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Old 03-18-2018, 03:28 AM   #41
azslow3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mschnell View Post
@azslow3:
Seemingly you want the confusion, instead of simply accepting the Control Path as a dedicated stream of Midi Messages, as strongly suggested by the FX parameter modulation for the same parameter being possible by either
I do not want any confusion. I just try to explain from where it comes. And I have failed so far:

Quote:
a Midi CC message (value 0..127 or high resolution CC 0 .. 16383) in the FX chain of the appropriate track
"Param" -> "FX Parameter List" -> "Parameter Modulation / Midi Link " -> Parameter name -> "Link from Midi or Fx Parameter" -> "Midi" -< "CC" -> ...
That is (I) "performance" + (IIb) case in my classification.

Quote:
a Midi CC Message (value 0..127, I don't know about high respiration here) in the Control Path :
"Param" -> "FX Parameter List" -> "Learn" -> parameter name -> wait for appropriate message.
That is (I) "settings"/"performance" + (IIa) case.

Quote:
I am not discussing whether or not this is desirable, but this is how Reaper works deeply within, and we very likely need to accept this design decision for good.
Yes, Exactly! Reaper separate (IIa) and (IIb). That is why one FX parameter has 2 distinct "MIDI assignments" in one menu.

MidiToReaControlPath is "bridging" them.
That is possible and can be useful. But that is outside "the design".
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Old 03-18-2018, 04:58 AM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by azslow3 View Post
MidiToReaControlPath is "bridging" them... But that is outside "the design".
Yep. MidiToReaControlPath is a lame surrogate for an unfortunately not (yet) existing virtual Midi device "Reaper Control Path" that would be able to be fed from any Track by standard Reaper routing means. Same would be a more straight forward Reaper design component.

-Michael
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Old 03-18-2018, 11:03 AM   #43
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Originally Posted by mschnell View Post
Yep. MidiToReaControlPath is a lame surrogate for an unfortunately not (yet) existing virtual Midi device "Reaper Control Path" that would be able to be fed from any Track by standard Reaper routing means. Same would be a more straight forward Reaper design component.

-Michael
Ok. I see. I have failed to explain why making "Reaper Control Path" as virtual MIDI device is not a good idea. But that is off-topic in any case, we are in "DAW controllers" thread

What can be more relevant to the topic is that I had intermediate success in my previously mentioned test. I mean MidiToReaControlPath on the input MIDI device level. Still many things to write and polish, intensive tests (especially for timing influence) and clear answer from Reaper developers (I use a separate thread with more then normal priority with completely independent from API MIDI processing, only they know how bad or acceptable that is) required to publish the result.
But at least I could play piano synth from my MPK Mini without noticeable (for me, not measured yet) jitter and controlling Reaper parameters at the same time, without "MIDI leaks" and without extra VST on the track.
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Old 03-18-2018, 02:09 PM   #44
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I've been through a few options over the years but now have a KMI K-Mix as my primary control surface. A control surface plugin for Reaper is available on the stash. There is no complex configuration; it should be 'plug and play'.
While you do not have quite as many knobs and buttons as some of the bigger dedicated controllers, recall that this one device can replace your mixer, your audio interface AND your control surface. As a control surface you have transport control plus full control over channel faders, master fader, channel pan, record arm, mute and solo, you have a meter bridge mode that will show you the signal levels on the channel strip LEDs and you also have the ability to bring any of the first 8 plugins on a channel into focus in the UI and then control any plugin parameter as well.
And you have timeline scrub, which gives you most of the benefits of a jog/shuttle wheel as well.
As a mixer you get 8 ins, two of which are mic/line with phantom power and the rest line level, and you have 10 outs (because the headphone out is directly usable as two independent outs as well). This is also its capabilities as an audio interface.
It will operate stand-alone as a mixer as well and has compression, noise gate and full parametric EQ on each channel. And it's about the size of a paperback book. In a home studio this is a very good solution, especially if you're constrained for space.
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Old 03-18-2018, 02:25 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by azslow3 View Post
Ok. I see. I have failed to explain why making "Reaper Control Path" as virtual MIDI device is not a good idea. But that is off-topic in any case, we are in "DAW controllers" thread
You might want to answer to my post in the Feature request forum, instead.

-Michael
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Old 03-18-2018, 10:05 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by Doc Brown View Post
I tried to assign faders on my akai mpk88 to faders in reaper and everything works as planned. The problem arose with my cc assignments on synths and plug-ins. I have Reaper set to only control the focused screen for my knob and fader assignments which works fine.

The problem was when I was moving a knob or fader on an effect or synth when a cc or fader was the same as a fader that was assigned to a channel strip the channel strip would move also. That is obviously not going to work for me. I tried to find a setting to defeat Reapers channel faders from control if a plugin is in focus but no such luck. Reaper automatically assigns cc numbers via the midi learn function and there is bound to be common cc conflicts with vsti mapping and channel mapping. No bueno.

I have done what you describe with no problems. It sounds like you are using the same midi channel, when using midi learn use an available midi channel, from midi learn you can assign multiple vst devices as long as you set the correct options when assigning the device.
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Old 03-19-2018, 12:17 AM   #47
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I have done what you describe with no problems. It sounds like you are using the same midi channel, when using midi learn use an available midi channel, from midi learn you can assign multiple vst devices as long as you set the correct options when assigning the device.
Sorry, this time I have not understood what that means.

My target it control VST and Reaper Actions from the same controller, without messages for Reaper also delivered to VST (and reversed).
I also have a wish to do this with the same controls, in my case keys on DP. I want define left pedal as "shift", so when it is pressed I have up to 88 keys for Reaper actions (start/stop, metronome, etc).
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Old 03-19-2018, 12:29 AM   #48
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Originally Posted by azslow3 View Post
My target it control VST and Reaper Actions from the same controller, without messages for Reaper also delivered to VST (and reversed).
I do this all the time in my Live setup (from my XTouch Compact). (In fact the "Reaper Actions" I use is feeding SWS LiveConfigs, but technically this is equivalent ( via "learn") .)

Moreover in this thread -> https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=202979 I worked with Pipe do do this for his ten-Button Peadalboard for controlling virtual Guitar effects, finally avoiding LiveConfigs for sake of less confusion.

But obviously this outside of the scope of what Reaper can do "out of the box" and needs dedicated add ons.

-Michael

Last edited by mschnell; 03-19-2018 at 10:59 AM.
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Old 03-19-2018, 06:50 AM   #49
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Originally Posted by mschnell View Post
I do this all the time in my Live setup (from my XTouch Compact). (In fact the "Reaper Actions" I use is feeding SWS LiveConfigs, but technically this is equivalent ( via "learn") .)
Live Config is interesting. And written by you PDF is the best documentation I could find for it

Quote:
Moreover in this thread -> https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=202979 I worked with Pipe do do this for his ten-Button Peadalboard for controlling virtual Guitar effects, finally avoiding LiveConfigs for sale of less confusion.
Also nice.

The only generalized alternative for both I have seen so far (in range of API provided by the DAW, which was more limiting then in Reaper) is... AZ Controller. Imagine you can assign arbitrary list of "actions" (including commands, parameters modifications, track muting/solo/etc), conditionally based on unlimited number of switches (so not just the "row", but user definable switches and current DAW states like transport and the context, even current values for any parameter of the DAW and/or VST) and these switches in turn can be modified by arbitrary number of MIDI/OSC/Joystick controls in arbitrary way...
Luxus? Overkill? May be. But once you used to have it, it is easy to miss it

Quote:
But obviously this outside of the scope of what Reaper can do "out of the box" and needs dedicated add ons.
-Michael
I want quote your own statement (from the PDF):
Quote:
A final advice about setups: the simpler, the best!
I am not gigging pro who carefully prepare each project for the stage.
I just want insert new synth and start playing it, without thinking about routing, extra tracks and FXes. But with a possibility to turn on metronome or adjust the track volume without making the synth sound crazy (or not sound at all...).

And for DP... using mentioned "all rounder", I could organize near unlimited number of operations (I mean more then I have ever wanted) just from 2 left pedals. But one pedal + keys "shortcut" should also work fine, till I have that "all rounder" in Reaper
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Old 03-19-2018, 11:04 AM   #50
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I just want insert new synth and start playing it...
This of course might be nice, but in many cases more detail is needed.

In fact for my live setup I did try Forte before I found Reaper. Forte was nicely, and easy to use, but by far not versatile enough for my needs, ... and of course not usable as a DAW, more expensive, and it's stalled since some weeks.

-Michael

Last edited by mschnell; 03-19-2018 at 11:12 AM.
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Old 03-19-2018, 02:20 PM   #51
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I see... So you know how it was at the end of the last year for Sonar users...

I have chosen Reaper because I knew, if something does not work as I like, I would like to "correct" it
And with such requirement, there was no other choice (in fact Reaper "advertisement" on CW forum was so "good" that it was at the very end of my list. I have dropped alternatives after asking for API.)

BTW all these years I was wondering how someone can use Sonar live. I mean a DAW which WILL stop working normally, with not "if" but "when". Or just revert to demo mode
Somehow I easily trust Reaper as a "music instrument". So when I had to use a DAW "outside home" during Christmas, it was Reaper which I had for several weeks and not Sonar which I had much longer.
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Old 09-14-2018, 10:23 PM   #52
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[QUOTE=ivansc;1965571]woogish: FFS, man! Can`t you post anything that doesn`t come across as negative?
Take a deep breath and SMILE before you post.

take yer pill today, old bean? Didn't mean to set your knickers in a twist.....
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Old 09-14-2018, 11:10 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by azslow3 View Post
...
* OSCII-bot. Search for it and BCR-2000 and you will find many threads. It is Reaper <-> OSC <-> OSCII-bot <-> BCR2000 schema.

OSCII-bot configurations are easy to write for anyone with at least basic programming skills. But it can be a show stopper without such background.
Not that "easy to write", even with basic programming skills, as you have first to understand the specifics in the language used for OSCII-bot scripts : take a look at this thread that I started more than four years ago.

To sum it up, the only thing that I wanted was to be able to use the endless knobs of my MPD32 to control basic actions in Reaper : zoom, horizontal scrolling, nudge... It's been a nightmare.

The result was that, as Reaper is absolutly unable to detect NRPN messages natively for actions control, I had to, first, add a virtual MIDI port in my system and, second, set up the script discussed in the thread to achieve what I wanted which has been anything but "easy to write", especially for the newbie that I was at this time. And there is not even bi-directional control involved in it...
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Old 09-14-2018, 11:54 PM   #54
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All I wanted was bi-directional control of volume, pan, mute, and solo per track with BCR2000.

NOT POSSIBLE

PERIOD.
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Old 09-15-2018, 01:10 AM   #55
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Not "out of the box". (Who wants this is just ignoring reality: no DAW can be able to provide dedicated support for thousands of Controllers with multiple different protocols - and the BCR is not even produced any more - plus thousands of workflows users wish to see.

By finding or doing some additional software this if course is possible.

-Michael
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Old 09-15-2018, 01:15 AM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cubic13 View Post
To sum it up, the only thing that I wanted was to be able to use the endless knobs of my MPD32 to control basic actions in Reaper : zoom, horizontal scrolling, nudge...
Please see the thread -> https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=183143 and help Geoff with enhancing and testing his "CSI" project that is aimed to support a great lot of different surface devices and a great lot of workflows users might want to see done via the surface devices they have.

-Michael
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Old 09-15-2018, 10:58 AM   #57
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When I used Logic 5.5, I was able to get bi-directional control rather easily for 32 channels. Here's how:

1. I used a BCR2000 (endless rotary)
2. I set the first group of 16 knobs to send and recieve CC7
3. I set the next group of 16 knobs to receive CC 8

4. In Logic's AWESOME Environment, I inserted an Object just BEFORE each of the SECOND
set of 16 faders, that converted all CC8s to CC7.
5. Then I inserted another object AFTER each fader that then converted CC7 back to
CC8, and sent that Object's out put back to the BCR2000.

This simple method gave me, when using two BCRs, 64 individually controlled bi-
directional channels of MIDI or Audio in Logic.

Comes 2018, I'm in Reaper (loving it).

Now the question - is there any way to do this in Reaper? Especially the CC conversions and re-conversions coming in and going out?

I'm also thinking this:

Bi-directional control is not really that important for me, All I really need is for Reaper, at the beginning of any mixing session, to send out MIDI commands to each channel OUT to the BCR to "set" its knobs to correspond to the current fader settings, etc., in Reaper. During mixing, one would use ONLY the BCR to 'run"
the faders, mutes, solos, etc. Then, on the next session, send the current Reaper settings ONE TIME to BCR, using the embedded MIDI (let's say possibly using either automation, or some dedicated MIDI tracks for just CC data).


This would require only an incoming conversion in Reaper for controlling faders, mutes, etc.

If I'm not being clear, I'll do a diagram. I'll be the first to admit that I"m a genius - and no one ever understands a genius......


OR:

For audio mixdown, set the first 16 faders to receive MIDI as usual, using the main MIDI input device connected to one BCR2000.
Then, set the second set of 16 faders to receive MIDI from a different MIDI input device, connected to another BCR2000.

This is just for input - should work, no?


If I'm not being clear, I'll do a diagram. I'll be the first to admit that I"m a genius - and no one ever understands a genius......

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Old 09-15-2018, 12:22 PM   #58
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2,3,4,5

I don't really understand, but did not try very hard.

Maybe Geoff does understand if you explain this to him and maybe he's inclined to implement something like thin in CSI.

-Michael
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Old 09-15-2018, 12:54 PM   #59
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I'm thinking that the option after "OR" is the best way - but what's the SIMPLEST way to map CC7 to achannel fader ?
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Old 09-15-2018, 09:33 PM   #60
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I think I can just forget this whole idea - if Reaper could save track volumes and pans as embedded MIDI data, or save automation as MIDI data, then there might be a prayer, but it doesn't, so c'est la vie - fergit I asked.......
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Old 09-15-2018, 10:48 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by woogish View Post
save automation as MIDI data......
This certainly is possible (e.g. by a JSFX plugin that takes the automation for it's slider and outputs Midi cc data accordingly to be recorded).

I suppose something like this is available and tested.

-Michael
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Old 09-18-2018, 10:11 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by woogish View Post
All I wanted was bi-directional control of volume, pan, mute, and solo per track with BCR2000.

NOT POSSIBLE

PERIOD.
An example for mute buttons with feedback (for 8 channels), complete (!) OSCII-bot script:
Code:
@input dev_midi_input MIDI "Nocturn"
@output dev_midi_output MIDI "Nocturn"
@input OSC_FROM_REAPER OSC "localhost:9000"
@output OSC_TO_REAPER OSC "localhost:8000"

@init
oscsend(OSC_TO_REAPER, "i/action", 41743);

@midimsg
(msg1&0xf0) == 0xb0 ? (
  (msg2 >= 0x78) && (msg2 <= 0x7f) && (msg3 == 0x7f) ? (
    oscsend(OSC_TO_REAPER, "i/track/%d/mute/toggle", 1, msg2 - 0x77);
  );
);

@oscmsg
oscmatch("/track/%{track_number}D/mute") ? (
  msg1 = 0xb0;
  msg2 = 0x77 + track_number;
  oscparm(0, 0) > 0 ? msg3 = 0x7f : msg3 = 0x00;
  midisend(dev_midi_output);
);
So, definitively possible...
Attached is complete script with mute, solo and volume (for endless encoders), heavily commented (more comments then code, lol).

Quote:
Originally Posted by cubic13 View Post
Not that "easy to write", even with basic programming skills, as you have first to understand the specifics in the language used for OSCII-bot scripts : take a look at this thread that I started more than four years ago.
Probably we have different interpretation for "basic programming skills"
Your case is a tick more (several lines) complex compare to the file attached, for NRPN parsing.
Check https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=137558 (replies from Banned) for full scale NRPN based controller integration.
Attached Files
File Type: txt volume.txt (6.0 KB, 120 views)

Last edited by azslow3; 09-18-2018 at 10:19 AM.
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Old 09-18-2018, 11:47 AM   #63
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Hi,
Miditranlator pro solves all. By bomes. And i am def not a programmer.
Did 1:1 translation between a Mackie d8b mixer speaking hui and converted bidirectional to MCU/klinkes. And more. Actions, layers, mouse pointer control from buttons on the console. Even used osc to get track # as midi data. Tale helped with that part:-)
And a general thing to the op...
Controlers that only send 0-127 aren't good for mixing. Much stair step effect. For static changes..meh.:-)
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Old 09-19-2018, 05:06 AM   #64
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https://www.nektartech.com/tablet/panorama-p1.html

This one seems great.
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Old 09-19-2018, 11:37 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woogish View Post

I STILL stand by my first reply
that's the SECOND time you've repeated your first statement.
I am 100% sure you won't be changing you opinion (or anyone else's) so stop repeating it, we GET IT
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Old 09-20-2018, 06:49 PM   #66
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And how many times do I have to see "Have a GOOD time....ALL the time !"?

why don't you go take a pill?

Then go take a flying leap.

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Old 09-21-2018, 09:46 AM   #67
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And how many times do I have to see "Have a GOOD time....ALL the time !"?
.
until you learn HOW to have a good time......chill dude.
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Old 09-22-2018, 09:30 AM   #68
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i have been using the ICON Platform+ .. it controls the mixer and transport pretty well
you may not get plugin control parameters , for which i enjoy using the Kontrol F1 .
its perfect with no headaches !
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Old 09-22-2018, 09:40 AM   #69
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anyone knows a controller with knobs with leds like x.touch mini from behringer, which is able to work in reaper? i don't have x-touch mini because it does not work in reaper.
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Old 09-22-2018, 08:26 PM   #70
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anyone knows a controller with knobs with leds like x.touch mini from behringer, which is able to work in reaper? i don't have x-touch mini because it does not work in reaper.
I can confirm it works to assign actions to the buttons/rotaries, and with the learn function, and with ReaLearn. Probably works with MCU, Klinke, and CSI also but I won't be testing those anytime soon.
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Old 09-22-2018, 08:36 PM   #71
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I can confirm it works to assign actions to the buttons/rotaries, and with the learn function, and with ReaLearn.
ohh i see! Thanks! I was about to buy one ~2 weeks ago, but I couldn't assign a vsti parameter to a x touch knob. Are you able to do this?
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Old 09-22-2018, 09:22 PM   #72
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ohh i see! Thanks! I was about to buy one ~2 weeks ago, but I couldn't assign a vsti parameter to a x touch knob. Are you able to do this?
I didn't try any synths but I did do reaper actions and plugins like ReaEq
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Old 09-22-2018, 11:01 PM   #73
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Default Behringer X-Touch with "Klinke"

I JUST Did The X-Touch w/ Klinke... It works great... and even better once you install the "Klinke"... There will be a learning curve; but if you know where to put "things" in reapers file matrix it's easy as "drag and drop" "cut and paste".

Hope this helps.

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Old 09-23-2018, 07:59 PM   #74
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Get a mid-priced Android tablet and run TouchOSC on it.
You will have a control surface that works perfectly and is massively customizable, and a thousand options for mounting it to your rig.
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Old 09-23-2018, 09:38 PM   #75
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IMHO the main benefit of using a surface device is having controllers that you can touch and hence handle without looking at, but keeping your eyes at the Screen showing other parts of Reaper.

-Micheal
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Old 09-23-2018, 09:48 PM   #76
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I posted in this thread before, but I'm using several controllers, and all they work fine. 8 motorized faders, fully automated, presets for Reaper, so no need to do any programming.

Icon Qcon Pro - presets for Reaper. No audio outputs, so you need a separate audio card.


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Old 09-23-2018, 10:00 PM   #77
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M Audio projectmix ... this is an oldie, but still works very well. Advantage is that not only has it 4 physical audio outputs, it also has motorized faders, and again, no customization necessary. Choose "cubase" preset on startup, and you're ready to go.






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Old 09-24-2018, 02:48 AM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mschnell View Post
IMHO the main benefit of using a surface device is having controllers that you can touch and hence handle without looking at, but keeping your eyes at the Screen showing other parts of Reaper.

-Micheal
For me, having a control surface device with multiple faders allows one to have the ability to massage the tracks with volume automation all at once at mix down. Huge no HUGE!!!
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Old 09-24-2018, 05:56 AM   #79
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Not sure if everybody has noticed the availability of DrivenByMoss, which supports many current controlers and protocols:

* Ableton Push 1 / 2
* Akai APC mkI / mkII
* Akai APC mini
* Arturia Beatstep / Pro
* Novation Launchpad Pro / MkII
* Generic Flexi (map any controller which speaks Midi)
* Mackie MCU protocol (with special support for icon devices) with up to 4 controllers
* Novation SL MkI/MkII
* Open Sound Control (OSC)

See: https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?p=1988209
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Old 12-07-2018, 07:37 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bourzia View Post
There is a setting in Reaper to set the max gain level to 10db to match the X-touch faders. Presfrences>Appearance>Track Control Pannels. at the bottom adjust the Volume Fader Range to +10 instead of +12.
Thanks for the tip! Just what I was looking for.
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