iZotope plugins causing a delayed REAPER quit

MRMJP · 11-07-2017, 07:01 PM

Are there any iZotope plugins users that authorize via iLok having an issue where REAPER is slow to quit when more than a few iZotope instances are inserted?

I recently updated the iLok manager app to V4 and maybe that is part of the issue because that seems to be around the same time the problem started up.

MRMJP · 11-08-2017, 06:53 PM

I will test now on my laptop where iZotope is authorized via challenge/response and see if there is a difference.

grinder · 11-08-2017, 07:06 PM

I use challenge response (Ozone 8 and Neutron 2)
Things run as they should.

Grinder

MRMJP · 11-08-2017, 07:25 PM

Thanks for the report. I'm in the process of trying to test iLok vs. computer authorization but I'm leaning towards an issue with iZotope and iLok causing REAPER to hang when quitting.

It's not so obvious with one plugin but with a few iZotope plugins instances, REAPER can take a long time to quit.

MRMJP · 11-08-2017, 07:50 PM

Actually, it seems that the method of authorization doesn't have an affect on things for me.

If I have say 10 instances of an iZotope plugin in a session, REAPER is slow to quit.

It never used to be that way but something seems to have changed recently.

For me it happens on macOS Sierra and High Sierra.

I wonder if anybody else can reproduce. I also can't reproduce this in any other apps, just REAPER.

MRMJP · 11-09-2017, 08:36 AM

Also, because REAPER has been updated more recently than any iZotope plugins I'm testing this with, I have to wonder if something changed in REAPER that is causing it to hang/freeze when closing/quitting when a session has many iZotope plugins inserted.

MRMJP · 11-09-2017, 09:48 AM

Seems to be related to Ozone 8/Neutron 2 but not Ozone 7. I guess it's an iZotope thing and why I only noticed more recently. Sorry for all the noise.

grinder · 11-11-2017, 12:36 PM

I have Ozone advanced 7 and 5 Neutron 1 also still installed
Along with ozone 8 and Neutron 2

Grinder

MRMJP · 11-11-2017, 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grinder

I have Ozone advanced 7 and 5 Neutron 1 also still installed
Along with ozone 8 and Neutron 2

Grinder

Have you noticed that with a session containing multiple instances of Ozone 8 and/or Neutron 2 that REAPER is slow to fully quit or the session is slow to close?

Ozone 7 and earlier don't seem to be affected but Ozone 8 is goofy for sure.

grinder · 11-11-2017, 01:01 PM

When I am next doing a mix I could try that I will not be on my audio today I need a rest.
I am just guessing here MRMJP I have 32GB Ram, Ozone would use a bit of Ram.
I have used Neutron and Neutron 2 in multiples with no trouble.
I am using Ozone 8 on the master bus only so far.

Grinder

MRMJP · 11-11-2017, 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grinder

When I am next doing a mix I could try that I will not be on my audio today I need a rest.
I am just guessing here MRMJP I have 32GB Ram, Ozone would use a bit of Ram.
I have used Neutron and Neutron 2 in multiples with no trouble.
I am using Ozone 8 on the master bus only so far.

Grinder

Thanks. iZotope has a few other reports of this already but I'm trying to help them pinpoint it.

I don't think it's related to RAM. The plugins perform fine and I use item FX so even though I have say a dozen instances loaded, only one is in use at a time in my mastering sessions, and I'm not using the entire 08 plugin, just the dynamics module.

It has something to do with the plugin closing so the app and/or session can fully quit.

What's weird is the session window closes but if you look closely you can see that REAPER freezes/hangs and is technically still open which can be annoying.

grinder · 11-11-2017, 01:20 PM

You joggle something there
Lately after installing the two Neutron 2 and Ozone 8 I have had a few instances where after closing Reaper and shutting down I have had to wait until
my computer shuts down (tell it to close the process) whatever process is hindering shut down. Reaper seems to close down perhaps it is that the Izotope's are not.

Grinder

MRMJP · 11-11-2017, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grinder

You joggle something there
Lately after installing the two Neutron 2 and Ozone 8 I have had a few instances where after closing Reaper and shutting down I have had to wait until
my computer shuts down (tell it to close the process) whatever process is hindering shut down. Reaper seems to close down perhaps it is that the Izotope's are not.

Grinder

Yeah, that's what I"m saying. Something must have changed for 08/N2.

I tried to reproduce the issue in WaveLab by loading a bunch of instances but there was no problem there. It's seems to be isolated to REAPER and Ozone 8/Neutron 2, at lsat on MacOS.

I tried AU an VST3 with the same result. I tried iLok vs. computer authorization with the same result.

It seems that the more instances loaded, the longer REAPER hangs when quitting.

Andy F · 12-13-2017, 04:49 AM

Yesterday I got the Music Production Suite, an now here are the same problems. After installing the iZotope Software, the whole thing is dammed slow. This really sucks. BTW the same thing in my Ableton Live DAW.

MRMJP · 12-13-2017, 06:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy F

Yesterday I got the Music Production Suite, an now here are the same problems. After installing the iZotope Software, the whole thing is dammed slow. This really sucks. BTW the same thing in my Ableton Live DAW.

I don't know if this is the same issue. For me, everything was fine other than when quitting REAPER or closing a session with iZotope 8 or Neutron 2 inserted in the session. The system or session didn't run slower, it was just a matter of hanging while quitting/closing.

Is everything slow even if you don't have any iZotope plugins loaded or just when you use the plugins? They can be fairly CPU intense so if it's happening in more than one DAW, I doubt it's a REAPER issue.

I would contact iZotope support.

Andy F · 12-13-2017, 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MRMJP

Is everything slow even if you don't have any iZotope plugins loaded or just when you use the plugins? They can be fairly CPU intense so if it's happening in more than one DAW, I doubt it's a REAPER issue..

Here's what I found out:

1. Reaper hangs or crashes while scanning the iZotope Plugins (Ableton Live also btw.)

2. Loading any iZotope Plugin needs at minimum 30 seconds. In this time reapers GUI is totally hanging.

3. While running the session with loaded iZ-Plugins reaper's GUI hangs often a very long time (minutes!!!).

4. Loading project with included iZ-Plugins could take up to 10 minutes (i7, 4.5 GHz, 32 GB RAM, SSD), or reaper crashes while loading.

5. You have several track with the same iZ-Plugin running, now you will add the same plugin into another track. Suddenly the iZ-Plugin says it is not authorized anymore and runs in demo mode (after showing up the auth-dialogbox).

6. Other iLok protected software like slate everything bundle randomly also thinks there is no authorization any more, if any iZ-Plugin is loaded.

7. While reaper is running iZ-Plugins and is hanging, you could not open any other iLock protected software (standalone software like RX-Editor), also the iLok-Licence-Manager will not work!

So I tried to deactivate all iZtope licences and go over to "Computer Authorisation" and: Voila! All work quiet well now.

But this is no final solution for me, because I need to run my licences on my notebook too, so that's why I prefer authorizing via iLok.

MRMJP · 12-13-2017, 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy F

Here's what I found out:

1. Reaper hangs or crashes while scanning the iZotope Plugins (Ableton Live also btw.)

2. Loading any iZotope Plugin needs at minimum 30 seconds. In this time reapers GUI is totally hanging.

3. While running the session with loaded iZ-Plugins reaper's GUI hangs often a very long time (minutes!!!).

4. Loading project with included iZ-Plugins could take up to 10 minutes (i7, 4.5 GHz, 32 GB RAM, SSD), or reaper crashes while loading.

5. You have several track with the same iZ-Plugin running, now you will add the same plugin into another track. Suddenly the iZ-Plugin says it is not authorized anymore and runs in demo mode (after showing up the auth-dialogbox).

6. Other iLok protected software like slate everything bundle randomly also thinks there is no authorization any more, if any iZ-Plugin is loaded.

7. While reaper is running iZ-Plugins and is hanging, you could not open any other iLock protected software (standalone software like RX-Editor), also the iLok-Licence-Manager will not work!

So I tried to deactivate all iZtope licences and go over to "Computer Authorisation" and: Voila! All work quiet well now.

But this is no final solution for me, because I need to run my licences on my notebook too, so that's why I prefer authorizing via iLok.

Interesting observations. I'm running a beta of the next update to 08/N2 and my issue was resolved.

I would report your detailed report to iZotope support ASAP while they are still fine tuning the next update and maybe if there are any lingering issues related to your findings, they can make that fix before the update is released.

Andy F · 12-13-2017, 08:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MRMJP

I would report your detailed report to iZotope support ASAP while they are still fine tuning the next update and maybe if there are any lingering issues related to your findings, they can make that fix before the update is released.

Yes, I reported it to the iZotope support some minutes ago. I think there is a real bug in their iLok implementation. Lost 2 komplete days because of this sh*t...

Andy F · 12-13-2017, 08:16 AM

Btw and off topic. I remember times (in the 90th of the last millennium) where cracked Steinberg software run more tracks at the same time, as my original payed software with the dongle, because the dongle code needed so processing power. Not funny... :-(

tzzsmk · 12-13-2017, 10:30 AM

I have a very negative experience with iZotope plugins in Reaper,
older versions caused instant crash of Reaper as soon as I put it in FX chain in 2/3 cases,
current RX 6, Ozone 8, Neutron 2 seem to be a bit better, but I can still clearly see there's something fcked up with the plugins, as for ex. single instance of de-click, de-clip etc.. result in 29000-ish PDC which is unbearable,
pretty much obvious the problem is with plugins themselves, as for ex. FabFilter plugins do not cause such problems, although they can be about equal in audio processing results

MRMJP · 12-13-2017, 10:44 AM

Yeah, Ozone was always a bit CPU intensive depending on what modules you are using but it was usable. That's why I like Ozone/Neutron Advanced where you can use the individual modules as needed and not have to load the entire plugin.

I don't think RX6 stuff is meant to be run live in real-time. It's EXTREMELY CPU intense and it's not just in REAPER, Pro Tools and WaveLab as well.

That's why these are best done in the standalone app or as AudioSuite in Pro Tools which is why it would be nice if REAPER developed it's own AudioSuite style processing.

That being said, I have some nice scripts from getting item copies into RX6 standalone, making the edit, saving the file and returning to REAPER and moving on.

I think most of the RX plugins are just not intended for real-time use and are best used in some form of offline processing.

vanceen · 12-13-2017, 03:26 PM

FWIW, I'm running Reaper with the Ozone 8 and Neutron 2 plugins with no problems. When there's a lot, it takes a little longer to load, but that's not unusual.

I haven't been putting any instances of full Ozone 8 or Neutron 2 into projects, just the individual plug-ins.

MRMJP · 12-13-2017, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vanceen

FWIW, I'm running Reaper with the Ozone 8 and Neutron 2 plugins with no problems. When there's a lot, it takes a little longer to load, but that's not unusual.

I haven't been putting any instances of full Ozone 8 or Neutron 2 into projects, just the individual plug-ins.

Yeah, my only issues was when quitting REAPER with a session open containing O8 or N2, REAPER wouldn't fully quit for a solid 10 or 20 seconds even though all REAPER windows would close.

Maybe it was a Mac only thing but ether way, it's been fixed and a public update should be ready sooner or later.

vanceen · 12-16-2017, 04:27 PM

Interesting occurrence. I'm sure I had no problem before, but tonight when closing a couple of projects with a lot of Izotope 8 and Neutron 2 plug-ins, the Reaper splash screen showed, "Removing Track 12", then "Removing Track 11", etc. This took 20 seconds or so to complete.

MRMJP · 12-17-2017, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vanceen

Interesting occurrence. I'm sure I had no problem before, but tonight when closing a couple of projects with a lot of Izotope 8 and Neutron 2 plug-ins, the Reaper splash screen showed, "Removing Track 12", then "Removing Track 11", etc. This took 20 seconds or so to complete.

This sounds similar to my experience except I never got the splash screen. Hopefully they release the official update soon so you can update your O8/N2 versions and no longer experience this delay.