good stuff in there too.
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Old 12-07-2012, 12:54 PM   #22
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nalooti... check your private messages please
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Old 12-07-2012, 02:58 PM   #23
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Not free, but SONiVOX's Dynamic Acoustic Bass is pretty affordable ($19.95) - not indistinguishable from a real upright, but fairly good nonetheless... Free trial, too: SONiVOX Dynamic Acoustic Bass
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Old 12-07-2012, 03:00 PM   #24
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Quote:
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Not free, but SONiVOX's Dynamic Acoustic Bass is pretty affordable ($19.95) - not indistinguishable from a real upright, but fairly good nonetheless... Free trial, too: SONiVOX Dynamic Acoustic Bass
Just bought that. Thnks Mad.
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Old 12-07-2012, 06:40 PM   #25
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that sonivox bass is nice sounding... yet is that actually a 'conta bass'???
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Old 12-08-2012, 06:36 AM   #26
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Default SoniVox installs zlib1.dll in WINDOWS\system32

This morning i've downloaded and installed the SoniVox Dynamic Acoustic Bass Free Trial.
I'm using GIMP which i've just tried to start and it failed with errors.
I figured out that it was due to a file "zlib1.dll" which has been installed in the directory C:\WINDOWS\system32 (where it has no place to be) during the SoniVox installation.

dll files of third party products should not be installed in WINDOWS\system32 !

Just for your info and to prevent you from running into similar trouble.

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Old 12-08-2012, 10:58 AM   #27
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gracias.

I am playing with my download, and have not gotten it to work yet. First thing I learned is that "presets" are not packed in with the VST, and you have to select one from the list in the directory on your hard drive.

Will keep working at it. Thanks for the hint.

Another reason to bitch about software written in non-standard ways by cowboys who figure you will figure out how they are thinking non-standardly. Aaargh.
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Old 12-08-2012, 12:14 PM   #28
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Ah, the Sonivox bass...

I did not buy it, but more than ten years ago, there was "LiveSynth", a soundfont player, and "Sonic Implants".... I bougt my first realistic drums from them, and this famous "Dynamic Bass". Very limited but ... very usable, I was very happy with it I must say!!

I also bought the demo version of "Kontr" by AS, it was dirt cheap because he was working on the full version, which I bought, and totally hate. But the limited "Kontr" is really nice (and no PACE/iLock at that time).

But I still prefer the free soundfont called "Bass Upright Switchable Strings" (143Megs). => I uploaded it here http://tinyurl.com/c2f5lag

I heard Trillian demos, wow... but if I was willing to pay for an upright bass, then without any doubt I'll go here, I tried it, and loved it. (for Kontakt):

http://www.orangetreesamples.com/cor...r-upright-bass
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Old 12-08-2012, 12:17 PM   #29
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Quote:
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Another reason to bitch about software written in non-standard ways by cowboys who figure you will figure out how they are thinking non-standardly. Aaargh.
Well, I see on the web page that you can buy the soundfont as well... you have to choose between "Vsti" or "soundfont" ? Soundfont is in this case a wiser choice, as it will work even in 10 years from now... (I bought it ten years ago and can still play with it, and no installation required)
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Old 12-09-2012, 12:55 PM   #30
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Well, I see on the web page that you can buy the soundfont as well... you have to choose between "Vsti" or "soundfont" ? Soundfont is in this case a wiser choice, as it will work even in 10 years from now... (I bought it ten years ago and can still play with it, and no installation required)
See. ANOTHER example of cowboys and their proliferating, conflicting pseudo-standards. Lets do it in FIFTY ways, and let the user guess. I think what they call DVI is a bastardization between VSTi and soundfont. Not only non-standard, but a mashup of two approaches.

Anyway, I didn't choose the soundfont option (guessed wrong??) because of OTHER problems I have seen with other soundfonts (all working in different ways).

Shit software. Maybe I will stumble on a way to get it working. Maybe not.
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Old 12-10-2012, 10:43 AM   #31
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I contacted Sonivox by phone (since they didn't respond to my email), and with help from a very good tech support person, I got the Dynamic Bass DVI working.

The issues included typical programmer assumption crap (where files are and what links they contain, and how they point to other files) mixed in with assumptions about what users can do in different systems ('Oh, you can only do that with 32-bit', etc).

Looking forward to playing with the controls now.
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Old 12-10-2012, 11:04 AM   #32
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are you going to tell us what you learned from them? and what it takes to make it work?
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Old 12-10-2012, 01:20 PM   #33
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are you going to tell us what you learned from them? and what it takes to make it work?
Of course - hey this is programming! - it DEPENDS on each person's system and hard drive. that should be the motto of today's programmer - "It fucking depends." But unfortunately the REAL motto is "It's up to fucking ME."

When the install happens, choose to install AS administrator.
Install by doing all the defaults. DO NOT vary from the pre-written script.
Do not put the VST (DVI) where you usually put your VSTs, just let it go where it wants.
If you want the standalone, you have to say you are running 32-bit.
Try various patches, because some MIGHT NOT work, but some will.

And as usual, when it fails, call tech support.
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Old 12-10-2012, 02:24 PM   #34
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here is one that I created

Contrabass WIN 64bit Contrabass WIN 32bit Contrabass OSX
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Old 12-10-2012, 04:01 PM   #35
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Default song

thanks axel. Will compare.

Meanwhile here is a start to a piece using the Sonivox bass.

http://www.reverbnation.com/open_graph/song/15460833

The bass alternates between two presets.
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Old 12-17-2012, 03:13 AM   #36
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I am redirected to the whole page of songs... so I don't know which song you are refering to.

On my side, I checked my old (10 years old) songs, and some of them were using this Sonivox Dynamic Bass (it was a "Sonic Implants" soundfont).

On http://www.soundclick.com/bands/defa...&content=music
if you check 08-Strange_Doors_2002 or 10-The_blue_lemon_dream, they both use this sound.

Note that my 2012 sound is more like this one now (Double Bass from Sampletank, and that I heavily compressed http://www.soundclick.com/player/sin...&q=hi&newref=1

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Old 12-17-2012, 06:59 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MadMadRiver View Post
Not free, but SONiVOX's Dynamic Acoustic Bass is pretty affordable ($19.95) - not indistinguishable from a real upright, but fairly good nonetheless... Free trial, too: SONiVOX Dynamic Acoustic Bass
+1 for that. I bought it and am very happy with it.
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Old 04-12-2013, 11:05 AM   #38
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Ok I am so glad this thread got spammed and bumped today, I missed it last week apparently.

Good links in this thread. My sometime collaborator and bassist will be moving to Canada sometime this year.
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Old 07-27-2019, 09:16 AM   #39
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James: Necro thread, but what upright bass did you finally settle on? I have been using Sonivox DVI Dynsacoustic bass for years & for some reason it has recently stopped working. So I am back looking at cheap uprights again.
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Old 07-28-2019, 08:03 PM   #40
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James: Necro thread, but what upright bass did you finally settle on? I have been using Sonivox DVI Dynsacoustic bass for years & for some reason it has recently stopped working. So I am back looking at cheap uprights again.
I think I mentioned this to you maybe 3 or so years ago (?) but I'm pretty sure that Sonivox Eighty Eight Ensemble has the same Acoustic Bass samples as their Dynamic Acoustic Bass.

You can split your keyboard and have things like bass/piano BUT you can just load a full range bass by itself. You don't get the extra processed sounds but the basic sampled sounds are there and sound very good.

Plugin Boutique has it on sale pretty often...I've seen it for around 10 quid at times I think. You can download a trial.
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